Could someone explain the Buddhist belief system to me?

[gatito]

Once again, I get the feeling that you do not read (or maybe understand) my posts. Being "one" with primordial awareness is to be a "Buddha/Christ", beyond consciousness with full clarity. I have repeatedly mentioned my ongoing obstructions.

 

Since you do not perceive a difference between consciousness and awareness, this is a difficult conversation to have and explain. But, on knowledge... consciousness is experienced.

 

To help with the explanation... Can you tell me... What is the purpose/use of a rainbow body?

 

Or, is it that you consider yourself "done"?

 

 

Sorry Jeff, I can't help you any more - ask your teacher (or TI ).

 

I'm done.

[XieJia]

awareness is not ours.

 

never saw a fundamentalist buddhist before but i guess there are some.

[gatito]

Last attempt to re-rail the thread and to answer DreamBliss's question.

 

[Tibetan_Ice]

You and TI have both invested heavily in AYP teachings and practice haven't you?

 

Hi Gatito,

That is quite an insult there.

 

If you knew me at all, or read any of my lengthy posts of the crap you will find at AYP, you would see that I have dismantled AYP and will continue doing so because of their misguided "guru" and faulty yogic scientific inventions. But you knew that, you are just trying to insult me.

 

Well, you've succeeded. I'm actually enjoying the energies.. Pleasure and pain kind of feel the same to me nowadays...

 

You know, I don't recall insulting you directly so there must be something that I've posted that you disagree with, and now, without the courage to confront me directly, you've taken to insulting me in other threads.

 

Was it the neo-advaita comments about Tony Parson's "no need to practice"? Do you consider yourself a neo-advaitan? Do you have any practices at all? Or do you just visit gurus hoping that it will rub off on you? And then, what are doing in a Buddhist thread? Are you shopping around for practices?

 

 

TI

[XieJia]

 

Make an island of yourself,

make yourself your refuge;

there is no other refuge.

Make truth your island,

make truth your refuge;

there is no other refuge.

Digha Nikaya, 16

[gatito]

Hi Gatito,

That is quite an insult there.

 

If you knew me at all, or read any of my lengthy posts of the crap you will find at AYP, you would see that I have dismantled AYP and will continue doing so because of their misguided "guru" and faulty yogic scientific inventions. But you knew that, you are just trying to insult me.

 

Well, you've succeeded. I'm actually enjoying the energies.. Pleasure and pain kind of feel the same to me nowadays...

 

You know, I don't recall insulting you directly so there must be something that I've posted that you disagree with, and now, without the courage to confront me directly, you've taken to insulting me in other threads.

 

Was it the neo-advaita comments about Tony Parson's "no need to practice"? Do you consider yourself a neo-advaitan? Do you have any practices at all? Or do you just visit gurus hoping that it will rub off on you? And then, what are doing in a Buddhist thread? Are you shopping around for practices?

 

 

TI

 

No TI: the intention wasn't to insult you. It was to poke a bit of fun at you, at Jeff and at AYP.

 

Please consider it an ill-considered attempt at humour and kindly accept my apologies, although on rereading your post, I see that, worryingly, you seem to be deriving some masochistic pleasure from it, so perhaps, on further consideration, no apology is actually warranted?

Edited November 10, 2012 by gatito

[DreamBliss]

First I'm pulling out my whistle and asking everyone to watch this:

 

Hopefully that will give the final word on some of what has been argued about here.

 

@Tibetan_Ice

I'm afraid I have been battling a migraine all day so I only scanned through all the posts here since my last visit. But I caught that you have an issue with AYP, I assume Advanced Yoga Practices? I would like to hear more about this, in PM or you can link to me stuff if you prefer. The reason why is I started meditation with Yogani's, "Deep Meditation" and this was one of the books in this series. I would like to know if these teachings are flawed and why you or others feel they are. I am not trying to argue with anyone on this here, PM or link to post or info contact only please!

 

Thank you!

- DreamBliss

[GrandmasterP]

 

 

 

I am a fundamentalist Vajrayanist.

 

Buddhahood and Vajrayana deities are both real.

........................

Enjoy.

:-)

[Tibetan_Ice]

...

