Babaji's Kriya Yoga?

[Trunk]

Has anyone experience with Babaji's Kriya Yoga?

[turbo]

Has anyone experience with Babaji's Kriya Yoga?

 

Here is a link to a kriya yoga library http://www.yoganiketan.net./.

[affenbrot]

Has anyone experience with Babaji's Kriya Yoga?

 

I met Marshall Govindan twice some years ago, and almost ended up in his school. I found it very cool, a very dedicated, knowledgable, loving teacher, many (from what I heard and observed) successfull pupils. Good teaching, structured, concerned about transmitting the complete techniques and the whole system.

I also remember Marshall Govindan spoke about daoist practice in high regard, he held the opinion that they shared a lot of common ground with the siddha tradition. (There's also a story in this school that siddha Boganathar supposedly taught alchemy as Wei Boyang in China, whatever one might think about the historic truth of this...)

 

as to the practices: some of the detailed meditation prescriptions I found almost Bardon-style, various pranayamatechniques I have never come across elsewhere, precise subtle anatomy visualisation-practices... all very good...

 

affenbrot

[Ian]

I met Marshall Govindan twice some years ago, and almost ended up in his school. I found it very cool, a very dedicated, knowledgable, loving teacher, many (from what I heard and observed) successfull pupils. Good teaching, structured, concerned about transmitting the complete techniques and the whole system.

I also remember Marshall Govindan spoke about daoist practice in high regard, he held the opinion that they shared a lot of common ground with the siddha tradition. (There's also a story in this school that siddha Boganathar supposedly taught alchemy as Wei Boyang in China, whatever one might think about the historic truth of this...)

 

as to the practices: some of the detailed meditation prescriptions I found almost Bardon-style, various pranayamatechniques I have never come across elsewhere, precise subtle anatomy visualisation-practices... all very good...

 

affenbrot

 

I know Michael Winn did a lot of Kriya Yoga and rated it highly, Taoist stuff only just winning out for him. I'm sure, Michael being Michael, there's a long article out there somewhere about why what he does is better....

[Yen Hui]

There's also a story in this school that siddha Boganathar supposedly taught alchemy as Wei Boyang in China,

whatever one might think about the historic truth of this...

 

Hi ya there, affenbrot ~ thanks for the tip. Any info on where to read more on the Wei Boyang connection

would be greatly appreciated ~ Thanks!

[affenbrot]

Edited April 6, 2007 by affenbrot

[Yen Hui]

Boganathar biography

 

in this text they name him only "Bo-yang"; but since they associate this particular story with his dog and the

doubting disciples (which is a story also told about Wei Boyang e.g in Richard Bertschingers translation of the

Can Tong Qi) I assumed they actually mean Wei Boyang.

 

When it goes on that he also went under the name of Lao Zi, for me doubt begins to creep in ... maybe they

begin to make things up here...? Maybe it is superficially researched, just because Lao zi was called Li Po yang

as well doesn't necessarily mean there's a connection?

 

 

as to the practices: some of the detailed meditation prescriptions I found almost Bardon-style, various

pranayamatechniques I have never come across elsewhere, precise subtle anatomy visualisation-practices...

all very good...

 

I took a 'sneak-peek' at your profile and noticed there that you're into 'Bardon'. It is interesting to note

that some persons claim Bardon, as well, is a reincarnation of Lao zi. Thanks for all the info. ~ Yen Hui

[Xienkula1]

Has anyone experience with Babaji's Kriya Yoga?

 

I have some experience with it. It is very powerful and very practical. It also has a spiritual and religious component. The 18 postures are quite unique and they do get the kundalini active, especially if you have done popular ashtanga yoga and increased your understanding of that style. This is more demanding than doing 1 mahamudra per every 12 breaths, yet it is more strengthening. They also have an extremely tranquilizing yet sharpening affect on the mind. The daily kundalini pranayamas are different than Lahiri Mahasayas Kriya yoga, but in many ways are analagous. They both have a warm and cold current as in microcosmic orbit. However the focus on the spine is a bit different. There is a different pranayam for each day of the week, which is also not a shared feature of Lahiri's Kriya pranayama which was a number of different simultaneous practices. Both use the ujayii pranayama. Also, there are seven techniques of meditation. The usual emphasis on khechari is there, but there is no insistance upon attaining full khechari to do pranayama. Nothing in the system seems to resemble, navi, talavya, thokar or higher kriyas of Lahiri Mahasaya. You have a daily spiritual practice schedual and you follow it morning and night, at specific time and keep it consistent. In second and third levels, more practices are given, and the practices of mantras are introduced as well as other types of meditation, different yogic techniques.

