Love Shys, Involuntary Celibates, True Forced Loneliness, etc.

[ilumairen]

30 minutes ago, Toni said:

I choose the values and the ideas that i have. 

 

Besides, today a man doesn't choose to live or not with a woman. Don't delude yourself.

 

I don't think Luke is the one deluding himself here...

[Toni]

3 minutes ago, liminal_luke said:

 

You think I haven´t made a choice?

I don't know ur particular case, but as a rule is not men who choose

[ilumairen]

3 minutes ago, Toni said:

I don't know ur particular case, but as a rule is not men who choose

 

You are actually correct; these days in many societies cohabitation and/or the establishment of a spousal home is a mutual decision, and no longer solely the choice of father and potential husband. 

 

Which should not be taken as indicative of it being solely the choice of the females... in case this is the assumption you arrived at. 

[ilumairen]

Hey Lukey, I wonder in the imaginary scenario alluded to how gay men end up married (to other men) or cohabiting.. 

 

Would they need to find a female to make the decision for them?

 

[liminal_luke]

More than a few gay men have married women -- often to the women´s horror when circumstances come to light.  If gay men can marry women, I can´t help but think it´s not that hard to do.

[Toni]

Times have changed more than people think 

Edited February 9, 2020 by Toni

[liminal_luke]

One more observation from the gay world.  Sometimes older gay men will complain that they can´t get sex but what they really mean is that they can´t get sex with men twenty years younger.  The older gay men sometimes think of this as "ageism" but, interestingly, they are not interested in having sex with each other either.  I wonder if something similar occasionally plays out among straights?

[ilumairen]

14 minutes ago, liminal_luke said:

More than a few gay men have married women -- often to the women´s horror when circumstances come to light.  If gay men can marry women, I can´t help but think it´s not that hard to do.

 

I actually have known a number of gay men who married women and had children (and lesbians who married men and had children) as they felt it was what was expected of them. 

 

 

Edited February 9, 2020 by ilumairen

[ilumairen]

3 minutes ago, liminal_luke said:

One more observation from the gay world.  Sometimes older gay men will complain that they can´t get sex but what they really mean is that they can´t get sex with men twenty years younger.  The older gay men sometimes think of this as "ageism" but, interestingly, they are not interested in having sex with each other either.  I wonder if something similar occasionally plays out among straights?

 

When I was looking into the terms used in the title here, I found this ranting complaint about how someone could only get laid if he lowered himself to fat and ugly or nasty and diseased women...

[liminal_luke]

8 minutes ago, ilumairen said:

 

When I was looking into the terms used in the title here, I found this ranting complaint about how someone could only get laid if he lowered himself to fat and ugly or nasty and diseased women...

 

I´m not surprised.  It feels as though the men identifying with the "incel movement" aren´t relating to women as human beings.  They accuse women of being shallow (for not having sex with them), and are blind to their own shallowness.

[SirPalomides]

I don’t know if this was brought up already, but a few mass murders and attempted mass murders have already been done by men identifying with the incel movement. And if incels want to cry that it’s not fair to tar the whole movement with these acts, I say such acts are a predictable consequence of an ideology encouraging men to see themselves as entitled to sex and women as unjustly denying their entitlement.

[liminal_luke]

Damn that Brad Pitt!  Only wanting to have sex with beautiful women.  Why not with Luke?  Beta male ain´t good enough for ya, Brad?  The world has really changed, and I´ll tell ya, not for the better.

[SirPalomides]

All the trouble started with the Brad Pitt’s rights movement of the 90’s...

[gendao]

Incel theory in a handy guide in case anyone wants to unpack and deep dive:

Quote

The Scientific Blackpill is about understanding the nature of human social and sexual behavior, especially female mate choice. In opposition to mainstream self-help advice, the blackpill highlights the role of largely immutable traits in social and sexual exclusion. These traits include physical attractiveness, stature, muscularity, race, personality, ability, health, neurotypicality as well as social and economic status.

Have fun, fellas!

[Earl Grey]

3 minutes ago, gendao said:

Incel theory in a handy guide in case anyone wants to unpack and deep dive:

Have fun, fellas!

 

I saw the studies for Asians before in university. Back then, we called them losers, not incels. Spend enough time around someone whining and hating white guys for being able to actually asking a girl out instead of seeking self-improvement is a good reason as to why not only were they not dating, they hardly had any friends.

