The pursuit of happiness is the road to hell...

[eye_of_the_storm]

The pursuit of happiness is the road to hell...

[Protector]

That's why I'm preemptive happy

[GrandmasterP]

http://m.youtube.com/#/watch?v=Oo4OnQpwjkc&desktop_uri=%2Fwatch%3Fv%3DOo4OnQpwjkc&gl=GB

 

Bob Marley had it about right.

[ShenLung]

I kind of like the idea of discovering happiness along the way, instead of chasing after it .. like three little birds on the doorstep ...

 

and Marley, oh yeah ...

[eye_of_the_storm]

I am thinking in terms of... one mans happiness is another mans sorrow

 

Consumerism, People, Environment

 

That if we change the pursuit of "happiness" to... the pursuit of wisdom... happiness would be naturally arising

 

/ a result of wisdom

Edited January 3, 2013 by White Wolf Running On Air

[Birch]

It depends how you define happiness. I noticed in my case I defined happiness in opposition to things I saw making others sad. Also to things (and people) I saw as making me sad. I've sort of simplified this because it does get into what 'everyone else' defines as 'happy-making' and being entirely reactive to that rather than looking within to what makes you personally happy. I'll let you know if I figure it all out.Hahaha.

[GrandmasterP]

Are the wise always happy I wonder?

[eye_of_the_storm]

Are the wise always happy I wonder?

 

That would depend on how wise we are talking

[eye_of_the_storm]

+ the wise do not pursue happiness therefore sorrow does not exist.. therefore they are happy.

 

Edited January 3, 2013 by White Wolf Running On Air

[skydog]

There is some truth to this..There is also some truth to the idea that if you dont chase enlightenment as if your life depended on it you wont achieve it.

[hydrogen]

http://m.youtube.com...4OnQpwjkc&gl=GB

 

Bob Marley had it about right.

 

So smoking MJ all day and singing some love songs are the way?

 

pursuit: It's an action. No action is the action.

 

Road: it implies there are separation. We never moved anywhere. We're all here, now, in one place.

 

Hell: It's not a public place. It's a construct that only exists in each individual.

 

We're already in heaven. Our mind build layers of maze to enclosed ourselves in our own hell. We just need to let the wall disappear to see that we're indeed in heaven.

 

I don't know exactly how to do it. Maybe believeing is the first step. I have to believe the stuff that I've writen myself.

[Vanir Thunder Dojo Tan]

Since everyone's happiness(es) are unique and individual, the pursuit should be undertaken with that in mind; that your happiness could cost someone else their own.

 

 

COULD you be happy? Taking the joy out of life for others? if you enjoy watching others suffer, i would like to share that with you, and enjoy your suffering. to share with you as you have shared with others

[GrandmasterP]

+ the wise do not pursue happiness therefore sorrow does not exist.. therefore they are happy.

 

........

Is happiness the absence of sorrow?

[GrandmasterP]

 

 

So smoking MJ all day and singing some love songs are the way?

 

pursuit: It's an action. No action is the action.

 

Road: it implies there are separation. We never moved anywhere. We're all here, now, in one place.

 

Hell: It's not a public place. It's a construct that only exists in each individual.

 

We're already in heaven. Our mind build layers of maze to enclosed ourselves in our own hell. We just need to let the wall disappear to see that we're indeed in heaven.

 

I don't know exactly how to do it. Maybe believeing is the first step. I have to believe the stuff that I've writen myself.

.......

MJ?

Just say NO!

I was thinking more along the lines of the relationship of happiness to worry and vice versa.

 

 

[Vanir Thunder Dojo Tan]

no.

 

 

Truly, happiness is the acceptance of every range of emotional expression without attachment or rejection.

[thelerner]

I think in the West happiness is all to often considered a pursuit w/ things as a goal. Whereas other places, often in Island life, happiness is a state of being.

 

Maybe we need to see happiness as a byproduct. Perhaps peace is the worthy goal. Such as- today I won't worry about anything. I'll protect my sense of peace as if it were my wallet. Smiles and good deeds will be my currency.

Edited January 3, 2013 by thelerner

[GrandmasterP]

A smile is a frown turned upside down so we should all aim to turn those lemons into lemonade.

:-)

[thelerner]

A smile is a frown turned upside down so we should all aim to turn those lemons into lemonade.

:-)

When life hands you lemons

Get a new life.

 

or get some gin

and turn the lemons into

something really useful.

[konchog uma]

i think that there is a kind of happiness that chases sorrow around the wheel of existence, and then there is the kind of happiness which comes from, as HNJT put it, acceptance.

 

In mahamudra practice there is the idea that at a certain point in ones meditation, all possible scenarios which might arise as one's circumstances have only "a single taste". This phase of "one taste" is followed by the final phase of mahamudra practice, "non-meditation", where mind constantly rests in the natural state, uncontrived in any way. I bring this up because the "one taste" is generally understood to be delicious, and the natural state is said to give rise to bliss and clarity.

 

i guess you could say that there is conditional happiness, and unconditional happiness. I am very sure that there is conditional sorrow, but i am not sure that there is unconditional sorrow. I think that when a person reaches an unconditioned state of mind, it gives rise to happiness. Not sure tho, curious what others think...

Edited January 4, 2013 by konchog uma

[ShenLung]

Under the influence of Morphine, the worst of pains moves to the side, somewhere. It is still there, but not so important. The minor pains that are a result of everyday living are gone, entirely. When the morphine is gone, the everyday pains that were before so ordainary that one paid them no mind, become the most excruciating experience of existance. So the addict retreats into the warm embrace of the morphine, and puts those common pains aside.

