The decline and eventual fall of the USA as world superpower?

[ralis]

And that is why I have bought coffee at Starbucks only once in my life.

 

I go into Starbucks to use their wifi when traveling.

[Marblehead]

I try to reemain an optimist but it is really hard anymore when the discussion involves governments, the stock markeys, financial institutions and big industry.

 

I have always said that Bernanke is part of the problem but the rich folks like him so he remains to earn those big bucks.

[Marblehead]

I go into Starbucks to use their wifi when traveling.

And you take your coffee that you bought across the street at McDonalds with you, right?

 

I always get a seniors' coffee when I go to McDonalds (which isn't very often).

[voidisyinyang]

Gee I guess slave labor is o.k. for another 7 years.....

 

 

Hershey Slave Labor Will End With Switch to Fair Trade Cocoa

Hershey slave labor to end, as chocolate giant vows to use certified Fair Trade cocoa by 2020.

 

 

http://www.takepart.com/article/2012/10/06/hershey-vows-stop-using-child-slave-labor-eight-more-years

 

The news agency also states that independent research conducted by Tulane University under contract from the U.S. Department of Labor, estimates about 1.8 million children are believed to work on those West African cocoa farms. Approximately 40% of the children―who range in age from five to 17―don't attend school of any kind. Some are reportedly subjected to beatings and prolonged exposure to pesticides and extreme heat.

According to the ILRF, Hershey slave labor "makes billions" for the company at the expense of these children, only about fifteen percent of whom it estimates are paid any wages at all.

[Marblehead]

That is what my government allows big business to do. Look again at the skin color of my president.

[voidisyinyang]

That is what my government allows big business to do. Look again at the skin color of my president.

 

Corporations own the government.

 

Check out HErshey lobbying expenditures - when this issue was in Congress.

 

http://www.opensecrets.org/lobby/clientsum.php?id=D000026470&year=2012

 

So 2010 it was $475 K

 

2011 it was over $500 K

 

2012 it was over $1 million

 

2013 dropped back to $150,000

 

Why? 'cuz Hershey got what it wanted - an 8 year delay.

 

http://thecnnfreedomproject.blogs.cnn.com/2012/01/19/child-slavery-and-chocolate-all-too-easy-to-find/

 

 

Abdul is 10 years old, a three-year veteran of the job.

He has never tasted chocolate.

During the course of an investigation for CNN’s Freedom Project initiative - an investigation that went deep into the cocoa fields of Ivory Coast - a team of CNN journalists found that child labor, trafficking and slavery are rife in an industry that produces some of the world’s best-known brands.

It was not supposed to be this way.

After a series of news reports surfaced in 2001 about gross violations in the cocoa industry, lawmakers in the United States put immense pressure on the industry to change.

 

http://www.globalexchange.org/corporateHRviolators#Hershey

 

In 2012 Hershey announced that two of its products, Bliss and Dagoba, a small portion of their product mix, will be certified by Rainforest Alliance in order to deal with complaints of forced child labor in their supply chain. They also claim to be taking action to increase yields through farmer education in order to increase income to cocoa farmers and that they support children’s programs in the US and West Africa. They still do not support policies to stop child labor. While 60 companies and organizations have signed a statement called the “Commitment to Ethical Cocoa Sourcing: Abolishing Unfair Labor Practices and Addressing Their Root Causes,” Hershey has not. Hershey has refused to pay farmers a guaranteed fair wage, refused to make visible its supply chain down to the farm level, refused to support the enforcement of anti trafficking law, and refused to commit to sourcing from farms who operate based on ILO labor standards.

Edited July 20, 2013 by pythagoreanfulllotus

[voidisyinyang]

To combat the child slavery in cocoa production, US Representative Eliot Engel introduced a legislative amendment to fund the development of a "no child slavery" label for chocolate products sold in the United States. Senator Tom Harkin proposed an addition to an agriculture bill to label qualified chocolate and cocoa products as "slave free".^[37] It was approved in the House of Representatives by a vote of 291–115,^[38] but before it went to the Senate the chocolate makers hired former senators George Mitchell and Bob Dole to lobby against it,^[37] and it did not go to a vote.^[38] Instead, the chocolate manufactures agreed with the Congressmen to create the Harkin-Engel Protocol^[39] to remove child slavery from the industry by July 2005.^[37] The voluntary agreement was a commitment by the industry groups to develop and implement voluntary standards to certify cocoa produced without the "worst forms of child labor,"^[39] and was signed by the heads of major chocolate companies, Congressmen, the Ambassador of Côte d'Ivoire, and others concerned with child labor.^[39]

