Living at peace with society...

[SEEKER OF TRUTH]

I find it interesting, that so many here seem to be cut from the same cloth. I wouldn't have guessed it from just joining, but after reading this thread, it seems that many are here, because the world doesn't always make sense to them.

 

I have been on both sides of this issue, me thinks. When I was younger I really tried to fit in, and for years, drugs and alcohol seemed to help with that, but eventually that quit working and then I had to come to grips with myself and my sense of values.

 

I think age has helped to numb the pain of my sense of separateness, from the mainstream, Fox News, Dancing with the stars, Want to be a millionaire, watching brethren.

 

I'm much more comfortable spending time with myself, since I went past the 40 year mark. I do enjoy other peoples company, on occasion and have to interact with many acquaintances on a daily basis, but I really enjoy my alone time and the peace and quiet that affords me, and I'm not ashamed of that in the least.

[oildrops]

I'm feeling this as well lately. It seems to me people just love to shit on each other. We are bred to become competitive and aggressive and those traits have been accepted and perpetuated. I still continue to be open to people, it's just a matter of not becoming attached and/or letting go when their plans no longer run parallel to my own. One thing I have learned from moving around is that it's important to have acquaintances, and hard to find friends, because good people hide out and those acquaintances will help you network.

[AsheSkyler]

Sounds like your (astrological) Practical Director, that is, "planet of oriental appearance." is Pluto,...which is often defined as someone painfully ahead of the established mentality and morality of the time. A Practical Director reveals what one would be good at. With Pluto as the planet of oriental appearence, there is an aptness of bringing new meaning, significance, and perfection to old forms. What forms or systems one is apt to bring updated meaning to, depends on the House that the Practical Director is posited in.

 

I resonate with your post in that I hardly spoke during the first 40 years of this life,...and for the most part, still find it necessary to remain quiet in most common circumstances, throughout the 48 States and 6 Countries I've been to. At one time, I felt my predicament was rather cruel,...until I realized that the universe is not here for me,...I'm here for the universe. It didn't relieve the mundane isolation from society at large, but did mitigate my understanding of things.

 

A Buddhist said, "Morality can only be imposed from without when we are asleep. It can only be pseudo, false, a façade, it cannot become your real being…morality is bound to be nothing but a deep suppression. You cannot do anything while asleep; you can only suppress. And through morality, you will become false. You will not be a person, but simply a "persona"—just a pseudo-entity. . . . Only a dishonest person can be moral."

 

But you can't tell moral people that. And especially in Judeao-based Countries, such discussion could get you worse than killed.

 

I still don't have enough sense yet to keep my mouth shut at all times, especially around the devout. I don't even mind a difference of opinions between people. I enjoy it, in fact. The problem lies in the ones who believe they have a God-given right to nag and verbally bash you into becoming the person they want you to be when there's nothing wrong with who you are.

 

Today I got a several hour mocking and insulting for not letting a woman put socks on me because my feet temperature was not to her liking, despite me feeling fine, not needing them, and generally don't like wearing things on my feet. Part of me says to be a pawn to people's wishes because they will always be more important than me, another says that I shouldn't be a doormat and they should learn to respect my wishes if they want me to respect their's. It's confusing, it's petty, and I don't understand why she made a big deal about me politely refusing in the first place.

[Vmarco]

The problem lies in the ones who believe they have a God-given right to nag and verbally bash you into becoming the person they want you to be when there's nothing wrong with who you are.

 

Authentic Buddhists and Taoists don't believe in gods.

http://www.buddhanet.net/ans73.htm

 

Lao Tzu said, "Do not go about worshipping deities and religious institutions as the source of the subtle truth. To do so is to place intermediaries between yourself and source, and to make youself a beggar who looks outside for a treasure that is hidden inside his own breast. If you want to worship the Tao, first discover it in your own heart."

[Vanir Thunder Dojo Tan]

If there were anything i could consider calling "worshipped" in my life, it would be the amalgamation of Truth, Awareness, Consciousness, Mind, and Knowing, or as VM might spell it, Gnowing... )((the meaning i am applying is ignorant of its own spelling ))(

[Apech]

Authentic Buddhists and Taoists don't believe in gods.

http://www.buddhanet.net/ans73.htm

 

Lao Tzu said, "Do not go about worshipping deities and religious institutions as the source of the subtle truth. To do so is to place intermediaries between yourself and source, and to make youself a beggar who looks outside for a treasure that is hidden inside his own breast. If you want to worship the Tao, first discover it in your own heart."

