Are you able to redirect sexual energy?

[Cameron]

If there is delight in it, therefore there is a view, and a distinction of something to delight in..

 

Whether you have successfully done anything or not does no good for my cultivation..

Your wisdom as an outcome is all we should be looking for.

Peace,

Aiwei

 

 

Aiwei,

 

You seem to constantly be pointing back to the teaching of no self. In my understanding this recognition or awareness of no-self is the fountain from which truth and wisdom flows. Is this correct?

[林愛偉]

The methods of sexual cultivation were only taught to the west because the western people respond to sex

and desire and feeling. If there was a technique of simply looking directly at the mind, they wouldn't be able to accept Daoism as its whole. So, introduce "fun" things like sex and dual cultivation. Then you can introduce the more meaningful cultivation.

Not that sexual cultivation is not meaningful, its just only a small percentage of the whole thing, and is actually not a life long method to cultivate. It is only a means to cultivate wisdom, and put an end to full on desire. Does anyone think it is natural for a woman to menstruate? Sure you all do. Science says so, but Daoist cultivation, some methods, will result in a woman stopping her menstrual cycle, without harm to her body. Not many can accept that, thoguh it is true, people can only feel comfortable with what they have the capacity to understand.

 

Sexual cultivation shouldn't be lasting too long, unless you are purposely going to be having sex, then don't ejaculate all the times, and by all means conserve it. If ther is no sex in your life, then work on putting out desires so you can get to the real work.

 

Peace and Happiness,

Aiwei

 

Aiwei,

 

You seem to constantly be pointing back to the teaching of no self. In my understanding this recognition or awareness of no-self is the fountain from which truth and wisdom flows. Is this correct?

 

 

Your analogy is nice. Yes, all methods I am talking about are pointing to the manner of no self. They are non-dual teachings.

 

Though we can use the word self to distinguish the characteristics of mind, it is only a manner of pointing to, and must be dropped at some point in cultivation. But for conversation purposes, it is our language that has definitions as it does, so we try to be as creative/articulate as possible.

 

Peace,

Aiwei

[Cameron]

Aiwei,

 

Just to throw this out there..this may not be the appropriate thread to even talk about this but it seems different threads are touching on the same topics now.

 

Where do you think all of this confusion began? I mean..we say things like karma..and each so called being has alot of karma they have to work through to become enlightened. But why all this confusion in the first place? Where did it all go wrong? I asked one of my teachers about this yesterday and he seems to always point back to the reality and that there is no problem. Everything is just the way it is and can be no different. From that perspective SELF goes into trance/confusion/ego/seperation almost for the purpouse of entertainment only to finally realize it's all a game and everything was ok all along.

 

But why do you think this original impulse to go into confusion/ego and leave(seemingly) the awakened state? I mean let's face it most of the world LOVES the conditoning of ego and seperation. If you just look at what is we actively create on a daily basis new and interesting ways for us to think we are seperate from one another. Not to mention new forms of violence and sickness to prevent seeing clearly.

 

But do you have any insight into the orignal conditioning for this? I mean, one of my non dual teachers basically says it's seeing that there is something wrong with so called ego that is the problem. Things are the way they are?

[林愛偉]

Hi Cameron,

 

You are really something! When you question, it isn't just everything you bring to it from your contemplation, there is such a yearning for that light ... basically.. I love your questions.

 

You questioned:

 

""Where do you think all of this confusion began? I mean..we say things like karma..and each so called being has alot of karma they have to work through to become enlightened. But why all this confusion in the first place? Where did it all go wrong? I asked one of my teachers about this yesterday and he seems to always point back to the reality and that there is no problem. Everything is just the way it is and can be no different. From that perspective SELF goes into trance/confusion/ego/seperation almost for the purpouse of entertainment only to finally realize it's all a game and everything was ok all along.""

 

The confusion began with the wanting of more of what we experienced. I will be honest with you, a discussion like this will go on for such a long time that a thread cannot hold its substance. I will speak from the point of distinguishing form, and I am sure at a later time we will go further.

