Tony Parsons Interview

[gatito]

Yep - tricky!!

 

I don't think that I've got it quite right myself either because I was trying to point out that not just any Hindu would do..........Hey! that rymes!

 

Maybe I'm a better poet than a stand-up comedian? (Or maybe I'm useless as both? - before someone torpedos me with that rather obvious opening!!

 

In fact, I think think that I'll leave the floor to TTB's own erudite resident comic to have the last word.

[GrandmasterP]

Yep. Kosher guru.

Good luck to him.

He does touch on the Kabbala in one of those books, it's all to do with chakras apparently.

The Indian lady got her money's worth for sure.

[gatito]

Yep. Kosher guru.

Good luck to him.

He does touch on the Kabbala in one of those books, it's all to do with chakras apparently.

The Indian lady got her money's worth for sure.

 

Personally endorsed by an "Indian lady" and GrandmasterP - you really can't go wrong with that.........can you?

[Lucky7Strikes]

Hi 7 strikes

 

 

 

I said my body had no survival needs, I did not say that I do not drink water or look both ways when I cross the road.

 

Do you understand the difference?

 

When I drink water I drink water. All this talk about doing it in order to survive is a fiction in your own head. It's a story you 100% believe in.

 

You have not seen emptiness yet, although your recognition of good emptiness teachers like Tony Parsons means that you soon will. You know it deep inside but its not fully conscious so you can't yet put it into words. Maybe we can talk some more later.

 

best wishes

 

You certainly have never been hungry or thirsty enough. Your mind saying: in drinking, just drinking water, walking just walking, and all phenomena are empty is actually much more of a fictional story than your body's survival needs. This is the totally delusional understanding of arm chair Buddhists!

 

Your body's needs are much more concrete than your ideas and it is very intelligent in its own way. If you practice energy practices or are aware of your body's mechanics, you will see that its reality is much more than what you may have happening in your mind. Your mind on the surface may not say to you "Im drinking water to survive." Of course not! It's very much molded into it from generations and generations! Until your body realizes directly the illusions of the physical world, you have no right to claim that its needs are a fiction. But have you? Have you seen through totally the illusions of the material realm? Be straight with yourself. Because if you have, you are a bodhisattva of a certain stature.

 

Having a physical body and knowing none other than the physical means that you are very much entrenched in its mechanisms for survival. If you have gone beyond that, I'd be very much interested in your direct experiences beyond the body. But I'm telling you, a good idea to test is just cut yourself a bit, or burn yourself, see what sentiments arise.

Edited November 12, 2012 by Lucky7Strikes

[Apech]

Personally endorsed by an "Indian lady" and GrandmasterP - you really can't go wrong with that.........can you?

 

That Indian Lady knows what she's doing ... I think GP's just blagging it

[gatito]

That Indian Lady knows what she's doing ... I think GP's just blagging it

 

I'ver no idea myself. I've even not looked.

 

I'm just trying to play with GMP - but he dosen't seem to want to bite.

 

(I suppose that's a good thing really. )

[gatito]

By the way, you should pop across and tidy up the Buddhist Forums when you've got a chance they've made a right mess over there.

 

Here's a picture I took earlier: -

 

 

You should really make them fill that in when they've stopped playing.

 

Someone could have a nasty accident if they fall into that.

Edited November 12, 2012 by gatito

[Nikolai1]

7strikes

 

Your mind saying: in drinking, just drinking water, walking just walking, and all phenomena are empty is actually much more of a fictional story than your body's survival needs.

 

My mind doesn't say it. What I said about just drinking water was a message to you designed to communicate the reality of any given reality.

 

Until your body realizes directly the illusions of the physical world, you have no right to claim that its needs are a fiction.

 

I have directly realised the illusions of the physical world. I have therefore directly realised the illusion of my body. The notion that the body is an 'entity with needs' is nothing more than an opinion, and always was. I drink water. All these notions about survival are illusions.

 

Have you seen through totally the illusions of the material realm? Be straight with yourself. Because if you have, you are a bodhisattva of a certain stature.

 

Yes to that, and through the illusion of the mental realm too as it happens. As to my stature, all I know is that I'm now in a position to talk about it. For years and years I simply wasn't.

 

If you have gone beyond that, I'd be very much interested in your direct experiences beyond the body.

 

I don't even know what you are talking about. For me, all experience is beyond the body. If you want me to tell you something extraordinary then I can't. My life is quite normal, although my thread on the law of attraction comes from experience.

