Tony Parsons Interview

[Jeff]

Hi Lucky7strikes,

 

Thank you for your thoughtful response. I do not practice Kunlun, but I do practice something very similar. I know what you mean by the energy "shaking" issues/obstructions loose. It is very impressive that you can let them go when they come up, many try to just avoid them and "hide" in deeper levels of consciousness.

 

By different types of energy, I meant that different types of obstructions/issues resonate with different types (or frequency ranges) of energy/light. Different paths (or cultures) describe the energies (or winds) in various ways.

 

Finally, I know what you mean about the impact of "awareness-juice". My question about entering/bubble relates whether you had formed a "guru" connection to Sadhguru. Your statement of "He was just there to nudge me and be a guardian to keep out the nonsense outside of spiritual work." answers my question.

 

Thanks again and enjoy the day.

 

[Tibetan_Ice]

 

Self healing is different from healing another person. These are very obvious points Tibetan Ice...I'm scratching my head really...

 

...

 

Sadhguru disturbs you doesn't he? But I bet he still draws you in very much. That's why you watched hours of his videos and you mind made all the nonsense to counter whatever he is saying. That's great! It's a sign that you have encountered someone who you can truly learn from. If a teacher only appeases you, then he is just catering towards your current preferences. No true growth can happen in such relationships. Only when you are threatened but at once drawn, you know he or she is the right teacher for you.

 

 

Hi Lucky

That is quite an experience you had there. Thank you for posting it..

 

There is no me. There is no you. To heal you is to heal me.

 

Usually, there are reasons for my actions, sometimes I'm not aware of them..

 

I was watching this video by Sadhguru called "introduction to kundalini yoga, third eye chakra meditation, kundalini yoga meditation beginners, " on youtube..

 

Here it is:

 

and in the notes for that youtube video:

 

Sadhguru is a yoga master, meditation master from India. The kundalini yoga, kundalini meditation, third eye chakra mediation (or) "inner engineering" an advanced kriya yoga meditation techniques / asanas he teaches all over the world has benefited millions of people / beginners to not only come out of depression, fear, sleep disorders, stress but also this kriya yoga meditation has helped people to awaken the kundalini shakti with in themselves and also helped millions of beginners to have the experience of third eye opening / activation and through the third eye guided meditation to heal themselves of any chronic diseases and obtain disease resistance.

...

If you are beginner and interested in awakening your kundalini shakti and activate your navel chakra, heart chakra, throat chakra, third eye chakra, you must learn the kundalini yoga, kundalini meditation taught as "Inner engineering" as online yoga meditation class, please visit the following website for more information

 

 

What I don't understand is this: If you have Kunlun and Max, why do you need Sadhguru?

 

And this is the big one..

 

Since you seem to have a dedicated practice to Kunlun (4 years) and have a close relationship to Max, why don't you ask Max about the dangers of mixing Kunlun and Kundalini? I'm sure everyone would love to hear the response..

 

TI

[RiverSnake]

Yep. Kosher guru.

Good luck to him.

He does touch on the Kabbala in one of those books, it's all to do with chakras apparently.

The Indian lady got her money's worth for sure.

 

Which book does he talk about Kabbala in?

[Lucky7Strikes]

Hi Lucky

That is quite an experience you had there. Thank you for posting it..

 

There is no me. There is no you. To heal you is to heal me.

This is only true if it is in your experience. My experience is not yet at that level and so it is with most people. A glimpse does not mean a full blown knowing. People are separated relatively, therefore surface healing of the effects and not the causes can become a distraction, and a hindrance as Sadhguru says.

 

Usually, there are reasons for my actions, sometimes I'm not aware of them..

 

I was watching this video by Sadhguru called "introduction to kundalini yoga, third eye chakra meditation, kundalini yoga meditation beginners, " on youtube..

 

Here it is:

 

and in the notes for that youtube video:

 

 

 

What I don't understand is this: If you have Kunlun and Max, why do you need Sadhguru?

 

And this is the big one..

 

Since you seem to have a dedicated practice to Kunlun (4 years) and have a close relationship to Max, why don't you ask Max about the dangers of mixing Kunlun and Kundalini? I'm sure everyone would love to hear the response..

 

TI

Sadhguru's definition of Kundalini is different from the Kundalini Max talks about which is raising the fire energy up the spine, which is not what is taught in Inner Engineering or any practices I have been exposed from Isha. Sadhguru actually tells people not to mess with the spinal energies as does Max. Kundalini is defined by Sadhguru as simply "dormant energy."

