Timing of Magic Over a Lifetime

[RiverSnake]

Found this article on another site and thought it was interesting and worth sharing:

 

 

"A while ago Jack had a great post about some of the reactions people have had about certain magical practices and how they might be dangerous, lead one into insanity, away from Holiness, etc..

 

I liked the post, because when I was younger, I got a lot of the same kinds of looks from some people. I went plunging into the Tunnels of Set with nothing but Falorioss images on photo paper and a beat up copy of Nightside of Eden. I held a Typhonian Portal open in my bedroom for a week straight until my neighbors could feel something terrible going on. I created Servitors with no expiration date that are still roaming the city of Philadelphia 17 years later. I took three types of psychedelics at once (LSD, Mishrooms, and Datura) and became a Buddhist. I formed a cabal of the CAOTO to have all night trip explorations on psychedelics most people have never even heard of. I summoned demons for frivolous reasons and paid the price. I played games with the weather, and other people paid the price. I did a public performance of the Mass of the Phoenix in front of 30 people at a Unitarian Church and yes I bled all over. I integrated BDSM into sex magic rituals just because. I nearly wound up hospitalized for a few days because of the effects of an un-grounded Chaos Sphere. I charged half cocked into an exorcism that I clearly could not handle. I charged half cocked into another one soon after, that I did handle but would not have been able to unless I failed the first time.

 

In short I learned by getting my hands dirty and playing the game. I have only met Jack once, and we never did not come up together, but I think we have some similar experiences in this regard. We both survived, and we both have friends that did not.

 

So what all this brings me around to is magical timing. We talk a lot of about time according to planetary days and hours. We plan according to eclipses and according to lunar phases. We sometimes even plan out according to season, but I wonder how many of you give thought to when in your life you are going to do something.

 

A lot of the things I did then, I would NEVER do now in a house with my wife and kids. Honestly some magic I would never even do once I got a job I cared about. Some of this is the type of stuff I list above the gung ho excursions of a magical youth but others are not so simple.

 

Take the HGA for instance. I had friends deeply worried about me when I was doing Samekh every day. There were times that I was absolutely close to coming unhinged. Some people treat it as this thing that is the pinnacle of magic and should only be undertaken once you have accomplished years of work I think it should be done very early on in ones career because the upheavals that can be brought up in the work can be enough to tear a family apart.

 

Crossing the Abyss is another one. Unless you are doing it through meditation (which is more effecient and smoother than any more active magical method) it might be best accomplished before one is settled, or after one is retired. Than again, different people lead different lives.

 

Lots of Tibetan Buddhists get asked to do Ngondro, which usually requires 100,000 full prostrations. Some Lamas brag (or get bragged about) that they did it two or three times! When they dont mention is that they did it when they were 12. Doing 100,000 prostrations is a great way to keep a 12 year old monk occupied. Its a challenging task for someone in their early 20′s. It can be downright harmful to overweight western suburbanites in their 30′s and 40′s, and every year at least a few people blow out their knees doing it. Good practice wrong stage of life

 

Not that long ago a friend of mine that is my age was talking about engaging in a long series of Ayahuaska based magical experiments and wanted to know what I thought. I basically told him that ship has sailed. He has two kids at home a few years older than my kids. I asked him how would you feel if you got an emergency call that your child is in the hospital, and you still have 5 hours of tripping your balls off to get through?

 

Everything from ritual equipment you keep out, to things you invoke in the house, to ways that you alter your mind state, have serious impact in real life. Doing something when you are in college may not be a good idea when you are raising toddlers. Than again revisiting that in later life, might be ideal. In fact, it is the last phase of life that many cultures consider the most spiritually productive. Many people who ask to become Sadhus get told to wait until they have a family and career first, than become a Sanyassi after they retire.

 

I wonder if any of the people that were criticizing Jacks practices were simply at a place in life where the kind of psychic or circumstantial upheaval that could be caused was unthinkable to them, yet very easy for Jack to handle. I know that is how it was with me, and I need to remind myself when I talk to some people, that is how it is with them now.

 

How has your stage of life effected your practice? Have to put anything away for the kiddies? Any good stories of youthful psychic shinanigans? Got anything planned for the empty nest?" by Jason Miller

 

Link to original article: http://www.inominandum.com/blog/timing-of-magic-over-lifetime/

 

 

My 2 cents, Peace

Edited April 8, 2013 by OldGreen

[RiverSnake]

My pleasure Viator.

Edited March 30, 2013 by OldGreen

[Birch]

Great article Old Green. Thanks!