 

It got ugly when they joined Asian-only frats and then they only dated equally-repressed Asian sorority girls, often after getting them drunk enough... abhorrent.

 

Everyone adds more victimhood into why they aren’t getting laid it seems.

[Toni]

Unfortunately racism is still a real thing. There are studies showing that asian males are not succesful with white women, while asian women are succesful with white men. The conclusion to this is quite clear.

[Earl Grey]

14 minutes ago, Toni said:

Unfortunately racism is still a real thing. There are studies showing that asian males are not succesful with white women, while asian women are succesful with white men. The conclusion to this is quite clear.

And I can tell you that those are only current results—the data itself excludes other issues that the Asian Americans who were rejected exhibited, which is incel behavior often. It is not pure racism, I can say that emphatically.

 

If I told you white women who didn’t like Asian men characterized them as being weak actually found them physically attractive and were waiting for the more jock type to show they were confident and had a personality, then it would explain a lot of missing variables.

 

 I never had issues dating women of other races. My friends didn’t either. What we have in common are strong personalities that don’t seem anything like a church boy or passive nerd or wannabe trying to act tough.

 

The people I saw who never got laid, white or Asian, loved to overcompensate.

 

”Look at my car! My income! My shoes! I have material worth! My abs! I have a beach body! I have an MBA! Why am I not getting laid but that short guy with a dad bod is?!”

 

Answer: the dad bod guy isn’t superficial and he’s interested in how women he dates feel, does fun things like archery and going to museums, reads books, doesn’t try to act smart or that people owe him. He gives himself freely and doesn’t mind rejection because he’s comfortable with himself.

[SirPalomides]

White people being racist has what to do with this incel stuff? Are white women some top prize in the hierarchy of women? Anyway I’m an Asian dude who married a white lady so whatever.

[Earl Grey]

16 minutes ago, SirPalomides said:

White people being racist has what to do with this incel stuff? Are white women some top prize in the hierarchy of women? Anyway I’m an Asian dude who married a white lady so whatever.

 

It's just more excuses. That whole list is sadly a whole series of bullshit excuses.

 

When I didn't score for three years, I didn't lash out at society or blame women--I looked in the mirror and decided I wanted to like me first, so it was co-created by me to be okay with who I am. 

 

At 36, I still run into girls fresh in college who ask if I can "hang out" sometime. 

 

Incels really need to get their act together. 

[gendao]

On 2/13/2020 at 3:37 AM, Toni said:

Unfortunately racism is still a real thing. There are studies showing that asian males are not succesful with white women, while asian women are succesful with white men. The conclusion to this is quite clear.

Yes, clearly Asian males' "personalities" are simply too short and incestuous...which thus have absolutely nothing to do with fishy red herrings like looks, height, masculinity, or any other physical traits!  As with all men! 

Such disgusting personalities, EW!  Incel theory debunked!

Edited February 15, 2020 by gendao

[Toni]

Wow, very good work and presentation of something which is too politically incorrect: Sexual racism against asian men, it is really disgusting. It is very difficult to accept.

 

Female hypergamy is something very dangerous for peaceful civilisation.

[liminal_luke]

One problem with online dating is that it encourages people to put their preferences into boxes.  We get "profiles" where people say things like "no asians"  or "no blacks" or "no bald white fatties."  Is this racism?  I can certainly see how the people negatively excuded might think so.  On the other hand, we all have our likes and dislikes and I don´t think there´s anything wrong with that.

 

Better, perhaps, to meet people face-to-face.  Oftentimes people that would otherwise think they´re not attracted to asians (or whatever physical characteristic) might find that they´re very attracted to that look when it comes packaged as you.

Edited February 15, 2020 by liminal_luke

[gendao]

^ Sure, but the point is that there is a lot of gut-punching, HARD TRUTH to incel theory.  Which is why everyone tries to deny & deflect from it...even when you hear it repeatedly from the horses' mouths themselves publicly!

 

Whereas I've found it to be more and more true IN GENERAL with increasing life experience in retrospect.  Whereas before, I was still conditioned to believe the fairy tale that the real "happy Hollywood ending" was marriage with your "true love"...I now see how that is just the best compromise that the average Joe can simply get.  It's not what every average man actually fantasizes about, but just the best he can realistically get.  But if they could get more...they would!