 

Buddhists don't believe gods are sources of refuge or the worship of them can lead to liberation ... but certainly the world view includes not only gods but other entities.

 

Our ancient world view .... which mankind has probably held for 99% of its existence is that the universe includes deities and that these deities inhabit and are vital part of nature. Look at any ancient civilisation for confirmation. This is not a mistaken world view just one that has to be treated properly by understanding what is meant by the term god. What we have been confused by is the equation God = Absolute ... which is a product and a defect of monotheism.

[Birch]

 

 

It really makes me crazy when my pinky accidentally hits a wrong key, it makes a little ping, and everything I've just typed goes up in smoke. Does anyone know what *&!!*k@# key that is??

 

My mind goes metaphysical to the max, so when I talk about buttons I'm also keeping in mind that I am the creator of my own life, at the very basic level. Maybe throw the bardos in, and my last bardo knew perfectly well what exact life I would create for myself in this lifetime; I believe at the time I make decision that it is me who is making the decision. I've come to believe that it really isn't. It's It, whatever you want to call it, the creative life-force, that makes the decision. So my repeated responses to certain stimulae that repeatedly happen over the years (because my life, after all, is exactly how it's supposed to be for my particular spirit to learn what it needs to know in this bardo and continue up the spiral) are what I call buttons.

 

A person whose life depends on doing their best to remove these fixed responses to certain stimulae (buttons) has to dig down and see the source of them before they can even start to turn around. Usually 'acting to the opposite' for a while and/or making an amend or two, if owed, will start the process. People whose lives depend on this are alcoholics and addicts and other -icts of any stripe, I imagine. This is a deep and tough process.

 

K - what is stealing potential in the sense this thread is talking about?

 

Really nice thread!

 

Yeah, I don't believe in a personal creation through Bardo. An impersonal one, definitely. And post-heaven, it becomes 'yours' of course, as long as consciousness is allowed. In saying it's hard to explain how this stuff has to do with 'stealing potential' I really do mean it's hard to explain. But I'll make an attempt. If you get to the point where you are conscious of your life and behaviours and reactions and are able to choose to express them otherwise from what they would have been had they been unconscious, you 'steal' the potential of that whole for yourself (not the one that was just following through as conditioned). So if someone makes a 'button-pushing' attempt and you recognize it but don't follow (or defend) then you have that potential of energy for yourself.

 

 

Joe B and PythagoreanFL do a better explanation, but I'm trying another one:-)

 

Edit: typo

Edited January 28, 2013 by -K-

[Vmarco]

If there were anything i could consider calling "worshipped" in my life, it would be the amalgamation of Truth, Awareness, Consciousness, Mind, and Knowing, or as VM might spell it, Gnowing... )((the meaning i am applying is ignorant of its own spelling ))(

 

You grasped a most important observation NAJA,...knowledge and gnowledge are two distinct things.

 

Knowing arises from the 6 senses; the monkey mind. The Tao can never be known.

 

Even in the West, when 5th Century BCE Greeks spoke of Higher Mind, they used the word Thymos, and pointed to what is called the Heart chakra at the chest,....as for Lower Mind, it was called Psyche, which arose from the grey-goo in the head.

 

'Gnothi Seauton', as inscribed over the portico of the Temple at Delphi, says and means Gnow Thyself, not Know Thyself. In other words, those who say they know, most likely do not Gnow. Some cultures like the Egyptian and Maya of Mesoamerica, thought so lowly of the brain, or sciential mind, that before burials it was sucked out and discarded, whereas the heart? was treasured.

 

Records of dissections of adults in Greek times shows that the (butterfly shaped) thymus gland to be as large as the heart. Today, in the world culture of knowledge, where gnowledge is no longer used, the thymus gland begins to atrophy after birth. Don't use it,...we lose it.

 

In the West, gnowledge (gnosis) began being eradicated as the Christian meme appeared,...led by the "Sprouter of Lies", the mass-murderer Paul of Tarsus, then Theodocius, and the barbaric reign of Justinian, which barred anyone outside specific neo-Christian beliefs from civil service, and whose forced baptisms upon Arabs encouraged the way for the establishment of Islam by the pediphile prophet Mohammed.

