I may have created a Tulpa...

[DreamBliss]

After reading some more of Josephine McCarthy's, "Magical Knowledge I" I believe that a few months back I created a tulpa, or thought form as she calls it. Breif info here:

http://adifferentpath.blog.com/2012/11/16/the-final-piece/

 

I don't want to go into the whole story. Too much pain, one of the reasons I am here at this forms actually. No I am just looking for free information on handing a Tulpa; specifically how to dismantle it or decreate it to return its energy to its source.

 

I sent McCarthy an email. But just in case she does not respond, perhaps there is a well read or well experienced Buddhist here who can help me?

 

I appreciate your help -

- DreamBliss

[GrandmasterP]

Invite it to go into the Light.

They do you know.

It's only hanging around because subconsciously you want and need it to.

Decide to change that and change will occur.

Your call bro.

 

HTH

[Apech]

Invite it to go into the Light.

They do you know.

It's only hanging around because subconsciously you want and need it to.

Decide to change that and change will occur.

Your call bro.

 

HTH

 

[GrandmasterP]

Works every time does Light.

 

[Fū Yue]

It's not an independent existence, you are the source of it, and when your attachment to it has been finally dissolved it will be re-consumed by your mind and the energy will be released. Break down the pre-conceived notions you have, of this thing's independent existence, it's 'reality', recycle your experiences with it, allow it all to return to a very bright, hot light, and be done with it, then. Every memory of it goes up in flames the moment the mind is directed towards it, every vision of form disintegrates into formlessness. Allow the mind to deal with it in it's own greatly creative ways, trust in the ingenuity of ordinary awareness.

 

Grasping on to phenomena makes them seem as though possessing inherent form, intensity gives phenomena color, vibrancy, a sense of 'life', ignorance makes them seem seperate from yourself.

[Andrei]

read Franz Bardon's Initiation into Hermetics, you can find it free on-line as .pdf, there is explained how to create and destroy tulpas.

[DreamBliss]

Thank you for your replies.

 

This all happened earlier in the year, and I have stopped it, probably one or two months ago. I went into our place in my mind, told her that our relationship was unhealthy, gave her back the ring she gave me (I created a ring for her and she for me symbolzing our relationship) and told her that I would not see her again. I left, and I dissolved the umbillicle (didn't know that's what it was at the time) between us. So I do not think I destroyed her. I also do not believe she will be an energy vampire, because I taught her some Qi Gong energy gathering exercises.

 

Considering how I handled this, do I need to go back in there and beckon her to the light, essentially killing her, or have I done enough to sever the relationship and connection between us? Yes, the connection is severed. She is not in my mind anymore, I do not feel her connected to me, and my energy levels have returned to normal. I have let her go and and have moved on (a contuing process.)

 

Once again I appreciate the help -

- DreamBliss

[Fū Yue]

Thank you for your replies.

 

This all happened earlier in the year, and I have stopped it, probably one or two months ago. I went into our place in my mind, told her that our relationship was unhealthy, gave her back the ring she gave me (I created a ring for her and she for me symbolzing our relationship) and told her that I would not see her again. I left, and I dissolved the umbillicle (didn't know that's what it was at the time) between us. So I do not think I destroyed her. I also do not believe she will be an energy vampire, because I taught her some Qi Gong energy gathering exercises.

 

Considering how I handled this, do I need to go back in there and beckon her to the light, essentially killing her, or have I done enough to sever the relationship and connection between us? Yes, the connection is severed. She is not in my mind anymore, I do not feel her connected to me, and my energy levels have returned to normal. I have let her go and and have moved on (a contuing process.)

 

Once again I appreciate the help -

- DreamBliss

 

She's probably gone enough. Just so you know, she was the relationship itself, that was the thought form. So it's not a matter of 'killing it' or 'letting it live', do the thoughts of this moment kill the thoughts of the next moment? Does the rain die when it becomes steam? Energy simply shifts its shape, appearing as this or that, there is no will behind it, it is the will. When one ceases (creating the conditions of) the story, the story ceases to be (as such).