Edited March 20, 2008 by Xienkula1

[seekeroftruth]

Hi,

I don't know much about the practice of Kriya Yoga, but here's a site where you can read on the technique and other stuff about kriya yoga: http://www.kriyayogainfo.net/

Hopefully this helps

[Adam West]

Hey all,

 

If anyone wants the Self-Realisation Fellowship lessons, PM me. Just do the breath through the nose and not the mouth.

 

It's a 13 meg download.

 

In kind regards,

 

Adam.

[Xienkula1]

Hey all,

 

If anyone wants the Self-Realisation Fellowship lessons, PM me. Just do the breath through the nose and not the mouth.

 

It's a 13 meg download.

 

In kind regards,

 

Adam.

It's important to note as you'll see if you download the link for the kriya yoga book above, that SRF kriyas are omiting some key instructions. The Babaji's Kriya yoga method comes via a completely different lineage of Babaji to V.T. Neelakanthan, and Yogiar (Yogi S.A.A Ramaiah) and is much more South Indian Saiva Siddhantha influenced in its approach. Rather than seeking nirbija or nirvikalpa samadhi, it's highest aim is for Soruba Samadhi, or attainment of the golden immortal body, where death and decay can no longer remain. This not to say one is better than the other, only to point out some distinctions of the two lineages, since this thread was called Babaji's Kriya Yoga.

Edited March 20, 2008 by Xienkula1

[Synophion]

Though I have never studied with this particular Kriya group [though the book 'The Auto. of of a Yogi' is a bookshelf classic] I have studied with Muktananda who also teaches a form of Kriya [depending how you actualy translate or perceive Kriya]. As far as I can see the Lahiri system is pretty standard yoga stuff, aside from the fact that each yoga teacher has his own particular approach to the four limbs of yoga [ie Bhakti, Kama, Raja, Jnana] with their own particular diety in tow and their own particular preferences in terms of pranayama [breathing], asana [exercise] and dhyana [meditation].

 

This system is really only as different from other Yoga systems as the Methodists are from the Baptists or Presbetarians. Best to read the Yoga Sutras of Pantanjali [the original text for all yoga - yoga meaning 'connecting to god'] on your own, then find the yoga teacher you have a personal preference for rather than listening to any platitudes of what is best or fastest track in the view of other people. There are so many 'genuine' yogis in India they are two a penny, but we often think because a few westerners popularised a particular yogi they met in India, that Yogi must be special, but be sure he/she isnt really that much more special or that much more different than any other.

 

Mindfully

Syn

[Xienkula1]

Though I have never studied with this particular Kriya group [though the book 'The Auto. of of a Yogi' is a bookshelf classic] I have studied with Muktananda who also teaches a form of Kriya [depending how you actualy translate or perceive Kriya]. As far as I can see the Lahiri system is pretty standard yoga stuff, aside from the fact that each yoga teacher has his own particular approach to the four limbs of yoga [ie Bhakti, Kama, Raja, Jnana] with their own particular diety in tow and their own particular preferences in terms of pranayama [breathing], asana [exercise] and dhyana [meditation].

 

This system is really only as different from other Yoga systems as the Methodists are from the Baptists or Presbetarians. Best to read the Yoga Sutras of Pantanjali [the original text for all yoga - yoga meaning 'connecting to god'] on your own, then find the yoga teacher you have a personal preference for rather than listening to any platitudes of what is best or fastest track in the view of other people. There are so many 'genuine' yogis in India they are two a penny, but we often think because a few westerners popularised a particular yogi they met in India, that Yogi must be special, but be sure he/she isnt really that much more special or that much more different than any other.

 

Mindfully

Syn

 

There is an analogous practice in Babaji's Kriya Yoga to the blue pearl of Muktananda's lineage, but there is not a formalized transmission of Shakthi Path in terms of peacock feather diksha, but rather via the initiation into mantra shakthi and direct connection to Babaji in meditation. Lahiri Mahasaya if you read about his life was quite the rocking space daddy. You are right however, to place the faith in God inside as there is where it must abide.

[Yoda]

Lahiri Mahasaya if you read about his life was quite the rocking space daddy.

 

 

I like the notion of doing a different pranayama system per day of the week. That might help out with the overload issues.

[Adam West]

This not to say one is better than the other, only to point out some distinctions of the two lineages, since this thread was called Babaji's Kriya Yoga.

 

I don't assume the Self-Realisation Fellowship lineage is not direct from Babaji, even if it has been simplified.

 

In kind regards,

 

Adam.