 

For the management of great pain, morphine can be good. Not so good as being healthy and whole, but good for the moment.

It is everyday, ordainary happiness that make the pains of existance so bearable. The great experiences of joy are just that, but should never be exchanged entirely for the everyday discovery of wonder and amazement in existance ... or else one may become an experience junky, always looking for the next great happiness.

[i am]

I completely agree that it depends on how you define happiness. I, as has already been stated, couldn't be happy causing others pain. Happiness for me...is a moving target, I'll admit, I'm still getting my shit figured out, but I'm on the right track. It involves getting what I want out of life without harming the planet and life on it any more than necessary, helping others to some extent, and feeling content with what I'm doing with myself. This involves something other than sitting in an office, only interacting with real people, nature and life in a second hand way. It involves a good social life with good friends, even if I don't see them more than once or twice a week (or maybe less...). And I don't mean fun drinking friends who will go out and be assholes with me and chase girls. I mean good people; good friends. That along with a practice in which I feel I'm getting somewhere, accomplishing something. I could probably sit here and think of more, but that's the gist of it.

 

It does not involve the American Dream, aka three-car garage, boat, camper, wife and 2.5 kids (though those first few are not inherently bad), high powered high paying yet soulless job, expensive clothes, fancy restaurants, people I pay to do the stuff for me which I think I'm above, etc. etc. All the ego-centric bullshit that I'm assuming (dangerous, I know!) is what you had in mind with this thread.

[OnPhourCoughee]

The pursuit of happiness, means ya ain't got it.

I knew a man that just couldn't be happy,

he went looking and is in his own hell now.

Turns out, he was sitting on it the whole time.

Edited January 4, 2013 by OnPhourCoughee

[eye_of_the_storm]

I am you have assumed correctly.

 

Also addressing the "Don't worry (ignorance), be happy"

 

In terms of the collective/ living together and treating all with compassion / understanding / grace etc

 

+ expanding our awareness in order to understand below

 

 

^ Insert environment + a good number of people find themselves in such a position ^ regardless of region / age etc

 

Just working to survive etc.

 

It does effect both the individual and the collective.

 

In pursuing happiness in such a way one potentially steals the joy of another

 

just as say the consumption of meat (other sentience / beings) steals the life + joy of another

 

but we are caught in this vicious cycle, this machine where people are $ and little else.

 

I am not advocating poverty etc... just awareness, to end exploitation of peoples / animals + the environment

 

to give back basically.

 

I think realistically the earth has the capacity for everyone to live like a king/queen.

 

Distribution etc + creating closed loop systems is the key (a form of immortality really).

 

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0770802/

 

http://www.movie2k.t...ie-2323252.html ^^

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=7_l5b6lZ0mM

 

^ complimentary material // both will probably tear your heart out

 

I too am working to get out of this cycle the best I can...+ change it if possible

 

> In the Love Hate one the Japanese man says somewhere toward the end... I just want peace... or the like.

 

He is an intelligent man but his desire to live peacefully + / truth / justice etc has made him a poor man (materially).

 

As the current system is inherently violent... and one doesn't wish to participate... though inevitably has to in order to survive.

 

I think there is a passage in the bible that talks of a time when beggars will become kings and kings will become beggars.

 

^ In terms of ones spirit...poor in spirit will be elevated materially... with those noble in spirit becoming beggars... as the system is inverted / corrupt... rewarding depravity.

Edited January 4, 2013 by White Wolf Running On Air

[ShenLung]

Thank goodness for the capitalist, who, completely unkowing, and only in the search to improve his or her profits, provided the children of a third world country with a means by which to feed their families.

 

Doing so, knowing, he would be a saint. Doing so unknowing, only we can regard him as a saint. Better for him that he does not know, since we want to hate his success so, and care about the masses less.

 

Poor? yeah, we always have them. They are good for an ideological crutch.

[eye_of_the_storm]

^ Not overly sure in which direction you are moving here?

 

request for more clarity please...

 

I'll respond by assumption though

 

Success... can be many things

 

I have no concern with material success acquired in goodness

 

Definitely not a communist or a capitalist

 

All I am concerned about is " A fair go" as we say in Aus.

 

And that this is extended to all people..

 

This includes self determination

 

What we think to be good or not isn't our decision to make... in terms of the "3rd world"/ other countries

 

/ non intervention

 

Im sure they were doing ok before we arrived.

 

As I said before I think the Earth has the capacity for all to live like Kings/Queens if we use our resources + knowledge + creativity better.

 

I think this will occur when we value wisdom/knowledge over profits (at any cost...environmentally, spiritually, socially) alone.

 

+ when our idea of what wealth is... is transformed...to see more clearly

 

<< Say these flowers in my display picture I would call a treasure... and a crown of flowers would go unmatched in beauty and so on.

 

that a persons individual creativity / self expression is priceless...

 

though now we live in a mass consumer society... where everyone is an iperson.

 

 

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

 

Wars are fought over the resources to produce... this "happiness" the ilifestyle ... "choice"

 

People have given their lives... spilled their blood... others capitalize on their death... the suffering on both sides... the documentary "The Business of War" I posted recently speaks / shows / highlights...

 

Edited January 4, 2013 by White Wolf Running On Air