Gambling? Winning money from other players?

[becomethepath]

Is it bad karma/ sin to win money from other players?

[Songtsan]

Buddhist wise - yes

[becomethepath]

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Edited September 8, 2013 by becomethepath

[Songtsan]

well - karma isn't so cut and dry like you think...the word means action/reaction...and is basically the same as cause/effect. Action/reaction are two sides of a single coin, as are cause/effect. The reason the Buddhists would say that it is bad is because when someone wins, someone always loses. No matter what side of the coin you are on, someone will suffer to some degree. They believe that one should not cause or be a partner to suffering in any way, that it brings further karma (actions) down the road.

 

Here would be an example: say you win and your friend loses...maybe they feel frustrated, etc. maybe they don't have that extra $100 now and can't buy those vitamins, or useful personal items that they normally would have bought - they incur suffering from it. Because you benefited from it, you are party to that suffering, and supposedly it will come back at you in the wheel at some point. Now do I personally agree with this? Yes/no - I believe that you are fine gambling personally...it's just that if you are Buddhist, I wanted you to know what they believe.

 

"And what six ways of squandering wealth are to be avoided? Young man, heedlessness caused by intoxication, roaming the streets at inappropriate times, habitual partying, compulsive gambling, bad companionship, and laziness are the six ways of squandering wealth." - Buddha Sigalovada Sutta

[Vmarco]

So even in a poker tournament where everyone agrees to a $100 buy in? And when I die and here comes judgement, will they see me taking money from other players or winning money from other players? Am I going to hell because of winning money from other players? Is there a difference between taking money from players and winning money from other players?

 

Look at a poker game as a Karmic Redistribution Activity,...casinos, as Karmic Redistribution Centers. Judgment is an ego construct,...a key fact of Buddhism is that no karma ultimately exists. This doesn't mean going around living falsely and without impeccableness,...those who realize that karma is an illusion, respond to the flow of life with compassion,...although caterpillars have not a clue what the compassion of a butterfly is,...regardless of all thecaterpillar experts on karma.

[Vmarco]

A caterpillar DOES NOT become a butterfly.

[ralis]

The OP is always asking these type of questions and for what reason I haven't a clue.

[becomethepath]

A caterpillar DOES NOT become a butterfly.

I don't understand.

 

Basically, if I'm part of the equation that caused a person to suffer, like winning their money (they'll be angry at me), or serving a patron alcohol (continue to aid their suffering), then i will receive bad karma because of that, right?

[Songtsan]

I don't understand.

 

Basically, if I'm part of the equation that caused a person to suffer, like winning their money (they'll be angry at me), or serving a patron alcohol (continue to aid their suffering), then i will receive bad karma because of that, right?

 

If you feel ill at ease while gambling, ask yourself if it is worth the cost...if you are having fun, and everyone else is, and the money isn't a big deal, then its ok too...every situation is different. Play each moment as it comes, and move from a center of wisdom-bliss, without attachment. Do not judge yourself for gambling or judge others for not gambling...I'm just dropping leaves of possibilities on you. Try to find happiness in what you do - if it causes you to suffer in the long haul - back out. There are plenty of different games to play.

[Flolfolil]

i don't personally see anything wrong with a consensual game where betting something is involved. But you clearly see it as negative, so it seems as if it is in fact negative, but just for you. There is no definite answer as to what is right and wrong, only what you feel in your heart.

 

Am i going to hell for smoking pot and being gay? Some people say yes. But i don't see anything morally wrong with either of those, so they cause me zero grief whatsoever.

[Songtsan]

yep - that's exactly it! Seriously I agree. Each to his own..I like gambling, but I hate it too..I once went to a casino and blew about $240 on roulette, blackjack, etc...I played all the games I ever wanted to play and said, "One time only, never again..." It basically worked. I buy a lottery ticket once and a while but stay away from gambling..though I like to play that game where you flip quarters and if you match the other person's coin, you get to keep it, but if you don't match, they keep your coin....

 

I think the best way to gamble is to invest in penny stocks...if they go up you win, if they tank, it was still fun to watch!

Edited July 3, 2013 by Songtsan

[becomethepath]

i don't personally see anything wrong with a consensual game where betting something is involved. But you clearly see it as negative, so it seems as if it is in fact negative, but just for you. There is no definite answer as to what is right and wrong, only what you feel in your heart.

 

Am i going to hell for smoking pot and being gay? Some people say yes. But i don't see anything morally wrong with either of those, so they cause me zero grief whatsoever.

so if the drug dealer is compassionate in dealing drugs, not trying to make money but to make people happy, will the drug dealer go to heaven then?

Edited July 3, 2013 by becomethepath

[Flolfolil]

so if the drug dealer is compassionate in dealing drugs, not trying to make money but to make people happy, will the drug dealer go to heaven then?

First things first - i don't believe in an exclusive heaven that only "good" people go to. If there is any afterlife, i lean towards the belief that it will just be another earth basically. What good is having a conscious individual soul if our free will gets taken from us? That sounds like fascism to me.

 

Then i will just remind you off my original point - If you don't see something wrong with something, it is not a sin for you. Sin, in my opinion, is just a nervous twitch that goes off because of your learned or born-with morality, and it is different for everyone. In my eyes, it is fine for someone to want money. But the second they decide that wanting money is bad, that is when it becomes bad for them.

 

In a nutshell, my opinion is this: Ignorance of sin = Lack of sin

[Songtsan]

Just be aware of your feeling states...if you feel suffering when you do something - you are adding energy to a suffering wheel in your mind, if you only have fun, then it's cool. When I was younger and played cards and lost, i would walk home feeling poorly (and being poorer)...when I won, I was happy - it's a gamble! lol..It will actually take care of itself I think...lose enough times, the suffering becomes intense and then you stay away...keep winning, and you become a pro and end up in reality TV shows...it all depends how much of a shark you are!

