Spirit->Organ Healing

[Uroboros]

In the TCM system, it seems that our body is an energetic sack/ vessel.

 

The Organs seem to be a denser manifestation. The Spirits are a "lighter" manifestation of the same "thing".

 

If you can heal the Spirits thru healing the Organs....You can also heal the Organs thru healing the Spirit.

 

If you are lacking Will, cultivate it and the Organ will grow stronger as well!!

 

The Spirits also help us see which Organs are unbalanced. Its a two way street!

 

This may help in understanding why a person may become diseased and then, go do things they always wanted to do ( healing the Spirit) and become healthy.

 

Has anyone ever tried this? If so, what has your experience been?

 

Peace.

[BaguaKicksAss]

I've always found it interesting in TCM Taoist stuff that different parts of our bodies, most especially our organs, house a large number of spirits . Specific generals for different areas, with different jobs and so forth.

[Uroboros]

I've always found it interesting in TCM Taoist stuff that different parts of our bodies, most especially our organs, house a large number of spirits . Specific generals for different areas, with different jobs and so forth.

 

It is fascinating, isnt it?! I love the way the Taoist/ Classical books/ systems see the world. Especially how It has a depth to it, in how the universe, our small place in it, is perceived.

 

An example of Spirit->Organ healing in my own life. I have had Liver problems since I was born. I have also had intense anger problems. From what I understand, the Hun has something to do with boundaries and humanity. Also kindness. To ones self and others.

 

So, boundaries is something I have worked on. Also, learning to express anger in a healthy, balanced way. I have noticed that anger fortified personal boundaries. Its very powerful and establishes boundaries that may be weak or broken.

 

In doing that work, my liver changes. It starts to work more, sometimes it gets un-stuck by itself after I work on a spiritual/mental/emotional aspect connected to it. I can feel it move and gurgle. Is it healed yet? Nope.

 

I have experienced a connection, though.

 

 

When you say a large number of Spirits, BKA, what amount are you talking about? More then just one that is expansive and vast?

 

I would love to hear what you know/ think!

 

Thanks.

 

Peace

[Aetherous]

The back shu points are good to use when one of the 5 shen is disturbed in addition to that organ being deficient.

[Uroboros]

The back shu points are good to use when one of the 5 shen is disturbed in addition to that organ being deficient.

 

Ohh! That is helpful to know! Thanks, Turtle Shell!

 

I will experiment with those....

 

Peace

[Isimsiz Biri]

 

An example of Spirit->Organ healing in my own life.

 

....

 

Is it healed yet? Nope.

 

 

Contradiction.

 

 

[Uroboros]

Contradiction.

 

Not a contradiction. There is heal-ing, it is not heal-ed, yet.

 

The aspect of my Spirit that is connected is also not heal-ed, yet.

 

If you still think there is a contradiction, please explain what you think and why. Otherwise, it is not clear and understanding cannot be gained.

 

Peace

[dawei]

Do you dream or how is your dream-state? (no... I won't turn Freudian on you!)

 

And how would you characterize your courage ? (No... I won't compare you to the cowardly Lion!)

[Uroboros]

Do you dream or how is your dream-state? (no... I won't turn Freudian on you!)

 

And how would you characterize your courage ? (No... I won't compare you to the cowardly Lion!)

 

hehe, questions! Fun.

 

I dream almost always. They are wild, crazy, constantly changing. Often times violent in some form. Like an action movie!

 

Courage? Hmm....I have it and I dont. Its a constant pull between knowing what I want to do/ be and restricting my self.

 

Overall, I have quite a bit of courage. I always do what is right for me at the time. No matter how scary.

 

What say you, oh wise one?!

 

Peace

[dawei]

hehe, questions! Fun.

 

I dream almost always. They are wild, crazy, constantly changing. Often times violent in some form. Like an action movie!

 

Courage? Hmm....I have it and I dont. Its a constant pull between knowing what I want to do/ be and restricting my self.

 

Overall, I have quite a bit of courage. I always do what is right for me at the time. No matter how scary.

 

What say you, oh wise one?!

 

Peace

 

Hun controls the dreams... they seem restless and looking for action at any cost.

 

I almost never dream... Or at least I never remember them (as we are told we all dream every night).

 

You need to explore why your dreams are this way... Liver/Hun.

