Changing Destiny, Liao Fan's Four Lessons

[Harmonious Emptiness]

Ahhh, just found this video. Been studying the book for months now. Looking forward to this !

Enjoy it with me?

 

Part one (of 12)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wfDJB-f0waI

 

 

pdf

http://www.buddhanet.net/pdf_file/liaofan.pdf

[Cat Pillar]

Looks interesting, thanks for the links!

[林愛偉]

Liao Fan's 4 Lessons are amazingly on point. When I read it in 2005, one of my disciples then suggested it, I immedietly was drawn in, and my life changed. I took those 4 lessons and utilized them into all aspects of my life/worldviews. Things changed, mind clearer, and simply more simple.

 

I have recommended this to many students and teachers. I still do. Getting it with a commentary allows one to go deeper in understanding the cultural nuances at the time of these methods. There is much to understand while applying, and even just reading off hand, much to consider. So a commentary would be advised.

[Harmonious Emptiness]

Thanks for your comment Lin Ai Wei.

 

Any particular commentaries that you suggest?

[林愛偉]

Thanks for your comment Lin Ai Wei.

 

Any particular commentaries that you suggest?

 

I found the one by Master Jing Kong to be very down to earth and clear.

 

:-)

[sati]

Please find as an attached file Master Jing Kong commentary of Liao Fan's Four Lessons.

 

Changing Destiny.pdf

[林愛偉]

Please find as an attached file Master Jing Kong commentary of Liao Fan's Four Lessons.

 

 

That;s so great! hahahaha

[Marblehead]

Yes, one can change one's destiny. All one needs do is get up off their butt and do something.

[Friend]

Edited January 20, 2013 by Friend

[JustARandomPanda]

I love the Liao-Fan story! Love it so much I have 3 different translations. One being from Master Chin Kung (aka Master Jin Kung). The other being from Evelyn Li and K.C. Ng. I also have a pdf of the story that's not the one linked to earlier.

 

Thanks for the Youtube links!

[JustBHappy]

Great stuff, thanks for sharing.

[Harmonious Emptiness]

I love the Liao-Fan story! Love it so much I have 3 different translations. One being from Master Chin Kung (aka Master Jin Kung). The other being from Evelyn Li and K.C. Ng. I also have a pdf of the story that's not the one linked to earlier.

 

Thanks for the Youtube links!

Thanks for these names too. Different translations can help things to sink in better.

 

edit:

Enjoying the Jing Kong commentary. Thanks!

Edited January 20, 2013 by Harmonious Emptiness

[starhawk]

Thank you Harmonious Emptiness and Sati. The video was very fun to watch.

 

It reminded me of a traditional Taoist text which is similar to Liao Fan's 4 lessons, but is shorter.

Strengthen the understanding of cultivating your morality as the basis for part of your spiritual improvement. A side benefit is the assured gaining of good fortune in the physical realm. It is called the Tai Shan Kan Yin Pien "Strengthen Your Way" Part of it is posted here for those who have not encountered it.

 

 

[Exerpted from The Key to Good Fortune: Refining your Spirit, by Hua-Ching Ni]

 

My favorite exerpts of the Master Ni, Hua Ching translation:

 

Tai Shan Kan Yin Pien

 

"The Truth of Life is the Law of Spiritual Correspondence."

 

"Calamities and blessings do not come through any definite, distinguishable door; it is the person who invites them. The subtle response of universal energy to one's mind and behavior is not usually recognized as the reason for calamities or blessings. Yet the accuracy of energy correspondence always occurs to people. Some of the ancients called the law of energy correspondence the law of retribution. Whatever name is used it means that whatever a person gives out, he or she also receives. In fact, the quality and quantity of a person's life is totally affected or changed by the way a person thinks or behaves.

 

The consequences of good and evil thoughts and behaviors are as inevitable as the shadow which accompany your body. People bear the marks of crimes and sins on their auras unless personal reformation has occurred. the aura is a person's energy field that consists of one's spiritual reality.People carry their spiritual reality with them, and the external world responds with corresponding energy.

 

The response from the subtle realm to a person's aura is as exact as if a spiritual being were keeping records of one's evil deeds, and determining punishment according to the seriousness of the transgression...

