Sinfest vs The World

[GrandmasterP]

Sorry kids, I had to take a phone call, I hope you didn't break anything while I was away

 

So, Buddhism, eh? I don't see it as such a negative thing. When I see some people talk about Buddhism, they say that it's more of an add on to your current spirituality. You can do what ever you want but if you want, there's an upgrade.

 

This samsara thing bothers me a little because instead of escaping, what scares me is that there's a way out of it and I don't want out.

....... Mocking the Moksha eh?

Be Careful what you wish for old chum.

[SunLover]

Sorry kids, I had to take a phone call, I hope you didn't break anything while I was away

 

So, Buddhism, eh? I don't see it as such a negative thing. When I see some people talk about Buddhism, they say that it's more of an add on to your current spirituality. You can do what ever you want but if you want, there's an upgrade.

 

This samsara thing bothers me a little because instead of escaping, what scares me is that there's a way out of it and I don't want out.

 

anyone can stay as a farm animal energetic food slave in samsara as long as no one interfere with my Ascension into Godhood and my escape from samsara and cycle of rebirth and death..

 

anyone who try to stop me from my own personal break for freedom from samsara and cycle of rebirth and death will know horrors beyond their vilest imaginations.. for i will put the heaviest curse on not only that fool's family but his entire lineage of ancestors and descendants so that they will always suffer like pigs on a farm..

 

thaumiel golachab thaumiel golachab thaumiel golachab

Edited November 13, 2012 by SunLover

[SunLover]

.

Edited November 13, 2012 by SunLover

[GrandmasterP]

Made it then?

[Fū Yue]

LOL

Edited November 13, 2012 by Fū Yue

[thelerner]

anyone can stay as a farm animal energetic food slave in samsara as long as ...

 

anyone who try to stop me from my own personal break for freedom from samsara and cycle of rebirth and death will know horrors beyond..

 

thaumiel golachab thaumiel golachab thaumiel golachab

Well..that was pretty random.

[Fū Yue]

Well..that was pretty random.

 

Wow, I deleted my comment because I looked back in general discussion and saw that this was the Sinfest thread and not SunLover's crazy-ramblings thread - so I just assumed I misfired, haha. Then I come back in here and I look up and see that he actually DID post that in this thread... I wonder what he was thinking.

[Marblehead]

... I wonder what he was thinking.

You are assuming an aweful lot with that statement.

[GrandmasterP]

What happened to that other SL thread?

The demon stuff.

Seems to have vanished.

[GrandmasterP]

Nah, just wondered where it had gone to.

[Apech]

Nah, just wondered where it had gone to.

 

Issuing curses is against the rules so its been Hid.

[GrandmasterP]

OIC

Seems fair enough.

Ta.

[DreamBliss]

The return of vs thread, yaaaaaaaaaay

 

I actually wanted to make this thread a long while ago since I couldn't find an equivalent on this site and I don't understand something.

 

So, one of the main goals of people around here seems to be escaping samsara and stopping reincarnation, or something like that.

That's what I don't get, why?

 

One Buddha had a quest of stopping suffering and at some point the wheal of samsara came up. Seems like there's an endless cycle of suffering that comes with living and attachment.

Some Buddhist people came up with an idea of removing attachments. The key word is 'some', the detachment almost became cannon if it wasn't for the other ideas.

 

So yeah, what's up, doc?

 

I can't remember what I was reading or what the resource was for this. But as I understand it the whole point in reincarnation is to keep learning about the truth of divinity, moving closer to it. You essentially orbit around from the energetic to the physical through each life, and as you develop more spiritually you move further and further out into the energetic, until finally you don't even go back to the physical. You end up at the highest level of the energetic, or divinity. You become God or Buddha or one with them or something.

 

So you want to stop reincarnation in the sense you want to develop enough spiritually where you no longer need to physically manifest. I guess that's the thought here. Of course in the process of all of this you are working out your karma (according to some systems) or reaching a perfect balance (in other systems.)

 

Samsara as I understand it has nothing to do with reincarnation. But my understanding is limited. Samsara is illusion, or suffering caused by illusion. While in this sphere of existence we experience in physical bodies you want to remove illusion and stop suffering. This of course leads to spiritual growth, and that will eventually bring you to a point of stopping reincarnation, which I guess means you will also no longer be suffering, but its not moving beyond Samsara all by itself that stops reincarnation.

 

So essentially the goal of Buddhists is to end their suffering brought on by illusion - Samsara. But why strive to end suffering? Why not strive instead to just develop yourself spiritually? Make that the goal, not ending Samsara. Seek the truth, make that your focus, instead of striving to look past illusion. To me there is a middle-man being placed here. I would rather bypass him and go straight to the main issue. The main issue is I need to develop myself spiritually, seek the truth of who I am, my true nature. I need to accept suffering and understand it as simply a byproduct of this sphere I currently experience in my physical body. I need to be open-minded enough to accept that I don't know everything, or, if you prefer, that I don't remember everything yet, and this is also a byproduct of this current sphere of existence.

