Bird people

[de_paradise]

Anybody run into anybody associated with ancient people somehow born from eagles, or something similar? A kind of lineage, not just a legend or hallucination, born into human form. And if so, what was this lineage about?

Edited November 19, 2012 by de_paradise

[chi 2012]

David Icke might have it wrong....It's not reptiles that are trying to take over - it's Bird People. Did you see the way Romney went after Big Bird? He knows something.

[eye_of_the_storm]

Lyra constellation apparently

 

Ancient star wars between the Lyraen (Eagle) and Draco (Dragon) continuing to this day?

 

Or maybe something else? ha

Edited November 19, 2012 by White Wolf Running On Air

[Aetherous]

Anybody run into anybody associated with ancient people somehow born from eagles, or something similar?

 

I'm interested in what brought you to ask this?

[Jetsun]

I read a book about someone who went searching for the legend of the Bird men http://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/161145509X , apparently it comes from the shamanic tribes of Peru associated with drinking Ayahuasca where it allows you to go on a shamanic journey in the body of a bird.

[Dainin]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tengu

[thelerner]

I was also thinking Tengu, bird spirits and legendary teacher of the martial arts, according to one strain of Tengu legend.

[GrandmasterP]

If it walks like a duck, quacks like a duck and looks like a duck....

[Taomeow]

A Quetzal is this bird:

http://t3.gstatic.co...xCedBj6O-HyUjHg

 

And a Coatl is this day-sign in the Aztec calendar, meaning "serpent" or "twin" :

http://t2.gstatic.co...7AWhCgiEJYEJPlQ

 

The reason "serpent" and "twin" are the same word in Nahuatl only becomes clear if you consider the structure of the DNA -- a double ("twin") helix (symbol for snake, and vice versa), and becomes clearer if you know the holographic nature of ancient languages, a single word occasionally encompassing the whole cognitive paradigm. Quetzalcoatl is one such word. "Twin" also means "the same," "a copy," "identical," "very closely related," etc.--

and may refer to the serpent being our twin, or we, its copy.

 

What exactly they were saying by attributing our creation to Quetzalcoatl -- our origin involving a donation of a particular type of DNA, the "twin snakes" being a generic term in this case -- or the specific snake DNA of our reptilian creator, with or without the involvement of birds (very closely related to reptiles), this I might know but may not tell, or might tell but just so that you can't tell I did... this last bit is an example of language spiraling around the subject without colliding with it directly, something practiced by shamans worldwide when they tackle matters of high complexity. The quetzal part of the name may have been used symbolically -- the plumage of this bird is brilliant, the flight striking -- the incredibly long flexible tail feathers wave and twist in a spiral-like motion when a quetzal flies... and ancient people were keen on metaphors, which modern researchers overwhelmingly miss, because the scientists among them are not poetic enough to get it, and poets among them, not scientific enough.

 

But ultimately there's no other way to get it than by spiraling around it without colliding with it directly, painting a double sine wave in the sky with your tail feather, and knowing the twin of your creator in yourself.

[GreytoWhite]

Birds are also genetically linked to dinosaurs. Birds are evolved from ancient reptiles that developed more feathers as well as developed more quickly from infancy.

[zanshin]

Horus, Thoth and Isis, Nike and a few other Greek goddesses, the Harpies.

 

The Mothman in modern times.

[Isimsiz Biri]

If we are talking about our physical bodies, we are descendants of Adam and Eve.

 

If we are talking about our astral bodies, our astral bodies are also formed by the energies of physical body.

 

Animal spirits are actually not spirits but intangible values. This intangible value starts its evolution and forms as minerals, then plants then animals. Finally it reaches a level that can be incarnated as a human being. Then it becomes a spirit.

Edited November 20, 2012 by Recep Ivedik

[eye_of_the_storm]

Birds are also genetically linked to dinosaurs. Birds are evolved from ancient reptiles that developed more feathers as well as developed more quickly from infancy.

 

I dont know about all this genetics stuff... as I have said before we share 40% of our DNA with a banana or something which I find quite funny hahaha...ahh

[de_paradise]

My understanding is that there's many ancient spiritual lineages, perhaps from pre-human days, extra-terrestrial, or from higher level beings interacting with humans, and somehow getting associated with some form. Think of Max's snakes and all the snake related schools for example. Eagles, phoenixes, garudas too. I guess it could be said a lot of of the ancient and powerful "stuff" remains hidden or apart from the mainstream schools. And nowadays we don't feel the need to turn every higher being into compartment of an established religion, like a Buddha or emination of Tara, etc. You get to hear lots of strange stories just listening to people, but you need a good background in this stuff to avoid misinterpretation.

