$1.5million Fajin Challenge

[dawei]

Well, you are completely wrong! If you are intelligent and observant and analyze it for the same details and with the same method I already suggested for the Mike Phillips vid, you will come in both vids to the same conclusion as I did!

 

At least if you analyze his second demo video about short & cold power!

 

I hear your honesty... and appreciate what your providing to this topic which I question. And I am glad you send the short power footage as it proves my point:

1. In the short footage, he snaps. He does not attempt any follow-through

2. In the long: He pre-disposes the test subject with how his head will snap back; he sets him up emotionally... and then when he wants to effect the long power, he recoils back and then follows through the test subjects body.

 

Sorry... No objective comparison can be made of that.

 

That does not does mean I doubt he has something behind it. He simply has invalidated himself from a comparison between his own short and long.

 

---

 

I once asked my Qigong master to show me an example of external Qi. I was studying Medical QIgong under him and he often talked of 'martial qi' in a medical qigong use... as he had martial full contact fighting in asia, special ops, and medical Qigong training from Japan and China. He has been practicing medical Qigong for over 50 years.

 

He demonstrated three energies; Jing, Qi, Shen with a 'one-inch push'.

 

Jing: I felt it like a good physical push

Qi: I came off my feet as I fell backwards stumbling

Shen: The breath was knocked out of me like someone punched me in the solar plexus

 

So someone may want to see someone's ass knocked to the ground but if you can't even breath, that is 'game-over'.

 

All there were delivered with the same exact force, distance, and pressure. No recoil and follow through needed.

Edited February 25, 2013 by dawei

[chenplayer]

Hello to everyone! Just wanted to chim in here for a bit, it nice to see Ya Mu here also been a long time since I have seen your posts. how have you been? Anyway to the topic at hand I just wanted to chime in some of my experience with fa Jin. But before I go into that I will give a quick background of my martial experience. I am a first degree black belt in Kyokushin karate, have a blue belt under Renzo Gracie in Brazilian jujitsu and have boxed for quite some time. I also spent two years living and training in Japan training in Kyokushin. Before I started my Chen practice I have only ran into two people that I can safely say did something close to fa Jin. One was William C.C.Chen who from and inch from my chest knocked me on the ground with a small tap. I was skeptical when he was demonstrating so he chose me as the next partner lol. The second time was From George Xu in a seminar I attended at the NYC Open center. It wasn't really fa jin but he placed his arm out and asked if any one can stop him from lifting it. It was bent from the elbow so his forearm was parallel to the floor. I got into my front leaning stance and gripped as hard as I could. Also on a side note I am 6'1 and at that timed weighed 250lbs. He lifted me completely relaxed. I did not fly away or bounce around or anything but he was soft and I felt no tension from him. It was pretty cool. I guess the point of both of these accounts is that they never told me what I was going to feel and let, as in Master Xu's case, get ready in a solid stance to make sure nothing would be left for doubt. I was humbled and honored at both these encounters. I will not speak about what Gary does because I have not meet or had a chance to feel what he does. So I will make no assumptions or comments on the video. Hope that was helpful in some way.

 

I wish you all a wonderful and beautiful day.

Peace and blessings!

[Wells]

I hear your honesty...

Thank you...

[dawei]

Thank you...

 

I should thank you as you have shared a wealth of understanding on the topic which I think is important.

 

---

 

Generally and not response post:

 

My QIgong master does 1 hand push hands. The second hand is free to direct Qi to disable the other opponent.

 

Has anyone tried this?

[Ya Mu]

This is not really directed at Ya Mu but his comments raise my post.

 

So what is it we are trying prove here?

 

Is it that Fa Jin exists or not? Or who has it and who does not?

 

It sounds more like a witch hunt on some level... And I don't mean to make this so negative but what do we really gain in the end of all of this?

 

And I am not suggesting that the motivation is not reasonable on some level from those who want to do this... but I just shake my head reading through these pages on what is it anyone hopes to really find out by taking videos of others.