 

Increase the goodness by accumulating virtue and amass spiritual merit by thinking good thoughts and doing good deeds. Have a compassionate heart towards all creatures. Be loyal to the real authority of life, which is the spiritual energy of your life... cultivate yourself; this will bring forth good influences on others.

...

The benefits of extending the kindness of a personal good nature are great. One who is good is respected by people. People of righteousness and peaceful energy find that happiness and wealth will follow them, all evil things will shun them, and spiritual beings will protect them. The person may even become an immortal or a god.

...

Improvement occurs not only on the level of action, but also in thought. He who thinks good, even before the good is accomplished, will find good spirits helping him. Conversely, he who thinks evil, even before the evil is done, will find that the bad spirits are together with him. "

 

 

Anyone who would like the entire text may PM me. Thank you.

[JustARandomPanda]

Here is a website that has yet another translation and intro commentary on Liao Fan

 

Buddhanet's Liao-Fan translation

 

here is another translation from Buddhanet but you can download it

 

For those who prefer less "Buddhist-y" Liao Fan chapters try this one by VenChinKung

 

Here is a site that uses Confucianism to also provide commentary on Liao Fan's 4 Lessions

 

Most people don't realize Confucianism is a valid spiritual cultivation tradition in China just as Taoism is.

 

Here is a Liao-Fan Facebook page for fans of the Liao-Fan story

 

Here is the Liao-Fan page on a website devoted to teaching about Chinese History and Culture (both ancient and modern)

 

Can you tell I'm a fan of the Liao-Fan story? I really credit it as one of the few books to really change my life.

[Harmonious Emptiness]

Thanks again for your contributions everyone. My relationship with the text and it's message has benefited!

Edited January 23, 2013 by Harmonious Emptiness

[Owledge]

Yes, one can change one's destiny. All one needs do is get up off their butt and do something.

You get off your butt and do something but succeed at nothing. Your destiny being that you'll never succeed at anything. How do you change your destiny?

 

I've read the into for Creating Destiny from the pfd file. Sounds like buddhist-moralistic talk for people who already have a lot of influence. They're changing their destiny all the time, if you can call it that.

The idea that if you simply do good deeds, the universe will reward you for it, seems almost infantile. Real life experiences disprove it as a general rule.

Well, to be fair, if one pays close attention, it's in the writing. It says, if you follow the guilde, it is GUARANTEED that your destiny CAN change ... not that it does. But then the word "guarantee" is misleading.

Edited January 24, 2013 by Owledge

[Marblehead]

You get off your butt and do something but succeed at nothing. Your destiny being that you'll never succeed at anything. How do you change your destiny?

Yes, that, regretfully, has happened many times before and will continue to happen in the future. The reasons for such happenings are way too numerous to even try to begin listing them.

 

But there are problem solving techniques one can use if they become knowledgable of them. There are techniques for attaining goals, big and small.

 

What we likely can't change is the environment where we are born and raised. Of course, one can move there are limits here too.

[Harmonious Emptiness]

You get off your butt and do something but succeed at nothing. Your destiny being that you'll never succeed at anything. How do you change your destiny?

 

I've read the into for Creating Destiny from the pfd file. Sounds like buddhist-moralistic talk for people who already have a lot of influence. They're changing their destiny all the time, if you can call it that.

The idea that if you simply do good deeds, the universe will reward you for it, seems almost infantile. Real life experiences disprove it as a general rule.

Well, to be fair, if one pays close attention, it's in the writing. It says, if you follow the guilde, it is GUARANTEED that your destiny CAN change ... not that it does. But then the word "guarantee" is misleading.

No, it's pretty sound and rational at the same time. If you are quick to anger, can never take criticism, are selfish and unable to connect with other people due to fear of giving, and have accumulated combative habits, they can keep fortune from coming to you, keep people from helping you, keep people from trusting you and your ability to work with them. Whereas strong character combined with humility and generosity are qualities that will draw people, and fortune, to you.

 

The more we unnecessarily fight with people out of petty selfishness, greed, and egotism, the more we really work against people, and the blessings that follow them. This is simply a brief material explanation, not going into the spiritual/cosmic levels which exist without being exposed to scientific authority.

[Owledge]

@Harmonious Emptiness

Exclude all the problematic character traits mentioned in your posting and tell me why there's still a problem.

