Buddhists forum vs Vedanta forum

[RongzomFan]

http://books.google.com/books?id=udZWwms7rgwC&pg=PA5&dq=kiss+of+the+yogini++This+is+the+basis+for+what+is+termed&hl=en&sa=X&ei=5xNWUbzqBIXV0gG9woEw&ved=0CDQQuwUwAA#v=onepage&q=kiss%20of%20the%20yogini%20%20This%20is%20the%20basis%20for%20what%20is%20termed&f=false

[RongzomFan]

Babaji's Kriya yoga is known to those who have the adhikara. I don't refer to the self realization foundation stuff but the real deal as taught by lahiri mahasaya's progeny.

 

Even the 'real deal' had stuff about Jesus as an ascended master. How much more New Age can you get?

[dwai]

Mods, how do I "ignore" Alwayson? The option to ignore people seems to have disappeared!

[Birch]

Should be in your settings Dwai. Are you guys insulting each other in Hindi? Forum rules apply to all languages.

[dwai]

Should be in your settings Dwai. Are you guys insulting each other in Hindi? Forum rules apply to all languages.

 

Thanks k...

 

Insult? Nah I was testing how Indian he is and so far he hasn't seemed knowledgeable in 5 of the languages, including the one he claims is his mother tongue

[RongzomFan]

including the one he claims is his mother tongue

 

Considering I never made any such claim, what language do you think that is?

[RongzomFan]

I can understand Telugu just fine. Just not written.

[RongzomFan]

How about? Kannada baratta nimige? Kannada dalli her beka? Tamil teriuma? Bangla jano? Bhojpuri ma kahanwa padega ka?

 

Nope none of those. Considering I already told you my state and caste, I thought you would be better at this.

[RongzomFan]

Thanks k... Insult? Nah I was testing how Indian he is and so far he hasn't seemed knowledgeable in 5 of the languages

 

Are you claiming to be knowledgeable in 5 indian languages? Thats a pretty big claim.

[dwai]

 

Are you claiming to be knowledgeable in 5 indian languages? Thats a pretty big claim.

not a big one. I lived in the south so I learnt Kannada. I worked in chennai so a little Tamil ...born in east so Bangla...Studied Hindi and Sanskrit...five? Plus English so six

[RongzomFan]

Well that is impressive even by Indian standards.

[Simple_Jack]

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Edited February 5, 2014 by Simple_Jack

[Simple_Jack]

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Edited February 5, 2014 by Simple_Jack

[dwai]

Even though you and dwai, have repeatedly expounded on how "all paths lead to the same end," in a way you two are hypocrites. Despite both of you being sympathetic to the relatedness of the two: You guys still foster the mindset of a dichotomy between Buddha Dharma and Hindu Dharma.

 

In some sense, I'm intolerant towards what is perceived as "delusion of wrong views," yet at the same time: I in fact look at both of you as fellow brothers in Dharma. Actually, I look at all sentient beings as fellow brothers and sisters in Dharma. In the end, I don't discriminate between what is a "Buddhist" view or what is a "Hindu" view.

 

 

Which translates to you being slightly deficient in the logic department

[Simple_Jack]

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Edited February 5, 2014 by Simple_Jack

[Simple_Jack]

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Edited February 5, 2014 by Simple_Jack

[dwai]

No dwai, I have just learned to see beyond the differences of individual doctrine to come to an understanding that they all lead towards liberation....

 

It seems like you and 3bob are unwilling to do the same.

 

For me, it's just Dharma. No matter what the difference is.

Well then we don't have anything to disagree on. I too understand the same thing and look beyond differences of individual doctrine.

 

That not withstanding different ways have different modality. So, a train ride is different from a bus ride is different from an airplane ride, even though all of these take us from point A to point B. They are available to us based on our financial capabilities and personal proclivities. Similarly, with Buddhism or Hinduism -- it depends on our personal proclivities, preferences and capabilities to take one over another.

 

Some of us take more than one...start with one, end with another, and so on. So while it is just Dharma (like travel), it is best left to the individual what they choose to follow. And my reasons for leaving the two fora separate is already articulated. I don't think militant Buddhists would let the likes of 3Bob or myself to our own devise and respect the fact that there is more than one way to do things.

