Spontaneous Suffocation

[Marks of Glory]

Here is another post which has the purpose to shed light on newer possible side-effects of certain practices.

 

I believe it is important to share the negative or "cautious" aspects of practice, so this topic seeks not only to expose a possible side - effect, but also to receive feedback of people who are more experienced and might have had gone through the same side effects.

 

I also am aware of those called "side effects" might have also an almost purely personal nature, in the sense that it is due to a personal energetic and physiological disharmony and is in no way to be generalized to other practitioners.

 

 

 

My physical body is resisting much less to physical work and, when I overindulge on them some side-effects take place.

The most important one, which I had started having contact about one year ago, especially deserves my attention and it is the onset of suffocation.

This suffocation takes place when I sleep or rest, generally during the Day time, due to tiredness or exhaustion. I lay down on a couch to take a nap and sometimes, during this nap, my breath simply stops.

This stopping of breath is not a Kevala Kumbhaka stopping of breath. The characteristic of Kevala Kumbhaka a suspention of breath in which the person does not feel any urge to breath, it i very comfortable.

In my case, it is different, I feel as if I am being choked and suffocated (may be even dying) and is not pleasant at all.

It has happened quite a few time on the last year, always when I get involved in alot of physical work, like planting trees, or spend alot of time in strengthening asanas.

I never concerned myself alot with this phenomena, but the last time it occurred, one of my aunts actually saw the crisis and was pretty shocked, so she ended up "scaring" me about it, so I decided to share this physical-physiological experience here.

She first of all noticed that I was giving loud gruning noises while trying to grasp air during my sleep.

On this particular day, my morning asana practice was quite intense and consisted of: three slow rounds of Sun Saultation, about 2 - 3 minutes of Jalandharasana and Halasana, about 2 minutes of *Bhujangasana, 2 minutes of *Shalambhasana, 8 minutes of Sirshasana, 1 2 mintues of *Khandarasana, some push ups, about 500 rapid contractions of *Uddiyana Bandha in total, and 1 minute honding into the pose of *Mayurasana, about 15 rounds of Bhastrika Pranayama* The poses I placed the * sign are especially tyring.

 

 

After the practice I felt very tired, but still very lucid.

my body was in a completely relaxed state and my breathing heavy and slow.

 

I have heard that Yoguis, particularly Hatha Yoguins that follow the path of Pranayama should avoid too much physical exertion, I have heard it very very briefly mentioned on "Introduction to Tantra" book of Arthur of Avalon.

 

I believe that this is a natural process but any ways...

Maybe this is the reason why it is said that one should be physically strong (strong Jing) before starting the Internal Alchemy process mentioned in Chinese Scripture, my source being Fabrizio`s book on the topic. ShouYuliang also mentions that Daoists cultivate Jing Before and After having started to cultivate Light and Spirit. So I kind of interpret this as there is naturally a period in the Process of awakening, in which the physical body (represented my Jing) receives alot of stress due to adaptations occuring on Physical, Physiological and Energetic, thus it needs to be strong before this stress period is gone through, having the risk of even desencarnating (Death, or Desencarnation is a possibility in which I started pondering about only after I say my Aunt`s fearful expression after she witnessed one of my "attacks".)

 

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To avoid this from happening, next time i feel exhausted, I will try to and laydown and rest without falling asleep, see what happens and add the "results" to this topic.

 

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Any info from other Bums is warmly welcome

Edited January 19, 2013 by Marks of Glory

[Marks of Glory]

I believe that this condition is aggravated in cases of an excessively weak diet and extreme summer Heat which makes my body meltish and slow and heavy.

 

 

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One of my "spiritual sources" that mentions experiences of Suffocation is Master Tolken`s "The hobbit". More especifically a passage of the book in which the Hobbit and his friends are lost in the Dark Woods, and are captured by giant Spiders who roll them in their silk cocoons, thus suffocating them, By the time Bilbo Baggins reaches his friends to save them, they are already purple due to the suffocation.

[GrandmasterP]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apnea

Best to have that checked out by a medical professional buddy.

[cheya]

Hi MoG

This REALLY sounds like sleep apnea, and it is not spiritual. People die from this.

Please follow GrandmasterP's link and advice to have yourself checked out medically ASAP!

 

Good luck!

 

[Birch]

Agreed it sounds like something for the medical doctor. The question on whether this is a side effect of practices is a good one. I read somewhere (and as usual, if I find it again I'll post) pranayama could have long term effects that might not be what you want, but I'd rather let the more experienced bum yogis weigh in on it.

 

I found this just now: http://www.ayurvedacollege.com/articles/drhalpern/Pranayama_Yoga_Ayurveda

 

Yep, see a doc and get a teacher.

Edited January 19, 2013 by -K-

[Marks of Glory]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apnea

Best to have that checked out by a medical professional buddy.

 

will check out with my doctor.

 

 

Hi MoG This REALLY sounds like sleep apnea, and it is not spiritual. People die from this. Please follow GrandmasterP's link and advice to have yourself checked out medically ASAP! Good luck!