 

Added: I see Gary's video. That should be disregarded as showing anything useful.

Since you quoted me and then said this, I'll have to assume you didn't read through the thread?

I can sum it up as best I know for you.

Stig has a facebook group which is devoted to the topic of fa jin. They have decided to find out if it is a repeatable phenomena or technique or are all the folks posting videos utilizing mechanical push and attempting to make it mysterious in order to be ?. They have a reward posted for anyone who can demonstrate this.

 

My view, as I have stated in several posts here, is that this will not prove anything, that it is a fact that qi is dynamic, so amplitude, etc can and most probably will be variable when utilized over and over in a "test". However, now they are speaking of mechanical vibration and not qi so my interest is not a piqued as before. I am neither for nor against the test but do think he has good intentions and it is not a "witch hunt".

 

When I learned that they are speaking of on body versus off body I'll admit my interest has waned as I have experienced this off body. I attempted to make a point about energetics and vibration in that a pure energy technique would not need physical contact whereas a physical contact technique could be a physical vibration which could induce that in another. This is different than an off-body pure energy method as I am sure you know.

 

I have no dog in this hunt. I did post one time on the facebook group but quickly learned that most there are fixed in their views of energetics and do not think qi projection is real.

Just making some observations about energetics which is of course what I am interested in.

What I experienced as fa jin was definitely energetics and also off body so no mechanical vibration was involved

 

 

[dawei]

Since you quoted me and then said this, I'll have to assume you didn't read through the thread?

 

My view, as I have stated in several posts here, is that this will not prove anything, that it is a fact that qi is dynamic, so amplitude, etc can and most probably will be variable when utilized over and over in a "test". However, now they are speaking of mechanical vibration and not qi so my interest is not a piqued as before. I am neither for nor against the test but do think he has good intentions and it is not a "witch hunt".

 

When I learned that they are speaking of on body versus off body I'll admit my interest has waned as I have experienced this off body. I attempted to make a point about energetics and vibration in that a pure energy technique would not need physical contact whereas a physical contact technique could be a physical vibration which could induce that in another. This is different than an off-body pure energy method as I am sure you know.

 

I have no dog in this hunt. I did post one time on the facebook group but quickly learned that most there are fixed in their views of energetics and do not think qi projection is real.

Just making some observations about energetics which is of course what I am interested in.

What I experienced as fa jin was definitely energetics and also off body so no mechanical vibration was involved

 

I tried not to drag you into my quote but apologize as it was unavoidable.

 

I respect your work and wish I could learn from you. I want to support what Stig is doing but sometimes a counter-post comes. I questioned the thread as I am also not sure what is proved.

 

My gut feeling, and I don't want to offend anyone... is similar to seeking the elixir of life; in this case, the elixir of Fa Jin.

 

I am not sure what we are trying to prove here.

[Guest munky]

-

Edited October 9, 2014 by munky

[Stigweard]

This is not really directed at Ya Mu but his comments raise my post.

 

So what is it we are trying prove here?

 

Is it that Fa Jin exists or not? Or who has it and who does not?

 

It sounds more like a witch hunt on some level... And I don't mean to make this so negative but what do we really gain in the end of all of this?

 

And I am not suggesting that the motivation is not reasonable on some level from those who want to do this... but I just shake my head reading through these pages on what is it anyone hopes to really find out by taking videos of others.

 

Added: I see Gary's video. That should be disregarded as showing anything useful.

 

Hiya Dawei,

 

Cheers for adding your perspective.

 

I would like to reestablish something that my article listed in the OP was conveying. People are too willing to subscribe to the notion of internal martial arts like Taijiquan having some sort of "magic powers".

 

We hear folks saying things like "they can transfer [energy] through the air without contact" and KO someone, or that they can transfer "highly condensed Jin/jing" through to an opponent with only a touch to deliver super-powered hits.

 

Yet there exists not a single scrap of credible evidence to substantiate such claims.