 

Your courage seems in the right place so there is some amount of self-actualization.

 

Maybe try this, as a purging action:

 

Slight cup your right hand. Then slap your liver/gall bladder area (or have another do it). And also move to the side of the ribs, and downward... all in a circular motion. how bad does it sting, or not? Wiggle the toes to give it a path out.

[Uroboros]

Hun controls the dreams... they seem restless and looking for action at any cost.

 

I almost never dream... Or at least I never remember them (as we are told we all dream every night).

 

You need to explore why your dreams are this way... Liver/Hun.

 

Your courage seems in the right place so there is some amount of self-actualization.

 

Maybe try this, as a purging action:

 

Slight cup your right hand. Then slap your liver/gall bladder area (or have another do it). And also move to the side of the ribs, and downward... all in a circular motion. how bad does it sting, or not? Wiggle the toes to give it a path out.

 

Interesting...i did not see the connection to dreams.. They are restless, looking for action.

 

You must have dreams so amazing, that your mind cannot handle the awesomeness! haha.

 

Very good point. I will explore why my dreams are the way they are....Oh, fun!

 

There is some amount of self actualization, yep. How much? Only the shadow knows.......

 

I can slap the liver area lightly, as you said and it does not hurt. The liver sometimes hurts on its own time. hah! I should fire it!

 

Thank you for your insight and help, Dawei.

 

Peace

[Isimsiz Biri]

Not a contradiction. There is heal-ing, it is not heal-ed, yet.

 

The aspect of my Spirit that is connected is also not heal-ed, yet.

 

If you still think there is a contradiction, please explain what you think and why. Otherwise, it is not clear and understanding cannot be gained.

 

Peace

 

Could you also support your argument with medical checks?

 

For instance, chronologically, your liver function test results (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liver_function_tests) were bad at one time, and then after some time, the same tests were applied to find better results? Did you give blood samples for these two separate tests? Or are you just talking about your feelings?

[Uroboros]

Could you also support your argument with medical checks?

 

For instance, chronologically, your liver function test results (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liver_function_tests) were bad at one time, and then after some time, the same tests were applied to find better results? Did you give blood samples for these two separate tests? Or are you just talking about your feelings?

 

My experience is based on observation and symptoms. Eye color, pain in liver area, feelings of sluggishness, temple area headaches/ migraines, nausea, before and after detoxification(liver specific and other) and what various doctors have said (that my liver is weakened/ damaged based on the doctor).

 

Do I have tests to "prove" my argument? No.

 

Do I need to? No.

 

I have no argument to prove. Its just an idea. Something to think about and see if it works for a person in their own experience, if it has any value.

 

If it has none for you, so be it!

 

Is there a reason you do not want this idea to be possible? Quoting what I said in reply to the contradiction comment and asking if I have tests, which wont ever really prove anything to you or anyone else, does not address what you thought was a contradiction and why you thought it was one.

 

Peace

[Isimsiz Biri]

My experience is based on observation and symptoms. Eye color, pain in liver area, feelings of sluggishness, temple area headaches/ migraines, nausea, before and after detoxification(liver specific and other) and what various doctors have said (that my liver is weakened/ damaged based on the doctor).

 

Do I have tests to "prove" my argument? No.

 

Do I need to? No.

 

I have no argument to prove. Its just an idea. Something to think about and see if it works for a person in their own experience, if it has any value.

 

If it has none for you, so be it!

 

Is there a reason you do not want this idea to be possible? Quoting what I said in reply to the contradiction comment and asking if I have tests, which wont ever really prove anything to you or anyone else, does not address what you thought was a contradiction and why you thought it was one.

 

Peace

 

First of all, what you have written was contradictory according to English language. Instead of writing "Is it healed yet? Nope." You should have said, at least, "the healing process still continues" or a similar thing.

 

I have nothing against your story. You are claiming that I do want your healing to be possible? How did you reach this solution is a mystery. You are reading a non existing intent from my side. If you like the ""Voowww, great story!" type comments, you should also be prepared to face objective comments too. I did not even criticize you, just asked for the liver function tests.

 

If you had had liver function tests with you, it would have been much more easier to prove your story to a skeptic. Repeat, I am not that skeptic but anyone can be. As far as I understand, some medical doctors inspected you visually and also tapping on your liver, for a experienced doctor it tells many things but it never replaces liver function tests.