[DreamBliss]

OK, well that's essentially what Mrs. McCarthy said. I found a reply in my inbox no long after starting this thread. So that's verification enough for me.

 

I will consider the matter settled for now. Thanks everyone for your help!

- DreamBliss

[RongzomFan]

Next, create for yourself a sexy tulpa.

 

Thats what I would do.

[DreamBliss]

She was sexy. Not too sexy, not slutty, nothing like that, she was the ideal companion for me sexually, except for the whole not being able to feel her bit. But more importantly, she was the ideal companion for me at every other level. Smart, loving, loyal, dedicated, kind, gentle. I could go on forever.

 

I'm sure I don't have to point out that sex is not, despite what the media might tell you, everything in a relationship. Hell I don't even have to, my experience is living proof! I created and fell in love with someone I couldn't even touch!

 

In the end all I can say is that I will be incredibly blessed to find, or be found, by someone even remotely like her.

- DreamBliss

Edited November 19, 2012 by DreamBliss

[Humble]

She was sexy. Not too sexy, not slutty, nothing like that, she was the ideal companion for me sexually, except for the whole not being able to feel her bit. But more importantly, she was the ideal companion for me at every other level. Smart, loving, loyal, dedicated, kind, gentle. I could go on forever.

 

I'm sure I don't have to point out that sex is not, despite what the media might tell you, everything in a relationship. Hell I don't even have to, my experience is living proof! I created and fell in love with someone I couldn't even touch!

 

In the end all I can say is that I will be incredibly blessed to find, or be found, by someone even remotely like her.

- DreamBliss

 

Well, if you do it again, maybe send "her" out to find a real world version of "her" and introduce the two of you?

Edited December 25, 2012 by Humble

[Gerard]

.

Edited September 13, 2013 by Gerard

[ShenLung]

I don't know this Josephine McCarthy, but there is a reason why thought forms should not be given a significant shape, to prevent them from developing independent ego. Mind conditioning should have been undertaken long before the understanding of how to shape an astral body independent of the self has been imparted, as well. Was this an outgrowth of an attempt to learn astral projection?

[DreamBliss]

No, at the time I was coming off an experience of Estactic Love and was feeling very loney. I had some, we'll call it alone time, pictured someone, and then next thing I know I was not controlling them. I was interacting with an independant entity using the forum I had pictured.

 

The more I think on it, and this subject, the more convinced am I that many of the things in our society are in fact Tulpas. Anything that people have collectively believd in, shed blood for, and put sexual energy into. I'm fairly certain the Christian God is a tulpa, given life by years of worship, devotion, belief, love and lots of bloodshed. As would be Satan, Santa Claus, Big Foot, most aliens, and even things like the "scientific process."

 

I don't expect anyone to agree with me. How could the majority of people do so? They never created a Tulpa! They have absolutely no experience as to what this feels like, nothing to compare to, no experential insight. The trick here is to not create some other tulpa with beliefs I have attatched myself to.

 

So while remaining unattatched and open to the possibility I am wrong, these are my thoughts on the matter. I created a Tulpa and I'm pretty sure the God of my former religion is a Tulpa. Since I no longer want to invest energy into Tulpas, whether pre-existing or created by me, I will stop any actions that could give energy to a possible Tulpa. With some exceptions. I mean the world would be pretty cool if Santa really existed. Same thing if there were unicorns, elves, fairies and so forth. So while I will not actively give energy to any of this, I will still enjoy Christmas and good fantasy stories. This will be my general appraoch. I can enjoy a variety of positive beliefs and creations, but this indirect energy is all I shall give them.

 

Instead I am conserving my energy for two purposes right now:

#1. The healing of the father of one of my friends. He has cancer and has been taken off chemo.

#2. The manifestation of the reality I created for myself and my family. Prosperity and Resources. In addition for myself I have created a wife, children, house I designed, future as a freelance computer artist working from home and my own work/play space to use for that purpose, and a bunch of other things to go with this.

 

We have a choice as to where we will invest our energy. It has been said that time is the only thing of value we have. Not true. I think perhaps our energy is the most valuable thing we own. We can invest it in the beliefs of others, feeding their Tulpas, we can invest it into our beliefs and create our own Tulpas, or we can invest it into the creation of the reality we want. There is no fate or destiny beyond what we create. We do so actively or passivly.

