How deep can you really go with a Vegetarian Diet?

[4bsolute]

Dear Ones,

 

the famous topic about diet and how it affects our spiritual growth...

 

From my current understanding, energy can flow better and better, the more earth element we reduce in our bodies. What does Tao say about this? Anything at all?

 

This is due to the natural quality of water and it's excellent form of transporting energy.

 

What I have experienced, reducing food, just with a diet, does not work if you do not yet have the propper spiritual background. It might even be the case, that spiritual growth And the food we eat go hand in hand. But it does not seem that the Willingness of Reducing the physical Food intake comes first, rather than the spiritual background, how much our spirit has evolved in this lifetime that it becomes just natural to super-easily step into another diet.

 

From my experience, when we feel trouble or want to restrict something in our lives, regardless of what elder monk says, it shows us that we are somewhat on the wrong path. What feels good is a gradual path to enlightenment and beyond. Maybe this does not fit into your lifestyle. I personally come back to so many things and just witness myself doing so because I have not yet understood certain components.

 

How much ego does that involve? Quite some, but is that important? For the moment not at all. The willingness to understand energies, like best practiced in Taoism, understanding your body, mind, emotions is far more important than jumping right into a liquid diet and want to eagerly meditate all day. This could work, but does not for me.

 

A gradual approach seem to offer so much more... What is more natural than changing your diet Because you see that you hit your limit in your current spiritual level, that your body Wants to become lighter - and not because, like I did initially, want to flee into spirituality to somewhat escape this world. Regardless of what "high" stuff I talk here sometimes...

 

How deep can you really go with a Vegetarian Diet?

 

 

Kind regards. And please for the love of Tao, do what feels good for you! The clinging to the senses will automatically drop as soon as they are understood, naturally and not forced.

Edited June 16, 2013 by 4bsolute

[skydog]

Hi 4bsolute

 

I wanted to express my thoughts on this subject through my blog

 

 

 

http://poemsofsinan.blogspot.co.uk/2013/06/my-own-experimentation-and-healing.html

Edited June 16, 2013 by skydog

[4bsolute]

Hi 4bsolute

 

I wanted to express my thoughts on this subject through my blog

 

 

 

http://poemsofsinan.blogspot.co.uk/2013/06/my-own-experimentation-and-healing.html

 

Do you speak DE? Since you have appear on a german blogspot

 

Thank you very much for sharing this.

[Chang]

Research certainly shows that a reduction in the amount of food we consume can extend our lifespan.

 

It can also certainly be argued that a vegetarian diet can expedite our spiritual growth and many would take this further espousing a vegan or raw food diet, perhaps even fruitarian.

 

There are also those who believe that a breatharian existance is possible. I new a fellow practitioner of the Taoist Arts who was working towards this and had reduced his food intake to one apple per day. To say that I have seen healthier looking corpses would be an understatement.

 

My own view is to follow a far less strict diet but aim towards what I consider healthy. But what is considered healthy by me is arbitrary and so I will not bother to relate it here. We should also keep aware of the fact that traditionally diet would reflect the geographical whereabouts of the person concerned. In the old days you would struggle to find a vegetarian Eskimo.

 

I believe that there is a quote from the Gospel of Thomas to the effect that we should pay more attention to what comes out of our mouth than what goes in it. We would all do well to reflect on this.

[Flolfolil]

we should pay more attention to what comes out of our mouth than what goes in it.

i know what i am saying the next time i encounter a butthurt moral vegan....

[skydog]

Do you speak DE? Since you have appear on a german blogspot

 

Thank you very much for sharing this.

 

I dont I am afraid, no.

 

This is just a temporary blog for me to expend some energy on until I get a proper website.

 

Thanks for the comments David

 

Cheers, your friend

[baiqi]

If you are looking for health and/or better energy flow, reducing meat is enough. (Unless you are already eating very little, which is pretty rare). I'd say once or twice a month is fine, when you go out with friends or family for example.

 

However, if you are talking about sprituality, it implies compassion for every living creature, not just humans. In that case,even a vegetarian diet isn't enough. Actually, I don't know what is enough.

So you're question: "how far..." is a very good one.

 

 

we should pay more attention to what comes out of our mouth than what goes in it.

Both are equally important, for different reasons. The hexagramm "Yi" of the Yijing, roughly says: " watch the movement of your mouth".

[Tom Lin]

I think that when you are along the path of your spiritual growth it is natural for oneself to reduce or even cut out consumption of meat.