[GrandmasterP]

Birds are also genetically linked to dinosaurs. Birds are evolved from ancient reptiles that developed more feathers as well as developed more quickly from infancy.

..........

Highly contested theory.

http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2010/02/100209183335.htm

 

Edited November 20, 2012 by GrandmasterP

[GrandmasterP]

My understanding is that there's many ancient spiritual lineages, perhaps from pre-human days, extra-terrestrial, or from higher level beings interacting with humans, and somehow getting associated with some form. Think of Max's snakes and all the snake related schools for example. Eagles, phoenixes, garudas too. I guess it could be said a lot of of the ancient and powerful "stuff" remains hidden or apart from the mainstream schools. And nowadays we don't feel the need to turn every higher being into compartment of an established religion, like a Buddha or emination of Tara, etc. You get to hear lots of strange stories just listening to people, but you need a good background in this stuff to avoid misinterpretation.

.........

Caveman Bob said.......

Bird fly.

Me can't fly.

Bird magic.

Me paint magic bird on cave wall.

Caveman and Mrs. Jones from the next cave are round at Bob and Mrs. Bob's for dinner, admire the bird painting and commission Bob to paint one on their cave wall.

Pretty soon Caveman Bob has given up his day job at the quarry in favour of full time bird painting and cave interior design.

'Bob's Magic Birds' does so well that after a while Bob comes to be known as 'Magic Bird Bob'.

In order to grow the business Bob realises that he needs to diversify and add value so comes up with little rituals and takes to wearing a bird feather cloak whilst he does those, then he paints your magic bird.

Bob advertises under the new slogan...

'Magic Bob's birds for that look of luxury, plus they bring good luck to your cave and family'.

Bob prospers and wants to spend more time with the guys playing golf so he takes on staff and trains them in bird painting and ritual.

Pretty soon the company is running itself and has branches all over the known world.

The further away from head office the more culturally varied the artwork and rituals became in order to suit the tastes and artistic preferences of various tribes.

Echoes of Bob's firm are still with us today.

Edited November 20, 2012 by GrandmasterP

[GreytoWhite]

..........

Highly contested theory.

http://www.scienceda...00209183335.htm

 

That article is over 2 years old. We have had some great work done in that time.

 

http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2012/05/120530212105.htm

[Taomeow]

That article is over 2 years old. We have had some great work done in that time.http://www.scienceda...20530212105.htm

 

From the article:

"Rather than take years to reach sexual maturity, as many dinosaurs did, birds sped up the clock -- some species take as little as 12 weeks to mature -- allowing them to retain the physical characteristics of baby dinosaurs."

 

That's neoteny, a developmental stop at an early stage of a species development, with features of a fetal or infantile stage, either physical or behavioral or both, persisting into adulthood and developing by self-amplification instead of transformation into the next stage normal for the original species. Neotenic species never reach true maturity and instead are forced to explore to the fullest some fetal or infantile characteristics as an alternative to growing up the natural way. This is the phenomenon whereby homo sapiens is also produced: by retaining into adulthood the biological characteristics of a chimpanzee fetus. This has been known for decades, and is observed in all domesticated species deriving from the wild ones, to a greater or lesser extent. (E.g., in domesticated cats neoteny is minimal -- they only retain three distinct kittenish behaviors into adulthood -- meowing, kneading, and purring, which promptly disappear in feral adults. In domesticated pigs, it is also reversible -- they grow tusks and harsh bristles of a wild boar within weeks after going feral. In dogs, who were domesticated much earlier than cats or pigs, it is more significant -- most of adult dog behavior is that of a wolf cub.)

 

In humans, neoteny is overwhelming (though it may also be reversible -- remember the taoist story about a demoted emperor's concubine who went into hiding in the forest, lived there with no contact with other humans, ate of the wild fare, and was captured years later all covered in fur and uncannily strong and healthy?) When neoteny happens in "natural" species, it is always drastic -- not a gradual transformation but an explosion of gene silencers, hundreds of linked traits being abolished all at once and new functions coming into play much the way an amputee who has lost his legs to an accident (rather than a disease) develops extra blood supply to the heart and the strongest upper body. On the genetic level, this works in a similar fashion -- putting a stop to certain functions will cause certain other functions to take over and get amplified.

 

To me neoteny does not look one bit as something that can be chalked up to "natural" "evolution." Evolution would have to make decisions in advance about how exactly to produce a new species by blocking developmental stages of the original one. It is impossible to produce a fully functional new species via this process without knowing what the goal is. Any random events of arrested fetal development in a dino or a chimp would be either teratogenic or lethal to the fetus instead of adaptive. So, neither creation nor evolution can explain a neotenic species in any satisfactory fashion, while intervention, genetic manipulation, explains it beautifully.