When one experienced their overall great bright nature in the manner of outter things, "material things", over and over again, caused the manner of fmailiarity with things. In light of the "absence" of these things in their mind was the karma they experienced from utilizing one manner for long long time, and creating views about it. Then, they wanted what they had when the outcome of it not being there manifested. This "wanting" was an outcome of the "I" they thought something was missing from.

That is where it began. From the seeds of greed, led to outcomes of believing there is something to have; which is ignorance, and because of this thought, they forgot the mind non dual mind, and as a result became upset, angry with not getting. Kind of like spoiled kids who get all from the parents until one day the kid has to do it himself, and though taught to, forgets how to do things. In a way it can be like that.

From those 3 things, I am sure you know where it profoundly comes from, the confusion began. To be ignorant is to be confused. The fact there is confusion points to one's ignorance.

 

Next one:

""But why do you think this original impulse to go into confusion/ego and leave(seemingly) the awakened state? I mean let's face it most of the world LOVES the conditoning of ego and seperation. If you just look at what is we actively create on a daily basis new and interesting ways for us to think we are seperate from one another. Not to mention new forms of violence and sickness to prevent seeing clearly.""

 

Now we are talking of our modern world. People become familiar with what they get, and develop views about it. Then they live those views(philosophy) and begin to see the world that way. Doing it for so long, it becomes deep rooted, and they teach children; in schools, t.v. computers, radio, etc. Children make their own ideas fromit and form society, which gets deeper rooted in this mass confusion of things. When one comes with truth, they can't recognize it, and bash the wise person because they view him/her with their conditions.

This impulse to go into confusion is just the momentum added to the desires. This momentum comes from how personally attached we are to what we experience. It is habit that keeps them on this wheel. The outcomes we see of sickness and violence are outcomes of their conditions in their minds. The world has a culture of violence in every thing we do, and sickness in all fascets of life.. it is deep rooted and has become common pace events in life. Inevitable if you wish. Becaus eof this heaviness of attachment, it is difficult to see the bright pure mind.

 

Lastly: ""But do you have any insight into the orignal conditioning for this? I mean, one of my non dual teachers basically says it's seeing that there is something wrong with so called ego that is the problem. Things are the way they are?""

 

Things are the way they are only to the mind who only sees nothing else but the WAY they see things. The WAY someone sees things may result in seeing violence.. there must be a manner of violence in their minds in order for the person to view somethihng as violent. View not as in looking, but view as in a mindset, perceiving of.

 

Everything is fine. Everything happening is simply people's karma. It is empty, but people make it full..give it form. It is of no form, and yet people still attach themselves to it.

 

This conversation can go on for a long time because of examples and utilizing conditions at the moment asked and such. But overall, it is from greed, anger and ignorance, or any of the 3 because they all move into eachother, where living beings have become confused. It is the developing of views within it all which causes our confusion. If there is greed .. there is a view, the same for the other two.

 

 

Peace and Happiness,

Aiwei

[Cameron]

Very nice. Thanks for your feedback and presence here. Am sure we will have many more questions come up!

[林愛偉]

Very nice. Thanks for your feedback and presence here. Am sure we will have many more questions come up!

[beancurdturtle]

The confusion began with the wanting of more of what we experienced.

 

Everything is fine. Everything happening is simply people's karma. It is empty, but people make it full..give it form. It is of no form, and yet people still attach themselves to it.

 

This conversation can go on for a long time because of examples and utilizing conditions at the moment asked and such...

It could go on, but your simple (brief) explanations work for me very well.

[林愛偉]

It could go on, but your simple (brief) explanations work for me very well.

[三江源]

Your ebb and flow is just your thoughts and emotions following them. You "being" a sexual being is all in your thoughts. Energy is energy, regardless of its pulse. It is you who likes it or dislikes it resulting in your view of pleasant and non pleasant.