[Birch]

Buddhists don't believe gods are sources of refuge or the worship of them can lead to liberation ... but certainly the world view includes not only gods but other entities.

 

Our ancient world view .... which mankind has probably held for 99% of its existence is that the universe includes deities and that these deities inhabit and are vital part of nature. Look at any ancient civilisation for confirmation. This is not a mistaken world view just one that has to be treated properly by understanding what is meant by the term god. What we have been confused by is the equation God = Absolute ... which is a product and a defect of monotheism.

 

Well God is a god if you see what I mean, but it has gotten out of hand. The Gnostics knew it would and so that's why they got ripped to shreds by Christian chariots. Are there ANY esoterics left inside the monotheisms?

[Vmarco]

Well God is a god if you see what I mean, but it has gotten out of hand. The Gnostics knew it would and so that's why they got ripped to shreds by Christian chariots. Are there ANY esoterics left inside the monotheisms?

 

Are there any Esoterics? I once read:

 

"So how can you know when a religious/mystical leader has broken through and knows the hoax? Because there are stages of learning a person goes through. You can recognize the stage a person is in. One who has broken through to the final stage of "enlightenment" speaks with authority and self-confidence.

 

When reading a religious book you can tell by the way the author expresses himself/herself if they've broken through, i.e., they realize the hoax but they're still promoting it.

 

Some say that St. Theresa of Avila, who wrote a number of books, broke through to the full realization. It is said that she totally stopped reading religious literature. Her whole adult life was spent constantly reading and writing about the Lord. Suddenly, she completely stopped it.

 

Did she realized her visions, her trances, everything was coming from her inner self. Her priest confessor, who had always heard her confessions, just could not get over why all of a sudden she stopped all religious reading...for that had been her passion in life.

 

Once a person breaks through the hoax of theism to realize there is no higher authority looking out for you, you miss the relationship you thought you had with God. The thought that reality is all there is can seem cold. It takes away the mystery and love that communication with God provided. Reality seems very cold at first.

 

So few finally break through to realize it's all a hoax. Many, many people live their whole life caught up living in a way they shouldn't be living, acting and doing things which go against themselves and their self interests.

 

It is extremely difficult to make the breakthrough. It is said to have taken St. Theresa fourteen years.

Edited January 28, 2013 by Vmarco

[Apech]

Well God is a god if you see what I mean, but it has gotten out of hand. The Gnostics knew it would and so that's why they got ripped to shreds by Christian chariots. Are there ANY esoterics left inside the monotheisms?

 

 

There are Christian mystics but they tend to be individuals and not a tradition ... e.g. William Blake.

[Owledge]

Today I got a several hour mocking and insulting for not letting a woman put socks on me because my feet temperature was not to her liking, despite me feeling fine, not needing them, and generally don't like wearing things on my feet. Part of me says to be a pawn to people's wishes because they will always be more important than me, another says that I shouldn't be a doormat and they should learn to respect my wishes if they want me to respect their's. It's confusing, it's petty, and I don't understand why she made a big deal about me politely refusing in the first place.

Many people are frozen by fear, not in the most obvious sense, but also not meant metaphorically. They are adapted to an unhealthy society, and anything that represents a reminder of something deviating from that makes them uncomfortable. If you deviate from social norms, you become a constant reminder of people's fear that makes them hide in the warm comfort of a society of oppression, violence and domination. In short: By deviating from the norm, you trigger people's inferiority complexes. Deep down they know they're weak-spined cowards, but they wish to suppress that and not be reminded of it. The irony is that they probably condemn themselves more than those who deviate from the norm without an agenda, just for their own pleasure.

Think about it: If someone didn't have the strength to cope with adversity and pressure and then you want to talk with them about it, they will immediately think "coward,coward,coward" and blame YOU for calling them a coward / reminding them they are one. That's why non-judging isn't the great solution to healing people. People judge themselves. They opened themselves to bullies' belief systems. A bully has low self-esteem, but if he was in fortunate conditions and got his hands on some power and social influence, he will try to feel better by making others have low self-esteem.

