World Medicine of Tao

[liminal_luke]

It would be nice if there were abundant clinical trails for all the complementary therapies out there, but even if they were it wouldn't prove much. We're brainwashed into believing that if someone out there does a double-blind study that concludes that X is the case, well then, that's it. Seems so simple until you read somebody else's double blind study that comes to the exact opposite conclusion. Don't believe me? Try figuring out from the scientific literature the healthiest way to eat--low fat, low carb, vegetarian? There's tons of published studies and still plenty of room for intelligent people to differ.

[Ya Mu]

It would be nice if there were abundant clinical trails for all the complementary therapies out there, but even if they were it wouldn't prove much. We're brainwashed into believing that if someone out there does a double-blind study that concludes that X is the case, well then, that's it. Seems so simple until you read somebody else's double blind study that comes to the exact opposite conclusion. Don't believe me? Try figuring out from the scientific literature the healthiest way to eat--low fat, low carb, vegetarian? There's tons of published studies and still plenty of room for intelligent people to differ.

Exactly! I probably shouldn't do it but I usually refer to them as Doubly Blind studies. THIS is why I advocate history of use as a much more accurate form of evaluation. It has proven itself over and over whereas double blind has a track record that is not pretty; only look to the info link I posted of the failed harmful drugs that allegedly passed double blind studies.

 

edit: Oh, and I agree with you about the fact it really would not make much difference for complementary therapies to pass these type of studies.

Edited November 18, 2012 by Ya Mu

[GrandmasterP]

Clinical trials have done for many traditional herbal remedies here in the UK with some herbalist companies of very long standing going to the wall.

Just a few big players now who have been able to buy certain well known herbal remedies and have those passed.

In one way it's been a good thing as the charlatans were effectively weeded out but to some extent they threw the baby out with the bathwater in that some old fashioned medicines are no longer available. Mucillage of Squill for example which cured chesty coughs for generations.

Gone forever with a pretty poor licensed substitute, containing next to no Squill at all; in its place.

We make our own herbal potions, that's legal just so long as they are solely for our own use.

[三江源]

Clinical trials have done for many traditional herbal remedies here in the UK with some herbalist companies of very long standing going to the wall.

Just a few big players now who have been able to buy certain well known herbal remedies and have those passed.

In one way it's been a good thing as the charlatans were effectively weeded out but to some extent they threw the baby out with the bathwater in that some old fashioned medicines are no longer available. Mucillage of Squill for example which cured chesty coughs for generations.

Gone forever with a pretty poor licensed substitute, containing next to no Squill at all; in its place.

We make our own herbal potions, that's legal just so long as they are solely for our own use.

 

 

Please tell what charlatans have been weeded out?

[GrandmasterP]

Crikey that would be a big list for Britain and one I don't have but from memory of the newspaper coverage at the time...

The back street abortifacient sellers were amongst the first to go.

A particular proprietary 'stomach remedy' containing kaolin and morphine much favoured by drug abusers.

Various herbal concoctions found to contain toxic impurities.

Petro Balsam (carcinogenic).

Bronze Maggot Dye (carcinogenic).

 

Related link here....

http://www.fitpro.com/news/index.php/2011/02/herbal-remedies-to-be-banned/

[Harmonious Emptiness]

Just sharing a thought which may be helpful:

 

Complimentary therapies often work like the spotter in a gym.. that bit of pressure is often enough to help the person lift the weight.

 

People today look to drugs in order to lift the weight for them and lose the benefit of actually pushing on their own as well.

 

Another way of looking at this is that the western medicine is the spotter, while the complimentary medicine is the push on the part of the patient.

 

Sometimes, often, it just takes a little bit to help someone lift the weight. When the person doesn't do the work for themselves, they just get weaker and weaker rather than stronger by their own effort.

 

"I do not open up the truth to one who is not eager to get knowledge, nor help out any one who is not anxious to explain himself. When I have presented one corner of a subject to any one, and he cannot from it learn the other three, I do not repeat my lesson."

- Confucius

[Ya Mu]

Clinical trials have done for many traditional herbal remedies here in the UK with some herbalist companies of very long standing going to the wall.

Just a few big players now who have been able to buy certain well known herbal remedies and have those passed.

In one way it's been a good thing as the charlatans were effectively weeded out but to some extent they threw the baby out with the bathwater in that some old fashioned medicines are no longer available. Mucillage of Squill for example which cured chesty coughs for generations.

Gone forever with a pretty poor licensed substitute, containing next to no Squill at all; in its place.

We make our own herbal potions, that's legal just so long as they are solely for our own use.

The problem with people making their own herbal potions is that it can certainly be a complicated process. However, certain herbal remedies can easily be grown in ones yard.

 

But I was appalled when I learned the UK would not allow herbal formulas from facilities meeting international standards of testing and production (tested for pesticides, etc). The Chinese herbal formulas are actually quite controlled, at least those purchased from reputable companies, and can certainly do a lot of good. I personally purchase Golden Flower Herbs manufactured in Taiwan. Kan Herb Company and Chinese Modular Solutions are two companies in the USA who have extremely high standards - I also use their products.