 

Nothing ... nowhere (please ... prove me wrong).

 

Whereas, in my training and experience, Jin is merely the art of taking unrefined strength, Li, and refining it into more efficient and effective means. I am deliberately presenting a framework of Jin that is both practical and pragmatic and it is a framework that has long been established within the internal martial arts.

 

Please refer to: http://bit.ly/UFxSwU

 

Nice and simple with pragmatic approaches and application. Whereas "believers" in this "subtle fajin" tend to advocate ignoring all of these fundamental "Jin" for the faith-belief that one day they can produce this "super power".

 

They go further of course ... they will say that unless you can do their "subtle fajin" then you aren't really doing Taijiquan, that your Taijiquan is "empty" or inferior and only they have "the real deal".

 

But then you ask them to actually provide some sort of credible evidence for their claims ... and it is usually about then they they start frothing at the mouth and lash out with ad homien attacks and denigrations (I believe the current case in point verifies that rather clearly).

 

Again, the fundamental and initiating question behind all of this is:

 

"Why is there not a single scrap of credible evidence that this Subtle Jin works for real (i.e. in real combat or at the very least in a controlled scientific environment)?"

 

Please note how, even after 7 pages of virulence and obtuseness, this question still remains unanswered.

 

Again I will emphasize, the whole point is to get some proper testing done to verify the reality and efficacy of the abilities that are being claimed. If they prove to be real ... awesome!!! Then we can focus on further testing to hone practice methods. If only some prove to be real ... awesome !!! We can weed out the fakes and frauds and focus in on the practical methods. If none of them prove to be real ... awesome !!! We can then go back to basics and work on ways of reworking and rethinking the ancient teachings held in the Taiji classics.

 

No witch hunt my friend ... just an earnest desire for honesty, accountability, and progression in the arts.

 

[Ya Mu]

... but when they combined yin and yang energy in level 4 in the dan tien through the school's methods (depicted as very forceful and practitioners have chance of dying), the energy could effect things at a distance.

Friend posted about doing this sort of thing; said it made him feel ill. I wrote of one experience in my book where I was attempting to knock over a can at some distance. I could make the can shake and rattle but never could knock it off of where it was sitting. This was a very foolish act on my part ...using qi for ... nothing. I have never tried this since and don't agree with those who say "why not". The "why not" for me is that this is not wu wei unless there were a specific need in the moment of the moment. I don't believe in using qi for these purposes.

[Stigweard]

Telling fairy tales again?

 

The first teacher Ray praises on his website is still Mike Phillips!

Obviously he hasn't updated his website since he doesn't support Mike anymore, right?

 

http://www.texastaichi.net/rayTeachers.aspx

 

Hahhah ... Ray still has that up on his site ... that is actually rather funny.

 

If you had seen the "fall out" between them you would realize how damn funny that is... but you would have to have a facebook account to see the rather public "to do" they had...

 

Edited February 25, 2013 by Stigweard

[voidisyinyang]

It isn't just energy if contact HAS to be made. It may be physical induced vibration if contact has to be made.

 

All this would be much more interesting if the rules called for off-body.

 

The master who did fa jin to me could do it off body. We project qi off body. The people I have accidentally knocked over in the past were several feet away; we see people move around with the qi projection as in it physically moves them. Why can't the martial guys do it off body? The only possible conclusion is that they are talking about a physical happening instead of a pure energy happening. A pure energy event does not require physical contact. And there are at least two people who post on here who have seen this.

Not to take anything away from those MA who can move just a bit and send someone flying. That alone takes a great deal of gongfu.

 

edit

Edited February 25, 2013 by pythagoreanfulllotus

[Stigweard]

Since you quoted me and then said this, I'll have to assume you didn't read through the thread?

I can sum it up as best I know for you.

Stig has a facebook group which is devoted to the topic of fa jin. They have decided to find out if it is a repeatable phenomena or technique or are all the folks posting videos utilizing mechanical push and attempting to make it mysterious in order to be ?. They have a reward posted for anyone who can demonstrate this.

