Turning vegetarian - need advice

[Rara]

 

 

I know In your case, it could be too few of the appropriate symbiotes, "

Ok, what is this? Google just gives me Marvel comics parasites...

[gatito]

Ok, what is this? Google just gives me Marvel comics parasites...

 

Lichen is a good example of symbiosis, (as is the dog/man relationship IMO )

Edited December 4, 2013 by gatito

[Rara]

 

Lichen is a good example of symbiosis, (as is the dog man relationship IMO )

Are you telling me to munch on a dog or am I really confused right now? Lol

[gatito]

Are you telling me to munch on a dog or am I really confused right now? Lol

 

Sorry, I was just having a laugh.

 

Regarding intestinal bacteria they help out by digesting your food and taking a bit for themselves - so both bacteria and (wo)man benefit.

 

Contrast this with bubonic plague, HIV (or tapeworms) and it's a one-sided relationship which damages the host (i.e a parasitic relationship)

 

From what I remember of my undergraduate biology, lichen is the classic example of symbiosis to give in an exam

[Rara]

 

Sorry, I was just having a laugh.

 

Regarding intestinal bacteria they help out by digesting your food and taking a bit for themselves - so both bacteria and (wo)man benefit.

 

Contrast this with bubonic plague, HIV (or tapeworms) and it's a one-sided relationship which damages the host (i.e a parasitic relationship)

 

From what I remember of my undergraduate biology, lichen is the classic example of symbiosis to give in an exam

Haha, biology was my worst of the three science subjects at school.

 

So, are you simply saying that animal could be essential for my digestion? I need biology stuff spelt out to me!

Edited December 4, 2013 by Rara

[gatito]

Haha, biology was my worst of the three science subjects at school.

 

So, are you simply saying that animal could be essential for my digestion?

No

 

I'm saying that everyone needs enough of the right (symbiotic) intestinal bacteria

 

(And incidentally, you've now deeply upset SnugglePuppy and Cerberus )

Edited December 4, 2013 by gatito

[Rara]

 

I'm saying that everyone needs enough of the right (symbiotic) intestinal bacteria

 

 

Haha...which I get from...? (puzzle nearly complete!!! Yay!)

[gatito]

Haha...which I get from...? (puzzle nearly complete!!! Yay!)

 

As I said above, live yoghurt, Lactobacillus tablets (e.g. acidophilus) (from Holland and Barrett) and kefir - but see the cautions above and make sure that you exclude any possible underlying pathology by seeing your GP - SERIOUSLY!!!

[Aetherous]

I haven't tried this but here is an option for probiotics.

[mYTHmAKER]

As someone already stated - check in with the local vegetarian society.

It is also helpful if you make a list of everything you eat in a week including spices condiments etc.

if you post it you might get some helpful feed back.

[mYTHmAKER]

Another thought

As a vegetarian it is a good idea to find a doctor who is a vegetarian so

you are on the same wavelength.

At some point a non vegetarian doctor will roll his/her eyes - 'if you don't listen to me and eat meat or at

least fish i can't help you.' or just tune out to your needs.

[i am]

Google MICROBIOME. There have been many NPR reports on it lately, and tons of studies.

 

Symbiosis isn't when you eat something. It's when two organisms work together to meet each other's needs. Think of the birds on a horses back, eating the insects that would otherwise bite the horse. Win-win. Birds eat, horse doesn't get bit.

 

Most food you eat, YOU don't digest. The bacteria in your stomach digests it. Everyone has good and bad bacteria. You have ecoli in your stomach. We all do. It's when there's too much that you get sick. Having a higher proportion of good bacteria to bad bacteria is what makes you healthy and digest well. Some you're born with, others come from eating the right things.

 

Without the right stuff in your gut, you aren't going to properly digest these foods you're eating. Taking probiotics is one good way to get healthy bacteria in you. Yogurt, kombucha etc. "Live, active culture".

[i am]

Here's one, but there has been a whole series on NPR, some of it a lot more interesting than this.

 

http://www.npr.org/blogs/thesalt/2013/11/08/243929866/can-we-eat-our-way-to-a-healthier-microbiome-its-complicated

[gatito]

<snip>

 

Symbiosis isn't when you eat something. It's when two organisms work together to meet each other's needs. Think of the birds on a horses back, eating the insects that would otherwise bite the horse. Win-win. Birds eat, horse doesn't get bit.

 

<snip>

 

As is usual, there does seem to be a bit of a disagreement, see: -

 

Symbiosis: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Symbiosis (//en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Symbiosis)

 

and particularly

 

Endosymbiont: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Endosymbiont (//en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Endosymbiont)

[gatito]

Another thought

As a vegetarian it is a good idea to find a doctor who is a vegetarian so

you are on the same wavelength.

