I felt a spark while trying to do an inner smile

[lino]

And saw a little bit of a flash of light, then jerked up from a spark...probably my body complaining from the awful position I had lying on the couch

 

I've only been able to get some body awareness and did try the inner smile because the way that it is explained, the inner smile seems to be pretty advanced (smiling into the organs)...at least for me. Next time, I'll do it to the Dan tien (even though I still can't feel it) and my nuts (more JING!! ) only, at least they can't bite me

[lino]

anybody have any tips?

[Leidee]

Don't try too hard.

 

I have a friend who has been meditating for 2 and 1/2 years before he felt the microcosmic orbit happen spontaneously. He wasn't expecting it and it took him by surprise.

 

Best to let ideas of what could or should happen go and just do what feels like it needs to be done at the time

[Neijia]

It's been my impression that... you have to create the Dan Tien, before you can feel it. Or does it exist before then? Chicken and the egg? Anyway.

The harder you try, the more you'll hinder your progress. Concentrate on the doing of it, more than the paying attention to/generating the sensations, and the further you go with it.

 

Of course... like anything, it'll a bit spotty at first, and takes a bit before you'll hit consistency...

 

 

Where did you feel the spark?

[lino]

It's been my impression that... you have to create the Dan Tien, before you can feel it. Or does it exist before then? Chicken and the egg? Anyway.

The harder you try, the more you'll hinder your progress. Concentrate on the doing of it, more than the paying attention to/generating the sensations, and the further you go with it.

 

Of course... like anything, it'll a bit spotty at first, and takes a bit before you'll hit consistency...

Where did you feel the spark?

 

I felt it for a slight fraction of a second when I was at a qigong session that was led by Robert Peng. Also, in my phospenes while checking out the back of my eyelids, I saw a purple web with three black holes or black disks, the bottom one was spinning so I'm assuming that it was the dan tien and that it was activated. I've lost 10 pounds the last month just from doing the abdomen vacuum, pushing out with the buddhist breathing, and restraining myself at the table so that I can do the vacuum. Not to mention that it's gotten extremely painful to be on a full stomach. I've been doing the perineum lifts every chance that I consciously get.

 

The spark was on the top of my head. I've been...ahem..."retaining" for two weeks. I already felt the micro and macrocosmic orbit. The micro was quite powerful for a couple of days. My legs have cleared out a lot of blockages and I'm finally beating back the candida on my tongue. I've been feeling micro sparks on my hands. My mingmen only opens up when I'm lying down though. I've been trying the five gates breathing, it's working but I've only managed to keep my mind on hands, feet, and the macrocosmic orbit (more like 4 points to me).

 

Visualization (fantasizing) is not a strong point for me (for the exception of when I'm thinking of women...for me it works since I'm trying to feed the dan tien) so I have to feel around in my insides.

[lino]

It's been my impression that... you have to create the Dan Tien, before you can feel it. Or does it exist before then? Chicken and the egg? Anyway.

The harder you try, the more you'll hinder your progress. Concentrate on the doing of it, more than the paying attention to/generating the sensations, and the further you go with it.

 

Of course... like anything, it'll a bit spotty at first, and takes a bit before you'll hit consistency...

Where did you feel the spark?

 

Also it seems that for me to be able to feel anything depends on my ability to relax into my body <---and that's only enhanced by my ability to contract. I'm making incredible progress so far, I'm probably going to have to make going to the gym a consistent habit.

[Spectrum]

"you have to create the Dan Tien, before you can feel it. "

 

W/ some folks abstinance for 3 days is enough to "feel" it. No mental creation neccesary. Just control where you put your minds eye. Emptiness is basic prerequisite to mco. You must observe what happens naturally... because the MCO is NATURAL, it's not a manmade concept, however else HT or other systems would have you believe. Pay attention to how you FEEL when the mco happens spontaniously in life... observe... however carefully, the waterway coarse of LIFE.