[RiverSnake]

Parts of this discussion made me chringe, others made me laugh out loud, thought this would be an appropriate place to post this "When Magic Blows Up". A great discussion, perhaps in the future I might go to crucible. http://deeper-down-the-rabbit-hole.com/2012/10/episode-77-crucible-discussion-2012/

 

My 2 cents, Peace

Edited May 26, 2013 by OldGreen

[三江源]

That was a very interesting podcast/talk. The ectopic pregnancy being the result of confliciting messages was illuminating.

[RiverSnake]

That was a very interesting podcast/talk. The ectopic pregnancy being the result of confliciting messages was illuminating.

 

Indeed, the fact that they said that magic usually "blows up" when doing a service for others was quite interesting. Using divination and checking with ones higher self before doing any kind of working is so important, it really helps prevent a lot of nonsense.

 

My 2 cents, Peace

Edited May 27, 2013 by OldGreen

[三江源]

Yes.. the thing is with magic, is that it can get a bit like a legal document, with the amount of provisos one has to build in.. there are always unforseeable possibilities that magic will find..

 

like the guy whose house burned down in order to give him the money he needed..

 

even saying 'if it be for the good of all' doesnt exclude massive inconvenenience which, like a good taoist story, may look disastrous in the short term even if it pans out for the ultimate good.

[silent thunder]

Good stuff. Thanks for sharing.

[BaguaKicksAss]

.

[RiverSnake]

Yes.. the thing is with magic, is that it can get a bit like a legal document, with the amount of provisos one has to build in.. there are always unforseeable possibilities that magic will find..

 

like the guy whose house burned down in order to give him the money he needed..

 

even saying 'if it be for the good of all' doesnt exclude massive inconvenenience which, like a good taoist story, may look disastrous in the short term even if it pans out for the ultimate good.

Indeed, I was listening to another story by the same guy. He asked an angel to help him get enough money by giving him a bunch of gold so he could retire and dedicate his life to spreading occult teachings. The angel said "yes" and then a week later he got fired from his job and the only way he could survive was to write like madman and get his works published. Be careful what you wish for. Angels can be evil.

 

My 2 cents, Peace

Edited May 27, 2013 by OldGreen

[BaguaKicksAss]

Bet he was grateful for it 10 years after the fact though! Sometimes we don't get off our own butts to do what needs doing, so we get help lol.

[DragonsNectar69k]

Bet he was grateful for it 10 years after the fact though! Sometimes we don't get off our own butts to do what needs doing, so we get help lol.

 

Ahh. Which is something I hate to acknowledge, but that is exactly how I learned about magick and all those crazy things involved with magick.

[DragonsNectar69k]

Indeed, I was listening to another story by the same guy. He asked an angel to help him get enough money by giving him a bunch of gold so he could retire and dedicate his life to spreading occult teachings. The angel said "yes" and then a week later he got fired from his job and the only way he could survive was to write like madman and get his works published. Be careful what you wish for. Angels can be evil.

 

My 2 cents, Peace

 

Yep, be careful what you ask for. Higher or lower beings do not concern themselves with the mortal state. Time seems to be something they do not care for nor need. Human's have a tendency to think linearly, from what I have experienced other beings tend to see the world in a totally different light, whatever that may be.

 

If you one takes the single topic of time and correlates it to the available scriptures in almost any religion, concerning eternity, there is no haste.

[DragonsNectar69k]

Found this article on another site and thought it was interesting and worth sharing:

 

 

"A while ago Jack had a great post about some of the reactions people have had about certain magical practices and how they might be dangerous, lead one into insanity, away from Holiness, etc..

 

I liked the post, because when I was younger, I got a lot of the same kinds of looks from some people. I went plunging into the Tunnels of Set with nothing but Falorioss images on photo paper and a beat up copy of Nightside of Eden. I held a Typhonian Portal open in my bedroom for a week straight until my neighbors could feel something terrible going on. I created Servitors with no expiration date that are still roaming the city of Philadelphia 17 years later. I took three types of psychedelics at once (LSD, Mishrooms, and Datura) and became a Buddhist. I formed a cabal of the CAOTO to have all night trip explorations on psychedelics most people have never even heard of. I summoned demons for frivolous reasons and paid the price. I played games with the weather, and other people paid the price. I did a public performance of the Mass of the Phoenix in front of 30 people at a Unitarian Church and yes I bled all over. I integrated BDSM into sex magic rituals just because. I nearly wound up hospitalized for a few days because of the effects of an un-grounded Chaos Sphere. I charged half cocked into an exorcism that I clearly could not handle. I charged half cocked into another one soon after, that I did handle but would not have been able to unless I failed the first time.

