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[Flolfolil]

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Edited March 6, 2015 by Flolfolil

[Protector]

IBOGA!!!!

 

[RiverSnake]

If you're gonna be doing any kind of hallucinogenics i'd recommend you find some one whom has experience and knows how to handle the substances and can act as a guide through the experience....a professional shaman....etc. Make sure to do your research though, plenty of fakes out there.

 

In regards to using drugs in combination with your practice.....not sure if that's a good or bad thing, i have no experience....though i know some people say taking hallucinogenics has "opened" them up in certain ways.

 

However, one's goal should be to practice cultivation to the point where you no longer need to use drugs to be "High". Drugs can be a serious crutch for those who rather just pop a pill than put any effort into there self-cultivation.

 

Also, my understanding is that you should never take any kind of drugs when your in a negative state (fear, anger...etc)....it can amplify tremendously and cause a "bad trip".

 

Most of what i am saying comes from hearing of other's experiences...so take it with a grain of salt.

 

-My 2 cent, Peace

[hydrogen]

I wish there some drug I that I can take daily without side effect and doesn't interfere with my moral daily life.

 

I don't see anything wrong with occasional use as fast path into another dimetion, though I never experimented with LSD or DMT.

 

I used to smoke weed with my meditation. The problem is that it's too good a tool. I could get into meditation mood in 1 minutes after smoking. The day I didn't smoke, I'd become frustrated about my slow progress. I started to incorporated more and more. Then one day I realized that I had been smoking daily, that made me an addict. I went cold turkey. I still miss my weed sometimes.

 

To serious meditator, drug is akin a steroid to an athlete. I have to agree with the bible thumber: drug is bad (if used daily).

[Aetherous]

I don't know about mixing drugs and practice (what practice?)...but when I did salvia divinorum (hallucinogenic), it had a very clarifying effect after the come down. I would want to experiment with chewing the leaves or trying tinctures or something, if it were still legal.

Edited November 24, 2012 by turtle shell

[Jetsun]

I don't think its advisable or needed to use sacred plants if you have a working spiritual path which you resonate with, for emergency situations and healing they have their uses. This is coming from someone who spent two weeks in Peru with Shaman taking Ayahuasca. There are so many risks involves, finding a genuine Shaman to work with is essential but they are very rare even in countries like Peru, the majority of those who call themselves Shaman have no real development and are obsessed with money, women and power like most other regular folk.

[Aetherous]

where do you live that salvia isn't legal?

 

Um...AMERICA. lol

[skydog]

Imo taking peyote or Iboga is not like meditation or qigong at all. It offers a peak experience or glimpse or healing etc. What you can learn in one night can equate to years of normal practice, of course thats one usage no need to go crazy.

[i am]

In my limited experience, they can be a bit of "fast track", which is probably detrimental to serious practice in the long run. I credit the hallucinogens I took (strictly for recreation as a stupid kid) while I was young for opening up doors in my head and possibilities in my mind that I never considered before. Whether they were illusions or glimpses of the "real thing" (and whether there is any difference between the two ) I don't know, but they got me thinking...

 

I have yet to test this, since I haven't taken any hallucinogens since I really started to "practice", but I feel that diligent practice, with an occasional substance-induced experience punctuating things, is probably ok. I think if you really are on a path, you'll know if the substance brings you closer, or farther away from where you're trying to go.

 

So...for someone early on their path with possibly no real teacher and not much of an idea what the "real thing" is...I guess substances probably aren't too great of an idea.

 

And it seems to me that I've never, so far, heard anyone who I'd consider to be far on the path, advocate using any substances. So at an advanced stage they don't seem necessary or beneficial.

Edited November 24, 2012 by i am

[Isimsiz Biri]

Please forgive me, which ones are legal, which ones are illegal? I got really curious.

[Humble]

On the legal side of drugs, has anyone noticed differences in practice with caffeine or tobacco? Both have had spiritual-esque applications in the past. But then both of them also were used without the crud mixed with them these days so,,,,,maybe they could still be beneficial?

[Aetherous]

The drug i do the most is perfectly legal and probably always will be though

 

What's your drug?

 

On the legal side of drugs, has anyone noticed differences in practice with caffeine or tobacco?

 

Real tobacco is considered the main "medicine" of many groups. It has a great energy. Order some of the real stuff from fur and hide, and tune into it. I have experienced a practice of chewing the raw leaf for a while, which is stimulating and might help activate the higher centers. Or some simply smudge the smoke around yourself...besides smoking with a ceremonial pipe. Or simply hold it in your hands with respect.

Edited November 24, 2012 by turtle shell

[Thunder_Gooch]

I guess depending on your goal drugs could be helpful, or harmful.

 

If enlightenment in a non-dualistic sense is your goal, go for it.

 

If enlightenment in an energetic sense is your goal, forget about it.

[oildrops]

Dextromethorphan, it is a dissociative like ketamine and pcp. It basically pulls all your attention inside your body. At high levels you stop identifying with your body. High dose users normally have out of body experiences. It is very stimulating to higher centers, and can cause one to feel like their upper body is floating around and they have no legs. It makes getting into a deep meditative state pretty much instantaneous. Prolonged addiction can cause ego death to the point where you don't feel like you even exist or anything is real at all

 

Woah man that sounds like nasty stuff. I think I took some of that a few times when I was younger. Are you sure that what you are experiencing is a "deep meditative state"? Have you been into a deep meditative state without drugs? Just curious.

