Yin and Yang of Breathing

[Shagrath]

First of all MERRY CHRISTMAS FELLOW BUMS

 

There are lot of different theories about breathing. I hope that you we can make them clearer and understand them better.

 

Some authors say that inhale is yin and exhale is yang. On the other hand there are authors who claim opposite, that inhale is yang and exhale is yin. Both of them make perfect sense to me, it all depends on angle of looking at the same process.

 

INHALE IS YIN EXHALE IS YANG

- on inhale we draw energy in

- on exhale energy is led out

- exhale leads to energy dispersion

- we are stronger when we exhale (punch, kick, lifting, pulling). we can perform better and stronger all yang activities with proper exhalation.

- reverse breathing. creating physical yin/yang environment during inhale and exhale

 

INHALE IS YANG, EXHALE IS YIN

- birth is yang death is yin. when we are born we have our first inhale, when we die we have our last exhale

- oxygen is yang, carbon-dioxide is yin. when we inhale we bring oxygen in

- when we are sleepy (yin) we yawn because of lack of the oxygen in our brain. so we have unconscious reaction for deep inhales to oxygenate or body to become more yang

- on inhalation lung and chest expands (yang), on exhalation everything compresses (yin)

- dense is yin, hollow is yang. lung are yin organ but when we inhale they become more hollow (yin)

- buddhists and yogis have most of their breathing exercises with longer exhalations. they say that the mind calms with exhalation, and becomes more restless with longer inhalation

- full yogic breath has the theory as chinese reverse breathing. they consider inhale to be yang and exhale yin. so when you inhale you expand your abdomen, chest and clavicles making everything yang, and then you exhale and contract and compress everything making it yin

 

 

The way I see it there is no definite way of categorizing the breathing processes. Like everything else in this world there is no definite yin or yang, just yin or yang compared to something. We could say that inhale is yang and exhale is yin when observing the physiological processes and in breath influence to mind. Furthermore we can also say the opposite (inhale is yin, exhale is yang) when looking the dynamics of energy in a body.

 

Any more thoughts or constructive information on this topic?

 

 

PS: please keep the posts constructive without arguing

[Protector]

There's a lot of that in tai chi stuff

[joeblast]

Broken down further into the constituent parts we see either a yin action taking place or a yang one;

 

Diaphragm descending is yang

Perineum firming is yang

etc

 

So in reverse abdominal breathing, we have all of the structures performing yang phase at once then yin phase at once. Coherently arranged they result in higher amplitude...

 

whereas with natural abdominal breathing, we have on inhale

diaphragm yang, perineum yin, abdomen yin, back yin, lungs ~yang;

exhaling,

diaphragm yin, perineum yang, abdomen, back, sides, all yang, lungs, yin.

 

a good balance.

 

Close image, although the periodicities dont exactly line up

 

 

 

[Shagrath]

There's a lot of that in tai chi stuff

 

Could you please give me the names of some good books that cover entirely that topic? I have read a lot of tai chi material and never encounter breathing explained in such a detail that leaves me satisfied

[Shagrath]

Broken down further into the constituent parts we see either a yin action taking place or a yang one;

 

Diaphragm descending is yang

Perineum firming is yang

 

How is that? In every book about comparison of yin and yang qualities they state that lowering is yin and ascending is yang. So in this case it means that descending of diaphragm is yin but at the same time lowering of diaphragm is making it more tense which is yang. And opposite ascension of diaphragm is yang but in that position it is more relaxed which is yin.

 

So in reverse abdominal breathing, we have all of the structures performing yang phase at once then yin phase at once. Coherently arranged they result in higher amplitude...

 

whereas with natural abdominal breathing, we have on inhale

diaphragm yang, perineum yin, abdomen yin, back yin, lungs ~yang;

exhaling,

diaphragm yin, perineum yang, abdomen, back, sides, all yang, lungs, yin.

 

a good balance.

 

I understand that point of view on breathing. I read in books of Dr. Yang Jwing-Ming, Jerry Alan Johnson and some others. But the thing is that taoist views are opposite then buddhist or hindu views. I didn't find any definitive explanation of breathing process. Even one tai chi really good master that is considered to be national treasure said that the strongest practice for developing lower dan tien is just plain abdominal breathing with some visualizations and he even said that every other breathing technique is just selling snake oil.