 

Energy leaks into reality creation whether we like it our not. Some goes into preserving reality as defined by our race over the years of its time here on earth. Everybody just accepts that gravity is some law and nobody can fly. Since thousands of us have believed that over thousands if not millions of years, this reality has fully manifested as our reality. More energy leaks into preserving reality as defined by us. The world is literally what we make of it. We say life sucks, we're lonely, we will never find someone to be with, etc. etc. The longer we say this, the more tears we shed for it anlong with any blood, and we manifest this reality we created the instant we started saying these things about ourselves. Christians only sin because they are told they are sinners who need saving. I know this from first-hand experience. Since I stopped calling myself a sinner, I have sinned less than when I defined myself, identified myself, as a Christian.

 

We can control these leaks to some extent, maybe even completely. Just observe what we think and say, and catch ourselves, without judgment, when we start the negative self talk, or begin to blindly follow someone else's belief. I confronted my dad with this. As a Christian he was upset with me for having tarot card books on hold at the library. Started going on as to how this is a Christian house, how its evil - you know the drill. I confronted him gently. I told him, "Dad, there is no passage in the Bible that says, "Thou Shalt Not Use The Tarot." In fact, the Bible encourgaes the use of drawing lots. That's all the tarot is, a way to figure out what to do." Something like that, not those exact words. Then I followed with, "Now dad, as yourself, why do you believe the tarot is evil? Is this even your belief?" He got kinda quiet after that, went on some more about how it's evil.

 

The point is here stop blindly following. We are all, in our various spiritual or scientific guises, blind men describing the parts of an elephant we are touhcing. None of us see the whole animal or know what it truly is. So please, for the love of, well everything I guess, stop trying to tell folks that you know the whole truth! Because you don't, you can't, and you probably never will, unless perhaps this is what enlightment is. Human perception is limited to the senses while we identify ourselves as humans in these fleshy containers. Always question, or as it has been said elsewhere, question everything!

 

The other leak to stop up is these patterns of thoughts we have been defining oursleves by without really being aware of it. Catch what you say about yourself and start the reprogramming process. Don't take my word for it, but you are an unlimited, divine being. You may even be God enjoying a physical experience in your body. I haven't been able to get that far yet. But I am learning to change how I see myself. I used to see myself as powerless. I know now that this is complete and utter bullspit! I used to see myself as limited. I know now I can do anything! I can create any reality I desire, and these are not just words, I have actually been doing this! Some examples...

 

The sink in the kitchen wouldn't go down. I worked on it (working in whatever way you can towards a desired reality manifests it quicker), took it apart and put it together 2 or 3 times. Poured boiling water and sink stuff down it. Did everthing I could to clean it out and fix it given the tools and resources I had on hand. Then I started to visualize the pipes being clear. When I say my repairs did nothing I ignored my mind trying to get me to doubt and focused, every time doubt tried to creep in, on those pipes clearing. Long story short the pipes cleared, and now drain better than they ever did before.

 

I created a reality of a large collection of presents under the tree. When we got the tree I worked hard to get it up (we got a Dr. Suess tree - curved in the middle.) When we finally got it to stay up and somewhat straight I started to decorate. Then my dad joined in. As far as gifts, there was a large pile under the tree, although in my vision these were symbolic and physical. So this reality manifested.

 

My mom wanted to go see my brother. After last Christmas and our knock-down-drag-out fight I was less than enthused. Not afraid, just didn't want to hurt anyone. Grew a lot since then. Created a reality that we have a good time and get along. We did.

 

I could go on and on. This creating reality process is very similar to true magical workings. It's very interesting. I still don't know the full extent of this, am still developing these skills, abilities, talents - actually I think these are probably gifts that all humans have. Whetever or whoever designed is, if anything or anyone. sure did an amazing job. Because we have the same creation abilities!