It is natural of your conditional response to things, but not of an over all human nature to just follow wht you feel. It is ignorance which causes one to follow what they feel, go on the up and down, and think it is fine and natural to do, but it only results in constant desiring and feeling, identifying.

Feeling the fire, is only desire, and it is only that way because of one's thoughts and attachments to what they experience. It is only a pleasure because you decide it is. And just because the majority of the people of this world think the same, doesn't make it actually a very practical manner of living.

To cultivate this big draw is just to detach from the thoughts and desires, utilize the energy without attachment and cultivate proper wisdom.

 

The way it is does not rely on people believing in it or liking it. It just is that way regardless.

 

This is the most direct post I have made here. I am not attacking you in anyway. I have seen your outlook on sexual energy from many many many people, and it only results in desiring and covering a "deeper" wisdom. I used to have those thoughts as you do as well...many many years ago, and I have tranfromed them.

I do sincerely hope that this post only makes the thought process for anyone turn moreso, and somehow point towards your non dual nature. For this post has no underlying attack of opinion or discrimination of anyone's thoughts.

What you feel makes sense for you is what will be for you. I am just simply laying out the process of things.

 

This will make for a good discussion.

 

Peace and Happiness,

Aiwei

That is golden! When one has reached the state which is only called a state to focus the discussion, of no self, there will be no distinction between a "Me" and an "Energy" to direct. The mind and body illuminates. Then any thought is already controlled...just for the sake of saying controlled.

 

Peace and Happiness

 

Aiwei

 

Hi. No problems at all, I dont feel attacked. I know everything you said already, of course. It is all very familiar. It's building block stuff of spiritual awareness. I feel I have gone the opposite direction from you. I had the awareness of no self, intuitively. I have it, as part of my being. Nothing I said contradicts that. Many of your assumptons about my sexual responses are false. You link desire with feeling 'sexual' energy. I dont link those two things.

Your response to me posits dualisms which I simply dont feel. I am not at the stage of needing to distance myself from physical reality, or intellectualise about it. I dont feel the need to emphasise that "I" is a construct.

I guess this really does point out to me that I have been alive quite a while now.

 

 

edited 5 years later to add.... been alive a bit longer now and have a deeper understanding of others doing precisely what is outlined by aiwei. Have no real idea how I managed to escape this common trap. can only be karma. My energy is more refined today than it was 5 years ago and I 'm as happy with my current state as I was with my state then. An attractive man will no longer make me feel on fire. I just may notice, or not, and ..like... whatever.. I'm much more neutral.

[iadnon]

As long as it concerns to me I've been quite proficient in sex energy ascension through the spine, that generated through sexual drive.

 

I've found some problems with the practice, as the overactive state of mind after practicing some days in a row.

 

Anyway I find the big draw rather difficult to do, so I apply the same principles in MCO exercise, but combined with sex energy.

 

And about ejaculating, it's ok. If you feel so, just shoot. If you feel you must store, just keep. It's a matter of listening to the body. It's true that there are a lot of aspects of our psyches waiting to feed from us, especially in what is related to food and sex. I've learned to see them coming, so when I'm in a practice session and I know intuitively that I'm losing the point I use a thought (normally linked with spiritual work) to go back. In this case I think about the three tan tiens and the need to feed the lower one. That mere act takes me back to the "real" job.

 

I'd like to ask some questions, taking advantage of this thread:

 

1.Mantak Chia tells about spinning the chi in the head to vivify the neurons with the ojas (transmuted sex energy). I don't feel anything special, and, many times, I lose the point.

 

2.When I download the energy to the sub navel tan tien, I lose the feeling of it. How is it supposed to feel?

 

3.Is it mandatory to, once charged the lower tan tien, ascend it to the other two ones?

 

4.What's the difference in between sex energy (that generated in sexual drive) and testicle energy?

 

Thanks a lot!

[林愛偉]

Hi. No problems at all, I dont feel attacked. I know everything you said already, of course. It is all very familiar. It's building block stuff of spiritual awareness. I feel I have gone the opposite direction from you. I had the awareness of no self, intuitively. I have it, as part of my being. Nothing I said contradicts that. Many of your assumptons about my sexual responses are false. You link desire with feeling 'sexual' energy. I dont link those two things.