[Xienkula1]

I don't assume the Self-Realisation Fellowship lineage is not direct from Babaji, even if it has been simplified.

 

In kind regards,

 

Adam.

 

This could be considered semantics. If it does it for you, go for it! However, when someone asks about "Babaji's Kriya yoga" they are usually referencing the lineage of yogi S.A.A Ramiah (and M. Govindan). Trunk perhaps you could clarify the nature of your inquiry.

Edited March 21, 2008 by Xienkula1

[SiliconValley]

it's highest aim is for Soruba Samadhi, or attainment of the golden immortal body

 

This simply is a 'Tamilized' term coined by Govindan and team, in all probability. The so-called Siddha literature, especially the Tamilian tradition, revolves around aspects of Yoga, Bhakti and Vedanta, selected from the mainstream scriptures, narrated through stories and songs, most often with a mystic touch. A lot of it is also heavily influenced by regional folklore. The word 'soruba' seems to be a distorted form of the word 'Swarupa': swa-self, rupa-form i.e. the True form of the Self. What the true form of the self is described variously by various philosophies like Advaita, Dvaita, Vishishtadvaita. Scriptures speak of Sabija/Nirbija and Savikalpa/Nirvikalpa Samadhis and there is no Soruba/Swarupa Samadhi described. As in Nirvikalpa Samadhi the true form of the self is revealed, it is probably this that the ancients wandering yogis of Tamil region described as Soruba. And this now is described variously as Golden Body, Light body etc.

 

While describing Samadhi, various schools of thought have different approach, like Raja Yoga, Kundalini Yoga, Bhakti Yoga, Advaita etc. But none of these speak in terms of the body or of immortality. Of course, even in the absence of proof from scriptures or teachings of various other masters in this regard, Govindan's terminology can be accepted if he describes it as "directly from Babaji".

 

Having spoken to various lineages of Kriya currently (SRF being only one of them and not even faintly popular with serious Kriya Yogis in India), what I understand is that Kriya was a practice that was simple and repeated practice of the same was what was taught. Gita and other scriptures have abundant references to this practice. 'Babaji's Kriya' seems to be a hosh posh of various Pranayamas, Kriyas, Mudras etc. from different traditions. I took his class mainly out of curiosity and the moment I heard his atrocious mantras, I kicked myself out. He even displayed some writing as Babaji's signature, vehemently describing how every one taught wrong kriyas or incomplete kriyas and how he was the only one to know the true form. Not the true sign of a master!

 

I also observed an interesting thing, some of the practices taught are in the same sequence as some standard books like Hatayoga Pradipika, Gheranda Samhita, Yogasara etc. Set A's sequence is from Book A, Set B from Book B and so on! Yes! If one says, "that was how Babaji revealed three bags of techniques that people learn in two days in level 1", I will believe them. The amount of mudslinging Ramaiah and Govindan did at each other at one point in time was known through out South India and Yogis of the previous generation fondly called them "jokers" :-)

 

There is some discussion here.

Edited March 21, 2008 by SiliconValley

[Xienkula1]

This simply is a 'Tamilized' term coined by Govindan and team, in all probability. The so-called Siddha literature, especially the Tamilian tradition, revolves around aspects of Yoga, Bhakti and Vedanta, selected from the mainstream scriptures, narrated through stories and songs, most often with a mystic touch. A lot of it is also heavily influenced by regional folklore. The word 'soruba' seems to be a distorted form of the word 'Swarupa': swa-self, rupa-form i.e. the True form of the Self. What the true form of the self is described variously by various philosophies like Advaita, Dvaita, Vishishtadvaita. Scriptures speak of Sabija/Nirbija and Savikalpa/Nirvikalpa Samadhis and there is no Soruba/Swarupa Samadhi described. As in Nirvikalpa Samadhi the true form of the self is revealed, it is probably this that the ancients wandering yogis of Tamil region described as Soruba. And this now is described variously as Golden Body, Light body etc.

 

While describing Samadhi, various schools of thought have different approach, like Raja Yoga, Kundalini Yoga, Bhakti Yoga, Advaita etc. But none of these speak in terms of the body or of immortality. Of course, even in the absence of proof from scriptures or teachings of various other masters in this regard, Govindan's terminology can be accepted if he describes it as "directly from Babaji".

 

Having spoken to various lineages of Kriya currently (SRF being only one of them and not even faintly popular with serious Kriya Yogis in India), what I understand is that Kriya was a practice that was simple and repeated practice of the same was what was taught. Gita and other scriptures have abundant references to this practice. 'Babaji's Kriya' seems to be a hosh posh of various Pranayamas, Kriyas, Mudras etc. from different traditions. I took his class mainly out of curiosity and the moment I heard his atrocious mantras, I kicked myself out. He even displayed some writing as Babaji's signature, vehemently describing how every one taught wrong kriyas or incomplete kriyas and how he was the only one to know the true form. Not the true sign of a master!