 

Understand that while this works like true magical work it is not magic in the sense that BAM! the reality you create happens. Sorry. Not that easy. You have to work towards it. You can't entertain any doubts. You have to see it clearly in your mind how your reality is. You should also feel it to give it extra power. Use past experiences or imagine future ones. If you pray for rain, remember how rain feels and sounds. If you pray for a mate, think how that would feel, to have found the best possible match for you. Understand this is true prayer, and it goes out to the Source, whoever or whatever that is, if it is anything. Don't start a "Church of the Source" and create another Tulpa! Just send out your prayer into the universe and trust that whatever or whoever needs to recieve it will.

 

Paint with broad strokes, leave the rest to the universe. In other words, trust the details will be painted it, you just sketch out the picture. Finally you have to catch yourself if you start saying stuff like, "This is lying..." "This doesn't work..." "This is stupid..." etc. You aren't lying. Sure you may not be able to interact with the reality you created the moment you do so. But that is only because it is in an energtic form and you will have to help it manifest in what I call "Sense Determined Reality." In other words it is where you can interact with it in your senses. But all things start as energy, then manifest as a denser form or something. Hey I don't know more than everything starts as energy! So just because you can't taste, touch, hear, smell or see it does not mean it is not real. The instant you create a reality, whether passivly or actively, one of two things happens. An existing reality is strengthened. A previously non-existing reality is created.

 

If you want to read about this more try, "Wishes Fulfilled" by Wayne Dyer.

 

So that's where I am, a little off subject I guess, but I started typing and couldn't stop. Need to sleep now...

- DreamBliss

Edited December 28, 2012 by DreamBliss

[joeblast]

...and since the nature of reality is quantum mechanical, these intentions merely alter the probabilities of manifestation. when the energy-potential is sufficient for something to manifest, it often does but its not guaranteed, even with a high probability.

 

great post, glad you seem to have found some equanimity, peace, direction /\

[ॐDominicusॐ]

You guys should see the tulpas created from porn and lust ....there are oozing massive giant balls of them all orgying up each other, all based on the minds of porn/lust addicts ....if your third eye is open you can see this...

 

it's all subconsciously created

[ShenLung]

Thought forms, created by an undisciplined mind, running about, doing...

 

better not to send, than to slay too many, from the lay of Odin, comes to mind.

[DreamBliss]

I guess someone needs to write on this subject. Perhaps I will. Folks need to learn how to clean up after themselves.,

 

I must confess... It is very hard, especially at this time of the year, for me right now. In the middle of reprogramming my mind which has been programmed by years of what I called "realist" thinking. Realist, HAH! The assumption that something will be some way simply because it has been before is perhaps the biggest assumption we humans collectively make! No realism is simply "justified" pessimism, and the so-called justifications used for it are based on past events, which no longer exist.

 

Something Wayne Dyer said I keep coming back to... Your body, right now, is not the body you had when you were a child. Not one cell of that original body remains. So even our bodies are not real. The past is gone, and everything that happened then has no bearing on what happens now unless we create that reality.

 

Anyway to stop beating around the bush... I was tempted today to play that video I made. Listen to the music I listened to then. Essentially risk re-connecting with my tulpa. It is almost unbearably hard to resist. I'm clinging to the reality I have created for myself, my ultimate reality, my dream, where I have a wife, children, house and a way to support us all. I try to hold on to that picture in my mind. I try to feel what it is like in this reality I have created. But it is incredibly difficult. After too brief moments visiting this reality I come back here, where it has not manifested yet. I am alone again. I have to admit I am tired of being alone. Even though I am not alone (reprogramming.) I have a family, they just haven't manifested yet.

 

ARG!

- DreamBliss

[Fū Yue]

That doesn't sound particularly healthy. You should work on dissolving the barrier between yourself, the environment and universe around you, that is a permanent cure for loneliness; rather than holding on to a future that is not certain, the Tao inside, outside, above, and below us is, and it is always there. Mother nature is reliable. Our self-identity, feelings, thoughts, beliefs, dreams, and aspirations are not. What you said about the body is doubly true of the self as well. Your perception of yourself is constantly changing at an even faster rate than your bodies cells are reviving themselves.

 

Why hold on to these impermanent mind states? Rest in the Tao.