 

Will check this out!

 

 

Agreed it sounds like something for the medical doctor. The question on whether this is a side effect of practices is a good one. I read somewhere (and as usual, if I find it again I'll post) pranayama could have long term effects that might not be what you want, but I'd rather let the more experienced bum yogis weigh in on it.

 

I found this just now: http://www.ayurvedacollege.com/articles/drhalpern/Pranayama_Yoga_Ayurveda

 

Yep, see a doc and get a teacher.

 

 

Oh yes!

 

I am so grateful for you all having said this to me.

I will surely consult a medical doctor and explain him my situation.

i probably will have a blood test check to check out my iron and vitamins levels since I am a vegetarian.

 

My father has Apnea but he is fat, and he says that apnea happens normally with people that are fat. It happens due to a relaxation of the breathing related muscles, which are impeded from continuing with their functions due to the extra weight of the fat and mass of obese people.

 

I believe that in my case, the Apnea that is occuring is a manifestation due to other factors. I.E. exhaustion.

The Apnea crisis that I have normally happen when I am feeling really exhausted, probably my muscles relax so much that the Apnea comes in.

 

So i guess i need to discover the cause of this Exhaustion or rather, my exhaustion can be due to my apnea that is ocurring every night, which in turn causes more ehaustion which leads to a more profound relaxation which leads to more apnea crisis.

 

for the meanwhile I will:

I am planning in adding some meat in my Diet, maybe a Liver Soup or broken bone Soup once a week for nourishment.

Avoid sleeping when I feel exausted, and probably try and just rest without faling a sleep, the exhaustion normally subsides. If I sleep, probably I should do it in a sitting or reclined position. (curious that the last time that I had a crisis, i instinctively turned with my belly downwards, every time I had crisis, I was laying down with my belly upwards, so the weight of my belly would sink down, forcing against the diafragm`s free movement)

I will check this out with my TCM physician also. I will probably get a sleeping test to test for my apnea.

My neck is very long which might contribute to this condition. The sofa in which i had some crisis is very soft and I was sleeping withou a pillow with could facilitate a blockage in my neck.

I will make my best to sleep on my sides instead of on my back, maybe by stitching a pocket on the back of my pijamas and putting a tennis ball there, so that I can`t lay down on my back, forcing myself to turn sideways.

 

Whoa, it seems that apnea affects alot of people who don`t even know it!!!! I certainly will sleep on my sides from today onwards!

 

oh... have you guys ever heard about that wooden "pillow" which is supposed to fit perfectly on one`s neck??

probably it has a shape intended to relieve those apneas! I will chech this out.

 

 

my brothers, thank you very much for your feedback! helped me alot (even save my life probably) rsrsrs....

 

i am going to my farm so will not reply for the next days, but will surely post futurely with updates.

 

I found a nice website full of info.:

 

http://www.umm.edu/patiented/articles/sleep_apnea_000065.htm

 

Thank you once again, God bless you all

[cheya]

Hi MoG,

I have a client, thin as a rail, recently dignosed with sleep apnea. This person's father had it so bad that his kids had to keep him awake while he was driving! Scary!

 

Your blood oxygen drops, so you are exhausted all the time. This client is undergoing treatment, and feels MUCH better! You will too!

 

Good luck!

[Marks of Glory]

Hi MoG, I have a client, thin as a rail, recently dignosed with sleep apnea. This person's father had it so bad that his kids had to keep him awake while he was driving! Scary! Your blood oxygen drops, so you are exhausted all the time. This client is undergoing treatment, and feels MUCH better! You will too! Good luck!

Hey Cheya.

 

Do you know what kind of treatment your client underwent?

 

thnks

Edited January 19, 2013 by Marks of Glory

[cheya]

My client is using a CPAP machine. There are other solutions, but I think this is the standard.

 

 

 

When your blood oxygen is low and you are sleep deprived, you can fall asleep very quickly, not necessarily in bed! You are sleep deprived because you wake up sometimes HUNDREDS of times during the night. Your doctor can send you to a sleep clinic and they will find out how often you wake up.

 

 

 

Another important thing to understand is that trouble breathing can be caused by narrow throat structure, which can be genetic, not just due to overweight. That seems to be the case with my client.

[Clarity]

Nothing wrong with seeking medical advice. However, to go against the grain here....there are weaknesses coming from your spiritual experiences (as karmas) which can be cleared.

 

You're welcome to PM me if you would prefer discretion.

[Sanzon]

Buteyko method is quite effective treating apnoea. It is simple in its concept- nostril breathing during the day, and night, with the tongue resting on the upper palate. Balances the blood gasses is O2 & CO2, and the respiratory centre in the brain gets retrained to trigger in accordance with blood gasses as it should. Benefits of testing the tongue on the upper palate will resonate with cultivators. http://www.buteyko.info/

[ChiDragon]

I think that was an asthma attack rather than a side effect of some kind.

@Sanzon...
Good advice.......