@Tibetan_Ice

I'm afraid I have been battling a migraine all day so I only scanned through all the posts here since my last visit. But I caught that you have an issue with AYP, I assume Advanced Yoga Practices? I would like to hear more about this, in PM or you can link to me stuff if you prefer. The reason why is I started meditation with Yogani's, "Deep Meditation" and this was one of the books in this series. I would like to know if these teachings are flawed and why you or others feel they are. I am not trying to argue with anyone on this here, PM or link to post or info contact only please!

 

Thank you!

- DreamBliss

 

Hi Dreambliss,

Let me guess, you decided to add spinal breathing to your routine of deep meditation and now you are overloaded?

 

Here are some links and quotes about what I discovered about AYP.. as requested.

 

 

http://thetaobums.com/topic/21469-patanjalis-sutras-and-samyama-questions/

 

http://www.amazon.com/Deep-Meditation-Pathway-Personal-Freedom/product-reviews/097646554X/ref=cm_cr_dp_qt_hist_one?ie=UTF8&filterBy=addOneStar&showViewpoints=0

 

This next post is a sarcastic reply to my comments on Amazon, and my reply follows.

 

8604 said:

You know, I could never thank you enough for this review, because this is what convinced me to buy this book!

 

TM courses cost what? $1500? And this is only $3.99 on Kindle? BEST DEAL EVER!(And TM reps claim that it can't be taught via books)

 

100 pages, double spaced? So it's essentially 50 pages, and written to appeal to 5th grade mentality.. Guess I don't have to worry about straining my brain to understand it. Also, 5th grade mentality is more likely to get bored with all the fluff you get in other books, so simple and more to the point is godsend for books on this subject.

 

While there may be truth in what you're talking about for the rest of the review, most people care about the benefits of meditation and are looking for a simple and effective guide to achieve them. For that purpose, this book is damn near perfect! I suppose that if anyone really wanted to get deep into who said what, this and that, and get into debates about it with you and plenty of others, they'll at least know how to meditate from this book and develop the habit, then do some further research on information, theory and fun facts. Though I don't see how that is important to the practice of meditation itself, especially when you could eventually experience it for yourself and go with what you believe is right in the long run.

 

But anyway, thanks again for your review!

 

Beware of what you are calling meditation. The "relaxation response" is not meditation in my books. It is a form of cat napping which leads to dullness and laxtiy. Most Buddhists will call this laxity and dullness and say that it can stilt your intelligence.

 

Apparently you don't read the AYP forum.. You should.

 

Here is a post on the AYP forum from Mikiji, an authentic TM instructor. The topic is about whether or not Deep Meditation is TM.

http://www.aypsite.org/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=12026

 

"I have practiced TM for 40 years, spent two years with and was personally trained by His Holiness the late Maharishi Mahesh Yogi as an initiator of TM in 1976, and have also been involved in AYP for about 5 years, attending two AYP residential retreats as well. From my perspective, the basic TM technique is virtually identical to AYP Deep Meditation. I'm speaking of the actual meditation procedure here.

 

There are vast philosophical and procedural differences in HOW ONE LEARNS each meditation technique, but very little difference in how one actually practices them. The "I Am" mantra is, in fact, one of the mantras we use in TM, a bija or seed mantra, although the Sanskrit pronunciation which Maharishi chanted to me was, at least to my ear, somewhat different, and it is only one of many mantras we may choose. Be that as it may, although the basic technique of AYP Deep Meditation is nearly identical to TM--how to think the mantra, how to handle the arising of thoughts and returning to the mantra, the time of meditation, etc.--these basic mechanics are sometimes word-for-word exactly what Maharishi taught me to say when teaching meditation, in my very long experience teaching meditation and my last 5 years involved with AYP I have come to appreciate the role of a trained teacher and personal instruction in giving the novice meditator the best possible start.

 

One CAN (that is to say, it IS possible) to get a good, proper and totally correct start with AYP just from reading what to do. BUT, it is also possible that the new learner may just not be getting it all quite right. The role of the instructor and personal instruction is to give an instruction, have the learner do it, ask a question and, based on the response to that question, give either further instructions, provide a refinement or restatement of the previous instruction, or ask the learner other questions to determine what steps to take next. It is a sort of guided instruction tree with nearly infinite branches, and since everyone has a different path of responses, and Maharishi basically gave us every possible response to each step and how to proceed from each point, we are able to guide a new meditator seamlessly AND CORRECTLY to a good and proper start. In addition, we have a structured guided checking procedure in TM whereby we can make certain that the meditator is, in fact, practicing correctly, and if not, to correct any subtle errors in mechanics or technique. We thereby "tune up" all new meditators several times during the 5-day course of instruction."