 

Best wishes

[GrandmasterP]

That Indian Lady knows what she's doing ... I think GP's just blagging it

 

LOL

Happy Diwali

[GrandmasterP]

I'ver no idea myself. I've even not looked.

 

I'm just trying to play with GMP - but he dosen't seem to want to bite.

 

(I suppose that's a good thing really. )

.....

I don't bite.

[Lucky7Strikes]

Hi Lucky

Don't get all confused now.. My feelings were not hurt. I have no interest in being insulted. I detected an abusive attitude in your posts/insults. Especially in the PM that you sent me.. remember?

 

You titled it "HEY YOU!"

You say the posts were abusive. Abusive! A bit of a drama queen you are! No one's here to abuse anyone here. Despite the language I use I know almost everyone here are genuine seekers.

 

I thought there were forum rules about insulting people.. Are you in danger of being banned here? Hey, if I could I'd insult you too! It's fun! It creates energy which, when dissolved by direct attention, produces great bliss.

Lol! Are you sure your feelings were not hurt? Banning people! Haha!

 

Yeah go ahead! Insult me! It has nothing to do with bliss, sure that may be the sensation of it, but its good to push one another and not have a filter in between discussions. I know that you are holding a lot back in these posts, and you really shouldn't! Speak your mind freely. Don't worry I won't ask anyone to be banned.

 

And what a contradiction that is. Did you actually study his teachings? Sadguru is shouting and selling "bliss, bliss, bliss" himself.

Have a look at this video.

 

In it, the Sadguru is saying that you have to enhance your perception with bliss from the pineal gland in order to have something more happen. He himself is pushing bliss. So, it is clear you don't understand what he is selling.

Ah, you don't understand the difference between sensational bliss and true bliss that comes from realization. One is fleeting, the other, is realizing something very natural within. Spirituality is supposed to be blissful! But if that becomes a goal for the ego, then it becomes trouble. It becomes like a drug, and the seeker becomes more entrenched in craving.

 

Don't try to analyze so much about the words Sadhguru is saying, but the meanings and the contexts of them. Don't you see how he is trying to relate the bliss of spirituality to the mundane person's search for it in daily activities like drinking and drugs? As Max would say, too much in the head, not enough in the heart.

 

This is no doubt, how to add something to you, which is contrary to most teachings, including Dzogchen, which strip off the layers of the onion (or settle them down until they become transparent).

 

And then, after all you've supported the maxim that it is wrong to heal anyone, in this next video, Sadguru is saying that sambhavi will activate the expression of your bliss body and that it will heal all your ailments!

 

But he never tells you how. You have to buy that...

 

 

It's a very bad sign when there is no consistency in the teachings. And, selling sambhavi as a healing tool that performs miracles is quite a sales pitch, isn't it?

Self healing is different from healing another person. These are very obvious points Tibetan Ice...I'm scratching my head really...

 

Note: I have been performing sambhavi during my twice daily meditations for 5 years now. Every day. So I am very familiar with the practice, and the light, and the bliss, and the visions, and the kundalini... First time I hear that it heals all your ailments though..

Perhaps the context in which you learned the practice is different. This is also a very obvious point for spirituality practices. The teaching isn't just about the technique, of how long you hold the breath or what type of posture you are in.

 

Sorry, didn't you say that Max was breeding a bevy of bliss bunnies with kunlun? Perhaps that's not how you meant it but it appeared to me to discredit Max and his Kunlun.

No. I clearly didn't. You are misunderstanding everything and not seeing things clearly. It was very clear what I wrote. It's been a very acknowledge problem with certain kunlun practitioners that they just become attached to the sensation of bliss like a drug. Max wrote about this several times on the forum when it was running, and I believe he mentioned it on the primordialalchemist blog a few times. It's not about the technique but the mindset, just like the Shambhavi. Two teachers can teach the same technique with an entirely different context to them, and they will be different practices as a result. The Shambhavi Sadhguru teaches comes with very carefully planned ways of shifting the mind's way of perception.

 

It's a funny world that we live in. If you kill someone, you go to jail. If you kill someone in war-time, you become a hero. So you see, you can be both at the same time. It's all a matter of perception.

However, if it is true that he kept the death of his wife secret for nearly a year before he told her family, that is borderline psycho.

You totally missed the point of my example.

 

What does it matter how long he kept the death of his wife from her family when she has severed herself from her body identity completely? Family is a physical relationship. Her true family is her fellow seekers. And didn't you read my reply? There were many people there during her time of passing and the father-in-law just filed unfounded police investigation all of them that came to nothing.

 

So how much has it cost you to take part in the Isha initiative?

