Similarities of practices between Sufism & Gnostic Christianity

[Jeff]

The purpose of this thread is to discuss the similarities (or differences) of advanced practices found in Sufism and Gnostic Christianity.

 

[Jeff]

Continuing from another thread...

 

In Gnostic Christianity (not "institutionalized" Christianity)... God is everything... The Holy Spirit is God in creation (existence). Energy practices are also only in the inner circles of Gnostic Christianity, the outer circles focus on ritual and form that lead to greater silence. As in meditation, the key is to learn to quiet the mind, before one can "feel" the power of the Holy Spirit.

 

In my experience with Gnostic Christianity, there are four major types of "energy"? How about Sufism (anyone know)?

 

 

(edit - forgot the smile)

Edited November 24, 2012 by Jeff

[eye_of_the_storm]

I have read Christian mystical texts referring to I assume chakras, as the 7 churches

Edited November 25, 2012 by White Wolf Running On Air

[gatito]

Could this thread be moved to Hermetic and Occult please, as Gnostic Christianity and Sufism both fulfil the criteria of being Esoteric (Occult).

[Jeff]

I have read Christian mystical texts referring to I assume chakras, as the 7 churches

 

That has been my experience also. Most Christian mystical texts talk about seven lights or candles (chakras) in the body. Some traditions describe an 8th, but going into the details it is described as the integration or merging of the seven. There was also originally seven churches. Rome broke off and the remaining six continued as the Orthodox (Greek) Christianity.

 

The four "types" of energy/light could be described as:

 

Body

Mind/astral

Cosmic/spiritual

Primordial

 

 

[Edward M]

I'd be extremely interested in hearing about gnostic christianity and their practices, if anyone could offer any information or point me to information, that would be very very cool!

 

Peace

[Edward M]

Also, what do you bums think of the practices in light of this video?:

 

I can see how it corresponds with Sufism, but I know very very little about the Gnostic practices of Christianity.

 

Peace

[Jeff]

I'd be extremely interested in hearing about gnostic christianity and their practices, if anyone could offer any information or point me to information, that would be very very cool!

 

Peace

 

Below is a very good site. Just be prepared to spend some time translating the nomenclature into more common/simple terms. Their Tau (teacher) has written some good books and is very responsive to questions.

 

http://www.sophian.org/

 

[Edward M]

Thanks Jeff! i've seen this site before, also have his book Gnosis of the cosmic Christ.

 

Must read it again soon, thanks for reminder! will try and register on the site now!

 

Peace

[Jeff]

Thanks Jeff! i've seen this site before, also have his book Gnosis of the cosmic Christ.

 

Must read it again soon, thanks for reminder! will try and register on the site now!

 

Peace

 

"Gnosis of a cosmic Christ" is an excellent book. His approach at the advanced levels is basically the same as Dzogchen. You may find it helpful to spend a little time with some Dzogchen texts/books. Primordial is primordial.

 

[Edward M]

Thanks Jeff, I may do that. Have a good one!

 

Peace

[raimonio]

So do you guys believe that the holy spirit is the same as the universal energy of Dao? If a Christian would start practicing Daoist Alchemy would he when gathering energy be gathering the holy spirit? If a Daoist master became Christian and let the holy spirit in, would the holy spirit already be there?

[adept]

So do you guys believe that the holy spirit is the same as the universal energy of Dao?

 

Yes. Words tend to get in the way of the Divine.

[adept]

I think 'The Gospel Of Thomas' is required reading for anyone interested in Gnostic Christianity.

I would love to learn more from the Sufism side of things.

[Jeff]

I think 'The Gospel Of Thomas' is required reading for anyone interested in Gnostic Christianity.

I would love to learn more from the Sufism side of things.

 

Completely agree. I think it should have been included in the New Testement.

 

[Jeff]

So do you guys believe that the holy spirit is the same as the universal energy of Dao? If a Christian would start practicing Daoist Alchemy would he when gathering energy be gathering the holy spirit? If a Daoist master became Christian and let the holy spirit in, would the holy spirit already be there?

 

In ancient texts the Holy Spirit as word was feminine. The concept is very similar to Shiva/Shatki in the Hindu tradition. A Daoist master feels the female principle (Holy Spirit) in everything. Just different words (cultures) pointing in the same direction.

 

 

[Seth Ananda]

The Word Shekinah {holy spirit/female face of God} seems to come from the sanscrit word Shakti... OM...

 

Also I like the works of Neil Douglas Klotz. He writes on Aramaic, Sufism and Gnostic Christian perspectives..

