Zhan Zhuang and Da Cheng Chuan

[林愛偉]

I'm going to try my best to pick the practice of Zhan Zhuang back up. My biggest problem is lack of disipline to keep going. I'll take up the stance, and stand there trying to clear my mind... 5 minutes later a random thought comes to mind about something that might be fun to do, so I'll forget the rest of my practise and go goof off for a while and then not remember about Zhan Zhuang again until maybe a few days later. >.<

I'm so easily distracted; the longest I've held a period of meditation was 45 minutes... but the fact that I could measure it may take away from the underlying quality of the meditation. >_<

 

 

Dont get rid of your thoughts, just practice how not to be moved by them. If you stop all your thoughts you die.. just don't be moved by them.. practice patience, which entails tolerance. When you want to go "goof" off, tell yourself, "Wait another2 minutes, I just did it for 5 mins, so another 2 minutes wont hurt."

Every time you are up standing and have a thought to go play, just wait an extra minute more than the last time. You will find yourself standing for a longer period of time each time, and forgetting th edesire to play.

You see, you must understand your attachments to the things you desire. THen you can start detaching.. a big thing to discuss.. good for a new thread.. hahaha

 

Peace,

Aiwei

[rain]

i have a similar experience

it quickly became my favourite position i qigong. having used a similar stance i tkd, i realized how it was much more effective to stand still for long periods of time.

 

it is fun to hear about the friend you could not lift.

my youngest son, got in the position and was immediately heavy as stone. impossible to lift from the ground. i believe many children have a natural balance and less energy-blockages, thus less imbalance? than adults.

it is fascinating.

[林愛偉]

 

I am so amazed at how she doesn't even understand the basics of QiGong, but can still do these things better than I can...

 

 

 

Understanding isn't skill- in -means. It is only intellect.

 

Because she had no intellectual understanding of how things worked, no expectations, no hindrances were in her mind. The task was performed effortless.

[三江源]

I have met him twice and doing a workshop with him in a few months on Taoist Qigong.

 

I was lucky to do a workshop with Ken when he came to England. He seemed to me to be the closes I've ever come close to a true androgyne. His energy transmission was so soft. And he was so amusing and erudite. I'd love to be able to work with him more. Do you go to Colorado to do it? How is it going?

[Cameron]

Yes, going to Boulder in Nov for 3 day workshop with Ken and Taoist Priest Master Tseng. I'll probably write about it in my journal after.

[三江源]

Ok, I will look you up.

 

Have fun!

[gendao]

In every step, step as though you are one meter into the ground or more, but you step as though there are clouds under your feet. That means your feet are soft ..there would be no heaviness present during the step, no abrupt shaking in the body and eyes from stepping. You gracefully glide...builds up speed, root and enhances the movement of energy in the body. Rememeber to keep the head pulling up and tail bone pulling down..

Cool description, nice!

 

BTW, I'm interested in the exact origin and function of the zhan zhuang form. Everybody vaguely knows what to do...but why? What are the specific design intents to all its aspects? Can anyone provide a really detailed breakdown of the actual what, how & why of this practice?

[Eric23]

From my reading on the subject... Our bodies have fast twitch muscles that we use for movement and slow twitch, stablizer muscles that actually hold us up. Zhan Zhuang strengthens the stablizer muscles. Several things drew me to this practice; I developed bad posture habits and the idea of strengthening from the inside out seems most logical for getting myself straight. After first reading of standing forms in Eric Yudelove's book, I found standing wuji to be one of the most profound stillness/meditative experiences. Years of a pretty active life style with my share of injuries, makes sitting cross legged (forget lotus) painful and counterproductive.

[林愛偉]

Cool description, nice!

 

BTW, I'm interested in the exact origin and function of the zhan zhuang form. Everybody vaguely knows what to do...but why? What are the specific design intents to all its aspects? Can anyone provide a really detailed breakdown of the actual what, how & why of this practice?