Very reasonable! A four day retreat I'm attending this weekend is only 400 dollars and they give you food, beds, even towels!

 

You know, you may have spent a few hours writing your abusive responses, but I also spent 3 or 4 hours watching Sadguru's youtube videos. I was happy in the fact that you had found the true guru, that which is inside of everyone. I was not happy to meet Sadguru and his sales pitches, stupid stories and underhanded marketing techniques.

 

But really, who cares? Who cares if you gain bliss from an authentic guru, a charlatan, an avatar or by placebo? Isn't the realization what counts, not the source?

Sadhguru disturbs you doesn't he? But I bet he still draws you in very much. That's why you watched hours of his videos and you mind made all the nonsense to counter whatever he is saying. That's great! It's a sign that you have encountered someone who you can truly learn from. If a teacher only appeases you, then he is just catering towards your current preferences. No true growth can happen in such relationships. Only when you are threatened but at once drawn, you know he or she is the right teacher for you.

Edited November 12, 2012 by Lucky7Strikes

[Lucky7Strikes]

Fair enough. But your behaviour should have shown the bliss that you had achieved, shoudn't it have?

Yeah! And luckily a lot of people responded positively. But there are still many people who cannot see anything besides their mind's analysis. And when they read any posts validating that nonsense, no matter how ridiculous they may be, they cling to it! Weren't you hear for the whole Kunlun fiasco on thetaobums?

 

I bought "The Crystal and the Way of Light" back in Sept, 2011. I'm trying to find "The Crystal Cave" nowadays. "Heart Drops of Dharmakaya" is pretty good too.

 

My point was that you said Dzogchen is not a practice and I am pointing out that it is definately a practice, a series of practices. Once one realizes rigpa, the goal is to remain in it 24/7. That is some practice. It is not "doing nothing" as you said. Nor is it the futility of practice that Tony Parsons says.

 

What's the matter? Can't stand peace or silence? Sometimes it speaks louder than words.

It's just a matter of words. But the 24/7 practice should become effortless. You like Xabir's stuff don't you? 24/7 practice means there is no conscious act of practicing since you no longer see duality of a doer and the deed done. Every action is self liberating and total and effortless. Hence the term "no practice and no method" can seem more fitting.

 

Peace and silence? Psh! I'm silent when I'm silent, and LOUD AS I WANT TO BE WHEN I WANT!

[flowing hands]

Tony Parsons doesn't know a fig!!!!!!!!

[Lucky7Strikes]

Tony Parsons doesn't know a fig!!!!!!!!

That's probably what he'd say too.

[GrandmasterP]

Yep he'd agree with you there Shaman FH. 'Nothing at All' is what Tony knows. Figs included.

Edited November 12, 2012 by GrandmasterP

[gatito]

.....

I don't bite.

 

Now we both know that's not true.

[GrandmasterP]

We do?

Little Mr Sunshine that's me.

Nary a snap this side of Michaelmas.

Ages since I turned anyone into a frog.

[gatito]

We do?

Little Mr Sunshine that's me.

Nary a snap this side of Michaelmas.

Ages since I turned anyone into a frog.

 

LOL QED

Edited November 12, 2012 by gatito

[Lucky7Strikes]

7strikes

 

 

 

My mind doesn't say it. What I said about just drinking water was a message to you designed to communicate the reality of any given reality.

 

 

 

I have directly realised the illusions of the physical world. I have therefore directly realised the illusion of my body. The notion that the body is an 'entity with needs' is nothing more than an opinion, and always was. I drink water. All these notions about survival are illusions.

It's not important whether or not you mind says it consciously. Our minds often don't say things consciously but act from deeper layers within.

 

Share with us the difference between a direct realization of the illusions of the physical world and an indirect realization of the illusions of the physical world.

 

And by the way, that the body is an entity with needs is NOT an opinion if you have not experienced beyond ordinary physical senses to see clearly that the body is an illusion, and to understand the mechanisms and causes of the illusion of the body having arisen. No matter how ultimately true the fact that the body is an illusion may be, for you it is still the truth that the body is there as a fully functioning living organism. No matter what you believe, this is in your direct knowing that you have a body and it has a presence within a physical realm. This is again, NOT an opinion if you are not freely able to navigate the illusion as illusion. Do not make fairy tales out of this. Be straight with your condition.

 

It is however another thing to slow apply the understanding that the world is an illusion to your practice until direct realization is had.

 

Yes to that, and through the illusion of the mental realm too as it happens. As to my stature, all I know is that I'm now in a position to talk about it. For years and years I simply wasn't.

