et-thoughts Posted December 7, 2012 (edited) . Edited December 11, 2012 by et-thoughts 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
GrandmasterP Posted December 7, 2012 I avoid my relatives. By and large they are a rum crowd. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
MooNiNite Posted December 7, 2012 (edited) Is that an absolute thought? certainly it seems like it is to me... I have difficulty when relatives resort to absolutes to talk about the relatives... Â i think it is absolute also Edited December 8, 2012 by MooNiNite Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
et-thoughts Posted December 7, 2012 (edited) . Edited December 11, 2012 by et-thoughts Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
GrandmasterP Posted December 7, 2012 You know them? Pirates could take lessons from some of my relatives. Travelling fair folk (Carnies) or static booth seaside fortune tellers most of em. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
et-thoughts Posted December 7, 2012 (edited) . Edited December 11, 2012 by et-thoughts Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
MooNiNite Posted December 8, 2012 (edited) yeah things always go deeper...but right/wrong/noble/lie are all just from a particular perspective..or relative. Â we have the ability take people as they are completely, instead of picking and choosing. Some are able to do this, most cant, most have to pick and choose. Edited December 8, 2012 by MooNiNite Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
et-thoughts Posted December 8, 2012 (edited) . Edited December 11, 2012 by et-thoughts Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Marblehead Posted December 8, 2012 "Relative and absolute, These the two truths are declared to be. The absolute is not within the reach of intellect, For the intellect is grounded in the relative." Shantideva 9 Nice words to refresh our mind with now and again. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Vmarco Posted December 8, 2012 Vmarco claimed, not the Muni. Â Tathagata - The Thus gone. One who has reached the other shore and left the vessel, not carrying it around (like you). Â Your interpretation/inference leaves room for re-evaluation, i'd say. Â Your confusion, accumulated by way of ignorant Lineage Holders, regarding the term Tathagata, is understandable. A key, perhaps the key, to realizing the term Tathagata lies through sources unused by Theravadians, such as the Prajnaparamita's. Â Yes,...the term Tathagata can be conceptually construed to imply "The Thus Gone One", like George Bush was the Decider,...however, the term Tathagata literally means "One who neither Comes nor Goes." Â It is suffice to say, that you continue to cling to a Long Path,...and thus are incapable of Short Path (Prajnaparamita) dialogue. Â As was previously mentioned,...prajna implies to see things as they are,...prajnaparamita is the Perfection of Prajna,...that is to say, the highest level of prajna when all wisdom is transcended. Â Wisdom is not Prajna. Prajna is the Consciousness beyond the Five Aggregates,...whereas wisdom is what the Five Aggregates feel is best about themselves. Â Wisdom is accumulated by ego. It literally means knowledge accumulated through philosophic or scientific learning. In other words, wisdom points to the highest and most lofty ideas of ego consciousness, whose sole purpose is to sustain itself. Wisdom is to make the best use of knowledge,...yet to realize enlightenment means to let go of all knowledge. Knowledge is acquired through thinking/the Head-mind,...the truth arises from gnowledge/the Heart-Mind. Â Unlike yourself, prajna is not occupied with cerebral games of interpretations,...prajna is not a doctrine, dogma, wisdom, or belief. Â I'll make you a bet,...if you can prove you can have a thought in the present, I'll come to your hot tube in Mizen Head, and offer myself to you as your slave. Of course, such a bet is ridiculous, for it is as impossible to think in the present, as it is to realize compassion without understanding Emptiness. Â Nevertheless, Long Pathers love to imagine. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Vmarco Posted December 8, 2012 was walking calmly along a road...'I’m standing still. If you desire to catch me, you too must be still."  'you too must be still' likely meaning 'still be', implying Angulimala was no longer still standing, having lost in the interchange... and still seeking to figure out what had just happened...  BTW in the now one can change the present, the future and the past... most don't but some can... some things have a beginning and then be eternally... from the eternal now before after present matters little what be eternal be what be eternal...  No. Look at it from a relative perspective. No matter how fast you are traveling, light continues by you at 186K mps. The only way to "catch" light, is to go 186K mps,...in which case, you become perfectly Still. From Light's point of view, it travels no distance, in no time, and thus has no need for speed.  In the absolute Now, there is no change, no time, no energy, no ignorance, no infinity, etc.  