 

My view, as I have stated in several posts here, is that this will not prove anything, that it is a fact that qi is dynamic, so amplitude, etc can and most probably will be variable when utilized over and over in a "test". However, now they are speaking of mechanical vibration and not qi so my interest is not a piqued as before. I am neither for nor against the test but do think he has good intentions and it is not a "witch hunt".

 

When I learned that they are speaking of on body versus off body I'll admit my interest has waned as I have experienced this off body. I attempted to make a point about energetics and vibration in that a pure energy technique would not need physical contact whereas a physical contact technique could be a physical vibration which could induce that in another. This is different than an off-body pure energy method as I am sure you know.

 

I have no dog in this hunt. I did post one time on the facebook group but quickly learned that most there are fixed in their views of energetics and do not think qi projection is real.

Just making some observations about energetics which is of course what I am interested in.

What I experienced as fa jin was definitely energetics and also off body so no mechanical vibration was involved

 

Heya Ya Mu,

 

I appreciate your thoughts here ...

 

I do think though that even you have missed the main purpose and intent of the FB group and my motivation. If I can ask for your consideration here I will try and explain...

 

Like it or not, there are frauds and charlatans infesting the internal martial arts world and they are dominating the airwaves with what is no less than unsubstantiated delusions and scams. As such arts like Taijiquan have stagnated and fallen behind the other martial arts in the world ... no longer can Taijiquan be heralded as the "supreme ultimate fist".

 

Self-styled "masters" are making any damn claim they want to because it is part of the "culture" that they have immunity from verifying such claims. Thus we have literally dozens upon dozens of "methods" being bandied about as the "real deal" ... the collective "message" being broadcast to the world is that "we" are bunch of clowns, charlatans, and whackjobs.

 

From the very outset all I have done is ask a very simple and straightforward question:

 

"Where is the proof? Where is the credible evidence that the method you are prescribing is real and reliable?"

 

You would think that there would be an easy answer to this question ... but no, all I have ever received, instead of straight answers, was the carry on as exampled in this thread. Fajin "believers", in place of reasonable discussion and transparency, seem to inevitably resort to bully-boy responses and personal attacks.

 

But after all the bluster, the original question remains unanswered.

 

And so we gave that question a home on Facebook, and we have invited numerous "masters" to come in and answer that question. Invariably they will come in and sprout their superiority, they will issue their "come and feel it for yourself" challenges not really understanding that anecdotal evidence is not credible proof of anything, and they will carry on with every denigration possible. They seem to think that if they can verbosely insult you into submission that that is some sort of proof of their superiority.

 

...but still the question remains unanswered.

 

We designed the testing protocol as a way of giving these "masters" an opportunity to prove their "fajin" in a way that would satisfy the requirement of delivering "credible proof". In fact we styled the test exactly on what Michael Phillips declared was the observable requirements of "real fajin", he even declared publicly that what we had designed was perfectly in tune with his "fajin". But when it came to him actually participating in the test all we got was more of his bluster and insults and another round of exit clauses.

 

Which is then why we decided to give the project some teeth ... The $1.5million Fajin Challenge

 

You would think that these "masters", if they truly believed they were "the real deal", would fall over themselves to sign up ... I mean how easy ... all they have to do is perform their special fajin in a controlled scientific environment and they scoop up $1.5million.

 

How many of these "masters" have even applied?

 

Zero, zip, zilch, nada, none ...

 

Now I want to go back to the original intent for a moment ... it was and still is a desire to see the art progress and evolve in real and pragmatic ways. If one of these masters have "the real deal" than great!! Let's see some credible evidence of that. For the benefit of the whole world of the Internal Martial Arts ... lets get some hard facts and figures of the efficacy of your technique, let's get your "method" out there because you will be the ONLY one in the world that has backed your claims up with credible, verifiable proof.