 

The techniques I practice from Isha are very complementary with my Kunlun practice or else I would have immediately noticed a counter balance happening. I'm very aware of what's happening in my body energy wise, and having done both for the past 4-5 months, there has been absolutely no negative side effects. In Isha there's no raising the energy upwards, but it is about resting in the flow of energy, much like Kunlun.

 

It's not about a need. It's about feeling a connection with a teacher. Sadhguru has cleared up so much in my mind and has dragged me out of filth, just by his words. What I experienced from Sadhguru is not something I think I would have realized merely through Kunlun, or if I did, it would've happened at a much later point in practice.

 

Kunlun is my engine, Sadhuru is my map, and Thusness/Xabir/Buddhism are my vision.

Edited November 14, 2012 by Lucky7Strikes

[Birch]

This map business. I'm wondering about it. Is there a point at which one can reliably say with full knowledge that no more maps are required and that one is going to start making them oneself rather than following anyone else's?

 

What I've noticed about Sadguru and Mark Griffin is that they are often 'meta-commentators' on things, providing a somewhat-structured 'empty of concept' space into which people can rush while still feeling somewhat supported.

 

But that's just another opinion of mine.

[Tibetan_Ice]

This is only true if it is in your experience. My experience is not yet at that level and so it is with most people. A glimpse does not mean a full blown knowing. People are separated relatively, therefore surface healing of the effects and not the causes can become a distraction, and a hindrance as Sadhguru says.

 

 

Sadhguru's definition of Kundalini is different from the Kundalini Max talks about which is raising the fire energy up the spine, which is not what is taught in Inner Engineering or any practices I have been exposed from Isha. Sadhguru actually tells people not to mess with the spinal energies as does Max. Kundalini is defined by Sadhguru as simply "dormant energy."

 

The techniques I practice from Isha are very complementary with my Kunlun practice or else I would have immediately noticed a counter balance happening. I'm very aware of what's happening in my body energy wise, and having done both for the past 4-5 months, there has been absolutely no negative side effects. In Isha there's no raising the energy upwards, but it is about resting in the flow of energy, much like Kunlun.

 

It's not about a need. It's about feeling a connection with a teacher. Sadhguru has cleared up so much in my mind and has dragged me out of filth, just by his words. What I experienced from Sadhguru is not something I think I would have realized merely through Kunlun, or if I did, it would've happened at a much later point in practice.

 

Kunlun is my engine, Sadhuru is my map, and Thusness/Xabir/Buddhism are my vision.

 

Hi Lucky

I see no difference between the fire up the spine and the kriya yoga that isha is teaching. Sure, he doesn't define kundalini in the conventional sense of the word, but third eye practice is going to awaken the kundalini.

 

Just the other day I focused solely on the third eye with perfect posture and had flames going up the spine.. again..

 

The reason the Isha practices you are doing right now are not activating kundalini is because, according to this video, they don't start beginners off with "advanced" practices.. but you are definately heading for kundalini awakening unless you never get to the advanced lessons.. and don't be fooled.

 

 

Listen to this:

 

 

 

And there there is this:

link: http://www.kavitachhibber.com/main/main.jsp?id=sadhguru-Jun2007

 

Sadhguru, This particular question is tickling my mind for more than a decade. Many elderly people especially religious leaders discourage people practicing kundalini yoga.

Many of my father’s friends who follow hatha yoga and prayanama did not encourage me even to talk about the Kundalini during my early twenties. They sow a sense of fear in the mind of aspirants who wish to take Kundalini diksha. Why this kind of stigma is attached to the practice of Kundalini yoga. Does the practice of Kundalini yoga brings mental imbalance to the sadaka?-V Dhanaraj

It is not a question of stigma. It is just to prevent people from not doing it correctly without guidance. How can you do PhD, when you don’t even know the ABC to begin with. Yoga is a very powerful and sensitive process and if not done properly it won’t benefit you. Kundalini yoga especially can cause severe physical and psychological damage and therefore must never be attempted without proper supervision.

 

This is from Sadhguru himself:

link: http://australia.innerengineering.com/pages/kundalini/

 

This is the way of the kundalini; it is sitting right there. Everybody is sitting on a jackpot, but they are all looking in other directions; they are not looking where the treasure is. So they never realize something like this is there. So kundalini is that treasure within you which has been left unused, untapped. Now, the kind of energy which can create something as fantastic as a human body, if a huge volume of it is untapped, can you imagine what you could create out of it? Anything, isn’t it? You could make something fantastic out of it. You could use that energy to transform this into a completely different dimension altogether; a dimension that you cannot imagine.

