Ho' oponopono -- Improving the World by Loving Yourself

[Mokona]

Sure, techniques that bring on self healing of the emotions, mind and even on an energetic level are certainley out there for anyone to grab and try. But when you lie and sell it for profit... Well I don't even know how to complete that sentence. I jsut find it fairly annoying. It's worse if the techniques themselves don't do anything, but just tap into the miraculous PLACEBO effect.

 

Was on the flatbench lifting once, ran out of juice and couldn't push up for the life of me, my spotter put his fingers under the bar and i "THOUGHT" he was pulling up - he wasn't - I powerhoused the bar into his face like I was lifting a feather. Placebo is a strong tool for healing and pushing limits.

Edited February 4, 2013 by Mokona

[Birch]

I wanted to post a video of a stage faith healer.

[Jetsun]

I don't think its just placebo, like I said earlier I'm not a huge fan but when I did the work on a connection with a person I hadn't seen in about ten years he almost immediately sent me a message online with a similar vibe to what I was sending him in my mind, which I can't put down to coincidence, so I do think it does something powerful between the connections people have with each other which is not limited by distance. The problem was that I wasn't clear in myself so I didn't know if I was releasing the connection or just making it more complicated.

[Mokona]

My mom does this all the time, without the technique. She answers the phone without looking at caller ID and says hi to whomever by name. Freaks them out. Thinking about people sometimes causes them to call her up, i've experienced it too. It's more of a connecting and pinging type thing that many people have a knack for and others need to practice to get to work.

[Birch]

I don't think its just placebo, like I said earlier I'm not a huge fan but when I did the work on a connection with a person I hadn't seen in about ten years he almost immediately sent me a message online with a similar vibe to what I was sending him in my mind, which I can't put down to coincidence, so I do think it does something powerful between the connections people have with each other which is not limited by distance. The problem was that I wasn't clear in myself so I didn't know if I was releasing the connection or just making it more complicated.

 

I have experience with this too. IMO/IME the honesty part (clarity) is very important. If I hate someone and pretend otherwise in a ritual including them because it seems like a nice thing to do, what's the benefit to them? I'd rather work on resolving the hate I feel before taking it into someone else's life and affecting us both.

[suninmyeyes]

Lets do a google search on the guy..

 

http://www.scamdetective.com/Online-Marketers/Joe-Vitale/Joe-Vitale-breaking-products-acceptable

 

Another great review:

 

http://mrfirespyre.blogspot.com/2010/08/joe-vitales-empire-of-miracles.html

 

Ah! Joe and the law of attraction:

 

http://www.theverge.com/2012/6/8/3068342/prosper-scamworld-internet-marketing-boiler-room-joe-vitale-mitt-romney (Lovely New Age BS)

 

Don't cha all thank me at once.

Thank you !!! lol

 

Original post at least made me look into what ho'oponopono is , so its good and informative to a degree .

In past whenever I have seen it mentioned I just skipped it , and never got interested into finding out what this practise involves.

[三江源]

The tenet behind this practice is oneness. No barrier between me and you. If you did the thing which causes problems, then so did I, as we are one.

 

I can apologise when you hurt me and ask for forgiveness, on behalf of our heart and humanity. it doesnt, of course, mean that I let you hurt me again.

 

If I hate you, it follows that I hate me, as we are not seperate.

 

If the mindset of oneness is inhabited, than what one does in this practice, is for one , and all.

[Birch]

The tenet behind this practice is oneness. No barrier between me and you. If you did the thing which causes problems, then so did I, as we are one.

 

I can apologise when you hurt me and ask for forgiveness, on behalf of our heart and humanity. it doesnt, of course, mean that I let you hurt me again.

 

If I hate you, it follows that I hate me, as we are not seperate.

 

If the mindset of oneness is inhabited, than what one does in this practice, is for one , and all.

 

'We' are not one Cat. Certainly the shared 'pristine' consciousness is above such distinctions of 'we' and 'me' and 'you' and 'I', however at the level at which hurt and blame exist, the 'mindset' you are referring to does not - otherwise, and this is a beautiful tautology - there would be no hurt and no blame.

 

I'm afraid I 'ran into your fist' on this one.

For 'background' the persons 'responsible' for mistreating me have never made an apology nor asked for my forgiveness. Had they done so I would have gladly given it:-) Rather they have shifted the blame for events onto 'me' and continue to do so. See above pdf on 'victim-blaming' for more on how this happens.

 

The idea you're promoting (you and so many others) sounds lofty, to me it just adds insult to injury. I suppose one thing to be greatful for is that it did happen to me and not someone else. I wouldn't wish it on anyone. And this includes the people who hurt me.