Edited March 30, 2013 by dwai

[RongzomFan]

Hinduism is about doing pujas at home and pujas in temples. Also throw in some customs, festivals, jyotish and popular stories about the gods.

 

1. I have not met a Hindu even aware of Advaita Vedanta.

 

2. Advaita Vedanta never comes up at any mass gatherings.

 

3. I have never heard a lecture on Advaita Vedanta.

 

4. Advaita Vedanta is not taught in Hindu 'sunday' schools.

 

5. Working Brahmin priests do not bring up Advaita Vedanta when questioned on Hinduism. (I do lengthy interrogations of Brahmin priests, to further my knowledge).

 

6. Advaita Vedanta has never come up in any real life situation thus far.

 

So adhering to Advaita Vedanta, which even traditionally is viewed as being close to Buddhism, is ironic.

Respectively, it is ironic for Buddhists to be so afraid of Advaita Vedanta.

Edited March 31, 2013 by alwayson

[Simple_Jack]

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Edited February 5, 2014 by Simple_Jack

[RongzomFan]

IMO, it seems like you (and 3bob) crave identification with the label of "Hindu." Which in turn creates a dichotomy between Buddhism and Hinduism as being two separate Dharmas, despite sharing the same cultural heritage.

 

They are confusing high philosophical systems, like Advaita Vedanta, with generic Hinduism. See my post above.

Edited March 30, 2013 by alwayson

[3bob]

I do not bug the folks over at the Buddhist forum and the real Buddhists there do not come over here to bug folks at the Hindu forum. (for Buddhists are busy with the Noble Eight Fold path and Hindus are busy with their particular schools)

 

I've never noticed Lama's and Swami's getting together for major nit picking sessions where they try to rip each other up and I'm sure not interested in such either.

 

So it's really simple for all of us, get busy with our own paths...

 

Om

[RongzomFan]

for Buddhists are busy with the Noble Eight Fold path

 

OR the teachings and path of the Mahasiddhas (Vajrayana).

[dwai]

Hinduism is about doing pujas at home and pujas in temples. Also throw in some customs, festivals, jyotish and popular stories about the gods.

 

1. I have not met a Hindu even aware of Advaita Vedanta.

 

2. Advaita Vedanta never comes up at any mass gatherings.

 

3. I have never heard a lecture on Advaita Vedanta.

 

4. Advaita Vedanta is not taught in Hindu 'sunday' schools.

 

5. Working Brahmin priests do not bring up Advaita Vedanta when questioned on Hinduism. (I do lengthy interrogations of Brahmin priests, to further my knowledge).

 

6. Advaita Vedanta has never come up in any real life situation thus far.

 

So adhering to Advaita Vedanta, which even traditionally is viewed as being close to Buddhism, is ironic.

Respectively, it is ironic for Buddhists to be so afraid of Advaita Vedanta.

Well obviously your experience is different from mine. I grew up in a family where Advaita was considered to be the highest learning. My grandfather was very well versed in various esoteric subjects (including being a highly accomplished jyotishi -- astrologer, who had made absolutely accurate predictions about various people's lives without taking a single penny from them).

 

I learnt the Bhajagovindam from him...he also taught me the primary premise of Hindu dharma (how all the various sects were united and the specific cult of any particular deity overcome) -- all roads lead to the same truth, but there are many paths leading there. He used to take me on long walks every evening where he would teach me pranayama. I learnt about Rechaka, Puraka and Kubhaka from him when I around 10-12 years old (of course I didn't know how vital these teachings were then -- I was more interested in playing with my friends).

 

The role that the social network we grow up in plays in our development is essential to how our perception develops. From your posts I see you as a mid-to-late 20 something who has just begun to delve into his native culture. And that despite of being insulated from it beyond the snapshots his parents have carried with them from their country of origin (which obviously is frozen in time and is nothing like growing up within a living organism that you learn to live with from day one -- as those of us who were born and raised in India do). To have your parents, uncles, aunts, grandparents constantly demonstrating the living traditions at every walk of life (often under the most unexpected circumstances).

