PUA and Spirituality

[Creation]

I dont mean to minimise the pain of being single, and how painful it must be to feel unable to find a partner. I'm sorry if I appear to be doing that. I am sorry if I appear glib or priveleged about relationships, that must be kind of irritating..

Thank you for understanding, cat.

Edited May 25, 2013 by Creation

[Maddie]

Quite oposite in my case .. I used to be celibate for loooong long time , and in all this time I never (literally never ) even thought about sex or attraction for man was not attractive , my mind was somwhere else .

 

However man kept on being attarcted to me , although I dressed down , cut off my hair , wore trainers and jeans 24/7 , no make up , looking like a boy ...and was even sort of proposed to get married by this guy whom I hardly knew .

He must have built some imaginary tale in his head about me or something wierd to make that proposition .

Another man kept on following me around , wanting my company and when I refused him he thought I was playing hard to get or something and when I actually screamed another time (that was last resort ) for him to leave me alone he still wouldnt understand , until my friend had a word with him eventually telling him to leave me alone .

 

Yup that is how it works, especially if your celibate and meditate. Yea the same stuff happens to me. I'm celibate and meditate and not only don't try to meet women, I try to avoid them (as not to get distracted from my meditation). So case in point, last night I get asked out to diner with one girl from school, today I get asked out to lunch from another girl from school. This is just with in the last 24 hours. I don't try to woo them, in fact I try to avoid eye contact and anything but the most innocent of conversation topics.

 

When your celibate and meditate you develop your qi, and this just draws people to you like moths to a flame.

[Creation]

I am hesitant to post this here, but maybe something interesting will come of it.

 

I am 23, and I have never had a girlfriend or had sex. I used to think that girls didn't find me attractive. Well, when I started paying attention I realized that they in fact do find me attractive. Just yesterday I was walking by a group of girls I had never met and one says "Hey sexy" as I walk by. I regularly see girls checking me out of the corner of my eye. So that's a step in the right direction. But when I try to interact with people, I normally feel a flatness, a deadness, like "I don't care" "I'm not interested". But in the case I am interested, it somehow never gets past that initial attraction. Sometimes they flake, sometimes they put me in the friend zone, sometimes they move on to another guy when they realize I am not going to reciprocate. They certainly haven't done anything to pursue me, like some of the guys here who are uninterested but beating potential partners off with a stick, LOL, but I suppose that is understandable given how stagnant my emotional energy is.

 

I have been been trying to find a more satisfying way of relating to people in general and women in particular for years now, with limited success. I have looked a lot a lot of dating and relating advice stuff, and learned a lot that will probably be useful at some point, but none of that material has done much to get me past the deep emotional and psychological blocks I have. Such as extreme feelings of isolation, rejection, unwantedness, unworthiness, high standards for and criticalness of potential partners, and intense fear of intimacy, physical or emotional. Mostly their philosophy for this type of stuff is hypnosis and affirmations, which really don't clear out the old gunk to make room for the new, and "clearing" techniques like EFT never worked for me either. The blocks around intimacy in particular hold me up from even taking a first step. Yesterday I tried gently and lovingly caressing my own skin, and I started screaming, then crying. That happens every time I try that. It's like I have all these clogged up emotions around not experiencing love and intimacy that I am unable to receive love and intimacy, even from myself. To be open to loving intimacy with a woman would mean opening up to all that pain with her. Which is terrifying. Because I know that is not something most women want, or could handle.

 

There are a lot of absurd things in this world.

 

Still, at this point I am quite confident that I am heading in the right direction with the work I am doing with myself. I can tell that the emotional baggage is being reduced and that it's just a matter of time and effort.

Edited May 25, 2013 by Creation

[Maddie]

I am hesitant to post this here, but maybe something interesting will come of it.

 

I am 23, and I have never had a girlfriend or had sex. I used to think that girls didn't find me attractive. Well, when I started paying attention I realized that they in fact do find me attractive. Just yesterday I was walking by a group of girls I had never met and one says "Hey sexy" as I walk by. I regularly see girls checking me out of the corner of my eye. So that's a step in the right direction. But when I try to interact with people, I normally feel a flatness, a deadness, like "I don't care" "I'm not interested". In the case I am interested, suddenly I get all needy and validation seeking, or I start getting really terrified of rejection or something like that. Either way, I sabotage the situation somehow and it never gets past that initial attraction. They either flake, or put me in the friend zone, or move on to another guy when they realize I am not going to reciprocate. They certainly don't do anything to pursue me, like some of the guys here who are uninterested but beating potential partners off with a stick, LOL, but I suppose that is understandable given how stagnant my emotional energy is.

