MT

[chenping]

chenping,

how are you today?

 

I am good, my friend. Allow me to commend you for not turning ugly over the Xiao Yao Pai thing.

 

indeed iron sharpens iron.

 

Honing my skill is not sharpening my sword. This is how I hone it with Stosh.

 

[Stosh]

I am good, my friend. Allow me to commend you for not turning ugly over the Xiao Yao Pai thing.

 

 

Honing my skill is not sharpening my sword. This is how I hone it with Stosh.

 

In your dreams buddy

[Wu Ming Jen]

Thank you sharing, Wudang Shan rules. I lived there for a while practiced kung fu 7 hours a day/. Tai Chi is the physical expression of Taoist philosophy. One can not move forward with out pushing off the back leg physically. forward and backward complete each other and are linked together, as are all true polar complete opposites, birth and death so on We are in the state of Tai Chi once we have a physical body. We prove Taoist philosophy physically to ourselves, Longevity living in our body comfortably well into old age is the goal.Met many old people with incredible skill, martial skill, no ego, refining the self, just incredible and peaceful.

Sorry to see the thread turn into a blood bath with such a beautiful topic.

[chenping]

Taichi enables one to live life either long and slowly or fast and furious. I prefer the latter.

Even as a kid, I didn't eat the way other kids did. I wolfed it down always.

 

Longevity has no value to me. Everything needs to be in season. Even people have a sell-by date.

If the body is not at the peak of its performance cycle, it's time to go.

Hanging on with loose teeth and blurred vision is not longetivity. It's pathetic.

[Stosh]

The wise man does not seek to prolong his life

weapons are instuments of fear , they are not a wise mans tools

[ChiDragon]

I see no art to war here, in accord with the Tsun Tsu , one gathers allies rather than create enemies.

 

Don't you see one gathers allies is part of fighting a war by not creating enemies to fight in a war. BTW The art of war is really a psychological war rather than physical war in a battlefield. Battle in the field is what one wants to avoid.

Edited April 11, 2013 by ChiDragon

[Wu Ming Jen]

I admire Master Lu 117 year old Ba Gua Master, You can see him move on you tube.Living comfortable threw ones natural years is priceless. Immortality is not living in the body forever it can be just knowing where you came from and where you return.Weapons are nothing but an extension of oneself you can attach fear or whatever to them.Turning the sword around it now becomes spiritual and no wrist or joint problems in the physical body.When things only live in mind is only half so I complete with physical reality and all natural laws that govern movement.

[Stosh]

Don't you see one gathers allies is part of fighting a war by not creating enemies to fight in a war. BTW The art of war is really a psychological war rather than physical war in a battlefield. Battle in the field is what one wants to avoid.

 

You ask this of me- that I dont see gathering allies as being a wise move ?

 

My point was that when folks all speak their different minds , espouse their different ideas ,

and get bent out of shape over invalidating points ,

, they are not waging a Tsun tsu stye war of gathering allies and operating for measurable gain.

Kissing up- isnt the general rule here , speaking WHATEVER to gain allies -isnt the rule here .

Instead The stuff that folks are espousing they generally do believe,

and they are willing to suffer 'sticking their necks out'

in public debate! to have themselves be known.

It instead appears a stategy-less emotional uphill charge into

withering cannon fire with little hope of gain

 

To bestow ones understanding at a risk of invalidation is a gift being offered ,

(all the time expecting-knowing that it can and will be used against you)

It is not warlike .

 

Your post indicates that we are actually largely in agreement but

One doesnt really want to divide their psychologial energies either

..conflicts of any type equate IMO ,, I certainly wouldnt be the first

person to extrapolate Tsun's work to other fields of endeavor.

 

I thought Tsun HIMSELF said that all of life was characterized by conflict

so I see no correction I should have applied regarding my application of

the philosophy

but I couldve misread parts.

Or used better wording

Edited April 11, 2013 by Stosh

[ChiDragon]

Gathering allies is only a preventive measure in the art of war. This is the peaceful side of Tsun's philosophy. If you have read the side of the real battle in his philosophy, then it would be a brutal war. It is time to kill to win by all means. There are two sides of the application in the art of war. Regardless, the object is to win a war. It is only a matter of what is the best way to win with the least casualties.

[Stosh]

Yes his bias was to win and profit by it even brutally ,

Im not saying he was a fuzzy warm loving human

The upside of his teachings are that one should think long and hard about the costs of

getting into a conflict rather than inflict waste-bloodshed on yourself by rash action.

But ,,,

Where is our diagreement CD ?

I dont see enough difference to expend energy objecting to what you are saying

and I dont see where you find fault with my response either ???