 

When all is lost, space is still as vast and accepting as ever. At the end of the day, the earth is still propping you up on her back, and you are living. This is enough for the body and the heart, which reliably plods on through time unending, why not the mind as well?

[suninmyeyes]

At the end of the day, the earth is still propping you up on her back, and you are living. This is enough for the body and the heart, which reliably plods on through time unending, why not the mind as well?

Nice Fu Yue , worth a repeat.

Edited January 1, 2013 by suninmyeyes

[DreamBliss]

That doesn't sound particularly healthy. You should work on dissolving the barrier between yourself, the environment and universe around you, that is a permanent cure for loneliness; rather than holding on to a future that is not certain, the Tao inside, outside, above, and below us is, and it is always there. Mother nature is reliable. Our self-identity, feelings, thoughts, beliefs, dreams, and aspirations are not. What you said about the body is doubly true of the self as well. Your perception of yourself is constantly changing at an even faster rate than your bodies cells are reviving themselves.

 

Why hold on to these impermanent mind states? Rest in the Tao.

 

When all is lost, space is still as vast and accepting as ever. At the end of the day, the earth is still propping you up on her back, and you are living. This is enough for the body and the heart, which reliably plods on through time unending, why not the mind as well?

 

I appreciate and respect these words, but I am afraid that this approach is not for me.

 

I believe we have all been given the power of creation. That we we can think into being whatever we imagine. That we are divine beings. We may even be collectively God, experiencing this reality in physical form. I am still wrestling with this last bit.

 

That means sitting back and saying, "Que Sera Sera!" is to deny the power we have been given. It is not a matter of opening and flowing. It is a matter of imagining what we want and manifesting it. It is a matter of re-directing our enegy from negative, extraneous things, taking control and being responsible for our lives, instead of leaving it in the hands of God or Tao.

 

Despite my thoughts here I am open to all possibilities. I am open to the universe. In fact I believe I am a part of it, connected to it, and may even be it (still having trouble with this concept.) But I don't ascribe things to fate, destiny, Tao or God. I am independant of these. I create the world, the universe, the creation, that I experience. Life is exactly whatever I make it. I have spent too many years viewing life as a big, stinking pile of s-t. Now I am reprogramming myself, retraining myself, to see life as the beautiful, joyous experience it is. It is not cold, impersonal. There is nothing and no-one working against me. Even if they were they can have no effect unless I let them. There is only what I choose to experience in my brief physical experience here, and I have chosen to experience my divine, powerful, creative nature.

 

So whenever I feel alone, instead of saying and feeling, "I am alone" I reprogram my thoughts, speech and feelings to love, I say, "I am love" "I am loveable" "I am desirable", etc. If my body is sick I say, "I am strong" "I am healthy" "I am well." Do you understand yet?

 

Whatever the truth of our nature, the keys of creation have been handed to all of us. But most of us leave them in our pocket. Tell ourselves things like, "If it's God's will" "Follow the Tao" or "I am weak." These statements are all equivalent in that they either leave those keys, this most precious of gifts, within our pockets, or place them in the hands of some other. My keys are out of my pocket. They are in my hand always. I will never give them away. I will honor the source that gave me this gift by developing and using it.

 

We are all meant to experience what is good and beautiful in this world. It was always meant to be a positive experience. There is no karma, no hell, no fate, no destiny, no God - nothing beyond what we accept and choose to believe. Even the Tao., the Way, can become a Tulpa if it is given enough power. I have had enough of creating Tulpas, of giving away my power, my life. No more.

 

I have the keys to all of creation in my hand, and I use them, like this.

- DreamBliss

Edited January 2, 2013 by DreamBliss

[Fū Yue]

It seems that you do not understand what is meant when I refer to the Tao. Following the Way means matching your steps in creation to the true nature of reality, not thinking about it or believing it. In order to do this, you must first drop your current paradigms and see nature as it is, without any bias. It is beyond thinking.

 

Do I understand yet? Yes, I understood you just fine when you said the same thing in the previous post. Your ideas are not original, they have been said in many different traditions.