 

It's pretty much the same with honesty. Honesty, honoring truth, is a virtue, yet society is not virtuous. A self-declared champion of honesty will make many people feel uncomfortable, because many people give power to their lies and don't want them unveiled. Ironically, they don't trust people who won't tell a lie. And due to generally widespead weak logical abilities, they will equal not-telling-lies with not-keeping-anything-unsaid.

 

This general problem of 'having sold your soul to the devil' is well-expressed in this movie scene:

Edited January 28, 2013 by Owledge

[i am]

Many people are frozen by fear, not in the most obvious sense, but also not meant metaphorically. They are adapted to an unhealthy society, and anything that represents a reminder of something deviating from that makes them uncomfortable. If you deviate from social norms, you become a constant reminder of people's fear that makes them hide in the warm comfort of a society of oppression, violence and domination. In short: By deviating from the norm, you trigger people's inferiority complexes. Deep down they know they're weak-spined cowards, but they wish to suppress that and not be reminded of it. The irony is that they probably condemn themselves more than those who deviate from the norm without an agenda, just for their own pleasure.

Think about it: If someone didn't have the strength to cope with adversity and pressure and then you want to talk with them about it, they will immediately think "coward,coward,coward" and blame YOU for calling them a coward / reminding them they are one. That's why non-judging isn't the great solution to healing people. People judge themselves. They opened themselves to bullies' belief systems. A bully has low self-esteem, but if he was in fortunate conditions and got his hands on some power and social influence, he will try to feel better by making others have low self-esteem.

 

It's pretty much the same with honesty. Honesty, honoring truth, is a virtue, yet society is not virtuous. A self-declared champion of honesty will make many people feel uncomfortable, because many people give power to their lies and don't want them unveiled. Ironically, they don't trust people who won't tell a lie. And due to generally widespead weak logical abilities, they will equal not-telling-lies with not-keeping-anything-unsaid

 

Yes.

 

People resent, without understanding that's what's going on, people living a life they're afraid to live. And only certain people, who aren't living that life, can handle being friends with someone who is.

 

And what's the deal with fear of the truth?? Crazy. There was a good line in Into the Wild...can't remember it, but something along the lines of "above all else, give me truth."

 

Not give me all hurtfull info and insult me, not never keep a secret. But when i ask, either tell me the truth, as you understand it, or say "none of your business." But don't lie...

[manitou]

 

Yeah, I don't believe in a personal creation through Bardo. An impersonal one, definitely. And post-heaven, it becomes 'yours' of course, as long as consciousness is allowed. In saying it's hard to explain how this stuff has to do with 'stealing potential' I really do mean it's hard to explain. But I'll make an attempt. If you get to the point where you are conscious of your life and behaviours and reactions and are able to choose to express them otherwise from what they would have been had they been unconscious, you 'steal' the potential of that whole for yourself (not the one that was just following through as conditioned). So if someone makes a 'button-pushing' attempt and you recognize it but don't follow (or defend) then you have that potential of energy for yourself.

 

 

Joe B and PythagoreanFL do a better explanation, but I'm trying another one:-)

 

Edit: typo

 

I think we're saying exactly the same thing. I can recognize the buttons that used to be there, or may be there still to some degree, but the reaction to act out in a given direction is gone. Before they were gone, the button-pushing would always involve Reaction A. When the button is removed, I can choose Reaction A,B,C, or no reaction at all. Full poential is realized.

 

The way you described stealing potential reminds me of a mental image I've talked about before. The moment of most potential is that moment when the conductor's baton is raised, there is dead silence and lack of motion. then, when a sound is made, the note is committed, the potential is reduced. Perhaps the most beautiful music is the silence.

[RiverSnake]

Over the years I have learned a variety of tips and tricks for psychically and emotionally defending myself...which I feel is what this thread is really about.

 

1. Always have your shields up

 

2. Learn how to identify emotional and psychic vampires right away and treat them with all the attachment you would a booger

 

3. Always be aware of your weaknesses or your trigger points (manitou touched on this topic)

 

4. Through meditation learn to control your thoughts and emotions (vampires will manipulate them if you let them)

 

My 2 cents, Peace

Edited January 29, 2013 by OldGreen

[Vanir Thunder Dojo Tan]

2. I love rocks as much I do people... nothing isn't life and I love all life... is that going to bite me in the ass?
3. hair trigger......


