The Rise In Buddhist Violence: How Does Theology Explain It?

[Vmarco]

O.K. many wrongs don't make a right! haha.

 

 

"One millionth of 1% false is completely false" Jed McKenna

 

Or, as McKenna correctly said, "99.9% of the World's so-called wisdom, East and West, for the purposes of awakening, is about as useful as a glass of warm spit with a hair in it."

[ralis]

Do you even know what the fuck you are talking about?

 

Do you have something to add? This discussion is revealing in many ways.

Edited April 9, 2013 by ralis

[RongzomFan]

appropriate word as this started by a rape.

 

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/asia/burmas-monks-call-for-muslim-community-to-be-shunned-7973317.html

 

So the real issue here is male violence from ejaculation addiction.

 

 

"....which erupted after the rape and murder of a Buddhist woman, allegedly by three Muslims, unleashed long-standing ethnic tensions."

[RongzomFan]

So basically Muslims started the whole thing.

[Guest Jason Croft]

the·ol·o·gy

1. The study of the nature of God and religious belief.
2. Religious beliefs and theory when systematically developed: "Christian theology.
3. http://www.google.com.hk/#hl=en&site=&source=hp&q=definition+of+theology&oq=deTheology&gs_l=hp.1.1.0i7l10.2665.21227.0.25868.3.3.0.0.0.0.139.316.1j2.3.0...0.0...1c.1.8.hp.j1Ks1oCE80o&bav=on.2,or.&bvm=bv.44990110,d.aGc&fp=791ca258d3f1b8ca&biw=1093&bih=498

1> Buddhism is not a religion with a god, it is a philosophy of peace and personal responsibility.

2> As such, Buddhism has no forgiveness, the only forgiveness is from the individual forgiving themself.

3> The law of Karma is the explanation of the above - which also fits Buddhism in with the Universal laws of physics with Sir Isaac Newton's 3rd law of motion: For every action there is an equal and opposite reaction.

 

[RongzomFan]

karma just means intention in Buddhism, specifically the intention to follow Buddhadharma

[Guest Jason Croft]

Muslims? well I guess that Muslims just got to be muslims ... just as Buddhists are Buddhists - their actions define their reality.

[RongzomFan]

I vote that this thread, a pro-Muslim view, go to the pit. Overall, from stories I've read, the Muslim minority of Myanmar, who by the way, own the majority of the Country's private wealth, and treat Buddhists like scum infidels, are quite oppressive towards Buddhists in daily life.

 

This latest clash was fueled by two incidents,...first involved a Buddhist woman attempting to sell a gold hair piece, worth an equivalent of $200 in gold. The creepy Muslim merchant would only pay $100,...and as the woman attempted to counter for $120, the merchanct sneakily damaged the piece, and in traditional Muslim form, offered $50. The police were called, and the Muslim got caught in their unconscionable act,...which riled the Muslims to initiate incident number 2,...that of 4 Muslim males attacking, and then setting fire to a Buddhist monk. Next thing you know,...the world is condemning Buddhists for retaliating.

 

The way I see it,...Muslims invaded Myanmar in the 14th Century,...and it's now time to purge the Country of this disease. I personally like to see the religion of the pedophile Prophet removed from all of Asia,...and along with Judeao-Christianity, obliterated from the world.

 

 

best post in thread

[Guest Jason Croft]

The only true Buddhists, that I have observed, are the Scottish. When attacked repeatedly by England they picked up and moved to USA - creating Nova Scotia (Nova Scotia is Latin for New Scotland)

 

Although - there was a time of war for Scotland - when the Roman army invaded the world as well as Scotland ... Scots have never been defeated in battle. - the Romans could not defeat the Scots so they built stone walls in an effort to keep them out of their way. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hadrian's_Wall and Antonine Wall http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antonine_Wall

 

Today, the walls are known as the world's longest urinals ) - How do I know the above ? I am a Highland scot- as is at least one other hillbilly on this forum

Edited April 9, 2013 by Jason Croft

[Vmarco]

So basically Muslims started the whole thing.