 

I have been been trying to find a more satisfying way of relating to people in general and women in particular for years now, with limited success. I have looked a lot a lot of dating and relating advice stuff, and learned a lot that will probably be useful at some point, but none of that material has done much to get me past the deep emotional and psychological blocks I have. (Mostly their philosophy for this type of stuff is hypnosis and affirmations, which really don't clear out the old gunk to make room for the new, and "clearing" techniques like EFT never worked for me either.) Extreme feelings of isolation, rejection, unwantedness, unworthiness. High standards for and criticalness of potential partners. Intense fear of intimacy, physical or emotional. That last one in particular holds me up from even taking a first step. Yesterday I tried gently and lovingly caressing my own skin, and I started screaming, then crying. That happens every time I try that. It's like I have all these clogged up emotions around not experiencing love and intimacy that I am unable to receive love and intimacy, even from myself. To be open to loving intimacy with a woman would mean opening up to all that pain with her. Which is terrifying. Because I know that is not something most women want, or could handle.

 

There are a lot of absurd things in this world.

 

Still, at this point I am quite confident that I am heading in the right direction with the work I am doing with myself. I can tell that the emotional baggage is being reduced and that it's just a matter of time and effort.

 

I don't know what if any practices you do, but based upon I saw you post I'd definitely recommend doing mindfulness meditation and explore all those things you said you feel about yourself regarding relationship and intimacy issues. If you look at them long enough with detached observation they will dissolve of their own accord.

[RongzomFan]

The Guru said, “Lady Kharchen, all ordinary activities of married couples in samsara are like unclean shit, piss and semen. One vomits as soon as they are seen or remembered, so get far away from the karma of misguided thinking."

[suninmyeyes]

..........

Edited May 27, 2013 by suninmyeyes

[suninmyeyes]

Yup that is how it works, especially if your celibate and meditate. Yea the same stuff happens to me. I'm celibate and meditate and not only don't try to meet women, I try to avoid them (as not to get distracted from my meditation). So case in point, last night I get asked out to diner with one girl from school, today I get asked out to lunch from another girl from school. This is just with in the last 24 hours. I don't try to woo them, in fact I try to avoid eye contact and anything but the most innocent of conversation topics.

 

When your celibate and meditate you develop your qi, and this just draws people to you like moths to a flame.

wow you must be super hot in addition to your cultivation in that case .

I certanly wasnt getting asked out twice a day by 2 different guys .. Or are you sure that girls do not like you sometimes as friends and find easy to talk to you ? It is easy to mistake sometimes between two ..

[Creation]

Creation , you are inteligent and cute (I saw you on the photo that time ) -- I tell you this as a friend , dont misunderstand .

Misunderstand? I understand perfectly well. I have plenty of women telling me exactly this. That's exactly the problem. It's always "just a friend", even as they complement me. But I must say I have never been preemptively friendzoned over the internet by someone living halfway around the world that I didn't even express the slightest sexual interest in. That is a new low for me.

 

If you consider yourself my friend, please be honest with me: what was going through your head when you added that caveat and italicized it no less? Why did you not just compliment me? What reaction were you trying to prevent? Were you afraid that I would somehow become burdensome with unrequited affections you imagined me developing if you left me unchecked, like a stalker or something?

 

Anyway, your advice to concentrate on potential for enjoyment rather than stagnation was very timely for me. Thank you for that.

Edited May 25, 2013 by Creation

[Maddie]

wow you must be super hot in addition to your cultivation in that case .

I certanly wasnt getting asked out twice a day by 2 different guys .. Or are you sure that girls do not like you sometimes as friends and find easy to talk to you ? It is easy to mistake sometimes between two ..

 

Oh of course, I'm not saying they all are wanting to hop in the sack with me, I'm sure many of them do just want to hang out as friend (thank god lol). I'm simply talking about pure attraction, whether it be lovers, friends, pals, colleagues what have you.