 

Please note that initially I don't give a fig what method is being used nor the "substance" that creates the effect (i.e. Qi, Jin, vibration, pulse wave etc. etc.). All I care about is, "Does it work for real? Yes or No?" If no then we move on ... but if yes than we can start investigating the hows and whys of the particular method, develop some baseline data help progress the art in ways that benefits everyone.

 

That my friend is truly where I am coming from with all of this

[flowing hands]

I've got to agree with you Stigweard, both Philips and Gary are not using fa jin in these videos. They really are poor examples.

Real fa jin does not use any of the body's momentum or force. The issuer of the fa will be completely still. To demonstrate real fa jin take away the human subject and put a heavy object to be moved. I have seen so many so called masters demonstrate their fa jin to weak and receptive students, that its become a joke and ruining what is a high practice of trad. Chinese martial arts.

[Ya Mu]

Heya Ya Mu,

 

I appreciate your thoughts here ...

 

I do think though that even you have missed the main purpose and intent of the FB group and my motivation. If I can ask for your consideration here I will try and explain...

 

Like it or not, there are frauds and charlatans infesting the internal martial arts world and they are dominating the airwaves with what is no less than unsubstantiated delusions and scams. As such arts like Taijiquan have stagnated and fallen behind the other martial arts in the world ... no longer can Taijiquan be heralded as the "supreme ultimate fist".

 

Self-styled "masters" are making any damn claim they want to because it is part of the "culture" that they have immunity from verifying such claims. Thus we have literally dozens upon dozens of "methods" being bandied about as the "real deal" ... the collective "message" being broadcast to the world is that "we" are bunch of clowns, charlatans, and whackjobs.

 

From the very outset all I have done is ask a very simple and straightforward question:

 

"Where is the proof? Where is the credible evidence that the method you are prescribing is real and reliable?"

 

You would think that there would be an easy answer to this question ... but no, all I have ever received, instead of straight answers, was the carry on as exampled in this thread. Fajin "believers", in place of reasonable discussion and transparency, seem to inevitably resort to bully-boy responses and personal attacks.

 

But after all the bluster, the original question remains unanswered.

 

And so we gave that question a home on Facebook, and we have invited numerous "masters" to come in and answer that question. Invariably they will come in and sprout their superiority, they will issue their "come and feel it for yourself" challenges not really understanding that anecdotal evidence is not credible proof of anything, and they will carry on with every denigration possible. They seem to think that if they can verbosely insult you into submission that that is some sort of proof of their superiority.

 

...but still the question remains unanswered.

 

We designed the testing protocol as a way of giving these "masters" an opportunity to prove their "fajin" in a way that would satisfy the requirement of delivering "credible proof". In fact we styled the test exactly on what Michael Phillips declared was the observable requirements of "real fajin", he even declared publicly that what we had designed was perfectly in tune with his "fajin". But when it came to him actually participating in the test all we got was more of his bluster and insults and another round of exit clauses.

 

Which is then why we decided to give the project some teeth ... The $1.5million Fajin Challenge

 

You would think that these "masters", if they truly believed they were "the real deal", would fall over themselves to sign up ... I mean how easy ... all they have to do is perform their special fajin in a controlled scientific environment and they scoop up $1.5million.

 

How many of these "masters" have even applied?

 

Zero, zip, zilch, nada, none ...

 

Now I want to go back to the original intent for a moment ... it was and still is a desire to see the art progress and evolve in real and pragmatic ways. If one of these masters have "the real deal" than great!! Let's see some credible evidence of that. For the benefit of the whole world of the Internal Martial Arts ... lets get some hard facts and figures of the efficacy of your technique, let's get your "method" out there because you will be the ONLY one in the world that has backed your claims up with credible, verifiable proof.

 

Please note that initially I don't give a fig what method is being used nor the "substance" that creates the effect (i.e. Qi, Jin, vibration, pulse wave etc. etc.). All I care about is, "Does it work for real? Yes or No?" If no then we move on ... but if yes than we can start investigating the hows and whys of the particular method, develop some baseline data help progress the art in ways that benefits everyone.

