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Songtsan

Why we fight to teach each other...

By Songtsan, in General Discussion

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Songtsan   

Songtsan
Posted (edited)

...and why the teachers are always fighting each other, why the students fight the teachers, why the teachers fight the students, and you know - all that stuff!

 

Let's examine the psychology:

 

1) We hold views

2) Someone asks a question or makes a statement

3) We share our views with them

4) Other people share their views with them

5) The view-sharers start arguiing amongst themselves about their views

6) People start taking things personally - making personal attributions about the view holder based on that view-holders views

7) Now people have 'colored' opinions (views) about other members and are more likely to see them through those 'view-colored' glasses every time they view them - based on past experiences

8) People get deeper and deeper into 'the shit' with other peoples

9) Now we have frenemies, enemies, friends, whoseknowswhatsnots

10) BIG TIME WASTE OF ENERGY

11) you coulda built a house with all the energy you wasted doing this shit in your lifetime!

12) time to come up with a better way!

13)let's do this shit!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

14)people stop fucking around.

15)It's time to get buck-wild! yee-haw

 

(dont mess wid me- I'm manic! I'll take you out ese - take you down to the river and shank you 'cause I'm a crazy loco vato!)

 

*I cannot promise you that I was not on drugs when I wrote this btw

Edited by Songtsan
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Songtsan   

Songtsan
Posted

....my thoughts:

 

obviously, everyone knows how this stuff works...what I would like to do first:

 

1) Identify problem - very detailed look

2) examine the costs (energy waste, stresses on kidneys, ruminating, all that stuff)

3) Determine root of the problem (attachment, ignorance, etc.)

4) Delimit the issue

5) Co-create hypotheses, theories, etc. as to how to deal with issues more efficiently

6) Discuss discuss - use our combined talents to figure sumtin out

7) co-create a unified system and test it out

8) go back to planning

9) re-test

10) loop loop last few #'s to refine

 

 

or not...

 

instead of all this fruitless trying to change each others views, maybe we can use our energy/time more productively somehow?

 

We are like computer programs trying to reprogram each other to each others ideal of perfection...

 

its the battle of the computer programs - thats what minds basically are - we are algorithmic, networked, we have subroutines, even have malware and viruses in our minds (like the djinn!)...

 

Let's psycho-analyze this shit

 

Why the hell not?

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Songtsan   

Songtsan
Posted

"In fighting to teach, we teach to fight."

 

As we are all role models for each other (i.e. we all take those things that we like in others and make them our own), it is axiomatic that we also pass on our bad habits to our students (who are us). Now, I am a believer in evolutionary psychology as it applies to personalities and ideas as well as biological adaptations...I can see that competition is good in that the best, strongest, most adaptable ideas will tend to be the ones that dominate the minds of the peeps.

 

Still - what a lot of lack is in fact knowledge of the root behaviors behind our actions. I have looked deep into my root desires, and have found it plain that it is nothing other than selfishness...

 

here is how it works for me:

 

I want to be respected

I want to be known for who I see myself as

I seek to continuously disavow others of their beliefs about me that I see as erroneous (and this is going to happen all the time...even if you are right in your perceptions some of the time about me - you are going to be oh so wrong a big percentage of the time as well)

People do not like it when other people label them as something they are not - it infuriates them and invites discontent and rebuttal

people get into "You are this!" followed by "No I am not this! I am that!"

 

It just goes around and around as everyone says, "I view you as this..." Then that person comes back as "No, that's not what I am - I am this way....it is you who is such and such.."

 

We waste time, get stressed, etc.

 

I have seen every single damn person here do this - no one has not done this....not a single person, including moi...

 

So, as much as we all talk about not labeling, not creating mind fabrications, we are all being hypocrites...

 

the true fact is that not one of can truly know anything about one another - there are too many layers and translation devices in the way...

 

Why bother letting delusional fantasies of the mind (your fantasies about me or that other person) cause your own delusional fantasy of who you are have an argument with my own delusional self which has its own delusional fantasy constructions of who you are, based on limited data that I have perceived through a computer screen get into twisted puzzle-knots of arguments that are all essentially about nothing whatsoever?

 

We can do better!

 

You can do it!

 

I can too!

 

If I wanted to - and I had the discipline to do so, I could simply avoid getting into these foolish arguments - it is simply because I care about people as individuals that I take the time to reply and 'go there.' So, assuming you are the same - you care about me, we all care about each other - we should see this and remember first and foremost that we are all here as enlightening beings and that we have the same overarching goals (generally speaking)...and so if this is the case we can find a way to work together better during this process...believe me you: you are not yet a perfected being - I ain't seen no one who is...there is no such thing probably, unless it is that being who can deal with any issue, at any time, in the most fluid of manner, without attachment. I can smell the attachment on all of you guys here...we all reek of attachment.

 

We all see this in each other - there are no secrets in this regards...

 

I am not saying that there is no place for giving or getting a psychic bitch slap, but why get dirtier than need be?

 

I like the journey as much as everyone, but I am finding myself more and more impatient as I grow older and find that there isn't as much time for playing in the sandbox anymore...welcome to my attempt to fix this issue within myself....by offering it to be seen by y'all and with obvious hopes that some others will work together to become better Buddhas.