 

So for me the path is straight forward. Accept suffering and the fact I don't know everything. Keep seeking the truth, keep growing and developing spiritually as I learn the truth about my true nature. Everything else will fall into place. Why focus on the negative or over-complicate things?

- DreamBliss

[DreamBliss]

I kinda agree with the sinner.. If I have an immortal soul, given choices of heaven, reincarnation or destruction of all parts of my soul, I'd choose heaven first, reincarnation next. For all its trials, there's enough good in the world, at least this life time, that I'd rather gamble for another shot at it, rather then poof, be totally gone.

 

 

Maybe after enough heaven I'd also choose reincarnation or even a few weeks sun bathing in hell. I don't know, probably won't be asked and not sure how much the Universe cares about little old me.

 

I was thinking about this last night. You know what I choose? I choose to be free in the afterlife. I want to experience all the afterlives that exist, all the afterlives man has created and any other that exist besides. I want to see Valhalla, The Elysium Fields, The River Styx, Heaven and even Hell. Probably won't visit hell. I want to see all these higher and higher vibrational states too. Experience the highest one that is often associated with feelings of pure love, the energetic state that is essentially God.

 

Then I want to be free of all belief-created afterlifes, and I want to see what the afterlife is really like, outside of man's beliefs. What exists beyond what anyone and everyone believes exists? What is the truth unaltered by any belief? What is the afterlife as initially designed by The Source/God? That's where I want to go next. That may be where I choose to stay.

 

But for me this is what I choose. And here's the weird, make your head hurt truth. If you believe in Heaven and Hell you will go to one of those two places based, once again, on whether or not you have met the terms of your beliefs.

 

In other words, for a Christian to go to Heaven they have to believe that Jesus is the Son of God, that He died on a cross for their sins, and they have to accepted Jesus into their heart and life. Failure to do so will consign them to hell. If they fail at any of the requirements in the Christian belief system they go to hell.

 

Buddhists and Taoists and Daoists and Hindus and everyone else that believes in reincarnation will orbit around and around, working out their karma, restoring balance, meeting the terms of their belief. This will be their afterlife.

 

Folks who think there is nothing after death will, since energy can not die, probably drift in some void of nothingness.

 

Good warrior vikings are hanging out in Valhalla right now, drinking fine spirits and telling wondrous tales of battle.

 

Some strange folk that became obsessed with Lord of the Rings or Harry Potter will find themselves in Middle Earth or perhaps in a strange version of England with Muggles and Wizards.

 

Essentially you create your afterlife by what you believe it to be. The more people who share your belief, and the longer that belief has been held. the more powerful that version of the afterlife. So there are probably a whole lot more Christains in Heaven and Hell than there are folk wandering around Middle Earth. Likewise there are probably a lot more people reincarnating than Christians.

 

I would be surprised if you had any idea how strange it is for me, a former Christian, to be saying this. To be changing my old beliefs in Heaven and Hell, disentangling myself so I can go into anyone's afterlife, because I accept the possibility of all afterlifes, and choose to be free to explore them.

 

Well hopefully I haven't caused anyone's head to explode

- DreamBliss

[DreamBliss]

Suffering my erse. By and large life is pretty sweet. It's what you make of it.

Many Buddhists are repressed miserablists, they actually enjoy suffering.

Hence the wealth of miserable Buddhist literature that they can buy so as to feel even worse about themselves and life in general.

They like that sort of thing and for those who like that sort of thing... that is the sort of thing that they like.

 

Taoism on the other hand is a cheery and positive path, we cultivate we get better at it. We die, we're reborn and get a chance to become even beter at cultivation, eventually we get off the wheel if we want to or stick around as a spirit guide (a.k.a 'angel' or 'boddhisatva' of 'demi-deity') if we don't fancy 'heaven' just yet but quite fancy the idea of a few decades or more fecking about helping human mortals on this side of life.

 

Taoism's a win - win situation whereas , apart from the Pure Land variety which almost identical to Taoism; Buddhism exists for exceptionally sad losers who like being the sad sacks they are and wish to remain the same, over and over again.

Good luck to 'em too, more fun for the rest of us to enjoy.

Plus it is quite amusing to listen to the poor wee lambs' constant doleful bleatings both on here and elsewhere.

 

I guess you have never read the words of Thich Nhat Hanh. Or if you have they were unable to penetrate into your mind for you to see the beauty they hold.

