Yin chi number 3

[BaguaKicksAss]

In case it wasn't clear about the thread split, the posts MPG was making in the SM thread, were split off into this thread that one of the members (HE I beleive?) created for off topic yin qi rants by MPG... It wasn't pitted, so this may not have been clear, so just pointing it out. So yeah he's still going on about SM and yin qi, but not in a SM thread anymore...

[Brian]

In case it wasn't clear about the thread split, the posts MPG was making in the SM thread, were split off into this thread that one of the members (HE I beleive?) created for off topic yin qi rants by MPG... It wasn't pitted, so this may not have been clear, so just pointing it out. So yeah he's still going on about SM and yin qi, but not in a SM thread anymore...

I think the fuel now comes more from the perception by some that Stillness-Movement and Ya Mu are intentionally being gored in this spinoff thread. That and the fact that MPG has plainly stated that if the discussion quells here then he will simply bide his time until the next mention of yin chi in a Stillness-Movement thread and jump right back in again.

[BaguaKicksAss]

That makes sense Brian thank you . And yes I figured. I just wanted to make sure that this thread in particular was seen for what it tried to be . The timestamp thing made it rather confusing....

 

PS, The tech team makes the BEST PFFs around, and would be happy to fancy yours up a bit MPG if you would like... a sub forum or two... (well OK and anyone else for that matter too, but trying to sell PFF posting to MPG today)

[Thunder_Gooch]

(deleted to consolidate posts)

Edited November 28, 2013 by More_Pie_Guy

[BaguaKicksAss]

The moving of an entire already going thread to your PFF, is more a mod level decision... I'm sure they will be reading this thread though, so you never know.

 

I was thinking more for future use.

[tongkosong]

More Pie Guy,

 

I do respect your resilient and unwavering belief, however, I do think you need a better way of communicating them to others. Communicate your opinion with honor and respect would be a better solution for you, in my humble opinion. If you bulldozed other people's beliefs and systems, nothing good would come out of it, regardless if you are right or wrong. The thing that I disagree with the way you communicate is, even when you are right, people get turn off and would most likely try to discredit you. Remember the saying winning the battle, but, losing the war. Another observation I make is that the more you carry on this behavior, the Mopai's reputation gets sullied. This is why I feel I have to write the previous post. I am sure you do not mean to disrespect John Chang or Mopai. Do know this though, since you contribute many opinions in regards to Mopai or John Chang (or anything Neigong related), people form an opinion on Mopai and John Chang through your posts. That is why it is our wish that you do not drag the Mopai and John Chang through your muddy battleground. Remember, if you respect John Chang, you should honor his wishes, which is to leave Mopai and him alone and out of any controversy.

 

[Green Tiger]

To all TTB members,

 

If you want to accuse me of trolling and spamming that's fine, but don't forget your role in the process. I am only replying when this topic is brought up, and I only am replying to replies I get.

 

If you don't want a reply from me, put me on ignore don't say anything more to me if you don't want a response.

 

Rather than cry wolf about spam and trolling, put me on ignore and exit the conversation.

 

Just my $0.02.

 

 

 

So either he is wrong, or JC and the mo pai school is.

 

I think the most likely scenario is that what he describes as earth or yin energy isn't the same thing JC and the mo pai school call yin energy.

 

He is describing something else altogether.

 

 

 

Hey MPG,

 

So I talked to the ancient ones and they said we're all just a little confused. What the Stillness Movement folks have been talking about is actually yabba dabba yin energy. What the Mo Pai folks have been talking about is yabba doo yin energy. Totally different, just like you said! So I guess you were right all along. Glad that's settled.

 

In all seriousness though, regardless of what you want to label the energy you're cultivating, you're wasting it arguing about labels.

 

My $0.02.

[Mal]

PS, The tech team makes the BEST PFFs around, and would be happy to fancy yours up a bit MPG if you would like.

Yes PPF's are great, but really unable to address

If the other side of the community has the right to keep bringing this issue up, as far as I can see I should have the right to continue to disagree with them, no matter if 95% of the community disagrees.

The replies in this thread really seem to be requesting a different communication style than what MPG is currently implementing, but at least non-insulting communication is currently happening in this thread - thank you for everyone's efforts to keep things civil.

[h.uriahr]

I find it interesting that he tackled all replies except the the one about John sending 3 level 3 students out to look for other totally awesome dudes. Kind of takes the wind out of his 'westerner badass' argument. Don't get me wrong, Jim was super nice...unless you brought up John...then I kind of caught on to why westerners were shut out. MPG is pushing his mo pai yin theory harder than a frat boy pushin roofied drinks...For the record, I think it's obvious that training outside and in natural clothing is better for you than indoors period but do I hail it enough to rape every thread all day long? No.