 

Properly transitioning into a plant-based diet needs to come from the heart or else it will eventually falter (from what i have observed). When your spiritual progressing your always going to want to create more positivity in your lifestyle and so becoming a vegetarian or a vegan greatly impact your daily routine a positive way. Your treating your body with reverence while contributing to a finer planet (no mutilation and slaughtering of animals)...

[Jainarayan]

I believe that there is a quote from the Gospel of Thomas to the effect that we should pay more attention to what comes out of our mouth than what goes in it. We would all do well to reflect on this.

 

It can also be found in the Synoptic Gospel of Matthew 15:11 "Not that which goeth into the mouth defileth a man, but that which cometh out of the mouth, this defileth a man.”

 

I've been attempting vegetarianism for the reasons of compassion and ahimsā, but I am struggling. I say struggling, because I'm gluten intolerant and carb intolerant and insulin resistant. Therefore wheat products are completely out; the typical legumes and grains are too carb-heavy. If I eschew eggs and fish, I am limited to milk (lactose-free, being lactose intolerant also ), yogurt, cheeses, fruits and vegetables. One can eat only so much fruit and vegetables. Herbivores graze all day because plants are so macro-nutrient poor.

 

For me beef is out, though there is no religious or theological injunction against it; I'm not wild about the idea of mammal flesh anyway. So I may return to chicken and seafood. I don't think it's in one's best interest for spiritual development to be so preoccupied with diet, or to put one's body at health risks. Even the Buddha called for the middle way. And I think that middle way is relative to each person.

[Stosh]

It can also be found in the Synoptic Gospel of Matthew 15:11 "Not that which goeth into the mouth defileth a man, but that which cometh out of the mouth, this defileth a man.”

 

I've been attempting vegetarianism for the reasons of compassion and ahimsā, but I am struggling. I say struggling, because I'm gluten intolerant and carb intolerant and insulin resistant. Therefore wheat products are completely out; the typical legumes and grains are too carb-heavy. If I eschew eggs and fish, I am limited to milk (lactose-free, being lactose intolerant also ), yogurt, cheeses, fruits and vegetables. One can eat only so much fruit and vegetables. Herbivores graze all day because plants are so macro-nutrient poor.

 

For me beef is out, though there is no religious or theological injunction against it; I'm not wild about the idea of mammal flesh anyway. So I may return to chicken and seafood. I don't think it's in one's best interest for spiritual development to be so preoccupied with diet, or to put one's body at health risks. Even the Buddha called for the middle way. And I think that middle way is relative to each person.

Thanks , thats precisely the reason why I am so against this unhealthy association of food with spirituality.

Its wrong, egotistically flattering, and physically unwise unless your metabolism fits it.

I need to eat extra vitamin d and B2 , thats just my metabolism..

so Ive been encouraged to eat red meats fish and dairy , and thats exactly what I am doing, and I think I can "out spiritual" most of the folks here.

 

[Jainarayan]

Thanks , thats precisely the reason why I am so against this unhealthy association of food with spirituality.

Its wrong, egotistically flattering, and physically unwise unless your metabolism fits it.

I need to eat extra vitamin d and B2 , thats just my metabolism..

so Ive been encouraged to eat red meats fish and dairy , and thats exactly what I am doing, and I think I can "out spiritual" most of the folks here.

 

 

I've been having a conversation with someone who was vegetarian for a very long time, and even vegan for a period of time. Half of her family is vegetarian. She and I both came to the conclusion that you can't bow to peer pressure, internet or real life. I know that's what's happened to me... I am pliable and prone to bowing to other people's opinions, even against my own better judgment and knowledge of my body and mind. It's further compounded by Buddhist and Hindu scriptures waffling on meat-eating. I won't deny that I have a measure of guilt because of Vaishnava Hindus (particularly Vaishnavas) who harp on certain (ambiguous) passages of the Bhagavad Gita as requiring vegetarianism. Well, there are as many passages that refute these people. I always say swim at your own karmic risk.

 

Anyway, I'm digressing. She related to me how sick she got being on a vegetarian diet, not because there is anything intrinsically and inherently wrong with it, but because of the food intolerances she also has, and forcing her body to adapt to something it is not suited for. One of her comments was that one man's medicine is another man's poison. You have to do what's best for you. I mentioned ahimsa before, non-violence; but that non-violence also extends to ourselves physically, mentally and spiritually. Many of us who are theistic also believe that God does not want us to suffer or do himsa to ourselves in the name of religion or scriptures. I myself need to remember that.

