Jeff Posted February 4, 2013 Hi Apech, I guess it depends on what you describe as emptiness. My perspective was describing the highest form and comes mostly from the Lankavatara Sutra... "The Blessed One replied: What is emptiness, indeed! It is a term whose very self-nature is false-imagination, but because of one's attachment to false-imagination we are obliged to talk of emptiness, no-birth, and no self-nature. There are seven kinds of emptiness: emptiness of mutuality which is non-existent; emptiness of individual marks; emptiness of self-nature; emptiness of no-work; emptiness of work; emptiness of all things in the sense that they are unpredictable, and emptiness in its highest sense of Ultimate Reality." ... "By emptiness in the highest sense of the emptiness of Ultimate Reality is meant that in the attainment of inner self-realization of Noble Wisdom there is no trace of habit-energy generated by erroneous conceptions; thus one speaks of the highest emptiness of Ultimate Reality." The description of the fifth bhumi (or maybe sixth) seems to fit with this "no trace" for me. Best, Jeff Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RongzomFan Posted February 4, 2013 As I'm not at all familiar with the Bhumi's,...thus my first stop was Wiki: The First bhūmi, called the "Very Joyous", is attained with the first direct perception of emptiness and is simultaneous with entry into the third of the five paths to awakening, the path of seeing.....Despite having directly Perceived emptiness, bodhisattvas on the first level are primarily motivated by faith. For me, I knew I was Kagyu as young as 8, just from investigating the spontaneous things coming from my mouth. Not suprizingly, Tilopa's Mahamudra was my first external guidance. For dozens of years, I've not only pondered daily from various translations, but did my own translation of those 28 verses. Through Mahamudra instruction, I was impelled to let go of hope, fear, and faith. At 19 I uncovered that I have every right to sow, but none to reap what I've sown,...a very non-american point of view. Thus reading that this First Bhumi, from perhaps a 3rd Century perspective, said "motivated by faith" it doesn't resonate with my own experience in unfolding. My basic assumptions regarding bodhisattvas arose from the Heart Sutra, which is the essence of how a bodhisattva sees. When I first read it, from my background in Mahamudra, it rang clear and simple. Afterwards however, reading various commentaries, like Thich Nhat Hanh's first commentary, I realized that very few had a clue what the Heart Sutra is about,...until last year, when prajnaparamita scholar Karl Brunnholzl published The Heart Attack Sutra. Although he has a few misunderstandings,...the overall book is more than 90% correct. Did you receive Mahamudra transmission? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Cheshire Cat Posted February 4, 2013 (edited) Hi Dao, I would argue that the "realization of emptiness" is something that is "objectively real/noticable". In many traditions, masters/gurus can transmit "light transmissions". Light transmissions are only possible if one has realized emptiness, because a light transmission is the transfer of "direct knowledge" thru/with Void. It is the blending of energy/form and void, or as the heart sutra describes... The realization of Form is Void, and Void is Form. Best wishes, Jeff Hi Jeff, light transmission is a phenomena that isn't directly related with realization of emptiness, imho. For example, Muhammad Subuh Sumohadiwidjojo was able to give to anyone an incredible mystical experience through initiation. But maybe I didn't get what you mean with "light transmission".... Edited February 4, 2013 by DAO rain TAO Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jeff Posted February 4, 2013 (edited) Hi Jeff, light transmission is a phenomena that isn't directly related with realization of emptiness, imho. For example, Muhammad Subuh Sumohadiwidjojo was able to give to anyone an incredible mystical experience through initiation. But maybe I didn't get what you mean with "light transmission".... A light transmission is the sharing of "knowledge" (or state of knowledge). An "incredible mystical experience" would most likely be a description of a experience perceived by the mind, so it would be unlikely to be a light transmission. But, I have no idea on what Muhammad Subuh Sumohadiwidjojo has realized. Best, Jeff (edit - deleted duplicate words) Edited February 4, 2013 by Jeff Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RongzomFan Posted February 4, 2013 But maybe I didn't get what you mean with "light transmission".... Its some New Age stuff of Jeff's 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jeff Posted February 4, 2013 Hi Alwayson, I would suggest that you read the Lankavatara Sutra. I think you would like it. Best wishes, Jeff Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RongzomFan Posted February 4, 2013 (edited) Only Madhyamaka is definitive in Mahayana. This is based on the opinions of the great Indian masters such as Atisa. Edited February 4, 2013 by alwayson Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Vmarco Posted February 5, 2013 Did you receive Mahamudra transmission? Yes. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