 

There is much more in this discussion, but eventually Yogani replies:

 

As a written teaching, AYP has certain limitations, as you pointed out. It is for people who have an intuitive sense of their journey and are prepared to take responsibility for their spiritual evolution, and who don't require as much detailed assistance as they may get in a hands-on teaching environment (TM certainly excels in that).

 

On the other hand, AYP has certain advantages. In this "information age," it is able to reach many people around the world with easy-to-access tools like deep meditation, spinal breathing pranayama and many other practices, along with detailed instructions on their application, effects and ongoing management. So while the knowledge is spreading out in a somewhat less concentrated form than one might find sitting at the feet of an expert, it is reaching many more people as a ready-to-use resource. The underlying premise of AYP is that the guru/expert is in each of us, and we hope to provide enough stimulus and knowledge to bring that out in everyone. It is a non-traditional approach for sure, and after nearly 10 years in the public sphere it is still an ongoing experiment. Time will tell. So far, so good.

 

So there you have it. Yogani disregards the fact that a TM instructor is telling him that AYP is lacking in the proper method of relaying the correct practice, that it must be taught in person, and that the technique must continually checked because it is very easy for the practitioner to adopt incorrect practice.. Instead, Yogani says that that disadvantage of AYP is overshadowed by the fact that the format of AYP, being a website accessible to millions, makes up for it.

 

In other words, it is ok to disseminate faulty information as long as you can do it to millions of people.. That makes it right or better.

 

Gee, if I would have had a teacher in person, maybe I wouldn't have done incorrect DM practice for 4 1/2.. (as Yogani pointed out to me.)

 

And, did you catch that part about AYP being created 10 years ago?

Do you really want to practice a "scientific invention" that consists of a mish mash of various practices, training in laxity, that eventually lead to overload and the inability to continue?

 

This is a quote from Yogani in that same post:

 

As for AYP, it does not come from a TM teacher. Rather, it comes from a wide-ranging exploration of many traditions, taking the best elements from each and integrating them all together into a cohesive "common sense" system that can be used by self-directed practitioners around the world. So it is a different thing. That is the path I have taken over 40+ years, so it stands to reason that AYP reflects that sort of open approach. In giving it back, the hope has been that others could benefit as I have.

 

Sometimes AYP has been called a TM derivative. Other times it has been called a Kriya Yoga derivative. Other times a form of Kundalini Yoga, Tantra Yoga, Hatha Yoga, or other things. Lately, AYP has even been called a Jnana/Advaita (non-duality) teaching. It is not any of these, and it is all of them -- the best elements from all of them integrated together for effective application by self-directed practitioners.

 

So, has Yogani denied that Deep Meditation is TM? He claims that Deep Meditation did not come from a TM teacher..

 

Do you know what happens when you build a car with pieces from various makes? If you have a caburetor from Ford, an engine block from Kia, an exhaust from BMW, brakes from Chev, sure, you might get something that runs and will take you from a to b. But there is no warranty, no dealer will want to fix it and it could be dangerous to drive. AYP is like that.

 

But yes, feel free to do what you want. Isn't your time more precious than money?

And if you do decide to follow AYP, be prepared for the following:

 

1) Any significant and insignificant experience that you have will be called "scenery"

 

2) If you post any post which does not support the AYP, deemed over-critical or not beneficial by the modertors, your post will be censored. If you persist in posting questions which are not beneficial to the AYP perspective, you will be banned. Freedom of speech is not respected at AYP, nor is AYP interested in universal Yoga or universal truth. It's AYP yoga or the highway.

 

3) After an arbitray amount of time (you have to find out for yourself because the web policy is too vaugue, on purpose), you will not be able to edit or delete your posts.

 

4) You will mostly find people who regurgitate the teachings on AYP (unless the person is a newcomer and doesn't realize the "secret" rules). This is also due to the heavy handed moderation.

 

5) Any time an intelligent, knowledgable poster starts to gain too much momentum and influence in the forum yet have divergent views, they will mysteriously disappear and never come back. (banned? )

 

6) If you think (like AYP) that TM or Deep Meditation is related to Patanjali's last three limbs of yoga or Patanjali's samyama, think again. Take a closer look. Learn what vitakka and vicara mean, directed attention and sustained attention (not dissolving attention as is the TM/DM way).