 

Maybe there is really none fixed explanation for this, so we can only say more yang or more yin looking from some specific point of view (physical level, mind, energy, physiology, etc).

[Protector]

Could you please give me the names of some good books that cover entirely that topic? I have read a lot of tai chi material and never encounter breathing explained in such a detail that leaves me satisfied

 

I haven't read that many tai chi books but I've been told a trick for clumsy people to help remember how you're supposed to breath on each move

Most of the time, when you move hands towards you, you breath in and when pushing away, breath out

So it's like yin yang yin yang, each move and breath either yin or yang depending on what you're doing

[Vmarco]

First of all MERRY CHRISTMAS FELLOW BUMS

 

There are lot of different theories about breathing. I hope that you we can make them clearer and understand them better.

 

INHALE IS YIN EXHALE IS YANG

-

INHALE IS YANG, EXHALE IS YIN

 

PS: please keep the posts constructive without arguing

 

Yes,...there are many theories,...theories arise from personal, relative experiences. Instead of looking at Yin/Yang from personal, relative experiences, it is better to observe Yin/Yang from Yin/Yangs point of view.

 

In tantric practices, yang is described as descending from above (compression, converging, imploding) and manifests the outward shape of the penis. Yin ascends from below (dissolution, diverging, exploding) and manifests the inward shape of the vagina.

 

The propaganda of self-proclaimed, New Age visionaries continually accommodates the absurd misunderstandings of duality. One of these visionaries wrote that male yang is "explosive, centrifugal, warming, destructuring, and dissipating, while the female yin is implosive, centripetal, cooling, structuring, and integrative." Once again, these are ego statements, based on a human-centric viewpoint, not nature’s reality. How is dissipating or destructuring warming? How is implosiveness and structuring cooling? These people only encourage a world in which people consider non sequiturs meaningful.

 

To understand the Tao and the nature of Light, there must be a metacognition of Who’s Who in Duality from duality’s point of view. The reality of duality is this:

 

Yin is feminine, spiral-out, diverging, radiative, expansive, disintegrating, explosive, discharging, centrifugal, cooling, dissipating, exhaling, and ascending (notice how these are all complimentary terms).

 

Yang is masculine, spiral-in, converging, generative, contractive, integrating, implosive, charged, centripetal, heating, accumulating, inhaling, and descending (again, all complimentary terms).

 

Intermixing or attributing yin characteristics to yang or vice versa because someone feels that feminine energy should be structuring and masculine energy destructuring is disingenuous. Some may not want to hear this, but there can be no authentic understanding and application of Tao until the basics of Who’s Who in duality is understood.

 

Most on this forum will disagree with this post because they have been indoctrinated to view Yin/Yang relatively.

 

For example, water is not Yin because it's dark and cool,...Water is Yin because it's moving away from form, integration, pressure increase, converging, towards DARK/COOL of unforming, disintegration, pressure decrease, diverge. Many principles dogmatic to Daoism are discussing human perceptions of objects, and denying the Tao of that object.

 

Fire does not seek a higher place,...there is no fire in the higher place,...fire is a process of the rhythmic balanced interchange of yang (heat) becoming Yin (cold). Yang is always known by is centripetal motion, while Yin is always known by its centrafugal motion.

 

Yang and Yin are two aspects of the same moving thing. Yin vibration descends for an apple blossom to form, and that form is Yang, Yang winds crystallized light into an apple, the apple falls, hits you on the head, and one says, "Ah, gravity", and walks away telling everyone of his discovery.

 

But, if one would have stayed under the tree, he would see Yin become predomenant, by decaying the apple, who expanded, unforming, disintegrating, pressure decrease rises up, to complete the cycle,...thus unveiling the Tao as the Tao.

 

Fire does not naturally rise, the heat of the fire rises, expanding into cold. Water does not compress, it is in the process of diverging from compressed Yang form into Yin's vapor. Again, you're not seeing the rhythmic cyclical nature of the moving Tao.

