Your Original Face

[Wu Ming Jen]

Master says to student,do you know where you came from? Student replies,I don't Know. Master says then you do know.Student/ What do you mean? Master/ You are telling me you come from the unknown. Student/ I do not understand. Master/ What is there to understand about the unknown, it just is. Years latter student reaches realization.

 

Master ask the same question to another student and student replies I don't care Master says you have potential.

 

What is your original face before your mother and father were born?

[Samurai Mountain man]

What is your original face before your mother and father were born?

 

 

Every possible face, thus no face at all.

[Wu Ming Jen]

That's Awesome

[Taomeow]

Chinese tradition holds that the worst thing that can happen to a person is "loss of face."

"Face" in its cultural connotations is a broad concept that includes, but is not limited to, your integrity (a correspondence between what you claim to be and what you prove to be), your idiosyncratic way to connect to other people and the larger world, your essential "worth" as a human being. This is not necessarily put together out of positives -- you can be a monster, but you better not fail to maintain all the attributes of your monstrosity or you'll lose your face as a monster. "Loss of face" includes, but is not limited to, loss of respect, of clout, of being taken seriously, of being taken "for face value." It is a disaster second to none -- "loss of face" is the leading cause of suicide in Asian communities.

So the question about what one's face was like before his parents were born is not unrelated. It may have been the face of a peasant or the face of a king. For thousands of years, you were born into a predicament you couldn't change. Your face was shaped by your ancestry, long before your parents were born. But what came before the first peasant ancestors and before the first king ancestors? That, too, shaped your face. But before that? The source, the origin, the what we're patterned on -- that's not faceless. It has "the virtues of tao" -- benevolence, reliability, duration, creativity, simplicity, fertility, and so on. So your original face is like that -- it is the face of virtue, the face of perfection. Whatever happened to change that -- that's "loss of face." Of the original face. The worst disaster of them all...

[Wu Ming Jen]

 

But before that? The source, the origin, the what we're patterned on -- that's not faceless. It has "the virtues of tao" -- benevolence, reliability, duration, creativity, simplicity, fertility, and so on. So your original face is like that -- it is the face of virtue, the face of perfection. Whatever happened to change that -- that's "loss of face." Of the original face. The worst disaster of them all... Nice

Edited April 12, 2013 by Wu Ming Jen

[manitou]

Master ask the same question to another student and student replies I don't care Master says you have potential.

 

This is wonderful. He has potential because he doesn't care.

 

The concept of 'face', it seems to me, is being constantly concerned about how others are perceiving you. This is to deny that we are all part of the One. To truly be a loving individual and try and live our lives by the Tao, to exist and dwell in love for ourselves and all others is to not care how we are being perceived. This way, we don't stifle our own actions and can live in freedom and harmony, regardless of what we perceive others to be thinking of us.

 

I discovered that there is much truth in 'Judge not lest ye be judged', to quote the Nazarene. There seems to be a direct relation between how often we have judgmental thoughts towards others (friends or strangers) and the fact that we assume they are judging us. We 'feel' judged if we are judgmental. It seems to work like the scales of justice.

[idiot_stimpy]

Think back, way back, to a time just after you were born and hadn't learnt any language.

 

Where was the mental thinker then? How could there be thoughts if language was not there to facilitate them.

 

Therefore who are you? The thoughts came after, a learned and conditioned phenomena.

[chenping]

Chinese tradition holds that the worst thing that can happen to a person is "loss of face."

 

To lose the original face is to lose moral composure. Immorality knows no shame.

Cultures that have no shame love the shock value of losing face.

 

[Taomeow]

Do you see the difference though between a "culture" and a pile of trash peddled by corporations for mass consumption? All governments are such corporations too, incidentally. You wouldn't mistake maoist ideology and the whole cultural modus operandi created on its basis for "Chinese culture," would you?.. Well, it's the same here. We the people are not them the overlords. Although of course there's people -- everywhere, here and there and everywhere -- who don't know it and identify with whatever they're being brainwashed into identifying with. That's another way to lose face -- to lose YOUR face and substitute the face of a "nation," "race," "religion," "just-like-you-ness" or "not-like-you-ness" and so on... but you're not falling for that, are you?.. That would be a fall a lot harder and a lot less dignified than the one the model took.

[Wu Ming Jen]

When I was in China on our return trip from Wudang two young girls met at us at the train station, got us a cab, transferred us to the subway and then got us to the airport in Beijing..They were very important and did a great service., At the airport I tried to pay them and they would not take the money, A chinese speaking american at the airport helped us translate.The girls did not take the money and the American helping us explained accepting would be like being a beggar and loss of face. The fact that we were very thankful and we had great respect for them in helping us out was like giving them great wealth,

 

Fun facts while in China - the girls were holding hands, friends hold hands, male or female

There is no such thing as personal space we all share the same space. Even driving other cars yield and make space for you. The constant honking is to say here I am, not the american version of road rage and screw you.

Realized I live in a fear based society in America. In China everyone takes care of each other especially kids.

The lack of crime, cops not wearing guns, So many situations while traveling showed how societies with fear of god, man against nature and so on is a horrible psychological disease. People in china seem to love america,

[Vanir Thunder Dojo Tan]

psychological disease. im trying to cure myself, but it's hard not to become poisoned when you are swimming in it!

[manitou]

psychological disease. im trying to cure myself, but it's hard not to become poisoned when you are swimming in it!

 

 

It is truly a discipline, trying to keep the thoughts high. But the rewards will be when the manifestations start changing.