 

If you are going to learn TM or Deep Meditation, I suggest you do some research on it first. It is interesting that many web articles on the adverse effects of TM indicated that after 4 or 5 years, many TM teachers and practitioners develop some form of psychosis or mental ailment. Coupled with Kriya practices and other practices 'borrowed' from a dizzying array of sources, this result is probably realized sooner..

 

I would suggest that if you want to learn proper meditation, look into Buddhist Breath meditation, anapanasati.. Shaila Catherine's books, Alan Wallace, Ajahn Brahm, are all excellent. After all, Buddha got enlightened, didn't he?

 

The advantage with living in these modern times is that we have the internet at our disposal, and it is now easy to research, compare and become informed.

 

TI

[Tibetan_Ice]

No TI: the intention wasn't to insult you. It was to poke a bit of fun at you, at Jeff and at AYP.

 

Please consider it an ill-considered attempt at humour and kindly accept my apologies, although on rereading your post, I see that, worryingly, you seem to be deriving some masochistic pleasure from it, so perhaps, on further consideration, no apology is actually warranted?

 

Hi Gatito,

Jeff is an interesting case, isn't he? He has no formal practice, just plays with energy and often times he comes out with statements that make him appear like he has actually experienced it (like nirvikalpa samadhi). But if you press him for clarification you soon discover that his display is quite different from his experience.. Perhaps one day he will attempt to follow a disciplined routine instead of just playing with energy, or not.. His favorite question seems to be "Do you ever get angry?", because he claims that he never gets mad.. (ever since the lobotomy... ha ha ... kidding..).

 

Thanks for the clarification and apology. Sometimes humour doesn't work in written text. I'm not masochistic, but then again, maybe you could call it that, at least towards the mind.

I would prefer to call it the "one taste". In Shaila Catherine's book called "Wisdom Wide and Deep", part of her suggested practices is to closely examine the sensations of pleasure and pain. When you do that, you discover that pleasure has a seed of pain in it, and pain has a seed of pleasure in it. And, when you break all sensations down to their constituent parts, they start to all feel the same. It is a great practice, especially when getting your teeth cleaned or visiting the dentist.

 

A while ago, I found the same kind of thing on a youtube video by Shinzen Young..

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QkI4S9IqrXI&feature=relmfu

 

 

 

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8Zz_BfTdp4E&feature=relmfu

 

 

 

TI

Edited November 10, 2012 by Tibetan_Ice

[Jeff]

 

Hi Gatito,

Jeff is an interesting case, isn't he? He has no formal practice, just plays with energy and often times he comes out with statements that make him appear like he has actually experienced it (like nirvikalpa samadhi). But if you press him for clarification you soon discover that his display is quite different from his experience.. Perhaps one day he will attempt to follow a disciplined routine instead of just playing with energy, or not.. His favorite question seems to be "Do you ever get angry?", because he claims that he never gets mad.. (ever since the lobotomy... ha ha ... kidding..).

 

 

Hi TI (and Gatito),

 

 

I wish you (both) well on your path.

 

 

(p.s. Your old friend says "hi".)

 

[gatito]

Hi Gatito,

Jeff is an interesting case, isn't he? He has no formal practice, just plays with energy and often times he comes out with statements that make him appear like he has actually experienced it (like nirvikalpa samadhi). But if you press him for clarification you soon discover that his display is quite different from his experience.. Perhaps one day he will attempt to follow a disciplined routine instead of just playing with energy, or not.. His favorite question seems to be "Do you ever get angry?", because he claims that he never gets mad.. (ever since the lobotomy... ha ha ... kidding..).

 

Thanks for the clarification and apology. Sometimes humour doesn't work in written text. I'm not masochistic, but then again, maybe you could call it that, at least towards the mind.

I would prefer to call it the "one taste". In Shaila Catherine's book called "Wisdom Wide and Deep", part of her suggested practices is to closely examine the sensations of pleasure and pain. When you do that, you discover that pleasure has a seed of pain in it, and pain has a seed of pleasure in it. And, when you break all sensations down to their constituent parts, they start to all feel the same. It is a great practice, especially when getting your teeth cleaned or visiting the dentist.

 

A while ago, I found the same kind of thing on a youtube video by Shinzen Young..

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

TI

 

In the light of this latest post you can consider my already revised and qualified apology to be withdrawn.

 

If you actually really ever felt insulted you should report me to the moderators.