 

I am very disappointed in you for saying this. It very ignorant and disrespectful. Perhaps Buddhists are focused more on the negative than they should be. As I said in an earlier post here they are trying to move beyond Samsara, or suffering. Naturally this causes the focus to be on suffering. It's better to focus on something positive. But this is my opinion, these are my thoughts on the matter.

 

Regardless some of my best teachers, who have been there for me through the words of their books, have been Buddhists. Lama Surya Das for example. The opposite of the "miserablist" you describe. Hanh, loving, wise, words like balm when I am suffering. How can can someone who is supposedly miserable write words that soothe like a balm when someone is suffering? It is simple, they could not, it is impossible. So I'm afraid I have to say you are wrong.

 

I encourage you to look deeply into yourself and figure out where this dislike or hatred, these negative feelings and thoughts towards Buddhists, are coming from.

- DreamBliss

[Fū Yue]

I can't remember what I was reading or what the resource was for this. But as I understand it the whole point in reincarnation is to keep learning about the truth of divinity, moving closer to it. You essentially orbit around from the energetic to the physical through each life, and as you develop more spiritually you move further and further out into the energetic, until finally you don't even go back to the physical. You end up at the highest level of the energetic, or divinity. You become God or Buddha or one with them or something.

 

So you want to stop reincarnation in the sense you want to develop enough spiritually where you no longer need to physically manifest. I guess that's the thought here. Of course in the process of all of this you are working out your karma (according to some systems) or reaching a perfect balance (in other systems.)

 

Samsara as I understand it has nothing to do with reincarnation. But my understanding is limited. Samsara is illusion, or suffering caused by illusion. While in this sphere of existence we experience in physical bodies you want to remove illusion and stop suffering. This of course leads to spiritual growth, and that will eventually bring you to a point of stopping reincarnation, which I guess means you will also no longer be suffering, but its not moving beyond Samsara all by itself that stops reincarnation.

 

So essentially the goal of Buddhists is to end their suffering brought on by illusion - Samsara. But why strive to end suffering? Why not strive instead to just develop yourself spiritually? Make that the goal, not ending Samsara. Seek the truth, make that your focus, instead of striving to look past illusion. To me there is a middle-man being placed here. I would rather bypass him and go straight to the main issue. The main issue is I need to develop myself spiritually, seek the truth of who I am, my true nature. I need to accept suffering and understand it as simply a byproduct of this sphere I currently experience in my physical body. I need to be open-minded enough to accept that I don't know everything, or, if you prefer, that I don't remember everything yet, and this is also a byproduct of this current sphere of existence.

 

So for me the path is straight forward. Accept suffering and the fact I don't know everything. Keep seeking the truth, keep growing and developing spiritually as I learn the truth about my true nature. Everything else will fall into place. Why focus on the negative or over-complicate things?

- DreamBliss

 

Samsara is the round of death and rebirth itself. The illusion of transmigration. Reincarnation is said to occur only due to our ignorance of actual reality. We keep telling ourselves the same after school special until we learn the very important lesson.

 

The truth is always looking us straight in the face every day, all the time, and we constantly skirt the issue. Case in point, the idea that the physical is somehow seperate from the energetic - but you're literally a huge column of pure light, where are the 'tendons'? Where is the 'flesh'? When we take 'existence' for granted, when we 'objectify' ourselves and others, we see such an 'objective' world. In actual reality, this sphere is a hall of mirrors, a crystal palace of incredible brilliance, and those who reincarnate do so only because they cover their eyes from the truth... lest the magnificence burn them to a crisp.

 

But then, I am no authority. See for yourself the truth.

[DreamBliss]

See what I mean?

Miserable.

Not happy.

Gloomy.

 

 

Ish old sausage there is more to life than whingeing on a forum, look out the window bro. Life is passing by right now.

Enjoy .

 

OK butting in here, but how exactly is what Ish said miserable? I detect no misery in his words. I suppose you think, based on my previous quote of you, that I am miserable? I am smiling, laughing a little, as I write this. Kinda hard for someone miserable to smile and laugh. Not in making fun either, I'm just that light spirited, seeing things in such a humorous light right now. You should have seen my words just 10 years ago or so. You would be scratching your head wondering why it sounds like there are two different people talking. Well that's because there are!

 

Anyhow man it sounds like you have some serious beef with the Buddhists, and that's pretty tough, considering, as far as I know, most of 'em are vegetarians!

DreamBliss

[DreamBliss]

Sorry kids, I had to take a phone call, I hope you didn't break anything while I was away

 

So, Buddhism, eh? I don't see it as such a negative thing. When I see some people talk about Buddhism, they say that it's more of an add on to your current spirituality. You can do what ever you want but if you want, there's an upgrade.

 

This samsara thing bothers me a little because instead of escaping, what scares me is that there's a way out of it and I don't want out.