At some point a non vegetarian doctor will roll his/her eyes - 'if you don't listen to me and eat meat or at

least fish i can't help you.' or just tune out to your needs.

 

Yep - very likely, although if they're professional, that shouldn't be an issue.

[Rara]

Another thought

As a vegetarian it is a good idea to find a doctor who is a vegetarian so

you are on the same wavelength.

At some point a non vegetarian doctor will roll his/her eyes - 'if you don't listen to me and eat meat or at

least fish i can't help you.' or just tune out to your needs.

Interesting scenario today! Saw the GP...this one doesn't even work at the surgery. He was in doing cover and earning "extra christmas money". He is a kickboxer and was completely impartial (so he totally understood my level of activity as a martial artist and was reflective how how impartial I am when giving personal advice) He did not care about my choice, he said that's for me. He cared about what was going on in my belly. It was like it was meant to be.

 

So he has advised that, as previously spoken about, I'm getting plenty of fibre and this is out of balance with my slow release carbs. So if I want to stay veggie, I should work out a better diet plan that balances this out. We mutually agreed that supplements were a bit of a forced idea, but he feels that I can get through this given time and patience. Half the world don't eat meat due to lack of availability, but all find a way. I thought this was a very interesting point! He also said, we are omnivores though. By nature, we eat what we have in front of us to survive. I loved his balanced argument...I really do have more research to do.

 

About ny diet then...here is a typical day:

 

Breakfast - 2 slices of wholemeal toast, 2 boiled eggs. Cereal,OJ, green tea

Mid morning - banana, unsalted cashews

Lunch- wholemeal sandwich with veg pate and salad

Mid aft- protein flapjack (oats,peanut butter,honey,whey protein)

Dinner- veg and bean burrito inc rice and salad.

Before bed-chocolate jaffa cakes or dark choc digestive biscuits because I'm hungry as hell and tired of all the sensible foods i've eaten all day lol

 

Plenty of water throughout the day. Sometimes a black coffee with 2 sugars at one point in the day too.

 

So the bread and veg will easily cause gas, says the GP. If anyone spots anything that should be changed, you will be of great help!

 

As of now though, I'm still veggie. Persisting. Just.

Edited December 5, 2013 by Rara

[gatito]

You've found a highly professional and competent GP by the sound of it.

 

Good luck with your experiment.

 

Best wishes

 

g

Edited December 5, 2013 by gatito

[mYTHmAKER]

Interesting scenario today! Saw the GP...this one doesn't even work at the surgery. He was in doing cover and earning "extra christmas money". He is a kickboxer and was completely impartial (so he totally understood my level of activity as a martial artist and was reflective how how impartial I am when giving personal advice) He did not care about my choice, he said that's for me. He cared about what was going on in my belly. It was like it was meant to be.

 

So he has advised that, as previously spoken about, I'm getting plenty of fibre and this is out of balance with my slow release carbs. So if I want to stay veggie, I should work out a better diet plan that balances this out. We mutually agreed that supplements were a bit of a forced idea, but he feels that I can get through this given time and patience. Half the world don't eat meat due to lack of availability, but all find a way. I thought this was a very interesting point! He also said, we are omnivores though. By nature, we eat what we have in front of us to survive. I loved his balanced argument...I really do have more research to do.

 

About ny diet then...here is a typical day:

 

Breakfast - 2 slices of wholemeal toast, 2 boiled eggs. Cereal,OJ, green tea

Mid morning - banana, unsalted cashews

Lunch- wholemeal sandwich with veg pate and salad

Mid aft- protein flapjack (oats,peanut butter,honey,whey protein)

Dinner- veg and bean burrito inc rice and salad.

Before bed-chocolate jaffa cakes or dark choc digestive biscuits because I'm hungry as hell and tired of all the sensible foods i've eaten all day lol

 

Plenty of water throughout the day. Sometimes a black coffee with 2 sugars at one point in the day too.

 

So the bread and veg will easily cause gas, says the GP. If anyone spots anything that should be changed, you will be of great help!

 

As of now though, I'm still veggie. Persisting. Just.

Sweets - sugar tends to make one feel hungry. Consider honey to be sugar.

bananas and cashews or any nuts with bananas difficult to digest

coffee can act as a laxative especially during transition

not sure but chocolate might also act as a laxative.

also nuts with sweets = gas

Do some research on food combining to get a better idea of what combines well.

[mYTHmAKER]

Rara since you live you England here is someone who is very knowledgeable re diet.