[Flolfolil]

It is all about intent.

 

Situation #1:

Drug dealer gets up every morning and says, "I am going to expand peoples minds because I love the world and everything in it, blah blah etc etc" - These people view themselves as good and trying to help. They spread love and get it in return.

 

Situation #2:

Drug dealer gets up every morning and says, "I hate everyone, I want to get people addicted so that they will be miserable and need to give me money for drugs" - These people actively hate other people, and view themselves as evil and unworthy of being a part of normal society. So the only option they think they have is to continue to be a dick.

Edited July 3, 2013 by Flolfolil

[Flolfolil]

Or you could look at it like this:

 

Do you want to mope and cry and feel bad for all the super tiny insects you kill every day but don't see? Of course not, because you are ignorant of it.

 

It is impossible to live a life where you don't step on someone elses toes. Just the fact that you exist causes suffering for other beings. i went down this road, and it SUCKS. Try apologizing to every inanimate object you bump into for a few weeks, truly believing that everything has feelings, then get back to me. If you view your every action as negative, you will inevitably start having suicidal thoughts where "the world would be better without me". No, it wouldn't. It would be exactly the same, minus you. Nothing you can do to fix that.

[Vmarco]

Basically, if I'm part of the equation that caused a person to suffer, like winning their money (they'll be angry at me), or serving a patron alcohol (continue to aid their suffering), then i will receive bad karma because of that, right?

 

If that were true, can you imagine the horror one who proselytizes Abrahamic belief systems will have to undergo,...I'd surely accept the karma of winning a millions hands of Texas Holdem, then turning a single person astray with Bible fiction.

 

As for caterpillars (and other karma pushing entities),..."There are no butterfly experts among the caterpillars, despite innumerable claims to the contrary" Jed McKenna

[Songtsan]

Or you could look at it like this:

 

Do you want to mope and cry and feel bad for all the super tiny insects you kill every day but don't see? Of course not, because you are ignorant of it.

 

It is impossible to live a life where you don't step on someone elses toes. Just the fact that you exist causes suffering for other beings. i went down this road, and it SUCKS. Try apologizing to every inanimate object you bump into for a few weeks, truly believing that everything has feelings, then get back to me. If you view your every action as negative, you will inevitably start having suicidal thoughts where "the world would be better without me". No, it wouldn't. It would be exactly the same, minus you. Nothing you can do to fix that.

 

The larger the hurt, the larger the burden....if you had a pet cow and you decided to kill it and eat it, you'd probably feel really guilty. The more removed we become from the killing, the harder it is to feel - "Sure, I'll pick up some steaks!" they are already prepared. I am sure if a picture of the cow it came from was on the package, less people would buy it. Out of sight, out of mind, as they say. I am sure there are sociopaths out there who could do terrible things and then sit down and play a game of chess, no problem. Not me, When I was a kid, there was a mouse that lived under the back porch, and I used to watch it avidly. One day, I threw a piece of wood at it, wicked little boy that i was, and it squeaked in terror when it got hit. I felt so bad I hated myself. Another time my cat jumped up on the counter and took a piece of meat off a sandwich i was making, and I got so mad that I spanked him and he ran and hid behind the refrigerator, and I felt so bad that i went and called him out and he eventually came running into my arms and I was so sorry. I think that insects don't feel pain, although I don't know for sure, but that's what the internet says...

[Flolfolil]

I think that insects don't feel pain

No offense, but i have strong feelings counter to this view.

 

i am pretty abnormal in my views of what is conscious and what is not. As in, everything is and nothing is not. You can't say "everything = consciousness" and not truly believe it. Some people seem to though.

 

"EVERYTHING IS CONSCIOUSNESS BUT HUMANS ARE SOMEHOW HIGHER SPIRITUAL BEINGS"

 

yeah, whatever

[Songtsan]

No offense, but i have strong feelings counter to this view.

 

i am pretty abnormal in my views of what is conscious and what is not. As in, everything is and nothing is not. You can't say "everything = consciousness" and not truly believe it. Some people seem to though.

 

"EVERYTHING IS CONSCIOUSNESS BUT HUMANS ARE SOMEHOW HIGHER SPIRITUAL BEINGS"

 

yeah, whatever

 

I just looked at the scientific reports on insect neurology and they seem to think no...but obviously I don't know for sure, because I am not an insect...it's obvious they have bioelectrical nervous systems just like us..but their senses are more limited. I definitely make attempts to remove unwanted guests from my houses by placing them outside where they belong, but if I have an ant infestation, say, I might have to go get the ant traps, and yes I will feel bad, but the suffering of them crawling all over me when I sleep is greater than the suffering I feel in killing them.

Edited July 3, 2013 by Songtsan

[Flolfolil]

i am about as far gone down the path to crazy town as you can get when it comes to empathizing for paperclips when i bend them and they never have their same shape again

[Songtsan]

i am about as far gone down the path to crazy town as you can get when it comes to empathizing for paperclips when i bend them and they never have their same shape again

 

Perhaps metal molecules like to be moved?

[Flolfolil]

Perhaps metal molecules like to be moved?

If i think that then yeah. Some days i feel terrible for walking on grass though. Wanna talk about sin? i honestly feel like my entire life could possibly be constant sin, or maybe sin doesn't exist, or maybe its just a social construct.

 

OR MAYBE i DON'T EVEN EXIST

 

man it is late, i would enjoy a bowl right now

[xor]

Is it good for you? I'd say you'll find out if you play... alot depends on your temperament and skill. In between hands you'll be doing alot of sitting doing nothing which can be great.