 

Here's some more on this topic:

http://www.amazon.com/Forgiveness-Time-Love-Hate-ebook/dp/B004TMAMK8/ref=sr_1_5?ie=UTF8&qid=1360003081&sr=8-5&keywords=forgiveness+a+time+to+love+and+a+time+to+hate

[Xienkula1]

It seems like this topic is stirring up the crap lol

 

Perhaps we should all just say I am sorry please forgive me I love you.

 

And Let's say a high No ! to the positive, a low No! to the negative!!! No from the center of this intolerable, no to this magnetic divorce that says it is not enough that I win, you have to loose! No! NO! nO! No! No! No! No to leaving any soldiers wounded and trapped in black holes on the field of the subconscious mind, until we have reclaimed every lost one in our center!!!

[Birch]

It seems like this topic is stirring up the crap lol

 

Perhaps we should all just say I am sorry please forgive me I love you.

 

And Let's say a high No ! to the positive, a low No! to the negative!!! No from the center of this intolerable, no to this magnetic divorce that says it is not enough that I win, you have to loose! No! NO! nO! No! No! No! No to leaving any soldiers wounded and trapped in black holes on the field of the subconscious mind, until we have reclaimed every lost one in our center!!!

 

Of course this is a difficult topic! I'm of the firm conviction that truth can be spoken shamelessly, even in the face of ridicule - which is often the first line of defense for people who would rather not hear it or that you tell. Of course, I could have left this thread alone - and I'm starting to think it would have been a better idea:-) but I find it hard to sit here reading about yet another very questionable New Age practice and not bring up what I see as being questionable about it.

 

This 'win-lose' idea is an interesting one Xienkula (although I have this hunch it's more about having something you thought helpful questioned and I'm not questioning you). I don't understand much of what you wrote about it above but certainly the 'abuser' 'loses' a 'victim' if the latter refuses to stand for it. Not more than that.

[Seth Ananda]

I love Ho'oponopono and use it regularly, but there is more to it than Vitale describes, and the story about Len fixing a psych ward is a hoax. No such ward exists, anywhere in Hawaii, that anyone has been able to find.

 

Ho'oponopono is an amazing complex self healing system. here is what I can come up with off the top of my head.

 

Ho'oponopono is based on healing the relationship between the Unihipili and the Uhane, or basic self and middle self.

 

Unihipili is child like in nature, It runs our body, stores our feelings and memories and beliefs, is hurt by insults or negative self talk, and is creative and very symbolic. {its much like the right brain to me}

Anyone who influences us becomes 'alive' within our Unihipili. That is part psychological, and part energetic, as we form 'aka' links to the people we are tied to.

Either way, we have the voices of our mothers and fathers, teachers, peers, abusers or victims, all there, living within our mind - rent free - and adding their two cents worth to all our mental processing of current experience.

 

All these voices cause the body stress, and consume our personal energy, and deeply affect our personal outlook and view of the world.

 

Uhane is the 'middle' self, or human spirit, and its functions are Reason, logic. distinction and intuition. Its job is to navigate the world, and to protect the unihipili, by being careful what it believes, but untill it becomes very powerful and refined, the negatives of others and self will slip through into the unihipili bringing wounds and hurt feelings.

 

Aumakua is the Higher self, or deep cosmic intelligence we all have hiding within. it also refers to gods/godesses, and certain nature spirits or spirits of place.

 

 

Ho'oponopono: Opono means to 'make right' and oponopono then means to 'make really really right'

 

So Uhane sits down and creates a space for dialogue with the various selves that are alive within the Unihipili.

 

One calls in any person one has charge with. One may apologise and ask forgiveness for any known or unknown actions.

One also offers forgiveness to them for any of their actions. {forgiveness is an act of self love and has nothing to do with whether they are worthy of it or not - once forgiven, your mind is free of them}

Any thing that helps you forgive you, them or the situation is fair game.

 

Forgiving yourself for creating the situation is good as well. Im sorry and I love you.

 

If they are troublesome, one may call on their Aumakua, which is defiantly sorry for past actions and will apologise regardless of whether their Uhane wishes to or not, and may give you great insight into what is going on for them leading to compassion, and after that one may cut aka ties with them and release them from ones mind.

 

Then there is external actions. Once your bodymind is clear you may need to make physical amends with the person.

The tv series 'My Name is Earl' springs to mind as a great example of this in action... lol.

 

 

 

Ho'oponopono is notorious for 'affecting' the person simultaneously in a positive direction, as their Unihipili which is very sensitive to subtle energies, feels the pressure release caused by your changed perception of them...

 

 

Be well everyone.

[liminal_luke]

Seth...

 

Your understanding of this process appeals to me. Could you share a little more about the nuts and bolts of how exactly it's done? I'm looking for something I could use to bring peace to my relationship. My partner has ptsd and possibly other mental difficulties. It's very hard to live with someone whose constantly depressed, anxious, thinks the police are following him around and spying on him, etc. Maybe I should just leave, and I might but I'm really willing to try anything short of that first because I really love/care for him.