Your response to me posits dualisms which I simply dont feel. I am not at the stage of needing to distance myself from physical reality, or intellectualise about it. I dont feel the need to emphasise that "I" is a construct.

I guess this really does point out to me that I have been alive quite a while now.

 

 

 

Everyone has the intuited awareness of no self but not everyone has awoken to it. And if they have they wouldn't be indulging in sexual desire. It isn't a thing, it has no marks.

What my post was saying is that it is from Thought which sexual desire results. There is a thought, then the desire. OR the desire, and then the thought emphasizes it.. OR vice verse.

 

I link attachment to feeling desire to "sexual energy". The dualism you see is only the construction of the method to dissolve the dual thinking. It is not fixed.

 

AMITUOFO

 

Peace and Happiness,

Aiwei

 

As long as it concerns to me I've been quite proficient in sex energy ascension through the spine, that generated through sexual drive.

 

I've found some problems with the practice, as the overactive state of mind after practicing some days in a row.

 

Anyway I find the big draw rather difficult to do, so I apply the same principles in MCO exercise, but combined with sex energy.

 

And about ejaculating, it's ok. If you feel so, just shoot. If you feel you must store, just keep. It's a matter of listening to the body. It's true that there are a lot of aspects of our psyches waiting to feed from us, especially in what is related to food and sex. I've learned to see them coming, so when I'm in a practice session and I know intuitively that I'm losing the point I use a thought (normally linked with spiritual work) to go back. In this case I think about the three tan tiens and the need to feed the lower one. That mere act takes me back to the "real" job.

 

I'd like to ask some questions, taking advantage of this thread:

 

1.Mantak Chia tells about spinning the chi in the head to vivify the neurons with the ojas (transmuted sex energy). I don't feel anything special, and, many times, I lose the point.

 

2.When I download the energy to the sub navel tan tien, I lose the feeling of it. How is it supposed to feel?

 

3.Is it mandatory to, once charged the lower tan tien, ascend it to the other two ones?

 

4.What's the difference in between sex energy (that generated in sexual drive) and testicle energy?

 

Thanks a lot!

 

Sometimes the feelings stop being felt, and sometimes that is where the cultivation is taking place...sometimes it is just a method to keep people cultivating.

 

If you don't feel anything, then don't look for one or it will be an outcome of your looking. Just let it be and there will be results in the future.

 

Do as you wish, but it is good to share.

 

Sex energy is metnally focused energy transformed into desire to have sex. Testicle energy is just energy in the testicles. Its function is just energy, and when met with the tools, like the testes, it results in making liquid essense-jing.

 

Peace,

Aiwei

Edited June 26, 2007 by 林愛偉

[zenbrook]

Everyone has the intuited awareness of no self but not everyone has awoken to it. And if they have they wouldn't be indulging in sexual desire. It isn't a thing, it has no marks.

Crikey, surely this is a little presumptuous?

You say that one who has awoken to 'awareness of no-self' would not indulge in sexual desire. Why would that be? Why would awareness of no-self limit one's responses to others or one's environment in this, or any other, way? Surely the opposite would be true - dissolution of separation between oneself and others would facilitate the fulfillment of sexual desire in its truest sense?

Perhaps it's a mistake to view sexual abstinence in this context as anything other than a path. Even the Buddha was only halfway there

 

Peace,

ZenB

[rex]

Seems like folks are following one of two paths: renunciation or transformation.

[林愛偉]

Crikey, surely this is a little presumptuous?

You say that one who has awoken to 'awareness of no-self' would not indulge in sexual desire. Why would that be? Why would awareness of no-self limit one's responses to others or one's environment in this, or any other, way? Surely the opposite would be true - dissolution of separation between oneself and others would facilitate the fulfillment of sexual desire in its truest sense?