 

Youre just going to have to throw me a bone before I sally forth to attack from the high ground.

Then youre supposed to grudgingly give ground ,bleeding my strengh and opening up my supply lines.

and when the moment is ripe ...youre supposed to cut off my head,( or you screw up and I get to rout your forces.)

Edited April 11, 2013 by Stosh

[ChiDragon]

No fault was found. Just to be sure that we do understand the same...........

[Stosh]

No fault was found. Just to be sure that we do understand the same...........

I think we do.

Have a great evening

[ChiDragon]

Stosh......
Have a great evening to you too.......

[chenping]

I think we do.

Have a great evening

 

You think? Your rationalization of Sun Tsu's martial philosophy is selfish and debased.

It's never about costs and always about principle when one is driven to wage war.

The shock and awe of Desert Storm was classic Sun Tzu but the reason for war was unprincipled.

 

Sun Tsu strategy is let you keep on thinking the way you do.

Martial art is deception.

Another bloodbath awaits you.

[ChiDragon]

The shock and awe of Desert Storm was classic Sun Tzu but the reason for war was unprincipled.

 

Even though that Desert Storm was unprincipled, but the general who fought the war and won by using a great strategy from the Art of War.

[chenping]

Even though that Desert Storm was unprincipled, but the general who fought the war and won by using a great strategy from the Art of War.

 

Yes, brilliant strategy used for the wrong reason. That was why - to prevent it falling into unworthy hands - Chinese martial art was, by tradition, secretly handed down and never openly taught to outsiders.

[Stosh]

You think? Your rationalization of Sun Tsu's martial philosophy is selfish and debased.

It's never about costs and always about principle when one is driven to wage war.

The shock and awe of Desert Storm was classic Sun Tzu but the reason for war was unprincipled.

 

Sun Tsu strategy is let you keep on thinking the way you do.

Martial art is deception.

Another bloodbath awaits you.

That is so wrong, Ill just leave you to wallow in it

[joeldjohnston]

@chenping - what do you seek?

[Vanir Thunder Dojo Tan]

The wise man does not seek to prolong his life

weapons are instuments of fear , they are not a wise mans tools

 

I dont think the wise man asserts what makes the man wise. but i might have confused myself and could have stopped at "i dont think". if i knew, i wouldnt ponder

[chenping]

@chenping - what do you seek?

 

Can you be more specific? Imagine yourself with a beer at a bar and you want to start a conversation with this ass standing next to you. You pop a question like that, you will get an answer you don't want.

 

So, ask me again.

[joeldjohnston]

The answer to that question isn't for me, but for you. I'm not asking that question OF you, I'm asking that question FOR you. If you know the answer already and are willing to share it, you can respond on many levels (spiritual, mental, physical) and I am interested in hearing whatever you have to say.

[chenping]

What do I seek? Frankly, I haven't figured out yet what I (this seeker) am. All I know if that I am a Chinaman stuck in a human body living on the Planet Earth. I don't buy it but that's the situation that I am stuck with. Pathetic, isn't it?

[Stosh]

 

I dont think the wise man asserts what makes the man wise. but i might have confused myself and could have stopped at "i dont think". if i knew, i wouldnt ponder

Im not sure who is the wise and who not in this scenario but

If Cp wants to live well rather than long , thats cool

I believe I was taking from Feng's translation and actually

was saying TTC supports him on that point.

Lately I have been aiming at introducing more of the lines as translated

to lessen the weight of my personal take , on things

Essentially to consider the tome in light of real time discussion more.

I dont think that would hurt any.

Its a bit of a grim perspective to think about ones existance in terms of

stuck and pathetic etc whereas living well ,,, thats a brighter view -worthy of

endorsement, as opposed to spending ones life trying to avoid the inevitable.

The weapon quote is easy yes? So there you are.

More than you needed to hear I suppose.

[joeldjohnston]

No, its not pathetic. We are all in the same boat as for the planet Earth bit. Being stuck however, is a frame of mind/point of view that can be changed. Freedom of thought allows us to expand what our mind is capable of perceiving and the Tao has been the gateway to that capability for me. No matter how mundane this existence is, I can focus on those words and escape the bonds that would otherwise be an incredibly oppressive reality.

 

Once you know what you're seeking, obtaining it is a matter of practice. For me, I seek equilibrium/balance. I seek singular simplicity in a sea of endless complexity.

[Samurai Mountain man]

joeldjohnston

 

'cept some of us aren't chinamen. damn i wish I wasn't such an ignorant westerner.

Edited April 13, 2013 by Samurai Mountain man