 

It does seem as if there is a pecking order of men...of which is largely based on their looks, persona, and clout.  The ones on the bottom are, of course, the incels, of whom women have no use for whatsoever...no matter what they offer.  Usually this is because they are too ugly, small, and/or unmasculine.  Above that come simps, who will share and/or scavenge Alpha Fux's leftover sloppy seconds with tryhard/high effort/low standards.  Above that comes your average Beta Bux chump who trades commitment/currency for sex in a relatively reciprocal, transactional relationship.  Of course, both spouses are still repressing their full desires to some extent, which is why most compromised marriages or LTRs like this ultimately become Cold Wars or divorces.  She still wants Alpha Fux...while he wants to keep spreading new legs and his seed out there.  But each has to fake their ruse to keep the other.  Then at the top of the heap come Alpha Fux's...who get first picks of the litters with low/no effort on tutorial mode and can enjoy committed women, without ever committing themselves (groupie harem).  Hello baby daddies!  Women will often come hit on them first, and rationalize all sorts of abuse for their chance to be with or their baby mamas.  THESE ARE THE FEW MEN who can actually FULLY & AUTHENTICALLY be themselves with TRUE CONFIDENCE without compromise or repression...something 99.9% of men will simply never experience.

 

Now of course, this is all just a HUGE GENERALIZED BELL CURVE and not ALL based just on looks (hardware)...but also software (clout, ballsiness, etc).  PUAs essentially hack their software to punch above their physical weight.  (They only downplay and don't hack their hardware, because they don't know how to...but if they could, they would!)  However, just having the desired hardware alone can vault you to the top with little added effort.  I mean, if you're 6'2" with model features and a ~6.4" min joystick...just sit back & enjoy the riiidddeeee, kiddo!

Edited February 15, 2020 by gendao

[Earl Grey]

4 hours ago, gendao said:

Yes, clearly Asian males' "personalities" are simply too short and incestuous...which thus have absolutely nothing to do with fishy red herrings like looks, height, masculinity, or any other physical traits!  As with all men! 

Such disgusting personalities, EW!  Incel theory debunked!

 

A buddy of mine do research on this because me and my friends have been the exception to this in that we've dated Jewess, black, Latina, and blonde women without a problem.

 

It was California where we found a lot of this "I don't date Asian boys!" nonsense to be pretty common, but looking at the average Orange County boy, it wasn't hard to see why someone wouldn't be attracted to him.

 

Let us call him "Brian". A guy who was arrogant about how high his GPA was but a serious little Napoleon who wouldn't even talk to white people unless they were assigned to work with one another, and pining for a girl but never making any moves, hoping that being friends will eventually make her change her mind. "Brian" then hates my guts because within weeks of knowing a gal he was pining for, I was already dating her because I communicated the signals that I was interested--and this was to someone who initially thought I looked like a creep because she "felt something different about me compared to the typical Asian". I call that atypical characteristic a personality and libido. Brian then spends most of his time complaining about other guys, how he is Asian and how he has to have a good job and prove to some hypothetical Asian girl in the future that her parents will approve of his school and his income. All I did for the girl was say, "Hi" and it went somewhere because I was persistent, not desperate. 

 

2 hours ago, gendao said:

^ Sure, but the point is that there is a lot of gut-punching, HARD TRUTH to incel theory.  Which is why everyone tries to deny & deflect from it...even when you hear it repeatedly from the horses' mouths themselves publicly!

 

Whereas I've found it to be more and more true IN GENERAL with increasing life experience in retrospect.  Whereas before, I was still conditioned to believe the fairy tale that the real "happy Hollywood ending" was marriage with your "true love"...I now see how that is just the best compromise that the average Joe can simply get.  It's not what every average man actually fantasizes about, but just the best he can realistically get.  But if they could get more...they would!

 

It does seem as if there is a pecking order of men...of which is largely based on their looks, persona, and clout.  The ones on the bottom are, of course, the incels, of whom women have no use for whatsoever...no matter what they offer.  Usually this is because they are too ugly, small, and/or unmasculine.  Above that come simps, who will share and/or scavenge Alpha Fux's leftover sloppy seconds with tryhard/high effort/low standards.  Above that comes your average Beta Bux chump who trades commitment/currency for sex in a relatively reciprocal, transactional relationship.  Of course, both spouses are still repressing their full desires to some extent, which is why most compromised marriages or LTRs like this ultimately become Cold Wars or divorces.  She still wants Alpha Fux...while he wants to keep spreading new legs and his seed out there.  But each has to fake their ruse to keep the other.  Then at the top of the heap come Alpha Fux's...who get first picks of the litters with low/no effort on tutorial mode and can enjoy committed women, without ever committing themselves (groupie harem).  Hello baby daddies!  Women will often come hit on them first, and rationalize all sorts of abuse for their chance to be with or their baby mamas.  THESE ARE THE FEW MEN who can actually FULLY & AUTHENTICALLY be themselves with TRUE CONFIDENCE without compromise or repression...something 99.9% of men will simply never experience.