 

Here is what I'm getting at though, whether its people wanting to date me or simply befriend me I've noticed it picks up more as I meditate with celibacy for longer periods.

 

In fact it seems like sex isn't even necessary. Lately these days simply in conversation with a girl I feel all these electrical tingly sensations all over (feels nice actually) and judging from the expression on their face they seem to be feeling it to or at least something similar. So its not about "sex" its more about the qi and how it feels (it makes simply having a conversation pretty fun lol).

 

I sure hope I'm not coming off sounding like an arrogant prick lol, I'm just reporting simply what happens, my experiences.

Edited May 25, 2013 by dmattwads

[suninmyeyes]

....................

Edited May 27, 2013 by suninmyeyes

[suninmyeyes]

Oh of course, I'm not saying they all are wanting to hop in the sack with me, I'm sure many of them do just want to hang out as friend (thank god lol). I'm simply talking about pure attraction, whether it be lovers, friends, pals, colleagues what have you.

 

Here is what I'm getting at though, whether its people wanting to date me or simply befriend me I've noticed it picks up more as I meditate with celibacy for longer periods.

 

In fact it seems like sex isn't even necessary. Lately these days simply in conversation with a girl I feel all these electrical tingly sensations all over (feels nice actually) and judging from the expression on their face they seem to be feeling it to or at least something similar. So its not about "sex" its more about the qi and how it feels (it makes simply having a conversation pretty fun lol).

 

I sure hope I'm not coming off sounding like an arrogant prick lol, I'm just reporting simply what happens, my experiences.

No you dont sound arrogant . I get you now .

[Maddie]

No you dont sound arrogant . I get you now .

Lol ok. oh btw don't worry its good for you to clarify where you stand with guys cause this is usually how it goes.

 

Girl says: I like you (shes thinking what a nice person and friend this guy is)

 

Guy hears: I'm like so totally head over heals in love with you and want to have your children like right now.

 

[Creation]

Sorry interent can be such limiting way of communication ..

With my history, I assume that there must be something creepy or off-putting about me and I feel pretty desperate for someone to give me some feedback on it what it is. Like "WHAT AM I DOING WRONG PLEASE TELL ME" So I'm quite sure that I would have taken it the same way in person.

 

I imagine that some dating gurus would tell me that the only thing that is creepy and off putting about me is my belief that there is seeming creepy and off putting about me, as amplified by my desperation to know what it is and what to do about it. Which is a very spiritual idea, to come back to topic. It's just a mirage, an illusion, a shadow in the room at night that I mistake for a person.

Edited May 25, 2013 by Creation

[Maddie]

With my history, I assume that there must be something creepy or off-putting about me and I feel pretty desperate for someone to give me some feedback on it what it is. Like "WHAT AM I DOING WRONG PLEASE TELL ME" So I'm quite sure that I would have taken it the same way in person.

 

I imagine that some dating gurus would tell me that the only thing that is creepy and off putting about me is my belief that there is seeming creepy and off putting about me, as amplified by my desperation to know what it is and what to do about it. Which is a very spiritual idea, to come back to topic. It's just a mirage, an illusion, a shadow in the room at night that I mistake for a person.

 

So basically you already get it. As you've already stated women do find you attractive but what messes things up is what is in your mind.

 

So then the answer isn't to keep fruitlessly doing what isn't working and getting the same results i.e. hoping to get a woman. Since the problem is in your mind, then it is in your mind that you need to go and sort out the problem.

 

This is done with meditation. Now its up to you

[Creation]

So then the answer isn't to keep fruitlessly doing what isn't working and getting the same results i.e. hoping to get a woman. Since the problem is in your mind, then it is in your mind that you need to go and sort out the problem.

 

This is done with meditation. Now its up to you

A diagnosis and prescription. Wonderful, that is exactly what I needed.

 

Actually, maybe there is a sense in which I am not being sarcastic...

 

:ph34r:

Edited May 25, 2013 by Creation

[Maddie]

A diagnosis and prescription. Wonderful, that is exactly what I needed.

 

Actually, maybe there is a sense in which I am not being sarcastic...