 

I did not say leave it to Tao. I said rest in Tao. Look, if you are so powerful, why are you stressing yourself out so much trying to counter these impermanent mind-states, which are only there for a fraction of a second, when they are already taken care of by your divine nature the very next moment? What I am suggesting is that you drop these prefabricated reactions, and see what's there without shouldering all this pretense.

 

By what you've said, your one-man attempt at strong arming the Tao within toward your conditioned will is not working out very well. It's not healthy to put this much pressure on the self. The most powerful intention is not said. The most powerful energy is unmoving. Let your self be like water, let your body be as a mountain, let your mind disappear into nature, and don't worry yourself with what is forever out of your control.

 

You will never be able to control mother nature. The Tao is not other than you, and trying to cajole yourself into helping yourself manifest yourself is just foolhardy.

 

No matter what you may believe, the fact of the matter is, energy is not your possession. Life is not your possession. It flows through you of it's own accord. It keeps you healthy because it feels like it, and it can leave at any time for any reason. The wish-fulfilling jewel in the heart does it's work whether or not you tell it what you want - it already knows. The thoughts that arise on the surface of the mind are just like waves on the surface of the ocean, and the same is true of feelings and even the superficial 'me'. If you really want to penetrate the depths of natural energy, you have to dive in and let it take you away, towards the truth and far from your imaginary fabrications and notions of control.

 

That's where the real magic is. That you don't even need to put on a facade of 'doing', that it just happens, because life loves you and fuck it, why not? Mother nature will play with you. The earth and the heavens can be your constant companions. You may find that they even have a voice of their own. But this is impossible so long as you steadfastly hold on to your idea of 'me' as an individual being separate from his environment, and the universe around him.

 

Are you so independent that if, tomorrow, the earth disappeared from below you, you would somehow survive? If the air were ripped from your lungs, would you still survive? If all the water in the world were to vanish suddenly, would you still survive? Get over yourself and give credit where credit is due. You owe everything to the universe. Without her, there is no 'you' independent from any of these elements. No belief necessary. You aren't the supreme godhead just yet, you still need mother earth, the sun and the moon and the stars. These are your relatives, respect and communicate with them, and get out of your head.

[DreamBliss]

I feel compelled to say something, just not sure what.

 

I guess I want to make it clear that I don't see myself as God, like I said I am still struggling with that. Likewise I understand that my physical body at least is connected to the physical, and my energetic body is connected to the energetic. Also I don't really think I'm trying to control nature. Far from it, actually.

 

My approach, so far at this moment, is to imagine the reality I want. This is basically a sketch, a lot of symbolism. I know that I don't know everything, that I may not even be able to in this physical body. So I leave the rest to the universe, or the source, using the two interchangebly. To whatever energy, entity or being may exist that we may be all a part of and are all likely connected to. The originator of everything, if there is an originator. Whatever or whoever that is is able to see the whole picture. I can, in this limited form, only see a few peices. I know what I would lik ethe picture to come out like. But I'm also smart enough to acknoweldge that whatever originated everything is a far greater artist than I.

 

I am fighting and struggling only with habbitual negative thought patters. But not a fight as if I see them as an enemy and am trying to destroy them. I know that, like meditation, the best way to deal with unwanted thoughts is to watch them, let them play out. My process is to be aware of negative thoughts, playing out from old patterns, and when I become aware of them, without judgement, fear, aversion, I simply choose to think positive thoughts instead. The reality I created for myself. My inner flame/spark water space, stuff like that. Likewise I choose positive feelings.

 

I do not agree that nature or the Tao or whatever will take care of me without my effort. That would be cool, sure. I'd love to just sit back here in my chair, never rising to eat or take a restroom brake, and trust that money will come to me, all my needs will be taken care of, and food will manifest out of thin air. But this is not the way things are in my opinion. Understand that this is only my opinion, I am not attatched to it, if it is proven wrong by personal experience I will change it.