 

 

-Sadhguru

 

 

So you aren't going to ask Max? I'm really curious because I do do Kunlun with an active Kundalini and although I can overload in 5 seconds. I just do Kunlun when things are calm..

 

Have you never done any kriya yoga?

 

TI

[Lucky7Strikes]

Hi Lucky

I see no difference between the fire up the spine and the kriya yoga that isha is teaching. Sure, he doesn't define kundalini in the conventional sense of the word, but third eye practice is going to awaken the kundalini.

 

Just the other day I focused solely on the third eye with perfect posture and had flames going up the spine.. again..

 

The reason the Isha practices you are doing right now are not activating kundalini is because, according to this video, they don't start beginners off with "advanced" practices.. but you are definately heading for kundalini awakening unless you never get to the advanced lessons.. and don't be fooled.

 

 

Listen to this:

 

 

 

And there there is this:

link: http://www.kavitachh...adhguru-Jun2007

 

 

 

This is from Sadhguru himself:

link: http://australia.inn...ages/kundalini/

 

 

 

So you aren't going to ask Max? I'm really curious because I do do Kunlun with an active Kundalini and although I can overload in 5 seconds. I just do Kunlun when things are calm..

 

Have you never done any kriya yoga?

 

TI

 

Third eye practice does not equal Kundalini. Isn't that obvious? Don't you know Red Phoenix is a third eye practice? Kunlun is a third eye practice.

 

"The reason why Isha practices..." Have you learned any Isha practices? Or are you just making assumptions...don't be fooled by what? What is Sadhguru trying to fool me with? The point here is I don't consciously force my energy anywhere during practice, but let it do its natural course with the right intentions and insight.

 

As for the first quote, the man asked specifically about Kundalini yoga and why people are often cautioned against it. So Sadhguru says it's because they need guidance. That doesn't suddenly make Isha practice fire path practices...

 

As for the second quote, you left out the first part of the whole quote, where he defines Kundalini. Your way of using only the last section after having read the introductory part is quite manipulative. I think it reveals what type of mindset you are in reading and watching Sadhguru.

 

Here is the part where Sadhguru talks about his definition of kundalini:

 

What is Kundalini?

 

If you look at it, on one level, kundalini is just another name for the source of your creation. Though you provided it the fuel from outside, all the growth that has happened to this body up to this day – from the day it was born and even before – has happened from inside, isn’t it? That energy which makes all this happen, you can call it God, Divine or whatever. In yoga, we gave it a specific name because we are not looking at it with faith, but as a science.

 

Today, science tells us that this body is the greatest piece of engineering on the planet. It really is a masterpiece. Something that is capable of creating this, you think this is all it could do? Suppose you saw one painting of an artist which was really incredible, would you think that is all he can do? He could be doing so many other things, isn’t it? Similarly, you allowed this energy to create only this much. You have seen just one piece of creation; you have not seen the rest of it. The whole system of yoga is looking at how to allow this ‘inner engineer’ or this ‘inner artist’ find his full potential. The physical body is the most basic thing he is able to create; he is doing it for everybody. If he is able to produce billions of them, then he must be capable of many more things. We are seeing how to allow him the freedom to function at his full creativity.

 

The word “kundalini” generally refers to that dimension of energy, which is yet to realize its potential. There is a huge volume of energy within you which is yet to find its potential. It is just there waiting, because what you call as a human being is still in the making. You are not yet a human being; you are a ‘human becoming,’ isn’t it? You are not an absolute entity of being human. There is constant scope to make yourself into a better human being. For this process to happen, the process of evolution allowed a huge volume of energy untapped, that if you become conscious, you could use this to make something fantastic out of it.

 

Ok?

 

I'll ask Max when certain practices like Shambhavi seem to counter my Kunlun. He'll know immediately and tell me to drop any other practices. But I'm not going to go up to him and do Shambhavi Mahamudra and ask if this is compatible with Kunlun. Why? Because, just like Max says with Red Phoenix, I was told not to share Shambhavi with people who are not initiated into Isha. It goes the other way too. If Sadhguru came up to me and asked about Red Phoenix, I won't show him at all unless I'm a facilitator teaching him. So I respect this both ways, because both Max and Sadhguru gave me the practices with those instructions.

 

I also don't know if Sadhguru's Shambhavi is what is generally known as Shambhavi, because he says it hasn't been taught this way to the general public ever. I'll probably ask Max about Sadhguru in the future. Maybe I'll shoot him and Diana an e-mail tomorrow. I'll let you know what they say.