Perhaps it's a mistake to view sexual abstinence in this context as anything other than a path. Even the Buddha was only halfway there

 

Peace,

ZenB

 

 

One who has awakened, seen their original nature, though still has cultivation to tend to, would not follow their desires on the ebb and flow on their whim. They would be more aware of the causes of their desires and most likely caution themselves in not entertaining them because they know what results. But not all can cultivate dilligently. Though one may have a high level of wisdom from awakening, they still need further cultivation to deepen the causes of complete pure enlightenment.

And if they did engage in sex, it wouldn't be in the manner of desire driven on the ebb and flow.

 

You may think it is a limit, but it isn't. It is quite the opposite actually. Cutting off sexual desires, or atleast cultivating to lessen desires, opens a whole other world of wisdom. Alters perception when cultivated properly. If sexual desire is not cut off, one cannot attain pure complete enlightenment.

 

When Sakyamuni Buddha was very close to his attainig pure complete enlightenment, he faced the strongest of his sexual desires. Deep burning desire so strong it led visions of beautiful women to appear in his mind. Tempting and trying to make him retreat from his cultivation. Do you think for one second that if he followed his sexual desires at that point that he would have attained the highest level of enlightenment?

Even he said that if he were to face another desire as strong as that of sex, he would not be able to make it.

 

Unless one isn't looking to end their afflictions, one must cut off desire. In the beginning, it isn't easy, so there are methods to cultivate to develop concentration, patience, wisdom, compassion, skill in means. Once a certain level is attained, the methods must be dropped along with the remainder of the desire..whatever is left.

I spoke of the overall mannerism, not subtle techniques. I have not spoken the whole in detail,but have spoken the whole in detail according to the conditions that have arisen along this thread.

 

Peace and Happiness.

 

Aiwei

Edited June 26, 2007 by 林愛偉

[林愛偉]

Seems like folks are following one of two paths: renunciation or transformation.

 

 

Both are the same. When you renounce something, you will transform,. When you transform you have put down what you no longer see a need to entertain.

 

Maybe there are two methods of one path.

 

Peace,

Aiwei

Edited June 26, 2007 by 林愛偉

[zenbrook]

Unless one isn't looking to end their afflictions, one must cut off desire.

What about liberating desire, 林愛偉? Would you consider that a possibility?

 

What if Shakyamuni, rather than renouncing the sensual visions before him, had used his penetrating insight in that moment to realise the empty nature of desire? Could he not have attained enlightenment also by this means?

 

Can sexuality not be an expression of the enlightened impulse? An act of giving, for example?

 

And what of the desire for liberation? Should one cut off one's motivation for spiritual practice also?

 

Peace,

ZenB

[林愛偉]

What about liberating desire, 林愛偉? Would you consider that a possibility?

 

What if Shakyamuni, rather than renouncing the sensual visions before him, had used his penetrating insight in that moment to realise the empty nature of desire? Could he not have attained enlightenment also by this means?

 

Can sexuality not be an expression of the enlightened impulse? An act of giving, for example?

 

And what of the desire for liberation? Should one cut off one's motivation for spiritual practice also?

 

Peace,

ZenB

 

 

Liberating desire says that there is an owner of desire that is liberating it. Because there is a mind of possession, there will be a mind of liberating that possession. So, for the mind of the condition in liberating their desires, yes it is possible. But really there is no liberating of desire, nor a liberator... and most of all nothing to liberate. It is upon the mind cultivating.. use what results in getting close to the result, and then drop it all to realize it.

That is exactly what he did.. when he realized it was empty, he dropped the whole idea of a being experiencing desire, and that tranformed the pretty women into horrid demons, which basically means the visions transformed into mundane seeds of desire, and thus vanished. He saw that the desires are indeed empty.