 

That my friend is truly where I am coming from with all of this

Hey Stig,

Actually I agree with you much more than I think you realize. It is the same in the qigong world as in the MA world - full of nonsense, bullshit, and not the real thing. Yes, in both fields it is buyer beware. Anyone seeking study in either field should look to the basics of training, then build on that foundation. Perhaps your endeavor will make a difference. I guess I am a bit skeptic as to it making a difference due to all I have seen in the qigong healing field.

Except for the one master, all the MA I have seen, both in person and on video, have someone pushing physically. It may only be a small movement but the movement is there. My interest in this is from the energetics viewpoint. Which is why I am more interested in off body. It has been proven to me that Fa Jin most definitely can be done off body. But I certainly agree that you will have to look long and hard to find it. Drew made a most excellent point in one of his posts which I agree with, that you will not see the higher level qi masters attempting this.

[Jeff]

Hi all,

 

I had another few rounds of brief emails with Gary last night. It has been somewhat challenging to get direct responses to my questions. But, this is where things currently stand...

 

-Gary is willing to do a test.

-He needs direct contact as shown in the video for the blow (which leaves the push concept very open).

-He states that he can transmit energy without direct contact and that is a normal part of his healing sessions.

-After repeated direct followup questions, he has said that I should be able to feel an energy transfer by just touching him.

-His email demeanor is very different than most spiritual types that I have had discussions with.

 

Given what I know so far (with the push-like contact), I think it is unlikely that i would be able to form an experiment with Gary that would meet Stigweards criteria. Also, since I am not a martial arts guy, i wonder/doubt if I would be able to tell if it was just a very fast finger movement. So, I am open to suggestions on the test concept. Should I take the test myself, or...

 

- just touch Gary and see if I can feel a blow or any energy transfer?

- instead talk my martial arts experienced friend into taking the test and see if he notices anything?

- pay Gary's fee for a session and get a feel for the energy transfer level (with no contact) and compare it to other healers that I know?

- pass and we look for someone else with martial arts experience in the Chicago area to take the test?

 

Best, Jeff

 

(edit - weird format problem)

Edited February 25, 2013 by Jeff

[ralis]

I've got to agree with you Stigweard, both Philips and Gary are not using fa jin in these videos. They really are poor examples.

Real fa jin does not use any of the body's momentum or force. The issuer of the fa will be completely still. To demonstrate real fa jin take away the human subject and put a heavy object to be moved. I have seen so many so called masters demonstrate their fa jin to weak and receptive students, that its become a joke and ruining what is a high practice of trad. Chinese martial arts.

 

 

If anyone has seen the Kunlun video of Max Christensen, that is a great example of compliant weak minded fools rolling around as if being controlled by Max's empty force. Max admitted that it only worked on his students.

[dawei]

I am open to suggestions on the test concept. Should I take the test myself, or...

 

- just touch Gary and see if I can feel a blow or any energy transfer?

- instead talk my martial arts experienced friend into taking the test and see if he notices anything?

- pay Gary's fee for a session and get a feel for the energy transfer level (with no contact) and compare it to other healers that I know?

- pass and we look for someone else with martial arts experience in the Chicago area to take the test?

 

Hi Jeff,

 

Seeing your this close to an agreement to a meeting, I would have it. A second person would be useful but I don't think it has to be a MA person. They may come at it with some internal resistance.

 

I would tend to see if he can do as I shared with my past experience of my Qigong master: Ask him to vary what he is doing without varying the movement, distance, contact, follow-through, recoil, etc.

 

Purely physical push vs one with Jin.

 

You could also see if you feel his energy at rest (touching his arm). Again, him doing nothing vs sending it.

 

I think different people produce this issue differently. Someone may be able to knock one over but another is simply internally powerless. I don't see any difference if the effect occurs.

 

You might also see if he is willing to direct the energy somewhere in your body. Then you tell him where you felt that force go to.