 

Liver is a very important organ in human body. My recommendation is to have liver function tests, for your own good. It will not jeopardize your spiritual process but supports and proves it.

 

By writing peace at the end of a post, there is no peace. Peace comes when the contents of your posts are peaceful.

[Uroboros]

First of all, what you have written was contradictory according to English language. Instead of writing "Is it healed yet? Nope." You should have said, at least, "the healing process still continues" or a similar thing.

 

I have nothing against your story. You are claiming that I do want your healing to be possible? How did you reach this solution is a mystery. You are reading a non existing intent from my side. If you like the ""Voowww, great story!" type comments, you should also be prepared to face objective comments too. I did not even criticize you, just asked for the liver function tests.

 

If you had had liver function tests with you, it would have been much more easier to prove your story to a skeptic. Repeat, I am not that skeptic but anyone can be. As far as I understand, some medical doctors inspected you visually and also tapping on your liver, for a experienced doctor it tells many things but it never replaces liver function tests.

 

Liver is a very important organ in human body. My recommendation is to have liver function tests, for your own good. It will not jeopardize your spiritual process but supports and proves it.

 

By writing peace at the end of a post, there is no peace. Peace comes when the contents of your posts are peaceful.

 

Hm.. - is it healed yet- nope-....How do these two statements oppose each other?

 

I was asking if you did not want it to be possible. Much is misunderstood/ missed thru typing. Clarification was the intent.

 

Criticism is a good thing! Your comment seemed a bit strange since you did not explain why what I said was contradictory, then asked a question about validity. That is why I asked to clarify your intent. I have no interest in debating if it is possible.

 

I do not need to prove my story. It is just that, my story. Tests will prove nothing, since the "skeptic" will not be there when I take them. The idea is also not based on my story. It is based on TCM theory.

 

In my experience, liver function tests, which I have had done in the past, told the western orthodox doctors nothing about its true condition. In my experience, there are far more reliable ways to see/ test and those have shown themselves to be accurate when done by a skilled practitioner. Examples- applied kinesiology, the various forms of chinese diagnosis, symptom grouping and channel state.

 

There is peace if I choose to have peace, just as you can choose peace.

 

Peace

[Isimsiz Biri]

Hm.. - is it healed yet- nope-....How do these two statements oppose each other?

 

I was asking if you did not want it to be possible. Much is misunderstood/ missed thru typing. Clarification was the intent.

 

Criticism is a good thing! Your comment seemed a bit strange since you did not explain why what I said was contradictory, then asked a question about validity. That is why I asked to clarify your intent. I have no interest in debating if it is possible.

 

I do not need to prove my story. It is just that, my story. Tests will prove nothing, since the "skeptic" will not be there when I take them. The idea is also not based on my story. It is based on TCM theory.

 

In my experience, liver function tests, which I have had done in the past, told the western orthodox doctors nothing about its true condition. In my experience, there are far more reliable ways to see/ test and those have shown themselves to be accurate when done by a skilled practitioner. Examples- applied kinesiology, the various forms of chinese diagnosis, symptom grouping and channel state.

 

There is peace if I choose to have peace, just as you can choose peace.

 

Peace

 

 

TCM is used together with Western Medicine in China too. I do not understand why you do not want to use them together. Anyway, it is your liver, not my business at all.

 

Everybody here speaks of tolerance, yet I do not see any sign of it.

 

Wish you a good health.

[Uroboros]

TCM is used together with Western Medicine in China too. I do not understand why you do not want to use them together. Anyway, it is your liver, not my business at all.

 

Everybody here speaks of tolerance, yet I do not see any sign of it.

 

Wish you a good health.

 

Sure, plenty use it together. I spent 10 years using Western Medicine. Now, I am having to repair the damage that was done and heal what was never healed. There is plenty of good in it, for sure. It is not my path, though.

 

That depends on what you consider tolerance. Is tolerance letting people say what they want to say and not saying what you want? If so, then it is one sided. Spectrums of tolerance!

 

Thank you! I wish you good health, as well!

 

Edit- After a bit of thought, I wonder if Tolerance would stem, mostly, from the Yi/Spleen. If the Yi opens potentials and tolerance is an acceptance of other potentials, maybe a Yi imbalance is at play.