4. they wont let me... meditation aside, they wont let me when im not meditating...!!!




as for numero uno...
1. except when they're down Lovemaking cant have shields, too much friction

[oildrops]

Over the years I have learned a variety of tips and tricks for psychically and emotionally defending myself...which I feel is what this thread is really about.

 

1. Always have your shields up

 

2. Learn how to identify emotional and psychic vampires right away and treat them with all the attachment you would a booger

 

3. Always be aware of your weaknesses or your trigger points (manitou touched on this topic)

 

4. Through meditation learn to control your thoughts and emotions (vampires will manipulate them if you let them)

 

My 2 cents, Peace

 

 

Can you give any insight on how you identify emotional and psychic vampires? I would think it is different for everyone, based on personal weaknesses. A side note: those "weaknesses" are what creates our need for others, but I guess it comes down to people either exploiting your weakness to make you dependent, or helping you strengthen and grow. I could use better intuition for avoiding emotional vampires.

[RiverSnake]

 

 

Can you give any insight on how you identify emotional and psychic vampires? I would think it is different for everyone, based on personal weaknesses. A side note: those "weaknesses" are what creates our need for others, but I guess it comes down to people either exploiting your weakness to make you dependent, or helping you strengthen and grow. I could use better intuition for avoiding emotional vampires.

Most people can intuitively feel these out for themselves.....a simple example is a Troll on this site. A troll posts some outrageous comments which he may or may not believe and this post stirs people up emotionally and psychologically because they lack self-control.....this triggers lots of argument or fighting and very long useless threads....all of which feeds the troll/vampire.

 

There easy enough to sense when you develop a bit of intuition. I see them all the time and I just ignore them. People can subconsciously or consciously be vampires as well....at one point or another in our lives we have unknowingly sucked other people's energy. Its conscious and aware vamps that can be quite annoying. Here's a couple of linkson the topic:

 

http://thetaobums.com/topic/7752-spiritual-vampires/

 

http://thetaobums.com/topic/14177-tao-bumss-emotional-vampires/

 

http://www.owningpink.com/blogs/owning-pink/identifying-warding-emotional-vampires-part-2-of-emotional-freedom

 

 

My 2 cent, Peace

Edited January 29, 2013 by OldGreen

[manitou]

 

2. Learn how to identify emotional and psychic vampires right away and treat them with all the attachment you would a booger

 

 

 

 

One of the more profound things I've ever heard on this site.

Edited January 29, 2013 by manitou

[Everything]

It is my opinion that there is a big difference between acquaintances and friends.

 

I have many acquaintances but few friends. My friends are those I can share my life with.

 

My acquaintances are those I share their and my needs with. These are people who can do things for me (and I can do for them) for fair compensation.

 

We invite acquaintances into our life for a limited time. Friends are always with you.

Sometimes acquaintances become friends!

 

Very often actually...

 

Almost all of my friends were acquaintances!

Edited January 29, 2013 by Everything

[Everything]

I think there's a differnce between acceptance and Acceptance. No, I wouldn't accept somebody bullying me or saying unkind things - but there is a graceful way out of that that doesn't have to upset our emotional well-being. Just be kind and walk away, understanding that there's no other way for that fellow to act. The man's in a hell of his own making.

 

But the Acceptance part is realizing 'that's the way that person is', and not expecting anything else from him. Part of maturing is taking people for what they are, bullies or not, and realizing that that's how they are. If he is in your presence, expect him to try to bully you. It's his nature. But how you are capable of responding, how much work you've done, is the thing that will dictate whether this will drive you crazy or something gentler, like looking at it with a degree of humor because you knew it was going to happen anyway. Blow it off.

 

What I've actually found, over all the physical moves I've made in my life, is that I'm always still there when I get to my destination. If I have buttons that are still predominant sticking out of my chest that people can push at any moment, this is going to happen whether I'm living in the middle of New York City or a small village in the Himalayas. The ultimate answer lies within us, and repeatedly moving from one locale to another to escape folks which are unpleasant to us only extends the lesson, as I see it. Until we do the inner work and file down the buttons, it will happen everywhere unless you can find an uninhabited island somewhere.

