There is no "consciousness"?

[FmAm]

idk. my personal belief is that anything that can be perceived exists on some level. Can you perceive consciousness?

I agree. It doesn't matter whether this world exists absolutely or relatively. Speculations on Oneness, on Consciousness or on the freedom of the will are totally irrelevant. I can see and feel how my interaction with this world has an impact on everything. I am a link in an indivisible chain of interaction. What matters is how I "recycle" everything I see and feel. If I'm wise enough it's possible for me to transform bad input into good output (practical buddhist aspect on oneness). (I hope everyone remembers this while reading my poor speculations.)

Edited March 25, 2013 by FmAm

[Boy]

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Edited March 30, 2013 by Boy

[FmAm]

An even wiser man would see that the very act of calling something good or bad is the actual problem. This is because... Watch the sinker closely!

 

An old and famous Zen proverb goes like this (quote from the internet):

 

Before a person studies Zen, mountains are mountains and waters are waters;

after a first glimpse into the truth of Zen, mountains are no longer mountains and waters are not waters;

after enlightenment mountains are once again mountains and waters once again waters.

 

After becoming aware of the reality, it's possible for a wise man to act in the world seeing things as they are. A wise man can recycle anger into peace.

Edited March 25, 2013 by FmAm

[Boy]

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Edited March 30, 2013 by Boy

[FmAm]

It sure leaves you hanging, doesn't it?

This is the thing I've tried to disclose: confusion is in the second part of that Zen proverb. Confusion is in the metaphysics, it's in the imaginary hierarchy of the existence. Confusion is in the metaphysical "why - because". There is no confusion in this world perceived as such.

 

(It's a bit difficult for me to express my thoughts thoroughly because English isn't my native language. But of course language is just a part of the problem. The real problem is that there is no problem and I'm still writing about the problem.)

Edited March 25, 2013 by FmAm

[Boy]

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Edited March 30, 2013 by Boy

[Cat Pillar]

unless one remains left hanging alone in the wind to get continuously spun about or crashed into the ground in an unresolved state with no answer/anchor, along with powering up 'thoughts' that there is none.

 

Hey now...quit talkin' about me behind my back!

 

In all "seriousness" though...that's a really accurate description of how I feel.

[Tom Lin]

The way i perceive the notion of consciousness is that, it is merely understanding that you are a higher being rather then the ego lie that we have been sold to by society. And the only way to become conscious is to move up past the heart chakra. That only happens when you truly love yourself and therefore everything around you.

[Boy]

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Edited March 30, 2013 by Boy

[FmAm]

The thing is to accept that problem or no problem, the bearer of problems is the beloved.

 

I (me) am the bearer of the problems. Sometimes the bearer is the beloved (there's a nuance of mysticism in that word, and it draws away attention from the relevant), sometimes he is hated.

 

The relevant part is that I can either pack my problems in a heavy backpack (out of sight) or just watch how they travel beside me through this life. Problems come and go, the bearer changes, and yet it's me who bears all the problems. Some of the problems are willing to hug me before they go, some aren't. Those not willing to hug me continue their "being" in other people and in me one way or another.

Edited March 26, 2013 by FmAm

[Boy]

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Edited March 30, 2013 by Boy

[Cat Pillar]

So then, cruel as it may sound, that means you're on the right path. "Nobody said it was easy.." Love, brother.

 

I wouldn't call it cruel. It is what it is. With conceptual understanding out the window, it seems like what's left is a waiting game.

[Boy]

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Edited March 30, 2013 by Boy

[Cat Pillar]

Two reasons.

 

One, without a conceptual basis to operate on, there's not really anything to be done. There's no basis on which to determine a course of action.

 

Two, while one may recognize the inability of conceptual understanding to encompass reality, this doesn't mean that the mind stops trying. At least, that hasn't been my experience. Recognition can put a temporary halt to it, but the habituated patterns don't disappear overnight. And it seems likely that the noise from habituated patterns covers up Knowing.

 

Thus, it seems like a waiting game for Knowing to manifest while the mind winds itself down.

[Boy]

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Edited March 30, 2013 by Boy

[Tom Lin]

yes patience and being receptive to the knowledge by being aware is key.

[Cat Pillar]

How synchronous!

 

You must dare to let love in.

 

This is something that has arisen a lot within the past couple of days. I've been working on opening my heart back up, starting with learning to love myself again.

 

 

Other than that, it depends on what you're gunning for.

 

The first step; Realization. To speculate on any goal beyond that first step seems...premature.

[Tom Lin]

How synchronous!

 

 

This is something that has arisen a lot within the past couple of days. I've been working on opening my heart back up, starting with learning to love myself again.

 

 

 

The first step; Realization. To speculate on any goal beyond that first step seems...premature.

Exactly. How do you know what you need if you do not know yourself in the first place?

[Boy]

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Edited March 30, 2013 by Boy

[3bob]

"Exactly. How do you know what you need if you do not know yourself in the first place?" by Tom

 

My take is that we can count on one desire that won't rest until it truly rests... also counter to some claims all desire is not false.

[Boy]

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Edited March 30, 2013 by Boy

[Boy]

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Edited March 30, 2013 by Boy

[Cat Pillar]

No, I'm quite certain you will have to love yourself through proxies. No cheating!

 

I am not sure what you mean by this.

[Boy]

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Edited March 30, 2013 by Boy

[dwai]

 

So then, cruel as it may sound, that means you're on the right path. "Nobody said it was easy.." Love, brother.

 

 

Yes! This is not how a follower of vedanta would express it, and your focus is on bhakti, but it is entirely correct! ...Ok, you'll encounter another station later on, but by then you'll be in perfect shape to handle it! :-D

 

Bhakti is also necessary. Pure intellect cannot get us beyond a certain point -- Bhakti is a rasa that softens us up to be able to love and be relaxed - to find one's self surrender oneself