movements during orgasm and sex

[mike 134]

Hi ppl,

 

I've been watching a lot of porn lately and I've noticed something rather interesting. Occasionally in some scenes I see girls moaning while rolling up their eyeballs and rolling their tongue upward. It does not happen very often (99% of porn orgasms are fake), and I haven't seen this in real life. I don't do this myself either. However, I do know that both movements are also established yoga techniques:

 

rolling up eyeballs = eyeball lock = "sambhavi mudra"

rolling up tongue = tongue lock = "Khechari mudra"

 

Is there a coincidence here? Why are porn stars (most of whom probably do not practice yoga) doing yoga postures during sex? How do they "know" to do them? And what does that tell you about other yoga moves; are they also somehow "innately known", therefore giving them an objective rather than merely empirical character?

 

Also it is interesting that there exists a neck lock ("jalandhara bandha") which consists of flexion of the neck downward so that the chin approaches the chest. But usually in porn when girls are doing the eye and tongue thing their necks are engaged in extension upward, which is the opposite of the neck lock. Is there any significance to this?

Edited July 21, 2013 by mike 134

[Apech]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gEmJ-VWPDM4

[Sloppy Zhang]

I think that, whether it's yoga or qigong or any other system that deals with energetic flows of the body, it was discovered and developed (over thousands of years) first from observation. How does the body tend to behave in orgasm? In sleep? While digesting food? In a fight? While running? While sitting? While talking? When there's a large amount of energy moving, how does it move and along what channels?

 

From there, systems were created to cultivate energy in specific ways. Move here, touch here, open there, etc. This would encourage/move energy in a certain way, and so develop you in that way.

 

So I don't think it is that surprising when people move into "spontaneous" postures (whether from yoga, qigong, etc) during instances where their body is experiencing large amounts of energetic flows (orgasm).

[silent thunder]

Cool observation.

 

From the time I noticed that I engage in spontaneous yoga poses and mudras, it's been an interesting process being aware of myself and watching others and seeing them engage in the same. It happens a lot.

 

I work in construction and now that I'm aware of it, I frequently see my co-workers (who are not into yoga or cultivation), releasing and incorporating muscle qi after a strong lift, through spontaneous yoga and yoga-like postures.

[hydrogen]

Also it is interesting that there exists a neck lock ("jalandhara bandha") which consists of flexion of the neck downward so that the chin approaches the chest. But usually in porn when girls are doing the eye and tongue thing their necks are engaged in extension upward, which is the opposite of the neck lock. Is there any significance to this?

 

When one put chin close to chest, it's easier to flow the Qi the one back of neck and upper back area. In general Qi goes up ward.

 

The extension helps the Qi flower in the front of neck/chest area. The Qi flow downward.

 

Of course you can train your body do different direction of Qi. I just find this way easier.

[Cheshire Cat]

Yoga and porn... they are the same

 

 

[Rara]

Not that I've read it but this is sort of the idea behind the Karma Sutra isn't it? Here, positions mean a lot in sex on some form of spiritual level, but in western porn, it's just less mystical. People don't know why doggy-style is hot, for example, but it just gets people PUMPED!

 

I wouldn't say they "know" about them. Just picked them up...universal body language which may just have some deeper reason behind it.

[mike 134]

I think theres a deeper reason why ppl do poses instinctively, but that doesn't explain some of the more difficult postures. I can't imagine an orgasm (or any biological process) that can cause somebody to do this

 

[hydrogen]

I think theres a deeper reason why ppl do poses instinctively, but that doesn't explain some of the more difficult postures. I can't imagine an orgasm (or any biological process) that can cause somebody to do this

 

 

 

Have you been to any real BDSM party, especially bondage related?

[mike 134]

real BDSM party? errr... I don't even watch BDSM porn it's a turnoff for me. But anyway whatever they do its not really natural though.

[hydrogen]

real BDSM party? errr... I don't even watch BDSM porn it's a turnoff for me. But anyway whatever they do its not really natural though.

 

exactly.

 

The mind is the originator. But the form limits the mind. Breaking out of the old form, you expand your mind.

 

It takes years of hard practice to get into weird position like that lady in the picture. The physical and mental effort factor is 10 from scale of 1 to 10. The mind expansion is around 5. The time line is 2 to 5 years.