 

 

 

I don't even know what you are talking about. For me, all experience is beyond the body. If you want me to tell you something extraordinary then I can't. My life is quite normal, although my thread on the law of attraction comes from experience.

 

Best wishes

 

If you have yet to experience reality beyond the senses you have not seen directly the illusions of the physical realm. Please be straight with yourself. You can have a very thorough understanding that the world is an illusion, but this does not necessary mean you've had a direct experience, an unshakeable knowing of the world's illusory nature.

 

It seems that you have understood emptiness but have not yet seen the depths to which it can perpetuate your being. To be lost here in saying, "there is not even a being to penetrate" then you have gotten stuck on the surface ideology of emptiness, whereupon you are only applying that understanding to surface experience.

 

There are great many layers to a person. The body, the energies, the emotions...to dismiss them because of the small glimpse of emptiness and the idea of emptiness is to be given a key to a tremendous treasure underneath you, but believing that the key itself is the treasure. True meditation can perhaps be said to happen only when one has a slight understanding of emptiness. One should extend their efforts even more at such a stage.

[hydrogen]

 

There are great many layers to a person. The body, the energies, the emotions...to dismiss them because of the small glimpse of emptiness and the idea of emptiness is to be given a key to a tremendous treasure underneath you, but believing that the key itself is the treasure. True meditation can perhaps be said to happen only when one has a slight understanding of emptiness. One should extend their efforts even more at such a stage.

 

Yes, Sensai.

 

Would you please share with us your direct experiences with emptiness?

[Lucky7Strikes]

Yes, Sensai.

 

Would you please share with us your direct experiences with emptiness?

 

Haha! Sensei! Far from it...veeerrryy far from it...but I know the difference between what is direct and what is indirect. For a long time I was a indirect practitioner. I am very familiar with the words and concepts people use especially from Buddhist lingo in the most cunning ways...because haha! I've been the most guilty of them all! This is my experience of anatta, or emptiness of self.

 

When I was doing intense practice, I realized first that despite all the knowledge I had gathered about "myself" I really did not know who I was at all. I then realized I didn't even know what the hell "knowing" was. Digging deeper and deeper I clearly saw that there was no one there at all that there was merely a boundary around nothing making it seem like there was. At that moment something within my energy body clicked open as if a knot that had been there to hold onto a boundary between itself and the rest of the world just let go instantaneously. I lost all sense of self will, and a tremendous sadness and pain started rushing from all parts of my body. I cried as if it were my own funeral!

 

Then the sudden absolute clarity of hilarity overcame everything, like my entire life of suffering was a very stupid joke! I don't know for how long but I danced in this stupendous feeling of ecstasy and freedom! One could do absolutely no wrong! My personality was seen to be a clear concoction of the mind, and no independent "thing" was found anywhere at all, even in other people. There's a great Zen poem on this about this Korean monk who rushed immediately out of his meditation hall and sang "who will I tell it to? there's no one here, there's no one here..." Like my signature says, it was a moment of a thousand petals entering an empty house, the entire world seemed blissful naturally, every step felt like a liberation of life, the sound of the herder's flute, and not of a human being.

 

But my deeper understandings came later when I saw that my old habits based on notions around the ego were still very much there or began re emerging after the peak experience, like the branches of a tree still there after the roots had been cut. If you read Hakuin's Kensho: Four Ways of Knowing, he puts in perfectly when he says that just because the sun has begun to rise, don't expect the snow to instantly melt. The snow was still there, and more than that, I saw that there are deeper inter-connected levels of blockages affected by years of living under the idea of a self entity within my energies, mind, and body. My energy practices after this took on a whole another dimension. I finally understood just a little bit (finally! like I was learning to baby step after witnessing people run marathons ) about what my Kunlun practice was there to do. Energy practices aren't to build energy, but rather to melt into that potential, that sea of energy always around us and within us but we feel separated from. Everything that I had been doing just took on a whole another direction. You may not see it from these posts, but I felt very humbled by all this. I felt like a miniature insect in a endless jungle that is the vast universe.

 

P.S.

 

Around 2 years ago, I also had days of tremendous awareness experiences where my consciousness began experiencing another level of being awake, like I was shown that our normal everyday consciousness was actually half sleeping compared to this. I was awake during sleep, and couldn't really eat anything. Just a lot of water and laughter. It was another dimension of awakefulness than beyond mere bodily senses. The comedown from that was not pleasant due to my lack of understanding and immaturity. Then it was 2 years of struggling in my own filth.