 

Who did it and what for... um, whoever domesticates chickens or sheep should be able to take a guess as to "what for." The "who" question remains debatable. But someone did it, no question. There's much genetic evidence that's popping up that points in the general direction of an intervention, on top of all the hush-hushed historic evidence. E.g., 11,000 years ago (just when homo sapiens suddenly started practicing agriculture and slavery and building pyramids), we turned blond out of the blue -- a recessive gene that was as rare as a chicken with dinosaur teeth (probably picked up from our cross-breeding with Neanderthals, who were blond and had brains 1/4 larger than ours and were taller and stronger than us, according to recent findings, and may have engaged in pity sex with our kind some 6 million years ago but not more recently, according to genetic evidence) suddenly exploded and became prominent or even dominant in many populations not connected with each other. Now this, in and of itself, does not prove that Aryans (martians, blond beasts from Aries, Mars) did this to us, but it does merit a pursuit of a kind of education not available to mainstream scientists -- e.g. a double major in epigenetics and comparative mythology. We do not currently produce scientific minds capable of grasping a wider picture, alas.

 

But some of them produce themselves, thank god/evolution/intervention.

[Birch]

Interesting post Taomeow. So why the 'hush-hushed' part? Is this just another version of present humans' distaste for any origin story that shows us of less than superior status? We've allowed the 'X% of our genes are shared with X species' statements for a long time, but I suppose it was to calm down the people who don't like hearing the 'humans = monkeys' thing.

 

I agree that we retain childlike behaviour but I thought it was more to do with the way power over people is distributed by people themselves.

 

I keep thinking of Fu Xi with this stuff. He basically turned up and got people to do things like adopt marriage, use agriculture etc.

 

 

[eye_of_the_storm]

It suddenly appeared due to mass global catastrophic event that wiped out near everything and everyone,the surviving humans had to start all over, though still had the knowledge?

 

I think nearly every culture has a great flood / deluge story. Some claim the asteroid belt in our solar system was once a water planet that exploded (few different theories)... called Lucifer? (The Bright and Morning Star) who fell to earth?

 

Atlantis, Lemuria, Mu legends.

 

I was looking into "forbidden archaeology" and they apparently have found dinosaur foot prints next to human foot prints that are millions of years old? odd

 

And carved beads that date 2 million years...

 

Who knows *shrugs*

 

What if we are the aliens we have been looking for? haha

 

The Indian Rig Veda? 5000 - 7000 BC speaks of flying machines we possessed (not UFO) and what could only be described as nuclear weapons.

 

Now it seems we are on the verge of WW3... maybe it will be time to start over again... maybe this has happened continually over millions of years /// build destroy build destroy... some perhaps attain something greater and leave the box.

 

Like the tales of the Inca who just "disappeared"?

Edited November 21, 2012 by White Wolf Running On Air

[Taomeow]

Interesting post Taomeow. So why the 'hush-hushed' part? Is this just another version of present humans' distaste for any origin story that shows us of less than superior status? We've allowed the 'X% of our genes are shared with X species' statements for a long time, but I suppose it was to calm down the people who don't like hearing the 'humans = monkeys' thing.

 

I agree that we retain childlike behaviour but I thought it was more to do with the way power over people is distributed by people themselves.

 

I keep thinking of Fu Xi with this stuff. He basically turned up and got people to do things like adopt marriage, use agriculture etc.

 

Why hush-hush... I was just watching a documentary about the burning of all documents in China pertaining to the travels of Admiral Zheng He (who discovered America in 1421, in the course of one of his seven unprecedented and unreplicated great voyages), thinking, uh-huh, another one of those... I think I've mentioned a friend of a friend whose hobby has been (for several decades) collecting information about Burned Libraries. He currently has over 100,000 of them in his database and counting. Ask anyone in the business of collecting any information of any events what the reason might be for the destruction of evidence. The answer will be, evidence is usually destroyed to conceal a crime.

 

As for human immaturity, it's not just behavior -- some humans are behaving as adults of the species (exceedingly rarely these days), it's physiology. We are not fully developed. We are stunted. A brain working at 5% of its capacity -- that's not infantile, that's fetal. Non-neotenic species utilize the whole of the brain they have. Also our physiology is abnormal for our habitat (hence clothes, fire-building and so on, things that scream "physiological maladaptation" where we are told they say "evolution" -- evolution is something that gives the body an environmental edge, not something that maladapts it to the environment and demands an out-of-body solution -- we haven't evolved to wear clothes and use fire, we suffered arrested development. A primate infant can't warm itself with its own body, relying on the external source, in the case of primates the mother. An adult primate is its own source of thermoregulation. We are never adult enough for that unless we practice tummo or some such continuation-toward-normalization cultivation routine. Just one example.)

