What has been your most humbling experience?

[CloudHands]

Thanks for your answer. All we can do now is debate. We are off topic

[silent thunder]

I think there's a big difference between being humbled, being humiliated and being ashamed.

Not sure everyone is talking about the same thing here, which is fine.

[Stosh]

Humbled is private , humiliated is the action at the event , ashamed is the personal reaction to public humiliation, they all go together like conjugations , though clement is somewhat correct, I guess, .. maybe , I dont really think so though... about BKAs thread, some of which I think she starts as conversation starters or because shes looking the the psyche aspect of 'sharing' .

 

Humiliation is not necessarily a bad thing of one is truly humbled instead of merely insulted.

We differ on that because you see the humbling as some "good thing" which I do not.

 

There is much else than humiliation that I drag around with me which I feel is far worse. Perspective, we all have a slightly different vantage point.

Ill take your word for that... and it makes sense- if this kind of humility is a "better option than the other".

Frankly I still think you are rather proud which is the thing which makes the issue sticky , IMO And yes we all have differing vantage points , perspectives , but its just possible that some may understand yours better than you might think , and youre not so all alone out there... thats just assumption of course , because no one can ever be sure of that which another experiences ( goes through , survives etc.) unless you have some mysterious mind reading power which goes beyond empathy.. even if it looked like the circumstances were entirely alike or entirely unalike looking. But Ill leave it there and go wander off.

[Marblehead]

Marblehead, Aetherous : if you wish to express, don't you look at the soldier's way as completely opposite to the Tao's way ? How do you link it otherwise ? I know carreer soldiers -so you can't do it to me- one told me he has no idea how many people he killed because you to far to know if you hit or not, the only one he was certain was a civilian, he throwed a grenade in a house to be sure they will not be attacked. He's one of the sweetest guy I know but isn't it war the main purpose of an army ?

 

No harm intended.

You have asked a fair question so I will respond.

 

I was a soldier a long time before I ever heard the word Tao.

 

I present to you a soldier's creed that I held to: I will help you if I can, I will kill you if I must. I still hold to that creed.

 

"The Art Of War" is a very Taoist book. It teaches that if one must do battle it is best to cause the least amount of damage possible.

 

The purpose of a military force is the defense of the nation. My government has taken war to extremes and does not in any way follow the guidance given in "The Art Of War."

 

I do consider myself to be a Taoist (Philosophical) and I have no problem knowing that I would defend those I love and our way of life. This would include defending my country against any aggression meant to destroy the way of life of my country.

[Taomeow]

Here's an example from my childhood (which usually contains answers to everything for everybody):

 

Humbling -- jumping across a wide ditch at a construction site, expecting to fly like an eagle and winding up on the bottom instead, with a three-inch-long, inch-deep cut on my leg from a metal rod that happened to have been sticking out of the side of the ditch.

 

Humiliating -- if I did it for show rather than for fun, it would have been. But I didn't and so it wasn't.

 

Ashamed -- if I did what was humiliating and realized it was my own fault. It was not my fault that I was inexperienced in judging distances, and it was not humiliating because I didn't do it to impress anyone, so ashamed, I wasn't either.

 

So, that was a pure humbling experience, no contaminations.

Edited January 9, 2014 by Taomeow

[silent thunder]

Guess we differ on shame, it's entirely possible to be humble, to be humbled and to be humiliated, without shame:

 

Humble is knowing your limitations. It can also mean low self esteem, but for me in this context it seems to be about modest acceptance of limitation.

 

Humiliation or being humbled is the process of having your limitations expressed to you, most often by others, but not exclusively.

 

Shame is the feeling generated by the awareness that you have done something reprehensible or socially condemned.

Edited January 10, 2014 by silent thunder

[Stosh]

Humble is knowing your limitations. It can also mean low self esteem,

I highlight that , because I see it, that one cant call humility- a pure virtue-- (vs vice)

But one can still KNOW ones limitations without the dross of the "humility"

 

The two are not linked .. I KNOW I cant jump a chasm, I dont have to carry emotional baggage regarding it .

 

Take the unreal stigma of 'good' humility versus the 'low' self esteem and what you are left with

is a peception of ones relative merit versus some 'greater' thing.

This is in agreement with your idea to be "humiliated, without shame" except that the word humiliated implies shame ,(or that shame would be considered an appropriate response in the face of the stigma) ,, whereas informed doesnt ,, so I'd promote that word instead.

So the benefit of Tms childhood experience was that she became made aware of her limitations , not that she possibly felt lessened or defeated or was exposed to herself as coming up short.

Edited January 10, 2014 by Stosh