 

 

That would be a big researching project, because there are so many opinions as to the why, what and how...who, etc.

But if we look at the function of all standing cultivation, there is one full out common aspect; Connecting the Joints. If there is anything we must do properly is connect our joints.. basically keep the body in proper posture so there is only slight or no obstructing of the flow of energy in the body, which can affect the mind.. and keep the mental posture well concentrated to keep energy balanced without distractiong so as to not affect the body with obstruction.

What one thinks, one experiences. What one experiences, one thinks. The What formed Zhan Zhuang was not really a standing posture, but just the idea of connecting the body effortlessly. One can do it in movement as well, but stillness with internal correcting of postures seems to boost the cultivation process up a lot of a bit.

The how is quite interesting as to How the whole cultivation began. Standing on two legs, may look easy, but actual Standing, with that energy posting(rooting) in the ground is actual standing, walking...and that is something not everyone can do.

If there is a proper etension of limbs, not full, but an opening, we all know that the energy flowing through the opened limbs easily nourishes the body more convieniently. This may be the most practical reason why it was developed.

 

Peace and Happiness,

Aiwei

[740157]

Dont get rid of your thoughts, just practice how not to be moved by them. If you stop all your thoughts you die.. just don't be moved by them.. practice patience, which entails tolerance. When you want to go "goof" off, tell yourself, "Wait another2 minutes, I just did it for 5 mins, so another 2 minutes wont hurt."

Every time you are up standing and have a thought to go play, just wait an extra minute more than the last time. You will find yourself standing for a longer period of time each time, and forgetting th edesire to play.

You see, you must understand your attachments to the things you desire. THen you can start detaching.. a big thing to discuss.. good for a new thread.. hahaha

 

Peace,

Aiwei

True, I guess it would be more accurate to say that I'm not so much trying to clear my head of all thought, but to bring myself to the point wherein I can sit in a tranquil state and not be distracted by what thoughts will drift through my mind.

Thank-you for the advice on bringing myself to extend the time spent in practice of Zhan Zhuang. I'm going to attept applying that, and pushing myself to go a little further each time.

 

 

Understanding isn't skill- in -means. It is only intellect.

 

Because she had no intellectual understanding of how things worked, no expectations, no hindrances were in her mind. The task was performed effortless.

Yes, I can understand that now. When you said that, it reminded me of something I had read in a book on ninjutsu arts. I can't quote it exactly word for word as I don't remember where in the book it is; but the idea is that one should study, learn, and master the art, and then forget everything one has learned and simply be able to do it without thinking about it. So now that is another goal for me to shoot for. Thank-you so much.

[fatherpaul]

 

Understanding isn't skill- in -means. It is only intellect.

 

Because she had no intellectual understanding of how things worked, no expectations, no hindrances were in her mind. The task was performed effortless.

 

this is the gateway to the innocent mind

 

thank you brother,

peace

paul

[Ryan McCoole]

Indeed, the Master's mind is the beginner's mind...if only I acted on that more...

[rain]

"Zhan Zhuang strengthens the stablizer muscles."

 

 

EXACTLY!!, i have been trying to tell this too !!

 

 

this is the gateway to the innocent mind

 

thank you brother,

peace

paul

 

 

"...only I

...only thought

...only material..."

 

 

but "i" "think" em miracles!!!

[Cameron]

I had this thing come up yesterday where it was like presence before the personality. Sort of hard to talk about. Sort of that primordial being that is before(and after?!) YOU.

 

And I agree with what others on this thread are saying it's like this innocent, open spacious mind. Actually even to call it mind feels like too much because mind implies a SOMETHING. When the best description of THAT seems to be nothing. Not A NOTHING..but just nothing.

 

Prior to self other duality WHAT IS.

 

WHO/WHAT is this looking out of your eyes?

[rain]

I had this thing come up yesterday where it was like presence before the personality. Sort of hard to talk about. Sort of that primordial being that is before(and after?!) YOU.