I love bullies. I met this one bully and he is very protective, in a kind, but also heroic way. When you're with him, you allways feel at ease, he's like a personal body guard. They're very masterful at countering. Sometimes people try to bother you and it just makes you laugh, because you can't wait for your friend to counter him. It is lovely when you see someone being himself as fully as he can, as passionately as he is. Leave the bullying to the bullies, then you don't have to get in their way. They just love doing what they do. Paradoxically, as you allow them to do what they love to do, you grant yourself more opportunity to do what you love to do aswell.

 

I actually collect bullies. They are like my pokemon. Only bullies are actually infinite times more cooler then pokemon to have around.

[Owledge]

@Everything

I think you misunderstand the word "bully". A bully is a tyrant. It's people who harasses easy targets in order to feel better about themselves. They have inferiority issues.

In school kids, the borders blur. Said process happens all the time in that environment, with varying intensity. It's kids trying to deal with the crap that previous generations left in society.

 

I especially remember one bully from my school time, because of that one time he got the worst grade possible for a test and started crying.

Edited January 29, 2013 by Owledge

[Vmarco]

@Everything

I think you misunderstand the word "bully". A bully is a tyrant. It's people who harasses easy targets in order to feel better about themselves. They have inferiority issues.

In school kids, the borders blur. Said process happens all the time in that environment, with varying intensity. It's kids trying to deal with the crap that previous generations left in society.

 

I especially remember one bully from my school time, because of that one time he got the worst grade possible for a test and started crying.

 

Bullying is a symptom of a deeper problem that the current society does not want to address, probably because nearly half the population (here in the US) have a propensity towards the route trigger of bullying,...that is, conservatism.

http://www.thirdworldtraveler.com/Society/Conservatives_Deconstruct.html

 

It might be possible for a liberal to be a bully,...although I've never heard of a case.

 

Although liberalism is demonized by conservatives, such as conservatives stunch rejection of any anti-bullying legislation, a quick read of an American definition of liberal, shows the insanity of conservatives claims:

 

On September 14, 1960, John F Kennedy said, "a Liberal is someone who looks ahead and not behind, someone who welcomes new ideas without rigid reactions, someone who cares about the welfare of the people — their health, their housing, their schools, their jobs, their civil rights, and their civil liberties — someone who believes we can break through the stalemate and suspicions that grip us in our policies abroad, that is what a ‘Liberal’ means, and I’m proud to say I’m a ‘Liberal.’"

 

In other words,...if one is not liberal, they're illiberal. How can a peaceful society ever occur in an illiberal society?

 

"it is no measure of health to be well adjusted to a profoundly sick society" J Krishnamurti

[Jetsun]

How do you do it? People around my area tend to, on the whole, be rather superficial and judgemental...I'm not saying this because I think I'm superior in any way, but after having some mind-blowing spiritual experiences, and being into all the stuff I am, I simply don't feel as if I belong/fit in around here at all. I've always been a bit "sensitive", and it's almost like I pick up, on some level, people's conditioned notions of what a male my age, in an area like this, "should" be like. The good news is, I'm working towards moving to another part of the country (or possibly overseas) next year, but in the mean time, how can I learn to just...accept? It's quite possible I'm making too much of this, and just need to seek out more friends in other parts of town, but for some reason I seem to have trouble in that area (making new connections that is).

 

Aaaaah, just venting.

 

Where would there be leather enough to cover the entire world? With just the leather of my sandals, it is as if the whole earth were covered.

 

Likewise, I am unable to restrain external phenomena, but I shall restrain my own mind. What need is there to restrain anything else?

 

- Santideva

[manitou]

I love bullies. I met this one bully and he is very protective, in a kind, but also heroic way. When you're with him, you allways feel at ease, he's like a personal body guard. They're very masterful at countering. Sometimes people try to bother you and it just makes you laugh, because you can't wait for your friend to counter him. It is lovely when you see someone being himself as fully as he can, as passionately as he is. Leave the bullying to the bullies, then you don't have to get in their way. They just love doing what they do. Paradoxically, as you allow them to do what they love to do, you grant yourself more opportunity to do what you love to do aswell.

 

I actually collect bullies. They are like my pokemon. Only bullies are actually infinite times more cooler then pokemon to have around.

 

My god this is beautiful, lol. Did you write Silver Linings Playbook?