 

In short I learned by getting my hands dirty and playing the game. I have only met Jack once, and we never did not come up together, but I think we have some similar experiences in this regard. We both survived, and we both have friends that did not.

 

So what all this brings me around to is magical timing. We talk a lot of about time according to planetary days and hours. We plan according to eclipses and according to lunar phases. We sometimes even plan out according to season, but I wonder how many of you give thought to when in your life you are going to do something.

 

A lot of the things I did then, I would NEVER do now in a house with my wife and kids. Honestly some magic I would never even do once I got a job I cared about. Some of this is the type of stuff I list above the gung ho excursions of a magical youth but others are not so simple.

 

Take the HGA for instance. I had friends deeply worried about me when I was doing Samekh every day. There were times that I was absolutely close to coming unhinged. Some people treat it as this thing that is the pinnacle of magic and should only be undertaken once you have accomplished years of work I think it should be done very early on in ones career because the upheavals that can be brought up in the work can be enough to tear a family apart.

 

Crossing the Abyss is another one. Unless you are doing it through meditation (which is more effecient and smoother than any more active magical method) it might be best accomplished before one is settled, or after one is retired. Than again, different people lead different lives.

 

Lots of Tibetan Buddhists get asked to do Ngondro, which usually requires 100,000 full prostrations. Some Lamas brag (or get bragged about) that they did it two or three times! When they dont mention is that they did it when they were 12. Doing 100,000 prostrations is a great way to keep a 12 year old monk occupied. Its a challenging task for someone in their early 20′s. It can be downright harmful to overweight western suburbanites in their 30′s and 40′s, and every year at least a few people blow out their knees doing it. Good practice wrong stage of life

 

Not that long ago a friend of mine that is my age was talking about engaging in a long series of Ayahuaska based magical experiments and wanted to know what I thought. I basically told him that ship has sailed. He has two kids at home a few years older than my kids. I asked him how would you feel if you got an emergency call that your child is in the hospital, and you still have 5 hours of tripping your balls off to get through?

 

Everything from ritual equipment you keep out, to things you invoke in the house, to ways that you alter your mind state, have serious impact in real life. Doing something when you are in college may not be a good idea when you are raising toddlers. Than again revisiting that in later life, might be ideal. In fact, it is the last phase of life that many cultures consider the most spiritually productive. Many people who ask to become Sadhus get told to wait until they have a family and career first, than become a Sanyassi after they retire.

 

I wonder if any of the people that were criticizing Jacks practices were simply at a place in life where the kind of psychic or circumstantial upheaval that could be caused was unthinkable to them, yet very easy for Jack to handle. I know that is how it was with me, and I need to remind myself when I talk to some people, that is how it is with them now.

 

How has your stage of life effected your practice? Have to put anything away for the kiddies? Any good stories of youthful psychic shinanigans? Got anything planned for the empty nest?" by Jason Miller

 

Link to original article: http://www.inominandum.com/blog/timing-of-magic-over-lifetime/

 

 

My 2 cents, Peace

 

I honestly fail to see the relevance of such practices. What was obtained besides amusing memories?

[三江源]

Yep, be careful what you ask for. Higher or lower beings do not concern themselves with the mortal state. Time seems to be something they do not care for nor need. Human's have a tendency to think linearly, from what I have experienced other beings tend to see the world in a totally different light, whatever that may be.

 

If you one takes the single topic of time and correlates it to the available scriptures in almost any religion, concerning eternity, there is no haste.

Dragonsnectar69k - I think you could contribute a lot to the tao of dying formulation, with these thoughts here.

[RiverSnake]

 

I honestly fail to see the relevance of such practices. What was obtained besides amusing memories?

Knowledge and experience. For some people blowing themselves up is the only way they learn.

 

My 2 cents, Peace

Edited May 28, 2013 by OldGreen

[BaguaKicksAss]

.

Edited January 12, 2014 by BaguaKicksAss

[DragonsNectar69k]

Dragonsnectar69k - I think you could contribute a lot to the tao of dying formulation, with these thoughts here.

 

I'd rather not bother Sree with his never ending 'thesis'. I've decided to leave that thread alone. If he has yet to venture to this side of the forum, that is due to his own inherit dogma.