 

You be the judge....and then ask,...why is the Western Media focusing on "militant Buddhists"?

 

 

GOLD HAIR CLIP By Jason Szep | Reuters

 

The spark was simple enough.

 

Aye Aye Naing, a 45-year-old Buddhist woman, wanted to make an offering of food to local monks. But she needed money, she recalled, sitting in her home in Pyon Kout village. At about 9 a.m. on March 20, a day before the massacre, she brought a gold hair clip to town. She had it appraised at 140,000 kyat ($160). With her husband and sister, she entered New Waint Sein, a Muslim-owned gold shop, which offered her 108,000 kyat. She wanted at least 110,000.

 

Shop workers studied the gold, but the clip came back damaged, she said. The shop owner, a young woman in her 20s, now offered just 50,000. The stout mother of five protested, calling the owner unreasonable. The owner slapped her, witnesses said. Aye Aye Naing's husband shouted and was pulled outside, held down and beaten by three of the store's staff, according to the couple and two witnesses.

 

Onlookers gathered. Police arrived, detaining Aye Aye Naing and the owner. The mostly Buddhist mob turned violent, hurling stones, shouting anti-Muslim slurs and breaking down the shop's doors, according to several witnesses. No one was killed or injured, but the Muslim-owned building housing the gold shop and several others were nearly destroyed.

 

"This shop has a bad reputation in the neighborhood," said Khin San, who says she watched the violence from her general store across the street. "They don't let people park their cars in front. They are quarrelsome. They have some hatred from the crowd."

 

That hatred had been further stoked by a leaflet signed by a group calling itself "Buddhists who feel helpless" and handed out a few weeks before. It suggested Muslims in Meikhtila were conspiring against Buddhists, assisted by money from Saudi Arabia, and holding shady meetings in mosques. It was addressed to the area's monks.

 

Tensions escalated. By about 5:30 p.m., four Muslim men were waiting at an intersection. As a monk passed on the back of a motorbike, they attacked. One hit the driver with a sword, causing him to crash, witnesses said. A second blow sliced the back of the monk's head. One of the men doused him in fuel and set him on fire, said Soe Thein, a mechanic who saw the attack.

 

The monk died in hospital.

 

Soe Thein, a Buddhist, ran to the market. "A monk has been killed! A monk has been killed!" he cried. As he ran back, a mob followed and the riots began. Muslim homes and shops went up in flames.

 

Soe Thein identified the attackers by name and said he saw several in the village days after the monk was murdered. Police declined to say whether they were among 13 people arrested and under investigation related to the Meikhtila violence.

Edited April 9, 2013 by Vmarco

[RongzomFan]

The only true Buddhists, that I have observed, are the Scottish. When attacked repeatedly by England they picked up and moved to USA - creating Nova Scotia (Nova Scotia is Latin for New Scotland)

 

 

I'm not getting this.

 

 

Are you saying that the Scottish understand emptiness?

[Vmarco]

I'm not getting this.

 

 

Are you saying that the Scottish understand emptiness?

 

I think he is suggesting that Buddhists are suppose to be passive,...and that is not true,...except for Westerners that don't understand Buddhism.

 

"In fact, one of the precepts of the Bodhisattva vows is to take strong countermeasures when the situation calls for it. If a Bodhisattva doesn't take strong countermeasures when the situation requires, then that constitutes an infraction of one of the vows." HH Dalai Lama

[Harmonious Emptiness]

Fear short-circuiting wisdom is the cause of these things, not the dharma.

 

Just wanted to restate that this is the cause according to the dharma. This time Buddhism is the religion being used as this instrument. This is how religious, cultural, and political imperialism develop.

Edited April 9, 2013 by Harmonious Emptiness

[konchog uma]

instead of considering that by adopting the philosophy of Buddhism, people should be immune to their own emotions and the oppression of invaders, and somehow be passive sheep in the face of violence... lets consider how you would react if your neighbor came into your house and took all your stuff and threw it out and replaced it with his stuff, and told you that you would be paying him rent now.