 

With Respect to your Seeking,

 

Spectrum

[Neijia]

"you have to create the Dan Tien, before you can feel it. "

 

W/ some folks abstinance for 3 days is enough to "feel" it. No mental creation neccesary. Just control where you put your minds eye. Emptiness is basic prerequisite to mco. You must observe what happens naturally... because the MCO is NATURAL, it's not a manmade concept, however else HT or other systems would have you believe. Pay attention to how you FEEL when the mco happens spontaniously in life... observe... however carefully, the waterway coarse of LIFE.

 

With Respect to your Seeking,

 

Spectrum

 

To begin, creative visualization is mandatory. In fact, it's a moot point to even discuss it's neccessity. Lacking prior training, or the accumulation of enough energy to make those observations, a mental nudge is important, if for nothing else than guiding the energy. Which you would do in order to begin to fill the Dan Tien... effectively creating it.

 

As an afterthought... HT is basic at best. And a group of plagurists at worst.

[Spectrum]

And saw a little bit of a flash of light,

 

Question: Did you visualize this flash of light? Or did it happen spontaneously during practice/meditation? From the sounds of your post it sounds very spontaneous, perhaps occuring in a place between wake and sleep (on your account of the jerk)... please expound.

 

"creative visualization is mandatory"

 

I think the center was there before we thought about interaction w/ it. I'm sure we observed something about it to. That is the basis of Taoist meditaiton and chinese medicine; observation of what is natural. The watercourse Way.

 

Observe first; then Guide. Observe what happens naturally in your body when you are breathing quietly. Of coarse it's ok to engage in breathing practice, but observe your practice. What sense does it make to create something you have not had the honor of observing first hand?

 

See what is initiated by the nondoingness of mind and doingness of body.

 

This is a basic dichotomy of thought in many forms of meditations, and assume some debate of coarse.

 

After the quiet mind is cultivated guiding through visualization is easy.

 

HT is basic at best. And a group of plagurists at worst.

 

I quoted in another thread "What is mind, no matter; what is matter, never mind."

 

Nice to hear the fellow seekers are keeping the internal inquiry process alive and well.

 

Spectrum

Edited March 3, 2007 by Spectrum

[Neijia]

Nice to hear the fellow seekers are keeping the internal inquiry process alive and well.

 

 

I can agree with that. Interesting thoughts.

[Spectrum]

I think the main thing I'm trying to say is that although visualization will work, in times when the mind is being it's monkey little self, chattering away, it will be more important for the practitioner to have the ability cultivated to silence the dialog, then to visualize something on top of the chatter, now the question arrises, can you drown out chatter w/ dialog?

 

Perhaps this is why Wu Ji is associated w/ Sung (Song) the psycho-physiological state of mind/body relaxation found in Chinese meditative traditions. Wu Ji isn't a visualization exercise, it's a physical state of being.

 

Now here's an interesting paradox : can you visualize silence and emptiness w/o thinking about it? If visualization is thought, and wuji is no thought, then visualizing emptiness is thinking about not thinking...

 

I think I'll not think about thought like I thunk that....

 

Spectrum

 

Edited March 4, 2007 by Spectrum

[Neijia]

Perhaps this is why Wu Ji is associated w/ Sung (Song) the psycho-physiological state of mind/body relaxation found in Chinese meditative traditions. Wu Ji isn't a visualization exercise, it's a physical state of being.

 

Now here's an interesting paradox : can you visualize silence and emptiness w/o thinking about it? If visualization is thought, and wuji is no thought, then visualizing emptiness is thinking about not thinking...

 

Achieving Bu Hsin, or no mind. The contradiction is that the concept is, by definition, inconceivable, and thus (using Socratic method based Western style reasoning) impossible. The experience and description (or lack? haha), however has been described validated by god knows how many billions of Chinese. That recognition of extraordinary experience and it's utilization being an important part of why I find Taoist arts to be so inspiring and worthy of dedication.

 

Not to go into one of those "In My Tradition" rants, but..

I've seen how monkey mind falls away naturally through the transformative process of physical effort and concentration. But without, of course, tension. And as the body and mind become integrated, and focus shifts to cultivation, the ability to turn the dialogue on and off at will becomes a snap. But of course martial traditions require strong visualization, and it's short hop and application from A to B.