 

Now of course, this is all just a HUGE GENERALIZED BELL CURVE and not ALL based just on looks (hardware)...but also software (clout, ballsiness, etc).  PUAs essentially hack their software to punch above their physical weight.  (They only downplay and don't hack their hardware, because they don't know how to...but if they could, they would!)  However, just having the desired hardware alone can vault you to the top with little added effort.  I mean, if you're 6'2" with model features and a ~6.4" min joystick...just sit back & enjoy the riiidddeeee, kiddo!

 

I have encountered all sorts of women. I dated a British-Chinese model once who bitched about how I wasn't tall or cute enough, but every time I left her and she was free to date a guy who was 6'4", she would say that he was terrible in bed, or another guy about 6'2" who had a three-inch tool and no self-control, and beg me to address her problems, which, in all humility (and stupidity), half the time I did because as a horny college kid, hey, I get to score, and the other half of the time, "Sucks for you, girl."

 

The girl who eventually succeeded her told me she had no interest in models, actors, tall guys, or the like because they are often too obsessed with themselves. She then told me a secret: the girls who claim they don't like Asian guys are actually waiting for an Asian guy to not act like the stereotype in their head of how an Asian guy is. 

 

None of my friends, whether Chinese, Korean, or Indian, act like the Asian nerd at all or hang out exclusively with Asians. We have personalities closer to Billy Connolly, Hunter S. Thompson, Ben Stiller, Chris Tucker, and Norman Mailer. This is why some of us ended up with blonde cheerleaders at USC or UCLA, one of them was openly polyamorous and his reputation somehow increased his "regulars", and the rest of us weren't even concerned with dating as what defined us as individuals. 

 

In college, the typical Asian nerd boys used to give me looks and ask why I hung out with white boys and black guys. I told them that those whom they were referring to (let's call them Caleb and Larry) were pretty nice guys, but the cool thing is, Caleb lived in Nepal and speaks Pali, and Larry speaks Mandarin and Korean from living in Taiwan and Seoul. 

 

"But they're just after Asian girls, dude!" 

 

"Caleb is married to a Japanese girl and Larry has a Chinese girlfriend--so what? We all get shawarma on Fridays and then go to Diddy Reese for ice cream after for a buck."

 

"But duuuuude! You're betraying your own race!"

 

"My race? Last I heard, Asians were not one race, but different groups from Japanese to Khmer and then even in India have different cultural groups like Telugu."

 

"Indians aren't Asian, though! And you're only kinda Asian because you're only half-Chinese, and Filipinos don't count either..."

 

"...Yeah, okay, we're done talking, and you go keep being yourselves. Asian women and everyone else who reject you are doing us a favor and filtering the gene pool by not letting you guys breed." 

[gendao]

^ Right, but all those anecdotes still confirm incel theory.

If a guy is tall or good-looking, but has a small dick or sux in bed...then his chick will still bail once she finds out.

The girl who says that model bros are too self-obsessed...is dating "down" now only after having been burned by her first picks too many times.  Again, Alpha Fux got first pick.

Also, you are embodying the Alpha Fux personality type...while the nerdy bookworms are embodying the Beta Bux stereotype (and you can thus see which one young women actually prefer).

I also agree that being uninhibited, confident, secure in your own skin, fun, funny (conveying social IQ), cool, and outgoing can compensate for a lot, too.  I have definitely seen short Asian PUAs who were able to well outscore oversized physical specimens due to this.

 

For one public example, there is YouTube rapper/entertainer Timothy DeLaGhetto who would probably never get swiped online...but has done quite well with some ladies because he is a talented showman.

So I'm not saying people can't ever overachieve.  Just that your hardware still definitely matters and the struggle is real (as you can see with all the direct quotes I posted).  Just because some "overcame" it...doesn't mean it wasn't there.  As for every overachiever, there are still tons of slackers who get the same or better results without even trying simply by virtue of their physiology.

Edited February 16, 2020 by gendao