 

Maybe this strays too far from what the original experience wants but this is how I would do it given someone is willing and I would want to at least test something besides if they simply knock me over.

[templetao]

As i read this thread and im realizing that very few understand the 108 jing expressions of taichi and what they are really like.

 

So ill explain a little bit. When you do your taichi and meditative exercises and in time you will start to generate waves of internal power.

 

These waves will always transmute and change in time as long as you keep practicing.

 

So ill go into one expression listening jing. So what is this really like? This is where your waves of internal power give you an understanding of the state of your opponent's energy and status by responding in different harmonics and wave formations.

 

This is a power that will develop in time. Meaning that your waves of inner power will have to continue to grow and transmute over time. So this is one level of attainment.

 

Your waves will grow over time. So learning taichi will teach you how to master and develop this power over time.

 

To those who know what im talking about - your left right vibration is just one out of many jing expressions. To get your internal power developed enough to where you can express all of the 108 jing expressions is a high development. Even distance power is a high development Lin Kong Jing is a hard attainment to get your internal power has to be very refined and mature. No one has this who is under 10 yrs of development. For remember the jing expressions come as your internal power develops.

 

Taichi is the vessel you use to master your internal power and to become a master of it.

 

Very very few really understand what a taichi body means and how valuable it is.

Edited February 25, 2013 by templetao

[Jeff]

Hi Templetao,

 

Do you see this "internal power" that is transmitted at a distance as different than what is done in energy/distance healing work?

 

Thanks, Jeff

[templetao]

Yes very different. Ling Kong Jing is a very specific thing.

 

Doing healing with something like reiki or some type of burning palm from a distance is not lin kong jing. Its a different type of energy completely.

 

Distance power means that you can now transmitted your waves of inner power over a distance. It doesnt just mean distance chi transmission. What you see people doing on youtube is something else it is not the distance power of lin kong jing.

 

Lin Kong Jing is the ability to transmit your inner power at a distance.

 

if anyone was to ever film real lin kong jing it would look like this the person receiving the distance strike would fall down like they were getting punched in the face. This is what makes it distance power. That is a very very hard attainment to get. Like at least 10yrs of hard work with the correct training.

 

Even the most highly developed ima masters can only project their jing a little over 10inches.

Edited February 25, 2013 by templetao

[templetao]

Let me make this point clear.

 

Out of the 108 jing expressions some of them are considered master level. Lin Kong Jing is one of them.

 

To have Lin Kong Jing means that your waves of internal power have been refined and developed enough that they can now leave your body.

 

It is hard enough to get to the point to where you feel your own inner power growing in your body even harder to get an opponent to feel it much harder to do it at a distance.

 

So if anyone says they have lin kong jing then tell them they should be on the cover of taichi magazine. Because that means that if your doing push hands with someone like that then they are able to project their jing past you. meaning that they can most likly fa jing you thru the wall and into the next room while doing pushing hands.

 

the people who can do that are very very few. Not many taichi masters trained in the right way reach that level of attainment. it takes hard work. To have lin kong jing means that your at the top of the ima world if you have the real attainment of lin kong jing and not what most people think it is.

[templetao]

Just to drive the point home in the magus of java there is a taichi master who cracks a rock in 2 from a distance. That is distance power lin kong jing.

[Vanir Thunder Dojo Tan]

Lin Kong Jing, 108 types, tai chi, wu ji, gotta pee, climb a tree. works for me!

[Wells]

Just to drive the point home in the magus of java there is a taichi master who cracks a rock in 2 from a distance. That is distance power lin kong jing.

 

Complete BS...unless Stig-test approved!!!

Edited February 25, 2013 by Dorian Black

[Owledge]

Thus we have literally dozens upon dozens of "methods" being bandied about as the "real deal" ... the collective "message" being broadcast to the world is that "we" are bunch of clowns, charlatans, and whackjobs.

Regarding media attention I suspect that the corrupt corporate media has made it part of their agenda to discredit the arts by selectively present only those who fail at what they do.