[RiverSnake]

 

While they are far from the wisest practices, they most definitely have an affect on the magician. The main affect is a tempering process. You really don't strengthen as a magician sticking to the easy and safe stuff. If you have not gone through hell and back (a saying not insinuating some place), you really don't comprehend much about life and/or magic. The purpose is to delve as deeply as possible into the depths of magic to see what one finds there. Most definitely not a path for everyone (as most would go insane from such things) but useful in its own right if the magician makes it back out the other side. The only thing is, how many make it back out the other side? It would be near impossible without a qualified teacher (not books).

 

I see it as sort of similar to the various bruises and fractures one might get over a lifetime of martial arts, or perhaps roughhousing as a kid. Can someone who has never fought learn how to fight? Some say not.

 

Magic is a different sort of battle, with ourselves ultimately, but different folks take different routes to mirror themselves.

 

I hope that makes some sense. I have a few thousand magicians over my life, and taught dozens (I have a low teaching tolerance lol), and there is not much (in the western traditions) I have not worked with, or at least tried. The folks I have worked with are also the work at it every single day sorts of folks, and have come from many different paths. So in other words, I have seen a LOT.

 

On a side note, no I do NOT recommend the above approach to folks .

 

PS, I don't think that most who get into practices such as many listed on that long list, really know what they are getting into, or what they are leaving behind .

A pattern I have noticed from a lot of experienced occult practitioners is that they were usually brought into the craft through some very intense suffering and trials and tribulations (terrible upbringing, negative influences, life sucking...etc). Some of them came to this suffering though there own stupidity and "playing" with magic and getting blown up......while others came from magically gifted families or were naturally gifted and completely rejected it and thus got there ass kicked by life and spirits until they were forced back into Esotericism through pure desperation to somehow save their skin.

 

What's most interesting is many of these practitioners look back on there experiences 10-20 years later and recognize there experiences as a kind of informal shamanic initiation in which they were tested by spirits and the path. It's interesting stuff.

 

My 2 cents, Peace

[DragonsNectar69k]

A pattern I have noticed from a lot of experienced occult practitioners is that they were usually brought into the craft through some very intense suffering and trials and tribulations (terrible upbringing, negative influences, life sucking...etc). Some of them came to this suffering though there own stupidity and "playing" with magic and getting blown up......while others came from magically gifted families or were naturally gifted and completely rejected it and thus got there ass kicked by life and spirits until they were forced back into Esotericism through pure desperation to somehow save their skin.

 

What's most interesting is many of these practitioners look back on there experiences 10-20 years later and recognize there experiences as a kind of informal shamanic initiation in which they were tested by spirits and the path. It's interesting stuff.

 

My 2 cents, Peace

 

I agree.

[RiverSnake]

Another good piece on magical mishaps, but referring to nature spirits specifically. Good stuff. http://www.inominandum.com/blog/because-you-should-know-better/

 

 

My 2 cents, Peace

Edited August 13, 2013 by OldChi

[Sloppy Zhang]

Another good piece on magical mishaps, but referring to nature spirits specifically. Good stuff. http://www.inominandum.com/blog/because-you-should-know-better/

 

 

My 2 cents, Peace

 

I've started to pick up on this a little bit as well. I don't think I'm developed enough to feel/communicate with spirits per se, but I have started to notice an "energy" behind certain places, certain actions, etc.

 

I've taken up not doing "unnecessary" things. Unnecessary could mean something that whacks out my energy, but also something that whacks out the energy of the area.

 

That said, I'm still in development, so occasionally I do things against my better judgment/feeling, and I wind up feeling reeeeeaaaaaaaal shitty about it later.

 

If I offend a spirit, again, I don't have the ability to perceive/communicate with them, so I wouldn't really know how to make amends. But I do feel really shitty and do the best to clean up my act for next time, because it's kind of a bad experience

[BaguaKicksAss]

That energy is actually how you communicate with them . Start chatting, then you will get a sense of their answer through the energy. If they are strong communicators you will *know* if they approve of something or not LOL.

 

Also to communicate with them, just talk to them, out loud. Use the feelings you get to perceive their reply, and a pendulum as backup.

 

In other words, if you get the feelings stuff you mention above, you will have no trouble, just need to figure out through experience what is what.

[RiverSnake]

Making offerings is also a way of communicating and expressing ones sincerest apologies.

 

My 2 cents, Peace

[Sloppy Zhang]

Making offerings is also a way of communicating and expressing ones sincerest apologies.

 

My 2 cents, Peace

 

But what to offer?

 

Sometimes people who don't know I'm allergic to peanut butter say "I'm sorry I've been such a dick, here, I bought you an extra large snickers bar."

 

Gee, thanks for the present, I can't eat it. Maybe you shoulda asked around and figured out what I like, or maybe even asked me