 

Dogmatic Daoist order of things may have been great for the times it was interpeted for,...but its missing a recognition of the Tao, from the Tao's point of view. The Tao's point of view must be the same as the Quantum view, or Light's point of view, or the Buddhist point of view, or the Tao would be untrue,...and the Tao is not untrue.

 

"If science proves some belief of Buddhism wrong, then Buddhism will have to change" HH Dalai Lama

So, if the Tao is not untrue, then there is something untrue or misguided about the current dogmatic interpretations of the Tao, because such interpretations are not harmoneous with the nature of nature.

 

Although I understand that Daoist principles have evolved into a philosophy and religion, the Tao is neither a philososphy nor religion. Thus, whereas most argue for a philosophy or personal belief,.... I'm arguing Tao.

 

Moving, incandescent objects are borne from moving, dark, objectless space. All incandescent Yang is surrounded by Yin's dark. Where is it ever true that light conquers dark? There is no amount of light that can illuminate all dark, for in Duality, darkness always surrounds it. Rudolph Steiner once said that light was the antipathic aspect of polarity, whereas darkness is its sympathic expression.

 

The Patriarchy (cerebralcentric knowledge) wants to deny the rhythmic balanced interchange of nature, by indoctrinating ideas like light conquering dark. They don't want to know that all phenomena, through the nurturance of darkness, dies into light. Polarity's Yang light does not hold within itself the potential to birth, for it is a result already spawned through Yin's darkness.

 

A prevalant human construct suggests that light is good and dark is evil,...not because it is, but because to understand the truth would wreck the fragile fabric of society's patriarchial brewed philosophical and religious beliefs they cling to for their identity.

 

"If you wish to unite with the heart and mind of the Mysterious Mother, you must integrate yin and yang within and refine their fire upward." Lao-zu

 

Who's Who in Duality

 

yang...........................yin.

 

centripetal....................centrafugal.

 

integrating....................disintregating.

 

spiral in......................spiral out.

 

implosive......................explosive.

 

converge.......................diverge.

 

in...........................out

 

generative.....................radiative.

 

Gravity....................Levity

 

inhalation.....................exhalation.

 

sphere…………….................…….torus.

 

Earth......................Heaven

 

solid........................vaporous

 

rotation decrease................rotation increase.

 

quartz.........................calcite.

 

heating........................cooling.

 

charging.......................discharging.

 

contraction....................expansion.

 

Father Earth.....…….............Mother Sky

 

particle………............………………..wave.

 

Geb………...............……..……Nut.

 

Father Time...................Mother Space

 

induction......................conduction.

 

winding light waves............unwinding light waves

 

pressure increase.....................pressure decrease.

 

infra-red..........................ultra-violet.

 

low frequency..........................high frequency.

[Shagrath]

Yes,...there are many theories,...theories arise from personal, relative experiences. Instead of looking at Yin/Yang from personal, relative experiences, it is better to observe Yin/Yang from Yin/Yangs point of view.

...

 

This is a new way of viewing, but that's the learning Thank you very much.

 

Few months ago I talked to one Taoist priest and he said that everybody thinks that Earth is pulling (hence the gravity) but in pure taoist teachings Heaven is pushing and because of that everything is falling down toward earth

 

Can you please tell me is it not the Sun yang principle and representation of male and moon/earth yin principle and representation of female?

 

 

Do you recommend some literature?

[joeblast]

How is that? In every book about comparison of yin and yang qualities they state that lowering is yin and ascending is yang. So in this case it means that descending of diaphragm is yin but at the same time lowering of diaphragm is making it more tense which is yang. And opposite ascension of diaphragm is yang but in that position it is more relaxed which is yin.

 

lowering or ascending is immaterial in some contexts, you're conflating what's important with these more rigid explanations here. muscular contraction is yang, muscular relaxation yin, I'm looking at this from the body's energetics, consumption, etc - things that have led me to what makes sense from my own experience.