 

:ph34r:

well I am studying medicine lol

[suninmyeyes]

With my history, I assume that there must be something creepy or off-putting about me and I feel pretty desperate for someone to give me some feedback on it what it is. Like "WHAT AM I DOING WRONG PLEASE TELL ME" So I'm quite sure that I would have taken it the same way in person.

 

I imagine that some dating gurus would tell me that the only thing that is creepy and off putting about me is my belief that there is seeming creepy and off putting about me, as amplified by my desperation to know what it is and what to do about it. Which is a very spiritual idea, to come back to topic. It's just a mirage, an illusion, a shadow in the room at night that I mistake for a person.

I dont know , I actually really like you and appriciate your posts and have never thought of you as creepy in slightest . So I cannot tell you anything else . This is the bare truth .

To me you come across as a brave , intelgent young man who is in touch with your self and working with deep layers of your being , becoming a beutiful butterfly .

 

Maybe it is that you just cannot accept/recgonise that some people actualy do like you .

 

Its very late here , see you tmrw..

Edited May 26, 2013 by suninmyeyes

[Creation]

well I am studying medicine lol

You must have missed the implication that I was sarcastic, just that there was a sense in which I was not. I could tell you were treating me like a patient and I resented it. Hopefully I have made it clear now. The sense in which I was not sarcastic was that it gave me a chance to let go of that resentment.

Edited May 26, 2013 by Creation

[Creation]

I dont know , I actually really like you and appriciate your posts and have never thought of you as creepy in slightest . So I cannot tell you anything else . This is the bare truth .

To me you come across as a brave , intelgent young man who is in touch with your self and working with deep layers of your being , becoming a beutiful butterfly .

Maybe it is that you just cannot accept that some people actauly do like you .

Thank you, that means a lot to me.

 

And I didn't even think you were hitting me me

 

That last line is dead on, by the way.

[Maddie]

You must have missed the implication that I was sarcastic, just that there was a sense in which I was not. I could tell you were treating me like a patient and I resented it. Hopefully I have made it clear now. The sense in which I was not sarcastic was that it gave me a chance to let go of that resentment.

 

I don't understand why you would resent someone trying to help you? You came to this thread presenting a problem, this problem causes you suffering. I wanting to help you alleviate this suffering offer a remedy. What is there to resent in an act of compassion such as that?

[suninmyeyes]

Thank you, that means a lot to me.

 

And I didn't even think you were hitting me me

 

That last line is dead on, by the way.

[Creation]

I don't understand why you would resent someone trying to help you? You came to this thread presenting a problem, this problem causes you suffering. I wanting to help you alleviate this suffering offer a remedy. What is there to resent in an act of compassion such as that?

I wrote out a long response explaining it, but it seems silly to post unless you really want to know.

[Maddie]

I wrote out a long response explaining it, but it seems silly to post unless you really want to know.

Well I did ask

[Creation]

First of all, it is not as simple as trying to help = good. Think about it. Have you never been put off by someone who wanted to help you? Perhaps because you didn't want or ask for their help. Perhaps because you didn't want to change your situation in the first place. Perhaps because the person trying to help you was clearly more interested in feeling good about them self than helping you. I'm sure there are plenty more reasons to feel put off by someone trying to help you.

Second, I most certainly did not "present a problem" in the first post I made. If you go back and read, you'll see that I was merely telling a story about my life, and explicitly stated that I was confident that I was on the right track to heal. Despite this, you inferred that I was presenting a problem and needed your help, and this is precisely what put me off in this particular circumstance. Well, that and the feeling that it was presumptuous of you to dictate a diagnosis and prescription. Like "Who is this guy who has never had a personal conversation with me yet thinks he can just tell me 'it's all in your head; meditate and your problem will dissolve' just from reading one post?" Friendly advice would have gone over much better.

I realize that from an "enlightened" perspective this is just my ego taking things personally (and I must point out that my ego was especially vulnerable because I was publicly sharing about such a painful and private issue). It was great practice for me to try to let go and not get so offended. I went back and read your posts and they didn't push my buttons anymore. But if you want to be a healer be advised that I am not the only person out their with a fragile ego, especially when talking about painful private issues.

[voidisyinyang]

male ejaculation sex is more of an economic exchange with females than spirituality.