 

Of course there are many possible therapies and I've suggested many of them--psychotherapy, psychiatric intervention, TRE, zaphen, exercise, getting good sleep and nutrtition, etc. The difficulty is that he isn't much motivated to do any of this. So I end up either being willing to stand by him while he does not much to improve his situation, or end up in a power struggle with him about taking care of himself. Neither option, obviously, is very appealing or feels right.

 

Perhaps this practice can help me see a new way through this and help us both. What do you think? Do I just think about him and the situation and repeat "I'm sorry, forgive me, I love you?" Thanks.

[Xienkula1]

Of course this is a difficult topic! I'm of the firm conviction that truth can be spoken shamelessly, even in the face of ridicule - which is often the first line of defense for people who would rather not hear it or that you tell. Of course, I could have left this thread alone - and I'm starting to think it would have been a better idea:-) but I find it hard to sit here reading about yet another very questionable New Age practice and not bring up what I see as being questionable about it.

 

This 'win-lose' idea is an interesting one Xienkula (although I have this hunch it's more about having something you thought helpful questioned and I'm not questioning you). I don't understand much of what you wrote about it above but certainly the 'abuser' 'loses' a 'victim' if the latter refuses to stand for it. Not more than that.

Absolutely!!! yes question everything and see how it resonates for you this is very welcomed, nor do I mind being questioned. It just spontaneously erupted maybe we should all do '', however it was hardly a tyranny of shoulds lol it was intended with humour. Definitely things like ho'oponopono or even meditation should not replace therapy, though the article is misleading in that it suggests just by loving yourself through ho'oponopono you can just free yourself or anyone of any predicament, and of course this is at best idealistic. However as Daskalos said about salt, we can talk about the taste of salt to someone who has never tasted all you want, but until they taste it for themselves, they will not know what is salt. If you test taste the ho'oponopono you might find something out for yourself, you have nothing to loose, and nothing stops you from questioning at the same time and observing everything.

[Birch]

Absolutely!!! yes question everything and see how it resonates for you this is very welcomed, nor do I mind being questioned. It just spontaneously erupted maybe we should all do '', however it was hardly a tyranny of shoulds lol it was intended with humour. Definitely things like ho'oponopono or even meditation should not replace therapy, though the article is misleading in that it suggests just by loving yourself through ho'oponopono you can just free yourself or anyone of any predicament, and of course this is at best idealistic. However as Daskalos said about salt, we can talk about the taste of salt to someone who has never tasted all you want, but until they taste it for themselves, they will not know what is salt. If you test taste the ho'oponopono you might find something out for yourself, you have nothing to loose, and nothing stops you from questioning at the same time and observing everything.

Ah, you don't think I have tried it:-)?

I've been 'living in here' quite some time. Perhaps I am possessed? Haha:-)

I think Seth's explanation was the better 'solo-practice' version of it.

[Xienkula1]

Ah, you don't think I have tried it:-)?

I've been 'living in here' quite some time. Perhaps I am possessed? Haha:-)

I think Seth's explanation was the better 'solo-practice' version of it.

When you say tried it, would you feel okay sharing what aspect you tried? There are many different aspects to this practice.

Living in here it feels as though you are in a state of pain Seth's description was good since the article gives the impression saying I am sorry is all there is to it, and that is not the case, there is much more.

 

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gK2c0ewpYns

 

I think we need to know that the original Ho'oponopono is not a questionable new age practice, it is a Hawaiian Tradition.

[Birch]

No, I prefer not sharing more than I already did about my experience with this practice in this thread (likely on the previous page by now).

 

Certainly I have had to deal with a lot of pain in my life. I'm not saying that with any further qualifications. I did think the way I said 'I've been in living here' sounded a bit strange after I wrote it:-) That's why I added the 'possessed' part. As a joke (and I was reading about being possessed by Kuan Yin yesterday, that's quite a practice too. Seth has a great post about Pan somewhere:-)) But I have felt that way before. Wanting to but not being able to leave this body. It's a pretty weird and horrible experience. As usual 'meditation brought it up':-)

[Seth Ananda]

Sure Liminal Luke, its very easy.

 

Sit down, relax, and imagine a stage, or a garden or some clear space where you can invite the various people who inhabit your mind, one by one, and forgive them, and ask for their forgiveness. Dialogue, express or say anything that feels like it needs to come out.

 

Keep at it till the forgiveness feels real and genuine, then bless them with love and move on to the next person. Bit by bit you will reclaim your self from the worlds projections and a great freedom will begin to arise...

[Xienkula1]

Sure Liminal Luke, its very easy.