 

Hence when I'm questioning Nikolai's statement on realizing that the outer world is a complete illusion, which is a realization one should ultimately arrive at (likely in degrees...to the point where it becomes certain that it is like a magical dream and never existent) according to Buddhism and even modern science, certain signs of your realization should manifest in shifts in consciousness and energy. It shouldn't be a mundane thing at all (too many people, having had no such break through fall into the ever popular zen saying, carry water, chop wood. Those are grounding practices that you do in these states to keep rooted on earth). The mundane should be shattered. I suspect it will be much more vibrant and incisive than seeing the emptiness of self since the physical world has a much stronger anchor than the personality. You can change personalities easily and observe the shifting of the ego. But to take the roots of the physical dimension out, it would require a level of energy the body is normally unaccustomed to.

Edited November 13, 2012 by Lucky7Strikes

[Lucky7Strikes]

I want to clarify that I don't mean to say everyone's experiences should be like mine. No not at all. People all hold to different truths and beliefs within them, and how they release will be dependent on that. But I do believe it is not a gentle experience as people seem to believe meditation is supposed to be. For me it was a literally mind shattering experience, and by far the most intense moments of my life.

Edited November 13, 2012 by Lucky7Strikes

[Boy]

...

Edited December 13, 2012 by Boy

[Jeff]

Hi Lucky7strikes,

 

Thank you for sharing. Is the energy flow 24/7 or only with practices? Do you feel different types of energy?

 

Also, when you were with/experienced Sadguru... Did it feel like you were in a "bubble" of him (or possibly like he came into you at a cellular level)?

 

 

(edit - added a question)

Edited November 13, 2012 by Jeff

[Lucky7Strikes]

Hi Lucky7strikes,

 

Thank you for sharing. Is the energy flow 24/7 or only with practices? Do you feel different types of energy?

 

Also, when you were with/experienced Sadguru... Did it feel like you were in a "bubble" of him (or possibly like he came into you at a cellular level)?

 

 

(edit - added a question)

 

The energy flow is completely dependent on the mindset. Non grasping and not identifying with your body and mind leads to a smooth flow. I practice Kunlun, which is a downward path and when experientially the mind at the head level begins to sink into the heart you begin to interact things is a very fluid manner...very much in harmony with the energies of your surroundings. Especially with other people. I'm not sure if you are familiar with Kunlun, but Max's mantra is to live the art, and I'm just now understanding that (haha! after like 4 years!)

 

But when I practice the current becomes intense and a lot of purging happens. For me much blocked emotional content tends to come out, crying, screaming, and just letting whatever you held within you simply flow out. This is, as I see it, the approach to nondual energy states...hopefully leading to the point where my energies are clearly seen to be interconnected with everything around me. That hasn't happened yet to its full extent...still a lot of letting go to do.

 

I'm not sure what you mean by types of energies, but I do feel my body's energy shift usually from constricted and unbalanced states to just being without any obstacles..like I'm just floating in my surroundings. I try not to associate any of my energetic states to outside influences. I think then the blame game begins. It's usually things within me being dug out. I only recently feel comfortable opening up energetically to people who'd like to do energy work on me, and really I'd only let someone who knows what their doing do that (hint: Max, Diana). Those experiences I'd rather keep to myself, because it would just create expectations for people (I really want people to experience it for themselves without any stories getting in the way). But it's nothing fancy like spirits or demons....just very mundane yet powerful emotions and habits within you expressing themselves. But when it's all calm, usually my body is running a cool, but excited current (like I'm kid about to go into a toy store), I guess that's why they often call it the cool fire.

 

In context of Sadhguru...just being near him your body and awareness feel as if they are being soaked with "awareness-juice". Not on a sensation level, but at a deeper, existential level. But it's not just him, the people of Isha and the way they conduct things create a certain atmosphere where you are not associating with the nonsense happening in your head but very intensely becoming aware of yourself not as an individual, but this vibrating life not different from the trees, insets, animals, the earth...It's a very devoted atmosphere there towards one another, not just Sadhguru. It crushes your silly-self.

 

However, during my direct experiences, it was JUST ME It's not like I felt Sadhguru entering me or whatever. It was just me being in that atmosphere without distractions searching within. If there is enough intention, I believe that can be created anywhere. Those moments were when the past three four years of practice culminated into the realizations I described above. Please don't think it was Sadhguru who somehow gave me these experiences. He was just there to nudge me and be a guardian to keep out the nonsense outside of spiritual work.

Edited November 13, 2012 by Lucky7Strikes