[thamosh]

Please understand that More Pie Guy does not represent Mopai or its views. He was taught by Jim, who was an outdoor student of Mopai. I feel that none of us should be able to have the final authority on what is Yin or what is being taught in a school. I am not worthy or knowledgable enough to represent Mopai or John Chang's views. Unless a student is given authority by the master of a school to represent the school's ideas and views, I feel it is better to keep our opinion to ourselves and maybe learn from others. In my opinion, the Magus of Java was never intended by John Chang to be the bible on everything Neigong related, but, I am not saying that everything in the book is false. As to More Pie Guy's opinion to Jim's accomplishments (compared to the indoor Indonesian students), I would say it is good to have a high opinion on your teacher, but do not do that while belittling others' accomplishments. This put you and Jim in a bad light because your ignorance shows your arrogance. Instead of arguing and promoting your views, More Pie Guy, it would be better use of your time to further your practice. I humbly hope that if you insist on continuing your arguments, please avoid using Mopai's name or John Chang's. Remember Jim's conversation with John Chang was mostly done through an interpreter, a non-professional interpreter at that.

 

Tongkosong,

 

So to better understand your above points are you saying that More Pie Guy should not post about the MoPai at all?

 

And

 

For him to do so is against the Mo Pai wishes?

Edited November 27, 2013 by thamosh

[tongkosong]

Tongkosong,

 

So to better understand your above points are you saying that More Pie Guy should not post about the MoPai at all?

 

And

 

For him to do so is against the Mo Pai wishes?

 

No, that is not what I meant. I respect More Pie Guy as a person with strong conviction and opinion, however, I feel he needs to stop posting his opinions as having the final authority of Mopai or John Chang. I am not agreeing or disagreeing with his opinions, but feel that unless a person was instructed by the headmaster of the Mopai school or John Chang, one should not say that the opinion posted is the view and teachings of Mopai. To form an opinion that carries the weight of a school is a heavy burden and you have to have the authority from the master of the school. To compare and put down an opinion made by another school, you have to be a level of a master of your system with full knowledge and understanding of your school and its teachings.

 

I understand that the internet is a forum of free exchange of ideas, but, if it is your own ideas, I have no problem with whatever you say. If you attach your opinion to a system or a school, then it is different. Due to the fiasco from Jim and others, John Chang and the current headmaster wish to get away from the "limelight" and to avoid further controversies, they wished to be left alone. I hope this clears up any misunderstandings.

[Mal]

I hope this clears up any misunderstandings.

 

Thank you tongkosong

[h.uriahr]

I miss Santiago.

[Mal]

I miss Santiago.

 

He is well and having a wonderful time. Good new job, still teaching martial arts and KAP

[Thunder_Gooch]

(deleted to consolidate posts)

Edited November 28, 2013 by More_Pie_Guy

[BaguaKicksAss]

We could invent a new religion based on worshiping invisible pink unicorns and flying spagetti monsters and if someone was dumb enough to really really believe that crap, they could get a faith healing and experience placebo based healing. Psychosomatic medicine works because the mind is a powerful thing.

 

I believe you are disrespecting my religion. I'm going to report you.

 

[xor]

Jim progressed as far as he was allowed to. This is like blaming a football team for not making the playoffs after they were all disbanded and all banned from the NFL.

 

There are many places and times where something else than talent bars you from advancing. I'm not blaming anyone here, it was a further comment on what I said earlier:

"While JC may be impressive there is not even guarantee that we are talking about things as it's taught in Indonesia. The indoor students might even have vastly different ideas than were given to westerners."

 

It may be unfortunate but there is no certainty what they received is what the ideas of the indoor students might be. Usually with traditions one only knows someone can represent any school when they are given the permission to teach.

 

What Jim and Kosta were taught about yin chi, it's mechanics and behaviors are crystal clear.

 

Did you listen to the timemonk interview with Kosta and what he said about receiving enough "yin chi" the moment you touch the ground to balance yin and yang? That seems a bit different from needing to meditate on the ground...

[Harmonious Emptiness]

well, as I said, check out the success rates of SM medicine. They are way way way beyond that of placebo. Not to mention that many if not most of the cases didn't even respond to actual Western medicine and doctors were already baffled after prescribing so many treatments. These treatments didn't work, which were already much stronger than placebos, and then SM medicine did work.

 

So, how do you continue to say it must only be placebo, when real drugs and treatments, administered in the same way placebos are administered, already didn't work on the same patient?

 

That's because it's effective. John Chang practices a similar medicine, though I don't know any more about it than you. Given the success rates of SM medicine using these modalities, I'm led to believe there are simply things in SM that allow one to gather yin chi which Mo Pai does not know about or does not use because it is more of a "hard" qi gong, whereas SM is more of a soft qi gong.

 

You'd do well to just stop posting and leave both of these lineages alone. Neither one of them wants you talking about them, and you have nothing to offer anyone about the truth of either one. I think it's time you respect those wishes.