 

I think the way things have been designed is that we have, as I said, been given the keys to creation. It is up to us to use them to provide for ourselves. It is a gift given to all of us. It is a part of our divinity. It is what, perhaps, we are connected to before we had physical bodies, and what we return to when we die. Some call this the Source. Some pool of energy that we are all a part of and connected to. In our energtic form what you are saying is udoubtably true. Everything this flows to us, through us, and we flow to or through everything. But once we have physical bodies, we have to first awaken spiritually, moving beyond religions and beliefs impose on us, then second we have to find these keys, then third we have to use them, and finally we have to invest much work, effort and will into the process. I think its because we, in a lower vibrational rate, are trying to bring something to us that currently exists at a higher vibrational rate. When we use the keys, we manifest whatever it is we wanted, but it is energetic to begin with, and it takes time and effort to make it tangible.

 

So I appreciate your advice. I will not outright dismiss it. All possibilities exist. That means what you said may be right and I may be wrong. Only a fool dismisses a teaching out-of-hand. Being open is part of being flexible, and this is a part of being unattatched. So I am open to any truths in what you have said. I will save this thread and let these words sink into the morass of my mind. Maybe meditate on them.

 

All I can say with any certainty at all is this. I lived life for many years as a Christian. Identified myself as a Christian. In many ways the Christian God is like Tao or the Way. One of those ways is that Christains are taught to trust God to provide. That He will care for them (the whole lillies of the field passage.) I lived my life according to those teachings for over half my life. Rarely were things beyond the most basic of needs every provided for. Blind trust, belief and faith is exactly the same as wishing without feeling or effort. They will both provide exactly the same thing - nothing. You can not ask God to fill your empty belly, nor can you trust Tao to fill it.

 

All that time as a Christian I worked hard, I served and I prayed. My earthly rewards were embarassment because I had no social skills (homeschooled), lonliness because I only every went on 1 date (not even a real date), depression because I lived in a double-wide trailer and had very little, thoughts of suicide because I never felt this joy Christians are supposed to experience. In short I worked without expecting anything, and nothing was amy reward. Now when I say work I refer to not-work (the belief, trust, no expectations, etc.) and religious work (preaching, teaching, being an example, etc.)

 

So as far as Tao or the Way, with all due respect, you can keep it. I will remain open to it, not adverse to it. But I will also not follow it. One time down the, "Trust God (in the case of Tao or the Way, the Universe or Nature) to provide and He (or she or it) will..." path is enough for this lifetime.

 

One last thing I know is what I am doing now works. It has proven to be experientially true. I have created a handful of realities and they all have manifested in various ways. Granted not always exactly as I outlined, but that's OK. I'm not attatched or adverse to whatever manifests either. I invest my trust and belief that whatever does manifest is the best for me at that time, in that moment. If it doesn't manifest then it was not for me at that time or in that moment. Meanwhile while I work to manifest my chosen realities, I go with the flow. I do not force.

 

So this is my Way, my Tao, my path, my religion of non-religion. It works for me and as long as it does I will continue to follow it.

- DreamBliss

[Fū Yue]

I feel compelled to say something, just not sure what.

 

I guess I want to make it clear that I don't see myself as God, like I said I am still struggling with that. Likewise I understand that my physical body at least is connected to the physical, and my energetic body is connected to the energetic. Also I don't really think I'm trying to control nature. Far from it, actually.

 

My approach, so far at this moment, is to imagine the reality I want. This is basically a sketch, a lot of symbolism. I know that I don't know everything, that I may not even be able to in this physical body. So I leave the rest to the universe, or the source, using the two interchangebly. To whatever energy, entity or being may exist that we may be all a part of and are all likely connected to. The originator of everything, if there is an originator. Whatever or whoever that is is able to see the whole picture. I can, in this limited form, only see a few peices. I know what I would lik ethe picture to come out like. But I'm also smart enough to acknoweldge that whatever originated everything is a far greater artist than I.

 

I am fighting and struggling only with habbitual negative thought patters. But not a fight as if I see them as an enemy and am trying to destroy them. I know that, like meditation, the best way to deal with unwanted thoughts is to watch them, let them play out. My process is to be aware of negative thoughts, playing out from old patterns, and when I become aware of them, without judgement, fear, aversion, I simply choose to think positive thoughts instead. The reality I created for myself. My inner flame/spark water space, stuff like that. Likewise I choose positive feelings.