 

It takes a few days to get someone to tie you up in a weird postion and get spanked publicly in a rediculous outfit or none. The physical and mental effort factor is 10. The expansion factor is 10. The time line is a few days.

[三江源]

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Edited July 25, 2014 by cat

[hydrogen]

What is the psychic development in detail, of the two situations, one self directed and promoting autonomy and perseverance and deep connection to the body, and the other surrender and catharsis and activation of infantile shame and any number of power conflicts within the psyche. What in the mind is expanded, in these two situations?

 

I have no idea.

 

Each individual is different.

 

I just brought up the BDSM to illustrate that poison can be effective medicine.

 

It takes lots of courage to willingly put oneself into a very publicly humiliating situation. Jesus did that.

[三江源]

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Edited July 25, 2014 by cat

[Andrei]

Yoga and porn... they are the same

]

 

[三江源]

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Edited July 23, 2014 by cat

[Apech]

ok. this is a good time to mention karezza and taoist sex, - sexual yoga - which will actually bring your partner to a place of real sexual pleasure.

 

worth researching. then you will see real life sexual responses, which some women in porn are replicating.

 

are you going to ask him up for coffee?

[Sloppy Zhang]

What is the psychic development in detail, of the two situations, one self directed and promoting autonomy and perseverance and deep connection to the body, and the other surrender and catharsis and activation of infantile shame and any number of power conflicts within the psyche. What in the mind is expanded, in these two situations?

 

Plenty of developed BDSM communities are a lot more "boring" than those outside of the community might expect, many of them place a huge emphasis on the self direction of the "sub", where they clearly lay out expectations, what is on the table, what is off the table, and what is a soft limit. In a healthy encounter, the "sub" is the leader, and anything beyond what the sub wants they have the ability call off (or even if they just aren't in the mood for continuing the encounter). The "dom" needs to be attentive as well, to know when a hard limit is about to be approached, and to back off when the sub requests it (or seems like they want to request it).

 

Pretty far cry from the popular media portrayal caused by books like 50 Shades of an insensitive, unstable, abusive partner that routinely exceeds the comfort limits of their partner.

 

On the flip side, plenty of "vanilla" sexual encounters involve surrender and catharsis and activation of infantile shame and any number of power conflicts within the psyche. Consider "slut shaming" and women who feel guilty about wanting to or having had sex with a particular person.

 

External form may or may not line up with how you perceive internal content.

Edited July 24, 2013 by Sloppy Zhang

[voidisyinyang]

Porn is just male ejaculation addiction - the opposite of Taoist training.

 

This thread should be in the Pit.

 

http://yourbrainonporn.com/is-my-premature-ejaculation-related-to-my-porn-use

[Sloppy Zhang]

Porn is just male ejaculation addiction - the opposite of Taoist training.

 

This thread should be in the Pit.

 

http://yourbrainonporn.com/is-my-premature-ejaculation-related-to-my-porn-use

 

But the thread isn't about porn, per se.

 

It's more about physical movement during orgasm/sex.

 

Porn just happens to provide the largest store of observable sex acts (some of which result in actual orgasm, some of which don't)

 

Now the OP mentioned that the orgasmic behavior he sees in porn (of a woman cumming so hard she throws her head back, eyes rolling up into her head) is not the same behavior he sees in real life. So a few things might be going on...

 

1) Porn is entirely faking it, and no woman orgasms like that

 

2) Porn is portraying an actual orgasm that some women (but not all) experience, and the OP has not been with a woman who orgasms like that

 

3) All women orgasm like that, and if the OP hasn't seen a woman orgasm like that, then she was faking it and the porn orgasms are real

 

And then look at the overall physical methods to induce certain energetic flows in the body. Yoga is certainly a study of how to do that, and the OP pointed out how similar positions appear "spontaneously" in people experiencing an orgasm.

 

So.... do they all do yoga in their free time, or is something else going on?

 

Unless some of us could round up some "non porn" recordings of sex acts on the same scale that porn can provide.

[voidisyinyang]

A person does not need to see a female to know if she is having an orgasm.