[h.uriahr]

To MPG,

 

Ditto buddy. What is with YOUR OBSESSION of bombing every yin thread/post? Oh I know "To

Enforce Justice and Promote Peace and to Slay the Injustice of the World!" To use your own logic, if John Chang made a video asking for all people to stop quoting a BOOK that he himself didn't write and to stop quoting OUTDOOR WESTERNERS youd probably yet still rally against the whole yin thing. You also seem completely oblivious to Kostas remarks about the other systems that collect yin in completely different manners and that collecting yin isn't all that difficult. Why dodge that? Maybe because it doesn't go with your whole "I'm right you're wrong" theory?? Kosta-the god who wrote your bible-seems to attribute yIn with gravity and if thats the case then you can collect yin in orbit i don't know man but your comments on yin are getting really painful. I've never ignored anyone and I don't want to start but you are on the very cusp. I enjoy the other things you contribute. Well other than when you call every single system in the world except maybe 8-10 I know systems WORTHLESS.

[h.uriahr]

Lets talk reality. If my dick is bigger than yours does that make me THE authority on how to pleasure women? No. Unless you automatically assume bigger dicks give instant pleasure. Also if you're only 3 inches and I'm 4 inches then that doesn't mean shit either so then you see how this is all pointless? I just wasted my time and yours by typing in some bogus bull dookie and because its on here you're gonna read it. Oh and don't fret because penile enlargement surgery has come a long way so you're in luck. Dr Scrotty can work wonders on your wing wong.

 

On a serious note why not make the first pair of yin collecting super pants? Make a hole in the perineum area so you can take the super collector rod and insert it, then using the taint tape attach the rod securely to your taint, shave first of course, and adjust the rod so that it drags on the ground! Boom! The telescoping super yin collecting taint pants! The idea is there brother now you work the magic!

[BaguaKicksAss]

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[Thunder_Gooch]

(deleted to consolidate posts)

Edited November 28, 2013 by More_Pie_Guy

[h.uriahr]

Ok so More Pie Guy wins! He has it down ladies and gentlemen! Ok MPG everyone on the bums has agreed to play a role playing game where we all pretend that yin chi isn't EXACTLY as the Holy Book 'Magus of Java' describes it as so you can stop correcting every single yin theory, yang theory, or any other theory BTW you're awesome for defending John and the Mo Pai. What would John do without you?

[BaguaKicksAss]

Placebo works on rats and dogs (can't find the quote now, forgot which other animal) that is awesome! I did not know that.

 

One of my fave methods for testing something is to do it on someone unknowingly. Though getting their permission first then waiting long enough they forget about it is probably a bit more ethical .

[Friend]

I dont know.

Only MJJBecker has expirience

in Stillnessmovement Qigong and Mo Pai

to be able to compare to a degree.Again

he can only tell on his level of perception and understanding.

Non the less I dont know about another Mo Pai Practioner

who exercise both.

 

So I dont think that a masterteacher from only a school can talk

properly when he do not know the other system.

It is only possible if the teachers are join forces

and show each other their system and discuss their theories.

 

I told once that Michael Lomax and John Chang should meet each other.

Only the lineage politics about secrecy etc

has to be regulated in some kind of way

and the willingness to work on greater scale.

 

I dont know if lineages do bargaining.

I only know they may fuse and they may split

and some lineages also carry the package from

die out as main lineage in their lineage.

 

Indeed it is true that different Cultivationenergy

are expirienced also different,

I do feel that a Qigong Set produce a different

sort of cultivationenergy with different abillities.

 

It is very possible from my view that the Yin Chi

is different, and I would like to say it is more raw

than subtle in case of the theory.

Still it fits that Sky is Yang and Earth is Yin.

 

Actually Michael Lomax told :

"In order to move physical objects, a much lower level of

energy is utillized than the type used for healing."

 

I like to change low and high with raw(less subtle) and subtle.

It is to my understanding that the more raw a energy

is - the more it underly linear principles:

(like the need of the grounding as I understand)

 

While the subtle one doesnt care about such

things (like the case being off ground in plane)

as things get more non linear and gain in potential.

 

As Michael Lomax said:

"Qi is potentially instantaneous with no limitation on amplitude"

 

So Yin Chi is different for someone for the subtle type

and the one with the less subtle type practitioner.

Actually it seems to me that the subtle type can gain

a bit of the less subtle type as by product.

 

While the less subtle type main Yin Chi is raw compared to the subtle

but gain little subtle Yin Chi.

The subtle one may more effective on cancer and other difficult illness

while the raw one affect even physical matter but seem to have difficulty.

 

So the energy of the subtle type when projected isnt very well as direct

projection to cause damage by energy but can support other energy as

carrier . Imagine a blastomere. Imagine the air one use to blow is harmless

if a average person use it.

 

But if putting a small projectile dart in then it is turned into a weapon.

This is how I see how it improves the martial art energy technical.

Some energy moves slow..... so when you put it on a vehicle

sort of energy .... then impossible things may get possible.

 

This is my opinion on Yin and Yang.