 

Ahhh.. giving sex.. for compassionate means? Now you are going into a very interesting manner of mind. Its good. Actually, if there is a woman and a man who are married, and one of them is cultivating the way, and awakens to his original nature, and begins to cut off desire, he/she may actually maintain desire for the sake of the relationship. For when a man and woman are married, depending on the causes and conditions of the relationship, they will not leave eachother, and thus out of compassion for the other, still maintain a relationship to a certain degree. That means not engaging in sex as much as the ordinary married couple does...and it is only done to maintatin the relationship, and give for the sake of the partner's causes and conditions which do not allow them to dilligently cultivate the way. The cultivator will inturn utilize the sexual experience and cultivate more dilligently in transforming whatever desire of lust they have into wisdom. That is where dual cultivation will take place..but it will not be based on lust, and will eventually be dropped, depending on the causes and conditions of the situation. This must be thoroughly understood: causes and conditions of the situation.

 

Another good one you point out... cutting off the desire for liberation in the sense of spiritual cultivation... Not at all.. This desire is useful as the drive to place the mind to concentrate. Yet there will be a point in cultivation reached where even the idea of liberating oneself and others becomes a hindrance. Not that one will not teach others to attain, it is tht one does not need that focus in their mind for their own cultivation, but they realize others still do. So they use teachings in that manner to transform others (teach others basically) and when those have reached a certain level, they too drop the idea of being liberated.

WHy do they drop that idea? because they realize there was no one who needs liberating, as well as nothign to be liberated from.

 

Peace and Happiness,

Aiwei

Edited June 26, 2007 by 林愛偉

[zenbrook]

Wow - three of my best theories shot down in flames!

 

If I may, however....... far be it for me to second-guess the Buddha's methodology at the moment of awakening, but if desire is in its essence empty - as you would say being 'nothing to liberate' - why then is renunciation, cutting off, being promoted as the only way to deal with it?

 

Why not simple allow it to self-liberate into the natural energy of the awakened state?

 

Oh, and by 'giving' I merely meant with regard to a little love and human tenderness. And not so much as a conscious act, either....... more as a naturally manifesting and earthier version of the brahma viharas.

 

(Don't want Mrs B to think compassionate motivation is all that draws me to her erotic charms. She'd probably take that quite badly. And I'd miss my testicles.)

 

Peace, and thank you,

ZenB

[Ian]

Aiwei,

 

Just to throw this out there..this may not be the appropriate thread to even talk about this but it seems different threads are touching on the same topics now.

 

Where do you think all of this confusion began? I mean..we say things like karma..and each so called being has alot of karma they have to work through to become enlightened. But why all this confusion in the first place? Where did it all go wrong? I asked one of my teachers about this yesterday and he seems to always point back to the reality and that there is no problem. Everything is just the way it is and can be no different. From that perspective SELF goes into trance/confusion/ego/seperation almost for the purpouse of entertainment only to finally realize it's all a game and everything was ok all along.

 

But why do you think this original impulse to go into confusion/ego and leave(seemingly) the awakened state? I mean let's face it most of the world LOVES the conditoning of ego and seperation. If you just look at what is we actively create on a daily basis new and interesting ways for us to think we are seperate from one another. Not to mention new forms of violence and sickness to prevent seeing clearly.

 

But do you have any insight into the orignal conditioning for this? I mean, one of my non dual teachers basically says it's seeing that there is something wrong with so called ego that is the problem. Things are the way they are?

 

 

Really good question. In fact one of only about three real questions I've ever found.

 

When I've asked it, the answer I've got was along the lines of, basically,: "We forgot the game wasn't real."

[林愛偉]

Wow - three of my best theories shot down in flames!

 

If I may, however....... far be it for me to second-guess the Buddha's methodology at the moment of awakening, but if desire is in its essence empty - as you would say being 'nothing to liberate' - why then is renunciation, cutting off, being promoted as the only way to deal with it?

 

Why not simple allow it to self-liberate into the natural energy of the awakened state?

 

Oh, and by 'giving' I merely meant with regard to a little love and human tenderness. And not so much as a conscious act, either....... more as a naturally manifesting and earthier version of the brahma viharas.