 

As for Fu Xi, remember that 13th century picture of what he looks like? alongside Nuwa the creatress of humans? Fuxi_et_Nüwa.jpg

[Isimsiz Biri]

It suddenly appeared due to mass global catastrophic event that wiped out near everything and everyone,the surviving humans had to start all over, though still had the knowledge?

 

I think nearly every culture has a great flood / deluge story. Some claim the asteroid belt in our solar system was once a water planet that exploded (few different theories)... called Lucifer? (The Bright and Morning Star) who fell to earth?

 

Atlantis, Lemuria, Mu legends.

 

I was looking into "forbidden archaeology" and they apparently have found dinosaur foot prints next to human foot prints that are millions of years old? odd

 

And carved beads that date 2 million years...

 

Who knows *shrugs*

 

What if we are the aliens we have been looking for? haha

 

The Indian Rig Veda? 5000 - 7000 BC speaks of flying machines we possessed (not UFO) and what could only be described as nuclear weapons.

 

Now it seems we are on the verge of WW3... maybe it will be time to start over again... maybe this has happened continually over millions of years /// build destroy build destroy... some perhaps attain something greater and leave the box.

 

Like the tales of the Inca who just "disappeared"?

 

Atlantis was the another human race that had lived on earth before our Adam and Eve were created.

[Birch]

Hi Taomeow!

I was pondering this one before sleeping last night (possibly the source of my less than pleasant dreams??) and I wanted to write a post about it that wouldn't just be a disgusted reaction - I tend to get those when hearing/reading of things that I find disgusting like GMO crops, or banking algorythms, but I digress.

 

Aside from burning libraries to cover evidence of crime (helps in revisionism to not have readily available documents) I also looked at it as cultural/political revisonism. Something that has been practiced (and continues to be practiced thanks to internet:-)) to enable faster 'regime-changes' than would otherwise be possible. Of course you can just kill off a generation and put the following into some kind of 'school' but if their past is easily accessible then you're just preparing yourself a revolt for that crime. Better just to change the texts.

 

I agree with you about the physicality of evolution. I don't understand the other ways evolution is often used to describe other things

like the spread of ideas or the normalizing of certain types of behaviour.

 

Then I was considering the idea of the unfolding of a person's 'blueprint', not in DNA terms alone, but in qi terms. In other words, even if the DNA has been tweaked to be stunted, is the rest of it still there in terms of qi? I've gotten used to the fact that my brain just isn't that great, am I deluding myself further if I consult my qi?

 

I remember coming across that image of Fu Xi and Nûwa and the story of Fu Xi's 'gifts' and being pretty weirded out by it. But I just put it aside (much like I do with GMO's and banking algorythms). I'd read Narby ages ago and it just sort of linked up with that.

 

Other things I thought about this morning:

 

- The Egyptians were the very first cargo cult

- Are we still getting given 'gifts' by the same people?

- I quite like not being covered in fur

- What do animals do with their 100% brains?

- Are there bits of me I can rely on that are fully formed?

- Holywood, what gives with the glut of origin-stories?

[madMUHHH]

This is kinda off-topic, but I still thought I might share this with you people. For anyone who thinks that there is something off both with the current scientific view on evolution (and materialism in general) and any type of creationism, this book might be very interesting. For a piece of philosophy it's also very readable in my opinion (and relatively short aswell):

 

"[...] Since minds are features of biological systems that have developed through evolution, the standard materialist version of evolutionary biology is fundamentally incomplete. And the cosmological history that led to the origin of life and the coming into existence of the conditions for evolution cannot be a merely materialist history, either. An adequate conception of nature would have to explain the appearance in the universe of materially irreducible conscious minds, as such.

 

Nagel's skepticism is not based on religious belief or on a belief in any definite alternative. In Mind and Cosmos, he does suggest that if the materialist account is wrong, then principles of a different kind may also be at work in the history of nature, principles of the growth of order that are in their logical form teleological rather than mechanistic.

 

In spite of the great achievements of the physical sciences, reductive materialism is a world view ripe for displacement. Nagel shows that to recognize its limits is the first step in looking for alternatives, or at least in being open to their possibility."

Edited November 21, 2012 by madMUHHH

[三江源]