The chocolate makers were to create programs in West Africa to make Africans aware of the consequences of child labor, keeping their children from an education, and child trafficking. The primary incentive for the companies' voluntary participation would be the addition of a "slave free" label.^[37] The 2005 deadline was not met,^[40][41] and all parties agreed to a three-year extension of the Protocol.^[41][42] This extension allowed the cocoa industry more time to implement the Protocol including creating a certification system to address the worst forms of child labor for half of the growing areas in Côte d'Ivoire and Ghana.^[42][43] By 2008, industry had collected data on over half of the areas, as required, but they did not have proper independent verification.^[44] In June 2008, the Protocol was extended until the end of 2010. At that time, the industry was required to have full certifications with independent verifications.^[42]

The European Union passed a resolution in 2012 to fully implement the Harkin-Engel Protocol and fight child labor in cocoa production.^[45] The resolution was criticized by the International Labor Rights Forum for having no legally binding measures and two major chocolate manufacturers claimed they were addressing the problem.^[45]

 

 

Like I said - goverment works for the corporations!!

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Children_in_cocoa_production

[narveen]

i wonder why you guys are bitching about the ways of the free-market

anyone wants to go to china or russia?

 

bad as she may seems, the usa is still the best deal on the planet

so, deal with it.

Edited July 20, 2013 by narveen

[ralis]

i wonder why you guys are bitching about the ways of the free-market

anyone wants to go to china or russia?

 

bad as she may seems, the usa is still the best deal on the planet

so, deal with it.

 

There is no free market. In order for markets to function there must be regulations. I refer you back to the recent posts on gas prices caused by unfettered rampant speculation. Deregulation of the trading environment means we are all paying dearly at the pump!

[voidisyinyang]

And you take your coffee that you bought across the street at McDonalds with you, right?

 

I always get a seniors' coffee when I go to McDonalds (which isn't very often).

 

http://t.co/oIOLrQfymu

 

Sign the petition link!

 

 

Here in the Northeast, we’re in the middle of one of the worst heat waves of the summer. It’s sweltering outside. But for McDonald’s workers in New York, it’s even hotter inside. That’s because McDonald’s is forcing its employees to come to work even though the air conditioning in the kitchen is broken. Worse yet, McDonald’s bosses knew the AC was broken, but they did nothing to fix it.

 

It’s gotten so bad, a McDonald’s cook was just put into an ambulance after she passed out from the heat.

Workers at that McDonald’s have walked off the job in protest of the inhumane working conditions. They need us to add our voices to their fight for McDonald’s to keep its workers safe at work during heat waves.

 

Sign our petition telling McDonald’s to cool it.

 

"In the middle of a heat wave like this, to be expected to stand in a hot kitchen with no air conditioning is inhumane and unsafe. We are human beings," said Jamne Izquierdo, a McDonald’s worker whose coworker passed out from the heat earlier today.

 

The sad fact is that conditions like these are a fact of life for millions of workers across the country. Speaking up can mean having hours cut or being fired. When workers are trying to scrape by, one meager paycheck at a time, they often have no choice but to keep working as long as they can. But when workers stand together, they’re strong. That’s why thousands of fast food and retail workers have gone on strike this year -- because power in the workplace can mean something as basic as the right to have air conditioning on the hottest day of the year.

We need to let McDonald’s know that consumers agree with these courageous workers. Join them in calling for McDonald’s to stop treating its workers like animals.

 

http://www.nbcnewyork.com/news/local/McDonalds-No-Air-Conditioning-Protest-Manhattan-Broadway-Washington-Heights-216182251.html

Edited July 20, 2013 by pythagoreanfulllotus

[narveen]

There is no free market. In order for markets to function there must be regulations.

 

what regulations do you want?

free market means anything goes from the starting bell

if i have a billion dollars and you have no net worth

the free market does not work for you

not because it is not free

it's because you don't count

 

I refer you back to the recent posts on gas prices caused by unfettered rampant speculation. Deregulation of the trading environment means we are all paying dearly at the pump!

 

do you have any money to your name?

why talk about subjects that are way over your head?

have you any idea how money flows?

how deep are the world markets in the various asset classes?

what percentage of trades are speculative compared to those of actual commerce?

 

as for the gas prices at the pump where you are

do you know how far removed the oil corporations are from you?

some are upstream producers while others are downstream refiners

then there are those between them and the guys who own the gas stations in your neighborhood

all of them have a part to play to make a free market efficient

 

if you don't like that and you feel powerless

then pick any other country where there are the regulations you want

and gas prices are controlled by the government.

chances are, all those goverments are also controlling you.

[Marblehead]

Corporations own the government.

I was speaking to that a while back here on this board.

 

2013 dropped back to $150,000

 

Why? 'cuz Hershey got what it wanted - an 8 year delay.

This supports your first sentence.

[Marblehead]

i wonder why you guys are bitching about the ways of the free-market

anyone wants to go to china or russia?

 

bad as she may seems, the usa is still the best deal on the planet

so, deal with it.

I agree with your second paragraph. But we are in decline and that is what I bitch about.

 

Free market? You gotta be shittin' me!