Edited November 11, 2012 by gatito

[RongzomFan]

I would suggest that if you want to learn proper meditation, look into Buddhist Breath meditation, anapanasati.. Shaila Catherine's books, Alan Wallace, Ajahn Brahm, are all excellent. After all, Buddha got enlightened, didn't he?

 

From the perspective of Vajrayana, meditation is contrived and conceptual.

 

Some good posts by Loppon Malcolm:

 

http://www.dharmawheel.net/viewtopic.php?f=40&t=4704

[Jeff]

 

From the perspective of Vajrayana, meditation is contrived and conceptual.

 

Some good posts by Loppon Malcolm:

 

http://www.dharmawheel.net/viewtopic.php?f=40&t=4704

 

Thanks for pointing out the above thread. I had missed it the first time around on the wheel.

 

[RongzomFan]

(P.s. Consider asking your teacher about the purpose of the rainbow body.)

 

do you have some point you are trying to make?

[Jeff]

 

 

do you have some point you are trying to make?

 

It relates to a previous discussion on consciousness. In understanding what the rainbow body is (or purpose of it), one can better understand the difference between self-relization and true Buddhahood. The dharma wheel thread you posted also touches on it through the description of Tibbetan "completion stage" practices.

 

[RongzomFan]

It relates to a previous discussion on consciousness. In understanding what the rainbow body is (or purpose of it), one can better understand the difference between self-relization and true Buddhahood. The dharma wheel thread you posted also touches on it through the description of Tibbetan "completion stage" practices.

 

 

 

Yes you first recognize the nature of the mind.

 

But then you have to remove all delusion, which is omniscient Buddhahood.

[RongzomFan]

(12:58 AM) Thusness: all those practitioners even after non-dual experience and still sink back to the Subject, will have the tendency of skewing towards the stage 3.

 

*Maybe Xabir can elaborate more on this.

 

 

Xabir and Thusness are not authorities on anything. In fact, they are always wrong about everything

[Apech]

Xabir and Thusness are not authorities on anything. In fact, they are always wrong about everything

 

Being always wrong is something of an achievement. Most people are right sometimes just through chance.

[gatito]

Xabir and Thusness are not authorities on anything. In fact, they are always wrong about everything

 

That means that, if we head in the opposite direction, we're certain to find the Truth.

 

The saviours have finally arrived!!!!

 

Somebody take out full page advertisments in all the major newspapers to tell the world leaders.

 

(@ Jeff: That's a joke about MMH founder of the TM cult)

[Jeff]

Hi SJ,

 

For simplicity, rather than copy your whole post, I will just respond.

 

Your above post describes things in a Thusness scale/system. I have had a couple of email exchanges with Xabir about it, but my knowledge of it (and the seven levels) is very limited. My experience on order and context has been different. As stated before, my path has been similar to Dzogchen (with Tantra /Tummo/Kundalini). The lack of Thusness describing/experiencing any energy/light flows makes it very challenging to compare/contrast. As an example, the opening of the 8th chakra is equivalent to beginning of forming a light body, but if someone can't even "feel" energy/light, it is very hard to have the discussion.

 

[Jeff]

 

Yes you first recognize the nature of the mind.

 

But then you have to remove all delusion, which is omniscient Buddhahood.

 

Agreed. But many seem to "think" that they are done after recognizing the nature of mind (consciousness). Removing/dropping/letting go of all delusion/obstructions can take a while to "unfold".

 

[idiot_stimpy]

My Dakini-woman, my queen, my lady!

 

The visible form of my pure awareness,

Form not separate from me, nor yet a part of me,

The phenomenal appearance of empty space:

She is beyond compare and beyond words.

[DreamBliss]

@TI

 

UPDATE!

 

This post is about to be heavily edited because it seemed I misunderstood some things and I want to set the record straight.

 

But yes, feel free to do what you want. Isn't your time more precious than money?

And if you do decide to follow AYP, be prepared for the following:

 

1) Any significant and insignificant experience that you have will be called "scenery"

 

2) If you post any post which does not support the AYP, deemed over-critical or not beneficial by the moderators, your post will be censored. If you persist in posting questions which are not beneficial to the AYP perspective, you will be banned. Freedom of speech is not respected at AYP, nor is AYP interested in universal Yoga or universal truth. It's AYP yoga or the highway.