 

Sit down, relax, and imagine a stage, or a garden or some clear space where you can invite the various people who inhabit your mind, one by one, and forgive them, and ask for their forgiveness. Dialogue, express or say anything that feels like it needs to come out.

 

Keep at it till the forgiveness feels real and genuine, then bless them with love and move on to the next person. Bit by bit you will reclaim your self from the worlds projections and a great freedom will begin to arise...

Breathing with it and charging up the lower dan tian is also important, but with the love that you would give your child.

[Cookie Monster]

.

Edited May 5, 2021 by Ocean Form

[Xienkula1]

No, I prefer not sharing more than I already did about my experience with this practice in this thread (likely on the previous page by now).

 

Certainly I have had to deal with a lot of pain in my life. I'm not saying that with any further qualifications. I did think the way I said 'I've been in living here' sounded a bit strange after I wrote it:-) That's why I added the 'possessed' part. As a joke (and I was reading about being possessed by Kuan Yin yesterday, that's quite a practice too. Seth has a great post about Pan somewhere:-)) But I have felt that way before. Wanting to but not being able to leave this body. It's a pretty weird and horrible experience. As usual 'meditation brought it up':-)

What do you mean by not being able to leave the body but wanting to? I think I know what you mean, but I would appreciate clarity from you.

[Seth Ananda]

I used to think that what we call Huna these days, was much more 'new age' than traditional, but I have changed my mind.

 

I continue to find things from traditional 'Kahuna' teachers that totally support much of Longs and others Huna teachings, particularly Ho'oponopono, Ha breathing, and theory about the 3 selves...

 

Outside of that, I don't really care, because new age or traditional, Huna as It currently presents itself, is a supremely effective system of self healing and transformation.

 

I dont think I have seen anything like it, in terms of pure simplicity and effectiveness. It is just so 'functional'...

 

I am devoting a large chunk of the next few years to Huna practice and study.

[Mokona]

Does anyone simply find correlation between different practices? I've seen similar forgiveness practices in esoteric Catholism. Although they normally involve Saints or Jesus Christ somewhere in the middle of the process.

 

Meditation and other modulaties of healing cause these issues to arise, even normal Chi kung becuase it shakes up the internal problems and they surface until dealt with. Take your pick of any healing system, just gotta find the one best for you.

 

Also, to clarify - Not attacking the Hippo practice at all, only certain aspects pertaining to the guy putting out there, as the links show - a shady dude. Probably better to get the practice from the source in Hawaii, or now that Seth is studying it. To bombard him with PMs until he gets sick of it. J/k.

 

Also, why not start a thread in the Healing Circle on this, where experiences of actual healing and as I read above "nuts and bolts" of how it is done can be shared freely? That's what the internet is for, after all.

 

Seth,

 

I read your reply. Do you sometimes find that these smaller peices of the overall "you" hold onto or block positive experience from the conciousness or hold onto gunky energy?

 

I've had one buddy describe it as seeing tiny people inside of other people, and when he works on them they shift to a better state, albiet not always completely. I've experienced a great deal of released positive emotion from allowing him to work on the smaller "me's" back in 2006.

[Birch]

Check this out too http://www.amazon.com/Internal-Family-Systems-Therapy-Guilford/dp/1572302720/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1360083810&sr=1-1&keywords=internal+family+systems+therapy+by+richard+schwartz

 

Very close to what Seth is referring to.

I tried the Seth version last night. After that I had a dream in which (literally) people were arriving in a boat and by car to come see me. I 'knew' it was because I was doing this stuff. So I did another session this morning. But I found I felt exhausted and had to sleep after it.

So I wouldn't pick a day on which you don't have time to rest after.

[Birch]

What do you mean by not being able to leave the body but wanting to? I think I know what you mean, but I would appreciate clarity from you.

That's pretty much it. I guess you might say it was a 'realization' that I'm actually incarnated here, in this here body and there's no getting away from the fact. It doesn't feel (as) horrible today:-)

[Birch]

Thanks for putting in the energy to bring nuance to this

There are so many assumed values in new age... So easy to get the automatic "you're being negative/projecting/acting from your ego".

 

What bothers me about a lot of this stuff is the impersonality of the advice people freely give out.

As if what everyone needs in any situation is to love everything unconditionally, be in the now, be more compassionate, avoid making judgements(!) etc..

 

(talking in general here not saying ho'oponopono is in itself new age)

Thanks for your comments. I think there is a lot of that stuff you're talking about. People can really be harmed by it because it doesn't take them into account as individuals. Leaving aside the distasteful idea that other people are profiting from people's desire to heal etc. I could get into the 'therapy industry' on this as well.

 

I've been looking at what these things like 'unconditional love' mean by definition, and what they mean to me by experience. The gap between those is often astounding. I reckon that's also a good exercise to do with oneself.