 

Your knowledge of Hindu society is stymied and minuscule because you have grown up in a society where hindu dharma is practically non-existent. My daughter has the same issues (albeit she is still too young to know it). So my wife and I spend time telling her stories of the puranas, try and immerse her in cultural activities as well as we can. But I know it's not the same thing as being part of a living, breathing, highly diverse culture (those of us who did grow in India have a completely different experience and perspective on these things).

 

The interesting thing is now when I think back, my grandfather never pushed me towards advaita or vedanta or any other ritual or tradition as I was growing up beyond exposing me to them through their actions and stories. When I grew older and started practicing, my grandfather was happy but told me to enjoy it, not take it too seriously (and with mediation he told me never to push too hard). He didn't explain why then, but I know now -- to try to hard is to make it a chore. And a chore is not something we enjoy...we get it done and over with so we can go on with our lives. His life was an example of sadhana at every level -- he meditated when it was time (no matter what chaos was ensuing in our household with the barrage of stimuli us grandkids would wreak on him, or the incessant stream of neighbors and guests coming in and out of our home). He would sit in lotus and it's like he would disappear. He would meditate twice a day as part of his daily ablutions, once in the morning and once in the evening (sandhya) and then he would reappear into the world. He didn't make a big deal of it, it was a very personal thing for him...he wouldn't talk about it and the experiences (He had once warned me to not talk about these things too much, since they tend to overshadow focus of what was important -- the sadhana (over the siddhis)).

 

I find it mildly amusing and sad at the same time when I come across people who have absolutely no idea of what that is like to sit and judge and tell me what is "wrong" with me and my point of view.

 

I once had a long and draining exchange with a luminary of the Iskcon movement (an american by birth) when he told me that only Gaudiya Vashnavism was the "real" deal and that Indians (from India) were deluded lunatics and ignorant because they didn't all convert to Gaudiya Vaishavism (in essence). He knew the Vedas by rote and was very articulate and intelligent. However, he couldn't understand one basic fact -- Hindus in india are very liberal for the most part because we have lived and grown up in an environment where multiple traditions live in harmony simultaneously. An Advaitin can also be a devotee of Krishna, Shiva, Shakti at the same time (any one or all at once). Or that a Shaivite can be also be a Tantrik and there is no dichotomy since we are taught that these traditions are never mutually exclusive, they are there for people of various capabilities (adhikaras). So while total surrender and devotion to Krishna might be the way for one, deep intellectual introspection might be that of another. Hatha Yoga might suit another better while meditation in silence for another. And all this amidst the smorgasbord of experiences that India provides to her children through the diversity of population, cultures, traditions, arts etc.

[RongzomFan]

Well obviously your experience is different from mine. I grew up in a family where Advaita was considered to be the highest learning. My grandfather was very well versed in various esoteric subjects (including being a highly accomplished jyotishi -- astrologer, who had made absolutely accurate predictions about various people's lives without taking a single penny from them).

 

Well even I mastered jyotish at one point. I came to the same conclusions as professional astrologers. Its a pseudoscience anyone can learn. Keep in mind I'm not denigrating it because Buddhism of course uses the same astrology. And yes it can be accurate.

 

I once had a long and draining exchange with a luminary of the Iskcon movement (an american by birth)

 

ISKCON people are brainwashed.

 

You might consider me brainwashed, however I do not view Padmasambhava, Vimalamitra, Garab Dorje etc. as historical figures. On the other hand I believe Shiva, Parvati etc. are real.

 

Your knowledge of Hindu society is stymied and minuscule because you have grown up in a society where hindu dharma is practically non-existent.

 

Thats hilarious. Keep making unfounded statements. I know about even obscure details for sthapana rituals for permanent idol installations in temples. Like I said I talk to Brahmin priests a lot.

Edited March 31, 2013 by alwayson

[RongzomFan]

No dwai, I have just learned to see beyond the differences of individual doctrine to come to an understanding that they all lead towards liberation....

 

It seems like you and 3bob are unwilling to do the same.

 

For me, it's just Dharma. No matter what the difference is.

 

As far as I'm aware only Buddhadharma leads to omniscient Buddhahood.

 

My point is that I view generic Hinduism as a subset of Buddhadharma.