 

All Samsara is, as far as I understand it, is illusion. In other words the assumption I guess is that what we experience in this sphere of existence in our physical bodies is not the truth of what is. So Samsara is moving from what we believe to what is. How's that for a succinct explanation? Anyhow it is nothing to fear. Sure it is unknown, but we should never fear the unknown, or the unbelieved. I direct your attention to my quote with what I choose for the afterlife.

 

In essence Samsara is like moving from the beliefs in the various afterlifes to choosing the afterlife that exists outside of all belief. This state, outside human belief and alteration, is Truth. Samsara is movement to truth. So don't be afraid of it. See it as an adventure. What is really out there in this sphere of existence you experience in your physical body? What would it look like when you moved past all the five senses to some other way of experiencing it?

 

Like undressing a beautiful girl the first time you are together. All sorts of things waiting for you to see and experience for the first time. But if you were too afraid to undress her, if you were that afraid of the unknown, well you wouldn't be getting any that night

 

Please forgive the somewhat crass illustration...

- DreamBliss

[DreamBliss]

anyone can stay as a farm animal energetic food slave in samsara as long as no one interfere with my Ascension into Godhood and my escape from samsara and cycle of rebirth and death..

 

anyone who try to stop me from my own personal break for freedom from samsara and cycle of rebirth and death will know horrors beyond their vilest imaginations.. for i will put the heaviest curse on not only that fool's family but his entire lineage of ancestors and descendants so that they will always suffer like pigs on a farm..

 

thaumiel golachab thaumiel golachab thaumiel golachab

 

All I can say to that is...

 

WHAT THE HELL MAN???!!!

 

Listen the only person that can stop you is you, and you don't want to curse yourself do you? And BTW a few things you should know about curses... If the Bible is correct on this, those who send a curse out where it is not merited get the curse back. It bounces off those who don't deserve it and comes back to you. Secondly a curse requires energy. Study the magician's path a little. The energy deficit you could cause yourself may create the very reality you don't want. Thirdly your curse can have no effect on someone who doesn't believe in it, thereby giving it power. So you're wasting your energy trying to hex or voodoo a Buddhist monk, for example. Bless instead of curse, focus on what you want not on what you don't want and don't judge anyone.

 

Believe in whatever afterlife you want for yourself and that's the afterlife you will get. But remember there is a source or God or something out there that may be weighting scales, assigning energy deficit/credit, assigning karma, etc. and your actions will have consequences as a result. This may have a direct effect on what you experience when your time in this sphere of existence is over.

 

So in the famous words of the 60's... Just chill man!

- DreamBliss

Edited November 17, 2012 by DreamBliss

[GrandmasterP]

 

 

I guess you have never read the words of Thich Nhat Hanh. Or if you have they were unable to penetrate into your mind for you to see the beauty they hold.

 

I am very disappointed in you for saying this. It very ignorant and disrespectful. Perhaps Buddhists are focused more on the negative than they should be. As I said in an earlier post here they are trying to move beyond Samsara, or suffering. Naturally this causes the focus to be on suffering. It's better to focus on something positive. But this is my opinion, these are my thoughts on the matter.

 

Regardless some of my best teachers, who have been there for me through the words of their books, have been Buddhists. Lama Surya Das for example. The opposite of the "miserablist" you describe. Hanh, loving, wise, words like balm when I am suffering. How can can someone who is supposedly miserable write words that soothe like a balm when someone is suffering? It is simple, they could not, it is impossible. So I'm afraid I have to say you are wrong.

 

I encourage you to look deeply into yourself and figure out where this dislike or hatred, these negative feelings and thoughts towards Buddhists, are coming from.

- DreamBliss

....................

DL likes a laugh. Why wouldn't he?

Can't be all bad. Like the old Mel Brooks song says...'gee it's great to be a king'.

Mr Nat Hahn I have not read but did hear him speak in London a while ago and was most impressed.

Our PL cousins are a jolly lot to be sure and the ethnic Buddhists in general seem to get through life without too much fuss and bother.

Then we have the converts.

Always more zealous are converts, in any path; it sorta goes with the territory and I am not aware of any or many ethnic Buddhists going in for the angst ridden hand wringing and sheer picky gloominess you can readily find in places like Dharma Wheel every day and on here from time to time fluttering under the (usually Tibetan) Buddhist prayer flag.

[Protector]

I didn't say I'm afraid of samsara thingamaging, I'm scared of leaving it

I'm the opposite of Pie Guy about this

 

Instead of scary thing I see something good and so I say, nah

[DreamBliss]

Well my apologies for my misunderstanding. Re-read what I said so that it applies to your leaving Samsara then. Same moral applies. Don't be afraid of what exists outside of Samsara. Buckle in and enjoy the exciting ride, wherever it takes you!

- DreamBliss

[Vanir Thunder Dojo Tan]

A New Challenger Approaches!!!

 

... Nah...