[raimonio]

Just read the Gospel of Thomas, I think my draw to Christianity ended with it, because I realized how hard it is to trust the church. I truly wanted to give them a chance but nahh, now I'll get back to where I used to be, despising church and praising the eastern arts

 

Gnosticism and the Gospel of Thomas are not with the church though

Edited November 26, 2012 by raimonio

[Jeff]

Just read the Gospel of Thomas, I think my draw to Christianity ended with it, because I realized how hard it is to trust the church. I truly wanted to give them a chance but nahh, now I'll get back to where I used to be, despising church and praising the eastern arts

 

Gnosticism and the Gospel of Thomas are not with the church though

 

Interesting thought. I think of it more like the organized church as the "outer form" of Christianity. All traditions have outer and inner meanings/understandings. Very hard to keep any tradition consistent over a period of 2000 years.

 

At it's most basic level, all of Christianity teaches love and surrender. You can never go wrong starting with a path like that.

 

[Unseen_Abilities]

The Word Shekinah {holy spirit/female face of God} seems to come from the sanscrit word Shakti... OM...

 

Also I like the works of Neil Douglas Klotz. He writes on Aramaic, Sufism and Gnostic Christian perspectives..

 

Just Google'd Neil Douglas Klotz and found this video...thought some of you might find it interesting

 

[Aetherous]

The Word Shekinah {holy spirit/female face of God} seems to come from the sanscrit word Shakti

 

I recently heard shekinah pronounced by a Jew. It sounded something like sh-he-nuh. The 'k' is like a hard H, and the 'e' in she is almost not even there. It would be cool if there was a linguistic connection, but I'm kinda doubting it after hearing it.

[Seth Ananda]

I recently heard shekinah pronounced by a Jew. It sounded something like sh-he-nuh. The 'k' is like a hard H, and the 'e' in she is almost not even there. It would be cool if there was a linguistic connection, but I'm kinda doubting it after hearing it.

Hey I have read studies on the Sanskrit root of Hebrew, and Shekinah definitely seems to be rooted in Shakti. The Egyptian Sekhem is another, all with connotations of divine feminine power...

Dont forget that Hebrew pronounciation has changed greatly over the millenia, and from region to region...

I also have spent time with my Hassidic friends discussing Kabbalah and have heard it pronounced with a sharper 'K' to what you said, but it is still softer than the way it reads.

Be Well, and may the Divine Mother smile on you

[theurgy]

Interesting thought. I think of it more like the organized church as the "outer form" of Christianity. All traditions have outer and inner meanings/understandings. Very hard to keep any tradition consistent over a period of 2000 years.

 

At it's most basic level, all of Christianity teaches love and surrender. You can never go wrong starting with a path like that.

 

 

Indeed there are fundamentally two churches: the church of Peter and the church of John.

 

As we recall from the Gospel, Peter denied Christ and even tried to prevent Jesus' capture by the Romans in the garden of Gethsemane. It was also Peter who didn't have even the faith of a mustard seed when he tried to walk on water as Jesus did. And yet, Peter (Petra) is the rock that Jesus said he would use to build his church--why? The simplified version is that as the representative of the exoteric church Peter shows us that enthusiasm can go a long way but falls short without a deeper understanding of the Path.

 

Now as Jesus hangs upon the cross he tells John that Mary is now his mother and that he is now her son in this way he passes on the blessing to John who represents the esoteric or inner church. Recall that John is the only disciple who wasn't martyred and he lived out his days on the isle of Patmos where he received the book of Revelations through a series of prophetic visions.

 

So as we see there will always be two churches. Everyone must start somewhere. For some it will have to be with organized religion. But for those who can see through the blame game and the popular secularism so prevalent today, they will find the inner church and will be guided accordingly.

[Aetherous]

Interesting, I had never heard that about John before. It is right in the bible at John 19:25-27. It just says his favored disciple, but apparently yes that is John.

 

In the Gospel of Thomas, if it's legitimate, it records Jesus giving James his authority (of course this would be before giving John the authority, so it would be sort of nullified):

http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/thomas/gospelthomas12.html

Edited November 29, 2012 by turtle shell

[Jeff]

The nice thing about the gospel of John is that he is clear right from the beginning...

 

There was a man sent from God, whose name was John. The same came for a witness, to bear witness of the Light, that all men through him might believe. He was not that Light, but was sent to bear witness of that Light. That was the true Light, which lighteth every man that cometh into the world. He was in the world, and the world was made by him, and the world knew him not. He came unto his own, and his own received him not. But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name: Which were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God. (John 1:6-13 KJV)

 

As John said... To those who paid attention and listened, were shown how to become sons of God (enlightened). Also, he reminds us that being enlightened is not of body or mind, but beyond...