 

Orgasms are triggered by the vagus nerve connection to the reproductive organ.

 

The vagus nerve is triggered by chi energy.

 

None of that info is going to be observed by watching porn.

 

Closest thing you might see is the right side of the neck pulsating from a female having orgasms.

 

But female orgasms can be done in silence with no physically visible reactions or have any number of physically visible reactions.

 

So the OP question belies any real knowledge of female orgasms. haha. The three options you give are faulty logic based on assumptions which favor pornography.

 

Again watching porn is male ejaculation addiction - the thread should go into the Pit since ejaculation goes against creating the lower tan tien and so it's not Taoist training.

 

Even talking about porn or sex goes against creating the lower tan tien which is based on the Emptiness and the lower tan tien is based on the mind not thinking about reproductive processes.

[Sloppy Zhang]

A person does not need to see a female to know if she is having an orgasm.

 

Orgasms are triggered by the vagus nerve connection to the reproductive organ.

 

The vagus nerve is triggered by chi energy.

 

None of that info is going to be observed by watching porn.

 

Closest thing you might see is the right side of the neck pulsating from a female having orgasms.

 

But female orgasms can be done in silence with no physically visible reactions or have any number of physically visible reactions.

 

So the OP question belies any real knowledge of female orgasms. haha. The three options you give are faulty logic based on assumptions which favor pornography.

 

Again watching porn is male ejaculation addiction - the thread should go into the Pit since ejaculation goes against creating the lower tan tien and so it's not Taoist training.

 

Even talking about porn or sex goes against creating the lower tan tien which is based on the Emptiness and the lower tan tien is based on the mind not thinking about reproductive processes.

.

Well I don't know enough about chi or the vagus nerve to be able to comment intelligently on it. And as I'm not a female, I can't comment on female orgasms beyond what I have observed with who I have been with

 

I also wouldn't say that ejaculation goes "against" creating the lower tantien or Taoism per se, because Taoism does deal with ejaculation (there are guidelines for how to do it if you want to do it in some traditions).

 

Regarding your last line, this entire forum goes against creating the lower tantien, because we're all doing a lot more thinking than non-thinking we should all be in the pit!

[voidisyinyang]

The book Taoist Yoga: Alchemy and Immortality explains that the upper tan tien is a closed cavity of light but when thoughts about the reproductive organ happen it triggers the back of the brain as prenatal chi energy to descend down the spine marrow to the scrotum to turn into reproductive fluid for ejaculation.

 

That process goes against the creation of the lower tan tien which is the foundation for the Taoist training.

 

Western thought tends to hide behind morality - claiming that talking about this stuff is somehow liberating morally or transcending some moral norm that previously was repressive - these are all just errors of being stuck in a reactionary mode to incorrect Western thinking.

 

So that is the basis of pornography.

 

The female orgasm can also be achieved by males since all males are originally female when developing pre-natally. The reproductive organ of the male was the clitoris which then connects to the main orgasm reaction of the cervix vagus nerve trigger.

 

So this process is the exact opposite of male ejaculation which causes the parasympathetic dopamine system to switch to the stress cortisol sympathetic nervous system.

 

The internal vagus nerve orgasm - whether it is a female or male - does the same process - increases the dopamine to serotonin and then through more orgasms increases the serotonin to oxytocin - the left side vagus nerve to the heart is then activated and pulsates.

 

So for example I first experienced the right side vagus nerve pulsating from internal orgasms after I discovered having mutual orgasms with females in public and only after a few years did I then see a female masturbating in public and sure enough her right side vagus nerve on her neck was pulsating exactly the same as mine did. hahahaha.

[thetaoiseasy]

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Edited March 24, 2014 by thetaoiseasy

[voidisyinyang]

Dopamine to Serotonin?

 

Parasympathetic dopamine system to switch to the stress cortisol sympathetic nervous system?

 

Drew, this is not a challenge. But I'm just going to throw you a few questions to think about.

 

1. What molecule is Dopamine a derivative of?

2. What molecule is Serotonin a derivative of?

3. Is there really a pathway in the body for their direct conversion?

3. Is Dopamine really part of the Parasympathetic Nervous System?

4. What neurotransmitter does the PNS actually use?

 

Robert Sapolsky, Why Zebras Don't Get Ulcers (Holt Paperbacks, 2004), p. 124.