 

Anyway... getting off topic.

Edited March 4, 2007 by Neijia

[lino]

Question: Did you visualize this flash of light? Or did it happen spontaneously during practice/meditation? From the sounds of your post it sounds very spontaneous, perhaps occuring in a place between wake and sleep (on your account of the jerk)... please expound.

I think the center was there before we thought about interaction w/ it. I'm sure we observed something about it to. That is the basis of Taoist meditaiton and chinese medicine; observation of what is natural. The watercourse Way.

 

Observe first; then Guide. Observe what happens naturally in your body when you are breathing quietly. Of coarse it's ok to engage in breathing practice, but observe your practice. What sense does it make to create something you have not had the honor of observing first hand?

 

See what is initiated by the nondoingness of mind and doingness of body.

 

This is a basic dichotomy of thought in many forms of meditations, and assume some debate of coarse.

 

After the quiet mind is cultivated guiding through visualization is easy.

I quoted in another thread "What is mind, no matter; what is matter, never mind."

 

Nice to hear the fellow seekers are keeping the internal inquiry process alive and well.

 

Spectrum

 

I saw the flash of light in the phosphenes on the back of my eyelids and the lights were off in the room.

[soaring crane]

 

To begin, creative visualization is mandatory. In fact, it's a moot point to even discuss it's neccessity....

 

I used to think the same thing but I've learned otherwise. There are ways of contacting your Qi flow without resorting to imagery.

 

I did this with a group of housewives last week.

 

We did foot breathing. Lying down comfortably on your back, hands on the Xia Dantian (or not), legs together, toes pointing upward. On the inhale, we tense the balls of the feel a little, pulling "upward" and on the exhale just let the tension go. We stay focussed on the feet and on the physical action. For a little while.

 

Then I instructed them to consciously lower the amount of tension. With each breath, tense/move the feet intentionally less. And less... and less... After not too many breaths, the movement automatically transfers to the inside and it becomes an energetic, Qi movement. The mind is totally focussed on moving the Qi, just a hair below the level of physical movement. It's like a sliding scale.

 

At that point, we guided the movement up to the knees, then the hips and then through the spine and as far as Mingmen.

 

And then I had them focus on the lower Dantian which worked better than at other times. Total time was about 15-20 minutes.

 

All of them understood the instruction and could follow it more or less easily. One had a great Qi experience when she felt channels opening in her legs and mingmen getting warm as her head cooled.

 

So... there are way for beginners to go about these things without visualizing. Maybe not for all aspects but I'm not sure on that either. And as my teacher says, when you're working with images, you're working in your head.

 

 

 

 

 

I saw the flash of light in the phosphenes on the back of my eyelids and the lights were off in the room.

 

When I meditate these days, I lay in bed with a sleep mask over my eyes and the shades down. I start in a fashion similar to what I described in my other post and once I get into the Qi movement, it becomes very light behind my closed eyes, behind the sleep mask and behind the shades. Not a "flash", though, more like a sunrise.

 

Once or twice I've gotten distracted by fractal patterns and din't feel they were healthy. I don't know why. It's got to be connected with the third eye but is it a healthy opening or a blockage?

 

I think seeing the Dantians would only happen if it were your intention from the outset, but maybe not. A Yoga practitioner would assign the image to chakras.

[lino]

To begin, creative visualization is mandatory. In fact, it's a moot point to even discuss it's neccessity. Lacking prior training, or the accumulation of enough energy to make those observations, a mental nudge is important, if for nothing else than guiding the energy. Which you would do in order to begin to fill the Dan Tien... effectively creating it.

 

As an afterthought... HT is basic at best. And a group of plagurists at worst.

 

http://www.astraldynamics.com/tutorials/?BoardID=6

 

Robert Bruce has developed a meditation system for people that are challenged when it comes to visualization. I found this on the myspace webpage of a martial artist that belongs to the Bujinkan. Most visualization exercises go way too fast for me to even develop a rough mental picture.