 

Not a pefect analogy, but lets consider the humanity of the situation before jumping to knee jerk conclusions. Its a little more complex than adopting a philosophy of nonviolence and being somehow "saved" from our own dark sides... that whole mindset seems very christian and naive to me. Buddhists get angry, Buddhists love their country of origin, Buddhists dislike oppression, Buddhists react emotionally, Buddhists are human beings not saints... in my opinion there is nothing difficult to understand about this.

 

People who put religion on a pedestal and expect it to solve all problems and get whiney when it doesn't are holding a false view.

[RongzomFan]

Buddhism doesn't teach passivity. Tibetans fought and killed the chinese. You just have to give back your monk precepts first.

[voidisyinyang]

Buddhism doesn't teach passivity. Tibetans fought and killed the chinese. You just have to give back your monk precepts first.

 

Bon, Buddhism and Democracy: The Building of a Tibetan National Identity ...

By Per Kvaerne, Rinzin Thargyal

 

...Bonpos are faced with the alternatives of converting to Buddhism or fleeing into exile.

 

http://books.google.com/books?id=dyWyYq_BBH8C&pg=PA45&lpg=PA45&dq=buddhism+bonpos+exiled&source=bl&ots=i_VuDZd6ua&sig=b5ZQ--nWsvia2yUz_t19-KBsxlw&hl=en&sa=X&ei=SU9kUanYI-Tf2QWO0oHgBA&ved=0CGwQ6AEwCQ#v=onepage&q=buddhism%20bonpos%20exiled&f=false

 

So to define something in the negative is classic Buddhist "neti, neti" logic!!

 

haha. Buddhism was certainly not passive when it aggressively took over Tibet.

 

Buddhism seems to be dependent on aggressive state power -- the tactic appears to be to convert the political leader who then uses force to set up the monasteries, etc.

 

So then there is "peace" in the Empire or nation or whatever -- with the Buddhist monks -- but then the monks are basically trained to defend the political leader if necessary.

 

But the conversion to Buddhism is a top-down approach with the state government enforcing it militarily.

 

So yeah I guess that is not being passive.

 

But it's not that different from Islam.

 

the thing about Islam is that the tribe Mohammed used to spread Islam -- that tribe had just developed iron weapons and so had an advantage over the other tribes.

 

If you read the Hadiths of Islam they are really alchemical texts - the sun is the right hand and the moon is the left hand, etc.

 

It's probably similar with Buddhism being an iron age spreading religion as the Iron Age started with iron weapons developing in India around 1200 BCE.

 

http://books.google.com/books?id=Kp9uaQTQ8h8C&pg=PA53&lpg=PA53&dq=asoka+iron+weapons&source=bl&ots=2ZNgxVKrKy&sig=NcHdW8aqtYYJykyC3ebhDQJIaMA&hl=en&sa=X&ei=J1JkUfS8JYGi2QX32IDIDg&ved=0CDYQ6AEwAA#v=onepage&q=asoka%20iron%20weapons&f=false

 

Yeah just as I suspected - at first Asoka did not have weapons but then he developed iron-based weapons....

[RongzomFan]

So to define something in the negative is classic Buddhist "neti, neti" logic!!

 

neti neti is Advaita dude.

[RongzomFan]

haha. Buddhism was certainly not passive when it aggressively took over Tibet.

 

 

Buddhism aggressively took over Tibet? I read countless books on Tibetan history, but this is news to me.

 

Tibetans genuinely loved and absorbed all aspects of Indian culture from medicine to whatever.

 

Indian culture naturally spread to Afghanistan, China, Japan, southeast asia etc.

Edited April 9, 2013 by alwayson

[thelerner]

Once more you've shown your inability to comprehend English. I never insinuated,...not even in the slightest,...to obliterate anyone,...nor would I.

 

There will NEVER be peace through inter-faith,....through tolerance of beliefs,....but ONLY by letting go of beliefs.

 

Know Allah, no Peace; Gnow Peace, no Allah.

 

The Heart essence of life cannot be understood through theism. As Chogyam Trungpa said, "we need to let go of theism."