 

What happens next, if you are male? You are having a terrific time with someone.

Maybe you are breathing faster, your heart rate has increased. Gradually parts of

your body are taking on a sympathetic [nervous system] tone....After awhile, most

of your body is screaming sympathetic while, heroically, you are trying to hold

onto the parasympathetic tone in that one last outpost as long as possible. Finally

when you can't take it anymore, the parasympathetic shuts off at the penis, the

sympathetic comes roaring on, and you ejaculate.

 

 

See the problem with scientists is they have not done the psychphysiological experiments on themselves.

 

I contacted the scientist Komisaruk, B.R

who researched the vagus nerve orgasms of females and he said that while it was observed the males also have internal orgasms it was not proven that males have vagus nerve orgasms.

 

http://www.universal-tao.com/article/through-power-inner-smile.html

 

" It's unbelievable!" says Gerhard H. Eggetsberger, biochemist and technical head of the Institute for applied Biocybernetics and Feedback Research, in Vienna. "This man is able to change his electrical skin resistance in a split second from 60 Q up to 6080 Q and to lower it down again. We even know how he does it - through a kind of sympathetic reflex. This means that he can simply switch from the Nervus Vagus to the Nervus Sympaticus. An untrained body would never do this as completely as he does this. We are scientifically proving spiritual knowledge that is 6000 years old!

 

and to store the energy?

 

 

But, without the powerful parasympathetic function, all the internal organs can not work properly. It is like the appliances working under a low electric power supply. Each organ must store sufficient parasympathetic bioelectricity you call it " Yin Chi" such as the "Liver Chi", "Kidney Chi", " Heart Chi"..., so that the sympathetic nervous function in each organ can convert the bioelectric energy into "work", output of forces or products.

 

http://www.actionlove.com/cases/case8940.htm

 

So this stuff all goes beyond Western science!!

 

You want to wait for your training until Western science catches up to Taoism?

 

haha.

 

Good luck on that.

 

Settling the Serotonin-Dopamine-Testosterone-Estrogen issue through Oxytocin and the Heart qi connection

 

http://fulllotusqigong.blogspot.com/2012/02/settling-serotonin-dopamine.html

 

 

Serotonin and oxytocin co-release in the brain so increasing serotonin likely increases oxytocin, too.....Considering the functional regulation of serotonin over the dopamine system, deficient serotonergic function may result in hyperactivity of the dopamine system, promoting impulsive behavior....Thus, oxytocin is proposed to be a key neural substrate that interacts with central dopamine systems....Furthermore, increased sexual experience led to increased immunoreactivity to Fos, the protein product of c-fos, following copulation to one ejaculation. Another intracellular mediator of DA's effects, particularly in castrates, may be the phosphorylation of steroid receptors. Finally, while DA is facilitative to copulation, 5-HT is generally inhibitory. 5-HT is released in the LHA, but not in the MPOA, at the time of ejaculation. Increasing 5-HT in the LHA by microinjection of a selective serotonin reuptake inhibitor (SSRI) increased the latency to begin copulating and also the latency to the first ejaculation, measured from the time the male first intromitted. These data may at least partially explain the decrease in libido and the anorgasmia of people taking SSRI antidepressants. One means by which LHA 5-HT decreases sexual motivation (i.e. increases the latency to begin copulating) may be by decreasing DA release in the NAcc, a major terminal of the mesolimbic system. Thus, reciprocal changes in DA and 5-HT release in different areas of the brain may promote copulation and sexual satiety, respectively....Copulator males had higher concentrations of serotonin in the epididymis, testicle and ventral prostate than their non-copulator counterparts, as it was found for epididymal and testicular tryptophan hydroxylase activity. However, preliminary data shows that serotonin elevation occurs in copulator males only until they have accumulated several sexual encounters, so it might be a response to genital gratification or sexual rewarding. Interestingly, only epididymal serotonin concentration correlated with reproductive fitness, offspring number, mating success and seminal plug volume in copulator males....It would appear that blood serotonin in the normal range is important for sperm motility. Values of serotonin above the normal range could affect negatively both sperm count and motility.