[Marks of Glory]

Buteyko method is quite effective treating apnoea. It is simple in its concept- nostril breathing during the day, and night, with the tongue resting on the upper palate. Balances the blood gasses is O2 & CO2, and the respiratory centre in the brain gets retrained to trigger in accordance with blood gasses as it should. Benefits of testing the tongue on the upper palate will resonate with cultivators. http://www.buteyko.info/

 

superb!

 

 

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Actually my brothers, I have a strong hunch that it side effect from (strong) pranayama practice affecting the respiritory and nervous system accompanied with exhaustion, but I rather not say anything for the moment and dig in deeper and go for the physician, but I certainly will come back with some answers, rsrs..

[Marks of Glory]

Hi all.

 

I have studied my breathing patterns lately... and i noticed that, if it is Apnea that I am suffering, it surely is not the physical type, for I have slept sitting down and in varied positions and sometimes some breath shortaged still takes place (but in a mild manner, not as drastic as the crisis that I have when I practice too much exercice). So I believe that my sort of "apnea" has it's origin in the Nervous System.

 

I have been noticing my breathing patterns bduring the day time also, and I noticed that it is very sutil, and very silent throughout the day, I guess this is a good breathing pattern to meditate, but not very good to do the day-to-day buisness, so I am practicing Ajapa-Japa throughout the day, which basically is conscious breathing. If I forget, my breathing will get very sutil once again, and I will enter a more transcendental and hibernating mode, so I constantly have to be aware of breathing. (Ajapa Japa means "repetition without repetition" which is being aware of the breathing process and often associating mantras with is, as So-Hong ("so" uininspiration, and "hong" in expiration), it seems like it's working to make me more alert during the day-to-day.

 

I have been thinking.. Ajapa Japa is said to be a very important practice for advanced Yoguins, so I have been thinking... maybe very advanced yoguins must practice Ajapa Japa all day long to continue alive and not desencarnate, or simply not to stay in a perpetual Samadhih, since they activated so strongly some "transcendental energies" that their breath is constantly stopping... I am Just thinking out loud here...

[zanshin]

Cheyne-stokes respiration. That's pathological apnea of neuro origin. Don't remember all the physiological details, basically sensors in brain get out of sync and don't tell lungs to breath with good timing.

[Marks of Glory]

Cheyne-stokes respiration. That's pathological apnea of neuro origin. Don't remember all the physiological details, basically sensors in brain get out of sync and don't tell lungs to breath with good timing.

 

 

Geese... those western abordations really spookes me out! rsrs...

 

I will read the article and try to observe my breathing patterns deeper still to see if I notice the typical oscillation mentioned in the Cheyne-stokes article on the internet..

 

Thanks for sharing sister.

[Marks of Glory]

hmmmm I will update some informations gathered these days...

 

first of all, I talked again and again to my aunt, and she is quite certain that the gasping sound emited by myself was actually while EXHALING the air, and not trying to desperately inhale..

 

exatly, she said that I was laying down with my belly downwards, in a position that remined my of a semi-bhujangasana pose, and whle raising my head I was emiting those creepy sounds.

 

Another thing that I noticed, acutally now I am quite sure that this physiological effect IS indeed a result of the pranayama and meditation practices. I am quite sure of this because of my experience of last night, in which I had a very strong and vivid dream, very archetypal indeed, and woke up with a sudden gasp of air (as if the dream had occured in the time while by breathing had been suspended). Interestsing enough it was mid night when I woke up of the dream, midnight being the best time inwhich the unconcious is active. When I woke up after the "dream" I felt very detachd from te external world, all my prolems seemed trivial (which, I believe, means that at that time my libido was introversed, which made be feel detacehd from the external world). Now I am again atached to it, which means I guess that my "kundalini raised, and fell", that is, that my "libido" became introverted (in an esoteric sense) and then fell again to the external world.

 

Anyways, I will continue with my practice, and hope everything goes alright, and avoid doing too much exercise not to tire my much, and, if I have night emissions, I will abdicate from the practice at least for that day and eat alot of nourishing food, fruits and vitamins, to recover the lost energy. I really feel that I am close to death in those experiences, and am afraid that I can "leave my body and not come back" if it is too much weak. But I think that Death itself is a major factor or a major "ingredient" in all yoguic and inner taois practices (isn't immortality the conquer of death?), s that means that all the alchemists deal with Death or "the death factor" quite close, and it is, in deed, possible that the "Great Experiment" or the process of awakening spiritually resulis in permament death if the Adept is not cautious enough.

 

I say that based on information that adepts of Hatha Yoga should not emit there semen "because they may die". It makes alot of sense to me now... Again.,... when my breath stays very weak, I feel as if I am dying, I think that if the body is not strong enough, the person undergoing this processs can really die... Kind of reminds my of the folks that die sleeping "like a bird".

 

my weak breathing patterns had ceased during the days in which I stopped my practice (about 4 days in duration).

 

I will did further still into this and will reply soon..