 

As for your mix of Kundalini and Kunlun, you ask Max yourself. Sadhguru's Kundalini isn't what your doing. So the answer I get isn't going to be an answer pertaining to you at all.

 

I saw Max this weekend and energy work together and he didn't mention anything about Kundalini energies or whatever within me and I had been practicing Shambhavi for 3-4 months twice every day. I had tremendous openings working with him and Diana. I've had no energetic problems with combining both practices, instead complete opposite. My Kunlun took on a whole another level coming back from Sadhguru.

 

Kriya Yoga? Well you said it yourself in this post. What Sadhguru teaches is called Kriya Yoga. My Kunlun activates during Shmbhavi all the time, and I feel a similar energy at Isha groups.

 

Anyways it seems like your the one now obsessing over Sadhguru for some reason. It looks like you can't put this down. If he was really a total nutjob and an actor like you said in your original post, you'd stopped watching his videos after first two or three. So this is great! Keep watching them. It's clear something is drawing you towards him but at once very afraid of him.

Edited November 14, 2012 by Lucky7Strikes

[Tibetan_Ice]

Third eye practice does not equal Kundalini. Isn't that obvious? Don't you know Red Phoenix is a third eye practice? Kunlun is a third eye practice.

Hi Lucky

You know, I took the Kunlun seminar and I would have to say that Red Phoenix is not solely a third eye practice. It also opens the crown.. More typical third eye practices are things like gazing, or moving one's attention just above the normal eye vision and looking out..

 

As for the second quote, you left out the first part of the whole quote, where he defines Kundalini. Your way of using only the last section after having read the introductory part is quite manipulative. I think it reveals what type of mindset you are in reading and watching Sadhguru.

I quoted the summary statement.. and even included a link. Got a problem with that?

 

 

I'll ask Max when certain practices like Shambhavi seem to counter my Kunlun. He'll know immediately and tell me to drop any other practices. But I'm not going to go up to him and do Shambhavi Mahamudra and ask if this is compatible with Kunlun. Why? Because, just like Max says with Red Phoenix, I was told not to share Shambhavi with people who are not initiated into Isha. It goes the other way too. If Sadhguru came up to me and asked about Red Phoenix, I won't show him at all unless I'm a facilitator teaching him. So I respect this both ways, because both Max and Sadhguru gave me the practices with those instructions.

 

Hint: when someone says their teachings are secret, there is usually a reason for it. Max's reason is that RP is traditionally taught in person along with the transmission. But Max isn't witholding any other practices. Why does Isha keep all of it's practices secret? Is that so they can sell them or is that to avoid scrutinization by others who know the classic kriya yogas?

 

I also don't know if Sadhguru's Shambhavi is what is generally known as Shambhavi, because he says it hasn't been taught this way to the general public ever. I'll probably ask Max about Sadhguru in the future. Maybe I'll shoot him and Diana an e-mail tomorrow. I'll let you know what they say.

 

I look forward to hearing about what they say.

 

As for your mix of Kundalini and Kunlun, you ask Max yourself. Sadhguru's Kundalini isn't what your doing. So the answer I get isn't going to be an answer pertaining to you at all.

 

I saw Max this weekend and energy work together and he didn't mention anything about Kundalini energies or whatever within me and I had been practicing Shambhavi for 3-4 months twice every day.

 

Now, this is going to sound like monty python, but, which shambhavi are you practising?

I found this practice from isha, and I wouldn't call it shambhavi, nor would I call it spinal breathing pranayama.. I don't quite know what to call it, other than some form of self hypnosis?

 

http://www.ishafound...English-pdf.isa

 

Preparation Sit facing east in a cross-legged posture, with your spine comfortably erect.Keep your hands upon your thighs, with your palms facing up.With your face slightly upturned, eyes closed, keep a mild focus between your eyebrows.

 

The MeditationThis meditation will happen in three stages:

Stage 1:Inhale and exhale gently, slowly.With each inhalation, mentally say to yourself: “I am not the body.” The

inhalation should last the whole duration of that thought.With each exhalation, mentally say to yourself: “I am not even the mind.”

 

The exhalation should last for the whole duration of that thought.Repeat this for 7 to 11 minutes.

1 A traditional offering to a Guru or Spiritual Master

2 Yogic practice involving life energiesStage

2:Utter a long “A” sound (as the “a” in father). The sound should come from just below the navel. You need not utter it very loud, but loud enough to feel the vibration.Utter the long “A” sound 7 times, exhaling fully into each sound.