[lino]

I think seeing the Dantians would only happen if it were your intention from the outset, but maybe not. A Yoga practitioner would assign the image to chakras.

 

I dunno. There were only three black disks that were in line vertically. I'm almost positive that these were the three treasures:

jing, chi, and shen.

I'm thinking that if I would have seen all seven or nine chakras, I would have seen 7 or 9 disks, or made the fractals that you mentioned.

I've only been able to intentionally awaken one chakra that I know of, the air chakra. I was hoping for the earth chakra first...then again beggars can't be choosers

I might try to open the lower three chakras since I think that the body might be giving me a cue as to what direction it wants to go.

I've unintentionally awakened the third eye a little bit over a year ago, but it was after two weeks of drowning in adrenaline in a sleep deprived state, one week recovery, and almost 48 hours straight of computer use. I had a slight pop in my skull and lots of cold energy started to circulate and it was pretty scary

[soaring crane]

 

I dunno. There were only three black disks that were in line vertically. I'm almost positive that these were the three treasures:

jing, chi, and shen....

 

When I wrote last time, I was thinking more along the lines of a purely spontaneous image but after reading through your personal practice list, I can see why it would be so heavily Dantian-biased. Fantastic stuff.

 

Have you planned any training breaks? Please be careful.

 

With your inner smile... I think it comes from embryonic breathing which involes projecting pureness, the unspoiled original self. Hmm... my German is better for this kind of thing. But what I do is a facial meditation. Relax the face, the forehead, eyes, jaws, ears... the whole head. And let a little smile form itself on the lips.

 

Then slowly pull the smile inward, something along the lines of the foot breathing I described, until you feel it in the middle of your brain. And then just continue along the same path but direct it downward, slowly, until it "lands" in the lower dantian. And feel Dantian smiling

 

And from there, the smile can grow and project itself outward through your whole system. The smile on your lips becomes just a reflection of the smile in your belly

 

But I really think it's best done in connection with gentle ubilical breathing and not a lot of complicated work or concentration on dogmatic systems. But, ymmv.

Edited March 7, 2007 by soaring crane

[lino]

When I wrote last time, I was thinking more along the lines of a purely spontaneous image but after reading through your personal practice list, I can see why it would be so heavily Dantian-biased. Fantastic stuff.

 

Have you planned any training breaks? Please be careful.

 

With your inner smile... I think it comes from embryonic breathing which involes projecting pureness, the unspoiled original self. Hmm... my German is better for this kind of thing. But what I do is a facial meditation. Relax the face, the forehead, eyes, jaws, ears... the whole head. And let a little smile form itself on the lips.

 

Then slowly pull the smile inward, something along the lines of the foot breathing I described, until you feel it in the middle of your brain. And then just continue along the same path but direct it downward, slowly, until it "lands" in the lower dantian. And feel Dantian smiling

 

And from there, the smile can grow and project itself outward through your whole system. The smile on your lips becomes just a reflection of the smile in your belly

 

But I really think it's best done in connection with gentle ubilical breathing and not a lot of complicated work or concentration on dogmatic systems. But, ymmv.

 

Training? what training? training break? I'm getting a lot of enjoyment from this hobby

 

While in the shower today, the circle or donut started changing colors. I think that I may be opening the earth chakra because the green changed to yellow and then to white.

[lino]

Training? what training? training break? I'm getting a lot of enjoyment from this hobby

 

While in the shower today, the circle or donut started changing colors. I think that I may be opening the earth chakra because the green changed to yellow and then to white.

 

I'm lost here. Is there any meaning if the white changes to white diamonds in a donut or circle formation?

[Spectrum]

Lost is a great show. What is the meaning of a rainbow?

 

Let go of the outcome; observe what is natural...

Edited March 9, 2007 by Spectrum

[lino]

Lost is a great show. What is the meaning of a rainbow?

 

Let go of the outcome; observe what is natural...

 

7 or 9 colors?

 

If I get one of those, and I feel that I'm in reasonable enough shape (which I'm not), then I would seriously consider going through the preliminary steps for inner alchemy.

[Spectrum]

13579 ? sounds like lost to me...