He may not be near you but there are links on his website which might be of interest

and I believe he has some publications

http://www.drsidhwa.com/

[Rara]

Thanks mTYHmAKER, I appreciate it. As for nuts and sweets etc, I see what you're saying. Just running out of ideas of what to eat as I clearly have enough veg and bread/rice as it is! Will do some digging

[xor]

Still learning myself but these seem like a good starting point on learning about food combinations:

 

http://www.livestrong.com/article/222971-diet-foods-to-avoid-in-combination/

 

(not sure about the blood type diet that gets mentioned there...)

Edited December 6, 2013 by xor

[mYTHmAKER]

What we eat

used to eat 3 meals a day now we are down to 2 as per schedule changes

wake up 10 am - 2 cups of green tea or water

about noon or with brunch -hemp powder 1/2 banana blended with water.

Brunch about 2pm- Blended greens ( romaine lettuce, cucumber, green pepper, celery. dandelion) with avocado, tomatoes sliced on top)

Fruit salad with blended nut and fruit topping( 2-4 oz nuts ( sunflower seeds, pumpkin seeds, walnuts, cashews) - 1 table spoon ground flax seeds and sesame seeds mixed in. Fruits vary with the season.

Here it is easier to digest the fruit and nuts as they are blended.

 

Dinner varies between 6 and 8 pm

Large green salad and a bowl of vegetables and beans (beans tend to take away hunger) cooked in a waterless pot. This could be kale, collard greens , mushrooms,onion,broccoli,parsnip. carrot, cabbage and whatever else is available.

Sometimes we have spaghetti with tomato sauce and veggies, Sometimes artichoke, or squash, plantain whatever, yams, whatever

 

If your food is balanced and you exercise you don't get hungry as quickly.

 

If i feel hungry at any time I might have a piece of fruit or a little nut butter

 

Weekends we eat dinner out

I don't like to make fancy dishes as the simple tastes good to me and takes less time

If you like fancy there are plenty of recipes out there. Dr Joel Fuhrman has some good ones.

[Rara]

What we eat

used to eat 3 meals a day now we are down to 2 as per schedule changes

wake up 10 am - 2 cups of green tea or water

about noon or with brunch -hemp powder 1/2 banana blended with water.

Brunch about 2pm- Blended greens ( romaine lettuce, cucumber, green pepper, celery. dandelion) with avocado, tomatoes sliced on top)

Fruit salad with blended nut and fruit topping( 2-4 oz nuts ( sunflower seeds, pumpkin seeds, walnuts, cashews) - 1 table spoon ground flax seeds and sesame seeds mixed in. Fruits vary with the season.

Here it is easier to digest the fruit and nuts as they are blended.

 

Dinner varies between 6 and 8 pm

Large green salad and a bowl of vegetables and beans (beans tend to take away hunger) cooked in a waterless pot. This could be kale, collard greens , mushrooms,onion,broccoli,parsnip. carrot, cabbage and whatever else is available.

Sometimes we have spaghetti with tomato sauce and veggies, Sometimes artichoke, or squash, plantain whatever, yams, whatever

 

If your food is balanced and you exercise you don't get hungry as quickly.

 

If i feel hungry at any time I might have a piece of fruit or a little nut butter

 

Weekends we eat dinner out

I don't like to make fancy dishes as the simple tastes good to me and takes less time

If you like fancy there are plenty of recipes out there. Dr Joel Fuhrman has some good ones.

Thank you for sharing. May I ask what your level of activity is and if you're quite slim? I'm always travelling about / exercising thus burning a lot of calories. I couldn't imagine surviving on this sort of diet...all the veg and fruit I'm consuming now is already passing through me - Casper The Ghost style!

[Rara]

Still learning myself but these seem like a good starting point on learning about food combinations:

 

http://www.livestrong.com/article/222971-diet-foods-to-avoid-in-combination/

 

(not sure about the blood type diet that gets mentioned there...)

How on earth?? Wow, how are you getting on with this? I'm a man on the move, and this looks really difficult to achieve. Though less pizza would certainly be a good thing for me.

 

This basically says to eat everything alone with no accompaniments. Quick and easy sure, but this is hard, say, if I want to eat out on work/with friends. Which is a lot...

[mYTHmAKER]

Thank you for sharing. May I ask what your level of activity is and if you're quite slim? I'm always travelling about / exercising thus burning a lot of calories. I couldn't imagine surviving on this sort of diet...all the veg and fruit I'm consuming now is already passing through me - Casper The Ghost style!

I am 5' 10 1/2" and weigh between 150 and 156#

Very strong so I'm told

I stretch and play tai chi chuan , sword and stick forms most every day

Edited December 6, 2013 by mYTHmAKER