Because, as I said, your view seems to come from fairytale land. Moralistically simplistic. More buddhist doctrine than Taoist wisdom.

Edited January 25, 2013 by Owledge

[Harmonious Emptiness]

Well, as the intro said, this way you "can" change your destiny. If we don't reform these faults, we continue pushing people and blessings away from us. If we do change these faults (or character flaws, if you will), we have a chance to change the damage they've done to our destiny.

 

There is an element of it that exists in "fairytale land" and it will always stay there. For example, a fortune teller predicted almost every major even in the author's life down to the day and even mark on his exams. This type of thing is not even remotely uncommon in some traditional cultures. The fact that it happens is not enough for everybody. They need to know "why" it happens, but their logical paradigms are not privy to understanding things of this magnitude.

[Birch]

" This type of thing is not even remotely uncommon in some traditional cultures"

 

Butting in here:-) That smacks of determinism to me.

However, I do agree that one's fate (place, time of birth, family, culture etc) are determining with respect to one's destiny. Check out the many 'poverty trap' studies. Would one argue that character defects are what are keeping these people from enjoying a better life? Under what circumstances is poverty a defect of character? Perhaps looking at that with an aim to helping them overcome them, don't you think? This is not sarcasm BTW. I'm quite serious.

 

 

As I understand it, fate is "stuff we have no control over" and destiny is 'stuff we have influence over'. The argument that our influence should be in a moral direction because it's one way of improving on an otherwise rotten fate is an interesting one. I'm not as convinced about this as I used to be. I feel like I want to be closer to the truth these days. What if there's really no reward for acting morally? Would you still do it? Why? I think that's the kicker (well it is for me anyway:-))

 

Edit: formatting

Edited January 25, 2013 by -K-

[Harmonious Emptiness]

" This type of thing is not even remotely uncommon in some traditional cultures"

 

Butting in here:-) That smacks of determinism to me.

 

Well this is where "Changing Destiny" shows that this "fate" as told could be altered.. When Liao Fan followed the teaching of a monk he managed to exceed the later predictions of the fortune teller by reforming.

 

However, I do agree that one's fate (place, time of birth, family, culture etc) are determining with respect to one's destiny. Check out the many 'poverty trap' studies. Would one argue that character defects are what are keeping these people from enjoying a better life? Under what circumstances is poverty a defect of character? Perhaps looking at that with an aim to helping them overcome them, don't you think? This is not sarcasm BTW. I'm quite serious.

 

I think poverty can be a cycle based on an inability to reform one's behaviour due to the influences of surroundings. The defensive behaviour often necessary in impoverished areas can make it difficult to relate in areas where opportunities are more abundant, thus keeping the impoverished from connecting with the opportune.

 

As I understand it, fate is "stuff we have no control over" and destiny is 'stuff we have influence over'. The argument that our influence should be in a moral direction because it's one way of improving on an otherwise rotten fate is an interesting one. I'm not as convinced about this as I used to be. I feel like I want to be closer to the truth these days. What if there's really no reward for acting morally? Would you still do it? Why? I think that's the kicker (well it is for me anyway:-))

 

Edit: formatting

 

People will act morally just to be able to live with themselves, even if they lose monetarily, myself included, I'm sure yourself included.

[Birch]

Interesting points and speculations Harmonious. I ought to go drag up a few of these studies so we can discuss whether it is behaviour being discussed in them (and do we include things like access to nutrition as a behaviour to be reformed or an aspect of fate?)

I don't know what to make of your idea of relating for now. I reckon it might be a bit more involved than 'defensive behaviour'. But I'll sit with it.

I don't know what makes other people act morally. I've done it in the past simply out of education (conditioning) or to avoid punishment. Which isn't very moral IMO:-)

[Harmonious Emptiness]

@ -K- : It would be interesting to compare this theory with studies, at least the sides that are related between them. I'm pretty flexible on the idea of past life karma, but I think there is much truth to reforming behaviour to reduce the limiting of possiblities.

 

For fate vs. destiny, I've viewed it as fate being that which we sink to and destiny being the fulfillment of life's challenge that we rise to.

[Mal]

The idea that if you simply do good deeds, the universe will reward you for it, seems almost infantile. Real life experiences disprove it as a general rule.

 

My life experience proves it, as a general rule.

 

Obviously YMMV