 

And I agree with what others on this thread are saying it's like this innocent, open spacious mind. Actually even to call it mind feels like too much because mind implies a SOMETHING. When the best description of THAT seems to be nothing. Not A NOTHING..but just nothing.

 

Prior to self other duality WHAT IS.

 

WHO/WHAT is this looking out of your eyes?

 

 

Wonderful.

 

 

thank you.

[Cameron]

no problem.

 

NOW..to fully uncover/open to/awaken to that nothing and embody it in every day life is a whoooooole other matter(for me).

 

If I had to guess the whole process of uncovering/unvieling, stabilizing and then embodying can take many,many years.

 

But it's nice to feel somewhat oriented in this journey!

[Spectrum]

Every time you are up standing and have a thought to go play, just wait an extra minute more than the last time. You will find yourself standing for a longer period of time each time, and forgetting th edesire to play.

You see, you must understand your attachments to the things you desire. THen you can start detaching.. a big thing to discuss.. good for a new thread

 

I wonder where those thoughts are from.

Edited July 7, 2007 by Spectrum

[Cameron]

stand/sit and realize that your both nothing and everything

 

or whatever your drawn to

[Ryan McCoole]

Today I was sitting and, for some reason, I felt more than usuall the Unity in my body...everything was One: my hands, legs, dan tien, head were One. When I took in each breth, I felt the WHOLE of me vibrating to that inner pulse. And then I began to expand my Awareness around the room, relaizing that I am the same as a penny or a tree or the little lamp by my bed.

 

It's interesting to think that, aside from a slightly different arrangement of carbon atoms, there is nothing seperating us from a tree or showerhead. Everything is blissfully One...it's good to feel that charge in practice as well.

 

Be well always,

Edited July 6, 2007 by Ryan McCoole

[Cameron]

Very cool. Ken Cohen calls this "center everywhere, circumfrence nowhere".

[Spectrum]

Sounds like "Sung" when settling into WuJi for Chi Gung or Tai Chi Chuan.

[Ryan McCoole]

Yeah "Sung", I remmeber reading about that in Lam Kam's book...its like settling into yourself..finding that groove and letting it groove you.

 

Cameron, I like that description! I think of it as the Taoist concept of "completly empty, yet completly full"...its that strange, calm charge.

 

Be well,

[Spectrum]

Yeah "Sung"... I think of it as the Taoist concept of "completly empty, yet completly full"...its that strange, calm charge.

 

Interesting that this is the start and end of practice.... the foundation upon which we experience stillness in motion, and motion in stillness.

 

Spectrum

[Spectrum]

For testing it would be done no less than 45 minutes, but can be longer.

 

In every step, step as though you are one meter into the ground or more, but you step as though there are clouds under your feet. That means your feet are soft ..there would be no heaviness present during the step, no abrupt shaking in the body and eyes from stepping.

 

I remember one thing about moving, place the foot, then transition the weight. That way the fall is both forwards and backwards simultaneously. Even movement that appears linear is circular. The calm eye of the center.

[Spectrum]

Fa Jing cultivation can be an option, and mostly it is released upon the extention of the technique in the form practice.

 

For the knees and arm connection; You can pay attention to the difference in pressure in the hip to the bottom of the foot to the floor on the arm extention. It is subtle at first, but with more practice of this awareness you notice it big time.

 

Interesting observation. I notice this often when doing slow transitions in the 108. I can literally feel the blood pressure changes between left and right hemispheres of the body when the transitions are fluid, meaning that when the corners are turned smoothly and the weight transition is consistantly uninterrupted the body does what is most natural during unrestricted free movement. Flows. Once you feel what is right practice, you avoid previous errors more easily. There is a stark contrast between the competitive athlete feeding on the pack and the wanderer who flows steadily cultivating the infinite.

 

Spectrum

Edited July 7, 2007 by Spectrum