[Marblehead]

Sign the petition link!

Naw. Remember that I am retired Army and spent many a days in conditions far worse than that and never bitched once. No guilt trips for me.

[ralis]

what regulations do you want?

free market means anything goes from the starting bell

if i have a billion dollars and you have no net worth

the free market does not work for you

not because it is not free

it's because you don't count

 

 

do you have any money to your name?

why talk about subjects that are way over your head?

have you any idea how money flows?

how deep are the world markets in the various asset classes?

what percentage of trades are speculative compared to those of actual commerce?

 

as for the gas prices at the pump where you are

do you know how far removed the oil corporations are from you?

some are upstream producers while others are downstream refiners

then there are those between them and the guys who own the gas stations in your neighborhood

all of them have a part to play to make a free market efficient

 

if you don't like that and you feel powerless

then pick any other country where there are the regulations you want

and gas prices are controlled by the government.

chances are, all those goverments are also controlling you.

 

Honestly, your rant deserves very little attention.

 

Without a regulatory environment the following occurs.

 

1. Rampant pollution; water, air, soil etc.

2. No food inspections; e coli, botulism, general food poisoning.

3. Pharmaceutical drugs that are not properly tested and approved.

4. No FAA inspections for commercial aircraft.

5. No inspection for construction projects; electrical, plumbing and structural.

6. Toys that are unsafe for children.

 

I don't have time to educate one such as yourself who refuses to understand social dynamics and how your actions affect others. The 6 points above are just a few things that an environment without regulations would look like. Furthermore, your narrative is nothing but a repeat of 'social darwinism' and authoritarianism.

Edited July 20, 2013 by ralis

[narveen]

I agree with your second paragraph. But we are in decline and that is what I bitch about.

 

if we are in decline, whose fault is it?

as a nation

we have the entrepreneurial drive

we have the technological edge

we have the brain power

america's decline is mainly political

our politicians don't deserve to lead this great country of ours

we need a better breed of politicians

 

Free market? You gotta be shittin' me!

 

our free market is pretty much rough and tumble

no holds barred

no gentleman's code of behavior

the only thing that matters is winning

if you get in the way

you will be eaten alive

america is eating everybody's lunch in business and in war

it's very much the way of the tao

Edited July 20, 2013 by narveen

[Marblehead]

Without a regulatory environment the following occurs.

 

1. Rampant pollution; water, air, soil etc.

2. No food inspections; e coli, botulism, general food poisoning.

3. Pharmaceutical drugs that are not properly tested and approved.

4. No FAA inspections for commercial aircraft.

5. No inspection for construction projects; electrical, plumbing and structural.

6. Toys that are unsafe for children.

Damn! If I wanted to be naughty I would say something like, "I think those things are going on right now with regulation."

Edited July 20, 2013 by Marblehead

[narveen]

Honestly, your rant deserves very little attention.

 

i agree.

we have different values

you care for things you can't do anything about

i care for things i can do something about.

this is why you are in one camp

and i the other

[ralis]

Damn! If I wanted to be naughty I would say something like, "I think those things are going on right now with regulation."

 

I think it would be worse than I stated. Yes, it does seem as though regulation does not exist.

[ralis]

i agree.

we have different values

you care for things you can't do anything about

i care for things i can do something about.

this is why you are in one camp

and i the other

 

You make no sense whatsoever.

[Marblehead]

if we are in decline, whose fault is it?

as a nation

we have the entrepreneurial drive

we have the technological edge

we have the brain power

america's decline is mainly political

our politicians don't deserve to lead this great country of ours

we need a better breed of politicians

Agreed. Americans are great people in the most part. Even the one who don't appear to be great could be great if given a chance. I mean, just look at the support our politicians got when they wanted to go to war against Iraq! Too bad it was all based on lies.

 

our free market is pretty much rough and tumble

no holds barred

no gentleman's code of behavior

the only thing that matters is winning

if you get in the way

you will be eaten alive

america is eating everybody's lunch in business and in war

it's very much the way of the tao

Our free market is set and diricted by our government to keep the wealthy rich so that our politicians can get all their perks from the wealthy. Always has been that way. There never has been a free market in the US.

 

And you are right, no gentleman's code of behavior. Doen't matter who you put out on the street as long as you can increase your profit line.

 

And no, that's not Tao.

[Marblehead]

I think it would be worse than I stated. Yes, it does seem as though regulation does not exist.

Agree. At least we have the shadow of regulation.

[Marblehead]

You make no sense whatsoever.

Hehehe. Who said we have to make sense here? Is that something the Mods started this morning?

[ralis]

Narveen,

 

You seem to be advocating the worst of capitalism, which is nothing but greed driven by social darwinism.

[ralis]

Fed to review ruling that allows big banks to trade commodities. Whether anything comes of this, who knows!

 

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/07/19/wall-street-commodities_n_3625750.html