Stage 3:Sit for 5 to 6 minutes with a slightly upturned face, and keep a mild focus

between your eyebrows.The total time of this practice is between 12 to 18 min. You can sit longer if

you want.

 

PLEASE NOTE While you sit for the Isha Kriya, do not pay attention to the activity of the mind or body. Whatever is happening in your body or your mind, just ignore it and simply sit there.Do not take a break in between, as it will disturb the reorganization of energies that happens during the practice. Each time you do the kriya , you must do it for a minimum of 12 minutes, and twice a day for 48 days (considered as a full mandala or cycle), or once a day for 90 days. This is your commitment. This is your Gurudakshina.

 

1 Anyone can practice this kriya and enjoy its benefits. Simply follow the instructions without making any changes. This is a simple but very potent kriya.You can remind yourself that “ I am not the body. I am not even the mind”

anytime during the day.The breathing should be as shown in the diagram above

 

So, is that what you are calling shambhavi? But what about turning the eyes upwards and in, and fixing the gaze?

 

Here is a classic interpretation of shambhavi mudra:

From the book "Kundalini Tantra" by Swami Satyananda Saraswati:

 

link: http://www.amazon.co...i/dp/8185787158

 

Stage 1

Sit in any meditative pose with the back straight and hands on the knees.

Look forward at a fixed point, then look upward as high as possible without moving the head.

Focus the eyes and concentrate on the eyebrow center.

Try to suspend the thought processes and meditate on ajna chakra.

Repeat Om, Om, Om, with awareness of the sound vibrations at the eyebrow center into which you are gazing. Each Оm should be produced in a soft clear voice, with awareness of every vibration of the mantra in the eyebrow center. Each mantra should be one or two seconds in duration, and immediately followed by the next.

Practise for 3 to 5 minutes.

 

Stage 2

Now the eyes are closed, but the inner gaze remains in the eyebrow center.

Begin to chant the mantra more slowly, with full awareness of the sound vibration in the eyebrow center. Imagine that the sound is being emitted from within the eyebrow center itself.

Gradually and effortlessly increase the duration of each Om, making it long and continuous.

The sound should be steady and of an even key, ending on completion of the breath.

Then refill the lungs completely by breathing through the nose, but do not alter the position of the body or head.

Begin the next Om, maintaining awareness of the sound emerging from the eyebrow center.

Practise for 5 minutes.

 

Stage 3

Continue to chant the mantra Оm, but become aware of the sound reverberating throughout the body.

Try to be aware of the sound only, listening to its vibration emerging from the eyebrow center and permeating the whole body.

Do not be self-conscious, but allow the sound to manifest itself fully, maintaining awareness of the vibration of the sound only.

Practise for 5 minutes.

Gradually the duration of the practice can be lengthened.

Caution: Do not strain the eye muscles; when they become tired or slightly strained, release shambhavi mudra.

Practise

This sadhana (consisting of practices 1, 2 and 3), for ajna chakra, should be continued daily for one month. Then proceed to the sadhana for awakening mooladhara chakra.

 

Here is also another rendition of Shambhavi mudra:

 

Kriya Yoga: synthesis of a personal experience

Author: Ennio Nimis

 

link: http://www.bahaistud.../kriyayoga8.pdf

 

Shambhavi Mudra A Mudra in which the ocular bulbs and the eyebrows are

upturned as much as possible; often the inferior eyelids relax and a bystander can

observe the white of the cornea under the iris. All the visual force of the ocular nerves

is gathered on the top of the head. Lahiri Mahasaya in his well known portrait is

showing this Mudra.

 

You said:

 

Anyways it seems like your the one now obsessing over Sadhguru for some reason. It looks like you can't put this down. If he was really a total nutjob and an actor like you said in your original post, you'd stopped watching his videos after first two or three. So this is great! Keep watching them. It's clear something is drawing you towards him but at once very afraid of him.

 

Actually, I practised Kriya Yoga for 6 years total. I'm not interested in it anymore. Right now I'm practising the preliminary practices of Dzogchen based on "Heart Drops of Dharmakaya" and waiting for the two books I've ordered from Norbu to come in.

 

Anyway, I hope to hear about your conversations with Max and Diane..

 

TI

Edited November 18, 2012 by Tibetan_Ice

[Lucky7Strikes]

Whatever. Sadhguru definitely doesn't need me to defend him on a website. His work speaks for itself.

 

Good luck on what you are doing.

 

But if you do change your mind, please come back on the forum and correct your statements. I often do so too. So we'll see.

Edited November 20, 2012 by Lucky7Strikes