 

The regulation topic reminds me of the fairly recent thing in the USA of massage therapy licensing. It ended up that currently most states in the USA require licensing. The arguments were that it would protect the public from harm and lead to licensed massage therapist being respected and decrease prostitution and allow the massage therapists to file and collect insurance. But the truth is that prior to licensing there is not one single documented case of anyone being hurt from massage therapy. The truth is that massage therapist are not respected any more or any less. The truth is that prostitution will happen anyway. The truth is that the largest benefits of the regulation were the massage schools who now charge upwards of $25,000 to teach people how to rub someone; incidentally the schools were the single largest pusher of the regulations. The truth is that in order for a person to really keep up with and file insurance requires them to hire a full time employee, paying them 20-30k per year or more. Great benefit to the public and to the massage therapists, eh?

[三江源]

 

 

But I was appalled when I learned the UK would not allow herbal formulas from facilities meeting international standards of testing and production (tested for pesticides, etc).

 

 

Sewn up. It's gutting and stultifying.

[Ya Mu]

Sewn up. It's gutting and stultifying.

It is a shame. Especially when England represented some of the early pioneers of natural medicine. Somewhere I have on my shelf a book by the doctor from England who was considered one of the founders of modern naturopathic medicine. As it was written a LOONG time ago it is probably worth a good deal of money. I wouldn't part with it due to the fact it was given to me by my teacher. The story I wrote above in an earlier post about the doctor throwing a chair through a patients window in order to give them fresh air was this particular doctor.

 

I am afraid with the current attitude in the USA that many natural supplements, including herbal medicine, will be regulated to death; fueled by those special interest groups representing pharmacy and other large corporations.

 

As a side note, how many understand that, in the USA, the single largest monetary contribution fighter against legalization of medical marijuana is the liquor lobby? The majority of physicians are for it.

[GrandmasterP]

http://www.fitpro.com/news/index.php/2011/02/herbal-remedies-to-be-banned/

 

This may be of interest.

 

 

 

 

By the by.

Do NOT attempt to make your own herbal potions or concoctions unless you really know what you are doing.

Herbal does not necessarily mean non-toxic and active ingredient strength can vary depending on time and season collected and across species. The definition of a poison is.....

Any substance which, if taken in sufficient quantity, may endanger life.

Don't make and take anything you have not been trained to identify, classify, pick and prepare-properly.

Edited November 18, 2012 by GrandmasterP

[Ya Mu]

Just sharing a thought which may be helpful:

 

Complimentary therapies often work like the spotter in a gym.. that bit of pressure is often enough to help the person lift the weight.

 

People today look to drugs in order to lift the weight for them and lose the benefit of actually pushing on their own as well.

 

Another way of looking at this is that the western medicine is the spotter, while the complimentary medicine is the push on the part of the patient.

 

Sometimes, often, it just takes a little bit to help someone lift the weight. When the person doesn't do the work for themselves, they just get weaker and weaker rather than stronger by their own effort.

 

"I do not open up the truth to one who is not eager to get knowledge, nor help out any one who is not anxious to explain himself. When I have presented one corner of a subject to any one, and he cannot from it learn the other three, I do not repeat my lesson."

- Confucius

Good post! And good Quote.

 

Referencing the quote, unfortunately, due to dynamics and prevalence of ignorance (or "cultivated ignorance" as RV said in another thread), repetition is necessary to get any particular thing across to all but the self-reliant thinking person (assuming they actually think and are willing to broaden their awareness). And then it is only a small percentage that will get their head out of the sand and broaden their awareness. I do think teachers are always glad of the small percentage.

[GrandmasterP]

2%

+\-

That's the percentage of first class degrees awarded each year in UK universities.

The remainder of students being content to snooze and make do with a 2-2 or less.

[Ya Mu]

...

By the by.

Do NOT attempt to make your own herbal potions or concoctions unless you really know what you are doing.

Herbal does not necessarily mean non-toxic and active ingredient strength can vary depending on time and season collected and across species. The definition of a poison is.....

Any substance which, if taken in sufficient quantity, may endanger life.

Don't make and take anything you have not been trained to identify, classify, pick and prepare-properly.

Worth repeating, over and over... This is why I prefer preparations done by respectable companies with professional herbalists and PH.D chemists on staff. I am very leery of lay herbalists who speak of certain preparations. Those ingredients are not found in the respectable modern herbalists manufacturers. Unfortunately, in your country, these products that are safe are now illegal whereas it is legal for a person to be ignorant and eat or take harmful preparations. In a way it is like the legalities have the distinct possibility to drive people to make uninformed decisions if they wish to explore natural remedies.

[z00se]

All medicine can be  good. What works for one doesnt work for another. Having them available is a benefit of society because we can try different things till we find what works