[三江源]

and I think I can "out spiritual" most of the folks here.

 

what does this mean? How do you 'out spiritual' someone?

[Stosh]

I'm smiling at your comments "it's wrong" and "I can out spiritual most" here. Interesting viewpoints in the same post.

I get a little tired about having to pussyfoot when others are tramping around in clogs.

 

I'm glad someone can see the sillyness of quantifying spirituality and making that kind of comparison.

Now if the vegetarian-spiritual connectors could see that ego crutch for what it is we'd be cooking with gas, bt I guess it will fall on deaf ears, it is much easier to adjust a diet than shift an attitude drop an illusion or forgo the substitute.

Carbs make people fat , retain triglycerides, exhaughst the pancreas, and subdue the energy of will.

Its just a chemically mediated situation. For Those who can make it work terriffic, but circumvention of the problems doesn't make them not exist , they continue in the form of the detour.

Edited June 19, 2013 by Stosh

[Stosh]

what does this mean? How do you 'out spiritual' someone?

Good question! Ask the folks claiming greater spirituality based on food selection.

[baiqi]

Spirituality is not based just on food selection, but it is a part of the equation. It is indeed hard to quantify it, but there are standards. For example, let's say I get angry all the time, beat my children, watch stupid things on TV, don't care about my health ... there is very little chance that I am enlighted in any way.

 

Now, if you have food intolerance, that may be a good reason for not being vegetarian, just like there are some parts of the world where it's harder than in others. You need to be realistic . However, if I were in your position, I'd at least give it a try. Just ask yourself these questions:

- what do I need to be healthy? What makes me ill? Where can I find everything I need (without being sick) excepted in meat?

 

If you can't find everything you need in vegetables, well it's fine to eat meat.

Make sure however it is the case. Lots of people still believe, for example, that you won't get enough protein if you don't eat meat, which isn't true.

[Stosh]

Its not just the quantity of protein, but the types of amino acids and the problem of having to substitute carbs for the protein

because the body cant provide enough glucose from fats alone to keep you going.(brains run on glucose solely and the conversions of foodstuffs is not based on your attitude)

( and spirulina is fifty times as expensive as chicken)

 

But aside from the nutritional things ( nutrition isnt the OP stance for going vegan here)

 

Understanding that there is no right or wrong (that is not subjective) is part of what I am trying to underline.

If the rightness or wrongness of killing and eating things is subjective then it doesnt have any basis to consider themselves better because of their food selections. They could deny themselves fruit ,dancing or television instead. (It isnt doing any favors to spread the idea that one needs to conform to a complicated and potentially harmful diet to be or indicate they are "good" people )

It is the teaching oneself restraint and strengthening will that is the potential spiritual benefit.

Teaching that all life is unified means that things dying and being eaten is just part of the cycle of life, wildebeest are not less or more spiritual than lions, and grass is not better than wildebeest.

Yin and yang together form the cycle , they dont exist alone, so yin or yang doesnt equate to 'good and bad' or 'nice and mean'. Its still clinging to value judgements.

 

 

However, if you are talking about sprituality, it implies compassion for every living creature, not just humans. In that case,even a vegetarian diet isn't enough.

 

Enough for what?

 

That ..is a value judgement compassion is not a sentiment central to the spirituality of Tao but If you are of a Buddhist bent it is self consistent, I guess.

 

What does it mean to keep ones footprint small if no one ( including me) cares to refrain from judgement or interference? Thats one reason why the wise keep their mouth shut.

Another is that the breath is usually wasted .

Edited June 19, 2013 by Stosh

[baiqi]

It doesn't matter whether you're a buddhist, a taoist or whatever.

 

 

That ..is a value judgement compassion is not a sentiment central to the spirituality of Tao but If you are of a Buddhist bent it is self consistent, I guess.

 

 

Compassion is central to all genuine spiritual traditions, including Taoism. It is part of the "three treasures" mentioned in the DDJ for example. Believing you can get "spiritual" without it is a mistake. This is a simple fact.

 

I am not into Buddhism (although I respect it), BTW.

 

 

Enough for what?

Enough to stop this useless exploitation/slaughtering of millions of sentient beings.

 

 

Its not just the quantity of protein, but the types of amino acids

That is not a problem either. Make your own search.