 

I also observed an interesting thing, some of the practices taught are in the same sequence as some standard books like Hatayoga Pradipika, Gheranda Samhita, Yogasara etc. Set A's sequence is from Book A, Set B from Book B and so on! Yes! If one says, "that was how Babaji revealed three bags of techniques that people learn in two days in level 1", I will believe them. The amount of mudslinging Ramaiah and Govindan did at each other at one point in time was known through out South India and Yogis of the previous generation fondly called them "jokers" :-)

 

There is some discussion here.

 

I don't know if it is fair to say they are a hodge podge from different traditions. If that is the case, you should be able to site which traditions they are from, otherwise it is all speculation. I'm still quite unsure whether Babaji is a literal phenomenon. However, I do know that just like there are legends of Taoist Immortals, there are legends of immortal Siddhas. Just like China has a golden pill of immortality, there is an apparent analogue in Siddha medicine. Govindan heard the term from his Guru. The idea is that when Siva taught Parvati the secrets of immortality, it was the secret of Kriya kundalini pranayama. Ramaiah claimed this. Not everything can be referenced in a scripture. But there are a couple in scripture who escaped death, Nachiketas, Markandeya and in other non-hindu scriptures etc. Many Siddhas where said to have acheived it, some tibetan yogis were said to have achieved it. Ramalinga Swamigal dissappeared without a trace after doing various practices. Of course they are anecdotes and we don't know anything about their veracity. Not speaking Tamil is a real disadvantage, and I think it would be necessary to speak the language and read the writtings of the Siddhas, and then discuss the material with those who had contemplated their meaning to begin to grasp the philosophy.

There's a lot of Kriya teachers who you could pin the "not true master" lable on in terms of their behaviour. There can be a lot of ego theatrics involved with the big massive power behind the ultimate jet plane to God illumination. It can often be a worthwhile excercise to examine one's own motives, get a grip on one's discernment, and clean up one's own stinky subconscious dirty laundry. It's a task that seems never ending.

That said, it does not mean that some principles and techniques offered might not be of some value to a personal practice, yet decidedly not everyone's cup of tea. Lahiri's technique was a lot more simplified, and it seems to be a very functional model. To you the Govindan/ Ramaiah stuff may not have been at all useful or even corrupted and distainful, but personally, the practice has been beneficial. Whether the 18 Yoga postures were thought up by Babaji or the Grand Poobaa, or sourced from the Hatha Yoga Pradipika, they still seem to work. Whether you think it's worth the $2000 bucks to learn everything is another story. To Govinadan's credit at least he has a policy that you can retake the workshop free over and over once you have paid initially.

Edited March 21, 2008 by Xienkula1

[SiliconValley]

Yes, they do work, but does one really attain immortality or realization by doing these series of asanas, pranayama and visualization and of course those mantras (!) - as claimed - is what someone needs to think if simple health benefits are not what they seek from these guys. There are two kinds of people - those with very less karmic content, called the 'camphors' - a touch of practice is enough for them to go ablaze and get success. For the rest, who are 'wet wood', and who need proper drying, these may not work in the intended way. It is the majority of such seekers who were traditionally warned to choose carefully what they get into as they would put in a lifetime's practice. Incorrect practice - taught without proper discernment and learnt incorrectly - both can cause irreparable damage. These Asanas of course work in the way they are meant to. All I was speaking was against the cult operation, sensationalism, unneeded stories, uncalled criticism of other masters and unhealthy commercialism. When a series of techniques found all over the place are packaged with all these unnecessary elements, it may be an indication. It is probably Falun-Dafa-ish in my opinion. I remember reading Yogani's views on this topic, but cannot find it at this moment. Will find it later and post the link.

 

Also, Lahiri Baba taught various different techniques with similarities and differences to various disciples. So one cannot really call what SRF teaches or what someone else popular teaches as THE model. And this is my last post on this topic.

 

Edited March 21, 2008 by SiliconValley

[Xienkula1]

 

I like the notion of doing a different pranayama system per day of the week. That might help out with the overload issues.

 

 

I think it may and it also gives you a chance to do something different so you don't get bored doing the exact same thing all the time. Keep smelling a rose and eventually, no matter how enjoyable, your receptors will get saturated and you will have diminishing response to the scent. So giving yourself a different stimulus may keep you sensitized to the effects.