 

3) After an arbitrary amount of time (you have to find out for yourself because the web policy is too vague, on purpose), you will not be able to edit or delete your posts.

 

4) You will mostly find people who regurgitate the teachings on AYP (unless the person is a newcomer and doesn't realize the "secret" rules). This is also due to the heavy handed moderation.

 

5) Any time an intelligent, knowledgeable poster starts to gain too much momentum and influence in the forum yet have divergent views, they will mysteriously disappear and never come back. (banned? )

 

6) If you think (like AYP) that TM or Deep Meditation is related to Patanjali's last three limbs of yoga or Patanjali's samyama, think again. Take a closer look. Learn what vitakka and vicara mean, directed attention and sustained attention (not dissolving attention as is the TM/DM way).

 

If you are going to learn TM or Deep Meditation, I suggest you do some research on it first. It is interesting that many web articles on the adverse effects of TM indicated that after 4 or 5 years, many TM teachers and practitioners develop some form of psychosis or mental ailment. Coupled with Kriya practices and other practices 'borrowed' from a dizzying array of sources, this result is probably realized sooner..

 

I would suggest that if you want to learn proper meditation, look into Buddhist Breath meditation, anapanasati.. Shaila Catherine's books, Alan Wallace, Ajahn Brahm, are all excellent. After all, Buddha got enlightened, didn't he?

 

I have never visited the AYP forums and am not sure I will. I have no calling in that direction at this time. It is unfortunate if what you say is true and they are censoring people. However that does not mean that the teachers of the AYP curriculum are to blame. They may be as helpless to do anything about it as anyone else. Maybe they do speak up and are ignored, their posts deleted. I don't know. But if this sort of forum control is going in then it is probably due to the people in charge or the “public image” people. It would be nice to see the AYP teachers separate themselves from AYP if this sort of thinking is going on and do their own thing, outside censoring or worry about “public image.”

 

As far as number 6 I have never compared any of these meditation techniques to anything else. I have read various texts on meditation, some books that weren't on meditation at all. I listened to George Noory's take on meditation. I read some books on chakra meditation. Even Wayne Dyer's book on it. I have tried new methods, dropped them, tried other ones, dropped those. But I find myself returning to “Deep Mediation” using my own mantra over and over again. My current mantra is, “Release, Flow.”

 

I have recently dropped DM once again and started to use Josephine McCarthy's meditation as detailed in, “Magical Knowledge I.” It is like ZaZen, except you count the out breath to 10 and back down again. Later you add a visualization of black smoke coming out with each exhale, and white smoke coming in with each inhale. I don't know how long I will stick with this. But for now this is what I am practicing.

 

As far as people going crazy using DM or TM I suppose you have proof of this statement? Any sort of research to back this up? How about 3 different, authentic, good resources for detailing the pros and cons of “dissolving attention”, “directed attention” and “focused awareness” in meditation? This would be a very fascinating field of study.

 

In the interim I will look up the books you suggested. Unfortunately folks keep suggesting these books around here, but they are not at my library, and the last one, “Opening the Third Eye” which someone recommended., is $50.00 - $100.00+ used! McCarthy's book, which I got for information on portals, was about $25.00 with tax and shipping. My point is it does not good to recommend these texts if the average person can not get them inexpensively or easily through... Ahem... Other less ethical means using the wondrous internet.

 

If I had the kind of money needed to buy all the books I should read as recommended here I would also have enough to enjoy my first real vacation in 20 years, a surf yoga retreat, a TM meditation retreat, a Buddhist meditation retreat, etc. As I do not have this sort of money, and it is unlikely at this time in my life that I will have it, well getting a book to teach me something is as impractical as going to India for me at this time.

 

Thank you for sharing the information with me I requested. I have decided to remove the AYP books from my list for now. The possible issues with them were, as far as I'm concerned, brought to my attention for a reason.

 

Thanks again!

- DreamBliss

Edited November 12, 2012 by DreamBliss

[RongzomFan]

Agreed. But many seem to "think" that they are done after recognizing the nature of mind (consciousness). Removing/dropping/letting go of all delusion/obstructions can take a while to "unfold".

 

Yes many people think that the end goal is recognizing the instant of unfabricated freshness (ma bcos shes pa skad cig ma) and the conceptualizing mind.

 

This is just the beginning.

 

You still have to work with the body's channels using esoteric tantric techniques until omniscient Buddhahood.

Edited November 11, 2012 by alwayson