 

I do not agree that nature or the Tao or whatever will take care of me without my effort. That would be cool, sure. I'd love to just sit back here in my chair, never rising to eat or take a restroom brake, and trust that money will come to me, all my needs will be taken care of, and food will manifest out of thin air. But this is not the way things are in my opinion. Understand that this is only my opinion, I am not attatched to it, if it is proven wrong by personal experience I will change it.

 

I think the way things have been designed is that we have, as I said, been given the keys to creation. It is up to us to use them to provide for ourselves. It is a gift given to all of us. It is a part of our divinity. It is what, perhaps, we are connected to before we had physical bodies, and what we return to when we die. Some call this the Source. Some pool of energy that we are all a part of and connected to. In our energtic form what you are saying is udoubtably true. Everything this flows to us, through us, and we flow to or through everything. But once we have physical bodies, we have to first awaken spiritually, moving beyond religions and beliefs impose on us, then second we have to find these keys, then third we have to use them, and finally we have to invest much work, effort and will into the process. I think its because we, in a lower vibrational rate, are trying to bring something to us that currently exists at a higher vibrational rate. When we use the keys, we manifest whatever it is we wanted, but it is energetic to begin with, and it takes time and effort to make it tangible.

 

So I appreciate your advice. I will not outright dismiss it. All possibilities exist. That means what you said may be right and I may be wrong. Only a fool dismisses a teaching out-of-hand. Being open is part of being flexible, and this is a part of being unattatched. So I am open to any truths in what you have said. I will save this thread and let these words sink into the morass of my mind. Maybe meditate on them.

 

All I can say with any certainty at all is this. I lived life for many years as a Christian. Identified myself as a Christian. In many ways the Christian God is like Tao or the Way. One of those ways is that Christains are taught to trust God to provide. That He will care for them (the whole lillies of the field passage.) I lived my life according to those teachings for over half my life. Rarely were things beyond the most basic of needs every provided for. Blind trust, belief and faith is exactly the same as wishing without feeling or effort. They will both provide exactly the same thing - nothing. You can not ask God to fill your empty belly, nor can you trust Tao to fill it.

 

All that time as a Christian I worked hard, I served and I prayed. My earthly rewards were embarassment because I had no social skills (homeschooled), lonliness because I only every went on 1 date (not even a real date), depression because I lived in a double-wide trailer and had very little, thoughts of suicide because I never felt this joy Christians are supposed to experience. In short I worked without expecting anything, and nothing was amy reward. Now when I say work I refer to not-work (the belief, trust, no expectations, etc.) and religious work (preaching, teaching, being an example, etc.)

 

So as far as Tao or the Way, with all due respect, you can keep it. I will remain open to it, not adverse to it. But I will also not follow it. One time down the, "Trust God (in the case of Tao or the Way, the Universe or Nature) to provide and He (or she or it) will..." path is enough for this lifetime.

 

One last thing I know is what I am doing now works. It has proven to be experientially true. I have created a handful of realities and they all have manifested in various ways. Granted not always exactly as I outlined, but that's OK. I'm not attatched or adverse to whatever manifests either. I invest my trust and belief that whatever does manifest is the best for me at that time, in that moment. If it doesn't manifest then it was not for me at that time or in that moment. Meanwhile while I work to manifest my chosen realities, I go with the flow. I do not force.

 

So this is my Way, my Tao, my path, my religion of non-religion. It works for me and as long as it does I will continue to follow it.

- DreamBliss

 

Once again you are not understanding what I'm saying. You evidently do not appreciate my advice, because you continue to overlay your own interpretation of what I mean when I say Tao, and then continue on with that same faulty interpretation which I had just said, specifically, was not was I was saying.

 

You keep thinking that when I say Tao I am referring to something other than you. You erroneously assume that when I speak of nature, I am referring to something external to yourself. You are separating yourself from the world around you for no reason. What does religion have to do with anything that I have said? I'm talking about you, and the world in your immediate presence, tangible right now, if only you would extend yourself beyond your self-imposed fleshly limitations and narrow field of vision.

Edited January 4, 2013 by Fū Yue