[Aetherous]

I tried dex a few times way back in the day. Seemed dangerous to me with the way it affected my breathing and heart (just looked it up and people have died from taking too much)...and also not something I'd consider spiritual in its effects.

 

For a similar effect IMO, that is safer...although not legal in most places...would be something like weed brownies.

 

And if salvia is legal where you are, I suggest using that as a way to come to savor the sober state of mind. At least that was its effect on me. People sometimes use drugs to escape normalcy for a while...that's fine...but do you know how blissful normalcy can be?

 

How great would it be to feel high when completely clear minded and capable? I can attest, it is possible. Spiritual practice greatly helps with this.

[oildrops]

Interesting. I really enjoy taking Kava sometimes.

Edited November 25, 2012 by oildrops

[oildrops]

+1 brownies. also fights cancer

[JohnC]

Shrooms, lsd, ayahuasca experience.

 

I think they are fantastic facilitators to your growth and the letting go of things, and clearing emotional trauma/ego/etc.

 

But not to be used as a crutch.

 

You should be practicing, then use this stuff sparingly for clarity/insight/etc.

 

John

[JohnC]

Checking into iboga..

[oildrops]

 

 

I thinkpsilocybin is objectively good.

Edited November 25, 2012 by oildrops

[konchog uma]

On the legal side of drugs, has anyone noticed differences in practice with caffeine or tobacco? Both have had spiritual-esque applications in the past. But then both of them also were used without the crud mixed with them these days so,,,,,maybe they could still be beneficial?

 

yeah i quit both because of my practice

 

and for other reasons, but i think that the best thing for a serious practitioner is to be stimulant and drug free, to the most refined degree that they can. Being on a natural cycle (not up and down in the case of caffeine, or nic-fitting in the case of nicotine) is the best for ones natural flow of energy and for ones meditative state. Most drugs are dependance-forming to some degree, and that is just no bueno mi amigos...

 

furthermore i think there are two kinds of drugs, which i will call intoxicants and entheogens. Intoxicants, like cannabis, alcohol, all the hard drugs, etc just make you feel "high". They might have interesting effects on ones energy, as you could imagine, but they mostly, as mentioned, cause dependance. The entheogens on the other hand, like peyote, psilocybin, DMT, iboga, etc seem to be conscious entities or to act as catalysts to put one in touch with conscious entities that will guide and assist and heal and cleanse the practitioner. These tend to not be habit forming, although they are best taken under the auspices of a practiced healer or shaman who can lead ceremony. Im not going to get into it except to say that taking them recreationally is disrespectful and indulgent and you will never get the benefits that sacramental use brings IMO.

 

ultimately the 8 circuits of consciousness theory, mckennas research into entheogen based shamanism, and other debutante excuses for taking drugs are for the most used to justify indulgent and dangerous behavior in the name of "healing" or "exploration". all 8 circuits are accessable to the sober yogi or meditator, most shamanism doesnt involve entheogens at all, and warns against the harms that can come to the reckless pracitioner (don juan told carlos that he only was using power plants with him because he was too stupid and blocked to walk the normal path, and warned against the deleterious effect that they have on ones energy body to boot).

 

the buddha classified intoxicants down there with killing, lying, stealing, and sexual misconduct... that pretty much says it all from a cultivation standpoint. In my opinion, unless you are taking entheogens in a sacred way, you are engaging in psychedelic masturbation, and not on much better footing than someone using intoxicants.

 

so thats my 2 cents. haha

[Owledge]

i was going to do ayahuasca with this guy i used to work for but he kept going on about illuminati 4th dimensional beings that feed on my fear and it kinda spooked me out of wanting to do something so intense around him lol

I'll just leave this one comment here and probably not make followup comments, because I don't feel like reading so much of this stuff.

 

It seems that ayahuasca opens your waking consciousness to your subconscious. It shows you the stuff that you chose not to see, and it shows you the belief systems that sunk into your subconscious and there maybe shape reality for you. I think that's why some people have their/certain beliefs about profound questions confirmed. They don't realize that when you enter the entheogen realm, there is no absolute truth anymore, just as time vanishes, too. So what you experience and believe to be the truth (because just like in the dream state you think what you experience is real) might simply be your own subconscious beliefs. For example, Joe Rogan said he thinks we are just bacteria, just a cancer on the face of the earth. This has nothing to do with truth as we usually understand it. It's his program of creating reality, competing with other people's programs of creating reality. It's your choice what to believe, and if you experience something during an ayahuasca trip that doesn't vibe with you, then feel free to make a decision to change that belief system and let the update sink in deeply.

The more my ayahuasca experiences move into the past, the more I personally, for me, feel like what I experienced during the trip is less useful than having made the trip itself. The changes in you that you are not aware of might be why you are doing the trip. If what you experienced is just confusing, then let it go. You don't want confusion, right?

It's about being your own author, to have omnipotence over yourself and make changes.

I can only speak from my own experiences, but nothing is certain or fixed when taking ayahuasca. Easy to fool yourself. As a shaman once said: Ayahuasca can be the worst of liars. - Actually, that's not hitting the core. There cannot be a lie if there is no truth. Only you can be that liar, if you choose to stick to the self-deception once you have been shown it.

[deci belle]

Certain drugs with the correct mindset is practice for some people at some times.

[zerostao]

DMT would be infine-ately much better than DXM.

thing is you can produce it on your own in your own brain,

so in that way the legality or non-legal is a joke.

and when you produce your own you dont have to worry about counterfeits

 

http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=DMT

[Mokona]

Mixing drugs with what practice? Dance?