Of course, New Agers imagine all sorts of fascinating things,...yet not single thing they imagine can exist in the Present,...in the Tao. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Birch Posted December 8, 2012 "knowledge accumulated through philosophic or scientific learning" Â But don't philosophers and scientists themselves know that the fruits of their philosophies or their sciences are, for want of a better term, not whatever they're on about? Or to be more specific, not the whole of whatever they're on about? I really thought that neither philosophers nor scientists had as much brawn as to suggest anything they concerned themselves with was more than models or ideas or ideals or hypotheses about reality and not it. But maybe people listening to them listen wrong? If you consider paths, same issues (as far as I can see, which is not awfully far in this respect). Religions as formulae for realization, not themselves realization. It's (as far as I know) why you kill the Bhudda. Why you do it yourself but only once you have found such a person. I can't work out the Xtian formula of Jesus sacrificing himself for us by being killed by others. I mean I could take a stab at it but it doesn't flow as easy for me. Â Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Marblehead Posted December 8, 2012 Wisdom is accumulated by ego. It literally means knowledge accumulated through philosophic or scientific learning. In other words, wisdom points to the highest and most lofty ideas of ego consciousness, whose sole purpose is to sustain itself. Wisdom is to make the best use of knowledge,...yet to realize enlightenment means to let go of all knowledge (but yet hold to the wisdom gained through it.) 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Marblehead Posted December 8, 2012 And y'all need to stop thinking about killing the Buddha. Just leave him alone! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Birch Posted December 8, 2012 And y'all need to stop thinking about killing the Buddha. Just leave him alone! I wouldn't worry yerself with me in that respect. I haven't found him yet. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
GrandmasterP Posted December 8, 2012 (edited) Buddha, being both omnipresent and omnicompetent; has to be able to do MMA. Ya just don't mess with the best. Edited December 8, 2012 by GrandmasterP Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
et-thoughts Posted December 8, 2012 (edited) . Edited December 11, 2012 by et-thoughts Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
et-thoughts Posted December 8, 2012 (edited) . Edited December 11, 2012 by et-thoughts Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
et-thoughts Posted December 8, 2012 (edited) . Edited December 11, 2012 by et-thoughts Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
et-thoughts Posted December 8, 2012 (edited) . Edited December 11, 2012 by et-thoughts Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Vmarco Posted December 9, 2012 Â Â If you think, believe, hold, that 'not single thing they imagine can exist in the Present,...in the Tao'... it means to me that the Tao you have spoken of isn't the real One... Â Â The real Tao neither Comes or Goes,...it is beyond the Yin/Yang which effects their motion from the Tao, yet isn't the Tao. The Tao is not One,...the One is not without a Many, like there is no Center without a boundary, no Here without a There. The One and the Many cannot realize the Tao,...because they are not the Tao. Â One cannot become enlightened,...nor can the Many become enlightened. Enlightenment is, when the delusion of One and Many are dissolved,...it does not become. Â The Long Path can never gnow the Short Path. The Short Path is fully gnown only when the Long Path is dissolved,...just like Heart-Mind is only gnown when cerebral-centricness is understood as false. Â The Short Path is really not a Path,...it is simply being honest regarding the way things are. Perceptions from the 6 senses are not the way things are. Â An enlightened person once implied, that suffering is a consequence of the desire for things to be other than they are,...and the way things are is not the way they appear to the 6 senses. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
et-thoughts Posted December 9, 2012 (edited) . Edited December 11, 2012 by et-thoughts Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Marblehead Posted December 9, 2012 One cannot become enlightened,...nor can the Many become enlightened. Enlightenment is, when the delusion of One and Many are dissolved,...it does not become. Is that like saying that one unbecomes enlightened? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
GrandmasterP Posted December 9, 2012 Were one to be travelling at the speed of light whilst holding a mirror before one's face, would one see a reflection therein? If so. Whose? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
et-thoughts Posted December 9, 2012 (edited) . Edited December 11, 2012 by et-thoughts Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