 

As for me,...I look forward to the Kalachakra War as soon as possible. Not that I'm for war,...but for most, like yourself, it will take war, both inner and out, to rid the world of belief systems that think people are their beliefs.

 

So you've given up on tolerance. Look forward to Kalachakra war, but you're not 'for war'(!?), just look forward to it. I'd say your not just for war, you're happy to incite it w/ inflammatory language. Just beware light the fire of war and it burns all. Better to seek tolerance.

 

You post in absolutes and in your own strange glanguage. There are many, I'd say most Muslims, know Peace and are peaceful. Are good neighbors and friends. You won't know that, can't, as long you start out lecturing people about their pedophile prophet etc., methinks you're the one who won't know peace. Waiting til some Tibetan mythic war to take place is not the way to go.

 

You have the ultimate circular illogic, You believe everyone should believe just like you, if not; War until they do, until there beliefs are obliterated. (The (anti-?)religious war to end all wars. That always works. 'Fight for what you don't believe in' (possible motto)) Funny since you claim your belief is in no beliefs. Like a true fundamentalist its not enough for you believe and live by it; Everyone must, otherwise you look forward to war, the crushing of their beliefs and substitution of your own.

 

Tolerance, respect for civility, law and each other is the way. But if you lived near Muslims, with your belief system you'd be wonderful at starting little mini conflicts.

Edited April 9, 2013 by thelerner

[Friend]

Edited August 17, 2013 by Friend

[RongzomFan]

http://books.google.com/books?id=dyWyYq_BBH8C&pg=PA45&lpg=PA45&dq=buddhism+bonpos+exiled&source=bl&ots=i_VuDZd6ua&sig=b5ZQ--nWsvia2yUz_t19-KBsxlw&hl=en&sa=X&ei=SU9kUanYI-Tf2QWO0oHgBA&ved=0CGwQ6AEwCQ#v=onepage&q=buddhism%20bonpos%20exiled&f=false

 

 

You totally misinterpreted. This book is referring to a terma text. There was no such thing as Bon before Buddhism.

 

If you mix up terma history with actual history, you are going to get confused.

Edited April 9, 2013 by alwayson

[Harmonious Emptiness]

Its a little more complex than adopting a philosophy of nonviolence and being somehow "saved" from our own dark sides... that whole mindset seems very christian and naive to me. Buddhists get angry, Buddhists love their country of origin, Buddhists dislike oppression, Buddhists react emotionally, Buddhists are human beings not saints... in my opinion there is nothing difficult to understand about this.

 

People who put religion on a pedestal and expect it to solve all problems and get whiney when it doesn't are holding a false view.

 

As I see it, both Buddhism and Christianity have hopes to transform the world we live in by transforming the people who live in it; however, there that transformation takes place on the internal plane. When the external plane is in chaos, the best that can be done is to be like the water trigram (of two passive lines surrounding one solid line): there are external situations that need to be acted on, but if that internal line is disrupted the whole thing is destroyed. As we can see by how this situation developed, it was people who got angry and fearful of being taken over and this reaction led to a destruction of the external and internal worlds.

 

What's going on is directly political. True Christianity and true Buddhism can effect politics indirectly by changing behaviour, but what's going on is a departure from the confidence in the power of the teachings of the religion and engaging in external politics instead. To say that these situations are related to the religion is just an illusion created by the external politics which has no more confidence in the power of what those religions teach.

 

This is not to say that fearing for the safety of your neighbors and family is only for weak people, I'm just talking about the mob mentality and other reactions that resulted.

[voidisyinyang]

You totally misinterpreted. This book is referring to a terma text. There was no such thing as Bon before Buddhism.

 

If you mix up terma history with actual history, you are going to get confused.

 

So that means Buddhism is actually Islam.

 

 

Second, the oral history claims Bon began 17,000 years ago in central Asia where Persia succeeded Bon's widespread growth with Islam.

 

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bon

[RongzomFan]

So that means Buddhism is actually Islam.

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bon

 

First off, I don't go by Wikipedia.

 

 

Secondly, I don't know what the fuck you are talking about, as usual.

[RongzomFan]

Yeah Buddhism is actually Islam