 

Peace

Edited November 22, 2013 by Uroboros

[Isimsiz Biri]

Sure, plenty use it together. I spent 10 years using Western Medicine. Now, I am having to repair the damage that was done and heal what was never healed. There is plenty of good in it, for sure. It is not my path, though.

 

That depends on what you consider tolerance. Is tolerance letting people say what they want to say and not saying what you want? If so, then it is one sided. Spectrums of tolerance!

 

Thank you! I wish you good health, as well!

 

Edit- After a bit of thought, I wonder if Tolerance would stem, mostly, from the Yi/Spleen. If the Yi opens potentials and tolerance is an acceptance of other potentials, maybe a Yi imbalance is at play.

 

Peace

 

I talked about a combined application not Western Medicine alone or TCM alone. For instance, you apply liver function test, continue your TCM (whatever it is) then have a second test.

[Uroboros]

I talked about a combined application not Western Medicine alone or TCM alone. For instance, you apply liver function test, continue your TCM (whatever it is) then have a second test.

 

I saw that. In my experience, blood tests are rarely needed and so far, they have not been for me.

 

Now, back on topic.

 

Do you have any thoughts about the Spirits and how they affect the Organs in healing?

 

Something I have been thinking about, Kidneys and Zhi. The Will is in the kidneys...if so, can we cultivate our ability to make aware, free choices and strengthen the kidneys?

 

This can become a tie in to personal growth, where you cultivate and change your self.

 

Peace

[Isimsiz Biri]

I saw that. In my experience, blood tests are rarely needed and so far, they have not been for me.

 

Now, back on topic.

 

Do you have any thoughts about the Spirits and how they affect the Organs in healing?

 

Something I have been thinking about, Kidneys and Zhi. The Will is in the kidneys...if so, can we cultivate our ability to make aware, free choices and strengthen the kidneys?

 

This can become a tie in to personal growth, where you cultivate and change your self.

 

Peace

 

Uroboros,

 

As a follower of Spiritism, I disagree with all TCM related concepts. Hun, Po, Shen, etc, five elements theory, I disagree. Sorry. Please do not ask me to post any further on this subject, because it is a taboo, everybody here believes that TCM is the best.

[dawei]

Now, back on topic.

 

Interesting blog on

SHEN AND HUN: THE PSYCHE IN CHINESE MEDICINE

 

http://maciociaonline.blogspot.com/2012/11/shen-and-hun-psyche-in-chinese-medicine.html

[dawei]

That Blog has very interesting articles. Check out the different years...

 

In one it says:

"When we feel angry, anger affects the Liver automatically, but it is the Shen of the Heart that “feels” the anger."

 

To tie in your other thread on 'sounds' to this thread on 'shen'... this is why some will advise "Haaaa" (heart sound) to deal with anger (Liver).

[Uroboros]

Uroboros,

 

As a follower of Spiritism, I disagree with all TCM related concepts. Hun, Po, Shen, etc, five elements theory, I disagree. Sorry. Please do not ask me to post any further on this subject, because it is a taboo, everybody here believes that TCM is the best.

 

Hmm. Then why did you decide to post on a TCM topic?

 

I asked your opinion so as to end the pointless arguments and move into a creative discussion about the topic this thread is about.

 

Peace.

[Uroboros]

Interesting blog on

SHEN AND HUN: THE PSYCHE IN CHINESE MEDICINE

 

http://maciociaonline.blogspot.com/2012/11/shen-and-hun-psyche-in-chinese-medicine.html

 

That Blog has very interesting articles. Check out the different years...

 

In one it says:

"When we feel angry, anger affects the Liver automatically, but it is the Shen of the Heart that “feels” the anger."

 

To tie in your other thread on 'sounds' to this thread on 'shen'... this is why some will advise "Haaaa" (heart sound) to deal with anger (Liver).

 

I will check those out! Thank you, Dawei!

 

Ohhh. I have read quite a few who advice the use of Heart sound to deal with anger. Other emotions as well.

 

Thank you for bringing both threads together! They do connect. Learn the Sounds, learn the Organs, can do some amazing things with them.

 

Peace

[skydog]

soul/follow your heart opens the heart which opens the rest of the body energetically.

Edited November 24, 2013 by skydog