 

I understand that point of view on breathing. I read in books of Dr. Yang Jwing-Ming, Jerry Alan Johnson and some others. But the thing is that taoist views are opposite then buddhist or hindu views.maybe in some very narrow contexts, but otherwise, no I didn't find any definitive explanation of breathing process. as opposed to...in my posts? there's a ton of descriptive stuff in the ymaa material, that is a logical basis for a bunch of the breathwork I've done. Even one tai chi really good master that is considered to be national treasure said that the strongest practice for developing lower dan tien is just plain abdominal breathing with some visualizations and he even said that every other breathing technique is just selling snake oil. "just plain abdominal breathing"...I've set out to bring together the energetics and the anatomy by reflecting the two upon one another. there's not really right way and a bunch of wrong ways...there are simply ways, some of which produce better results for certain desired outcomes than others.

 

Maybe there is really none fixed explanation for this, so we can only say more yang or more yin looking from some specific point of view (physical level, mind, energy, physiology, etc).

since yin and yang are relative, we are always considering context and point of view when we mention the terms

[ChiDragon]

"INHALE IS YIN EXHALE IS YANG

- on inhale we draw energy in

- on exhale energy is led out

- exhale leads to energy dispersion

- we are stronger when we exhale (punch, kick, lifting, pulling). we can perform better and stronger all yang activities with proper exhalation."

 

If I may go into the refinement of breathing, I would consider that....

"- on inhale we draw energy in" which is gaining energy would be considered as Yang .

"- on exhale energy is led out" which is loosing energy would be considered as Yin.

 

".....(punch, kick, lifting, pulling). we can perform better and stronger all yang activities with proper exhalation."

Yes, all the actions are considered to be Yang but they were from the Yin effect of exhalation.

[joeblast]

yes, context

 

the question is, what are you trying to explain?

[ChiDragon]

The question is, what don't you understand....???

[Vmarco]

This is a new way of viewing, but that's the learning Thank you very much.

 

Few months ago I talked to one Taoist priest and he said that everybody thinks that Earth is pulling (hence the gravity) but in pure taoist teachings Heaven is pushing and because of that everything is falling down toward earth

 

Can you please tell me is it not the Sun yang principle and representation of male and moon/earth yin principle and representation of female?

 

 

Do you recommend some literature?

 

For me, understanding the nature of duality has come from Undivided Light (Tao) and Divided Light (yin/Yang)

http://thetaobums.com/topic/19803-what-is-light/

 

That understanding appears fully compatable with texts like the Hua Hu Ching, Heart Sutra, Shurangama Sutra, Tantric Mahamudra, etc.

 

Yin/Yang is always relative,...however, do we observe it from the effect of the moving lever (Yin/Yang), or from the causeless fulcrum (Tao)?

[dawei]

For me, understanding the nature of duality has come from Undivided Light (Tao) and Divided Light (yin/Yang)

http://thetaobums.co...-what-is-light/

 

That understanding appears fully compatable with texts like the Hua Hu Ching, Heart Sutra, Shurangama Sutra, Tantric Mahamudra, etc.

 

Yin/Yang is always relative,...however, do we observe it from the effect of the moving lever (Yin/Yang), or from the causeless fulcrum (Tao)?

Without a long dissertation in response

 

Isn't the relativeness only in one sense [eye] and transmitted to our mind's eye and then transmitted to our senses and then transmitted to our understanding? Did I ask this before of you from another thread? There is a sudden deja vu... do we recycle our questions?

 

I guess what I mean is: The entire body of explanation about Yin and Yang is simply our manifest perception of things... but not the reality of things (or non-things). So I assume you are sticking to an 'explanation of things'.

[Truth Seeker]

I guess what I mean is: The entire body of explanation about Yin and Yang is simply our manifest perception of things... but not the reality of things (or non-things). So I assume you are sticking to an 'explanation of things'.

 

At the most exact level, every thought and theory could be qualified by saying it's just our perception of things, but in general we do divide things into the objective and subjective. And while our perception of cold, hot, etc. is subjective, that doesn't change the objective concept that cold is yin and yang is hot. So I don't think the CONCEPTS of yin and yang are "always relative." That said, and going back to the OP, during inhale/exhale different parts of the body may seem yin or yang depending on what they're doing, but my understanding is that as a whole, inhale is yin because it's receiving (moving inward) and exhale is yang because it's expelling (moving outward). This is the primary action of breath, and that dictates yin or yang, despite what the lungs, diaphragm, carbon dioxide, etc. are doing.

[Shagrath]

Thank you all very much. Now I will try to digest all the valuable information that you shared.