 

(Don't want Mrs B to think compassionate motivation is all that draws me to her erotic charms. She'd probably take that quite badly. And I'd miss my testicles.)

 

Peace, and thank you,

ZenB

 

 

 

""why then is renunciation, cutting off, being promoted as the only way to deal with it?""

 

This will go off to another topic haha- -Because when one entertains their sexual desires, they are also mixing their mind with that of the partner. What results is acting like the other parter, thinking like them, having their memories, emotions.. because it transfers and adds to your own, mixes with your own. If you cannot distinguish, it makes it a hindrance. If you can distinguish, then you still have something in the mind which points to an "I" wanting sex. It makes for more work to be done.

The wanting covers the original nature. That is why it is cut off. Selflessness removes the "I" and the wanting. When there is noone wanting, there is nothing to want, and thus all things are abundant, ...no separation.

 

If it was left to just letting it liberate on its own without a direction, for the sake of saying direction, it wouldn't be done in one lifetime. It would go up and down, here and there, and that is just because one's mind would be that way. If one's mind is not of stable characteristics, then there will be an ebb and flow. Since the elements of the body can be off balance in its energetic characteistics, one's mind will be affected...unless they are not. If they are not affected, there would be no imbalance, and an ebb and flow of any desire.

 

No testicles is not fun.. haha It will be all naturally done actually. The method is just understanding the mechanics of it all, and yet it is very simple. Liberating to the "natural energy of the awakened state" does need a little push in that direction. That is where a bit of cultivation takes place, but by all means it will be natural, for the further one gets the more they can step aside because controlling is just the beginning steps, and as one gets further along, there is less to control, and less of the view of their being a controller.

 

I am not speaking of a totalitarian mannerism of cultivation.. haha "YOU HAVE DESIRE??!! BAAAADDDD! " haha not at all.. just to be aware of ones habits and urges and then direct that energy to nourish wisdom. It is all natural, not agressive, just dilligently cultivated for the result.

 

Peace and Happiness,

Aiwei

Edited June 27, 2007 by 林愛偉

[zenbrook]

I am not speaking of a totalitarian mannerism of cultivation.. haha "YOU HAVE DESIRE??!! BAAAADDDD! " haha not at all.. just to be aware of ones habits and urges and then direct that energy to nourish wisdom. It is all natural, not agressive, just dilligently cultivated for the result.

Then on that note I shall bow out (hopefully gracefully!) of the dharma battle

 

My thanks to you for your patience and heartfelt responses.

 

Peace,

ZenB

[林愛偉]

Then on that note I shall bow out (hopefully gracefully!) of the dharma battle

 

My thanks to you for your patience and heartfelt responses.

 

Peace,

ZenB

 

Same here my brother.

 

My thanks to you on your compassion and patience with our conversation .

 

 

Peace and Happiness,

Aiwei

Edited June 27, 2007 by 林愛偉

[Pero]

Renounciation is not exactly the only way. I was actually surprised you said this ZB since in another thread you said you practiced Tantric Buddhism, which is not a path of renounciation. Though of course it can apply it, and it`s not unimportant or something.

 

Nice discussion BTW. I love to read your posts Ai Wei. (this even rhymes )

Edited June 27, 2007 by Pero

[zenbrook]

Renounciation is not exactly the only way. I was actually surprised you said this ZB since in another thread you said you practiced Tantric Buddhism, which is not a path of renounciation. Though of course it can apply it, and it`s not unimportant or something.

 

Nice discussion BTW. I love to read your posts Ai Wei. (this even rhymes )

Not as surprised as me, Pero!!

 

It was precisely the promotion of renunciation as 'the only way' that I was arguing against.

 

Like you, I view it as one possible method among many. Unlike you, I failed to express that adequately, for which I apologise.

 

I hope that doesn't mean I have to go back in the ring with Aiwei?

 

Peace,

ZenB

[beancurdturtle]

I hope that doesn't mean I have to go back in the ring with Aiwei?

Where he'll soundly trounce you with a pillow of potentiality.