 

Less of:

Angry Buddha

Stilted Buddha

Demeaned Buddha

Angsty Buddha

Insulted Buddha

Buddha of Righteous Indignation

...add more infinite Buddhas to the list

 

(burn the list when you are done)

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Songtsan   

Songtsan
Posted

I'm just coming to the realization that I'd rather use my time for myself. This is why I created my website to write about habits/ways we can optimize and utilize our time in a way for doing meaningful things for ourselves. This is what interests me. Self development without the stigma added to the word.

 

The weakness of posting your ideas in your own private Idaho is that you will not grow through constructive criticism as much...the strength is that you will grow naturally and learn to love yourself as the beautiful piece of art that you are...beautiful things are often easily destroyed by mean people though...in the crucible of life, with its many interactions, beautiful things can also grow stronger and more beautiful through all the stress and strain and growing pains...

 

the middle path is what works best for most....;)

 

too little struggle leads to sloth and weakness in the knees and someone who is easily unbalanced

 

too much struggle leads to insanity, giving up, self-hatred, anger/hate, less forgiveness, etc.

 

always aim for the "yellow-orange" zone - not the "green," and not the "red"

 

don't ever listen to the advice of those who think they know it all ;)

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Songtsan   

Songtsan
Posted (edited)

When someone criticizes you, there is often a good reason why...so it's important to think about their statement.

 

However - if you already have heard the criticism a thousand times, and you are choosing to be that way, then you may feel righteously indignant when others continue to be a certain way. Sometimes, people may criticize you because they really think that you didn't know something. When you already have heard that opinion a thousand times and you keep getting hit with it, you might lash out - I just did recently in another thread. It can feel like a bunch of crows are pecking at you - trying to make you hear them, make you take their advice and change your ways. The pressure is like being hit with pebbles all day...it leads to emotional/energetic armoring - a sense of cringing or being shocked when people hammer at you so. People claiming to be compassionate beings will rip at each personalities, trying to shape those peeps personalities to suit them so that they feel better.

 

Here is a suggestion of etiquette: "If I don't ask you to try to improve me in a certain area, please don't start trying to do it."

1. None of us needs big "sisters" or "brothers"

 

"If something you do is aimed at me personally and offends me, it is only common sense that I will lash back with a correction for your very own" - this is a fair law and should apply to everyone equally. I doubt many would disagree

 

If I have never personally criticized you and you start criticizing my persona, that will automatically make you a person of "alert" to me - I automatically won't trust you - I grew up in the 'hood - carried guns around when I 16, knives and machetes and shit before that...I've been jumped and robbed and all kinds of shit...I have really really deep conditioning in me not to trust people - my guards are fierce and numerous and they are not being dissolved soon! My point is if you don't where the people you are talking to come from...give them the benefit of the doubt if you can.

 

I am guilty of this as much as anyone, but I think that if we, you know, every once and a while have a regularly scheduled meeting time. A time that we all come together and work on playground rules, sort of like everyone has a house meeting every once and a while, this would be great. Like totally dudes...

 

Remember that this place is a psychic house - a 'noo-house' a 'mental mansion' that we come to hang out at - we should keep the place nice and spiffy...unless - do you like living in a kind of Savage Jungle?

 

Maybe we could still have a meeting every once and a while to let people introduce and do some show/tell, refurb, etc.

Edited by Songtsan

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Songtsan   

Songtsan
Posted

I would like to heal the community of some of its squabbling, especially as I am a notable contributor of said squabbling..I don't like that it happens as often as it does, would like to try to ameliorate the situation. This place is my home of sorts - I don't have the comfort of my own website...it's you are the owner of your own club, pub or bar...of course everyone there is going to treat you nice. Here everyone is just strangers and the bouncers (thankfully) don't moderate the hell out of the place, so we can be real to each other here. I am still just seeking some level of efficiency - perhaps an occasional cleaning ritual or hazing ritual we can perform to catalyze things in an emotional cathartic release or trying to improve the energy here - you know, make things more productive for everyone - keep things going in the right direction, not get mired down...I suppose everything has its cycles though...

 

We do inter-exist though - bottom line....if we all try our damned best not to be too selfish, you know focus on keeping a nice quaint house, pull up the weeds and stuff, etc.

 

This place is also reality - we live here too....don't shit in your own backyard, don't piss on the front porch of your neighbor...that type of thing

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Songtsan   

Songtsan
Posted

What is wrong with being selfish? We are all selfish with the exception of the very few. As in regards to a website, I can help set you up or if you want I could let you guest-post on the website.

 

I too wish there was a way to moderate this place or that place better, but then it will just be what you want it to be. Let it be; and join in. Even though this place is filled with a colossal amount of information, at the end of the day it's all just opinions.

 

Nothing is wrong with being selfish - I am all the time...I just hate wasting energy - I really just like exploring the group mind psychology of this place, I find it interesting...

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Yascra   

Yascra
Posted (edited)

Dharma battles can be a great exercise.

Unfortunately some people mistaken them as an excuse to use violence whenever they encounter other practicioners, and of course that's what this kind of debates or battles should not be about.

 

 

Nothing is wrong with being selfish - I am all the time...I just hate wasting energy - I really just like exploring the group mind psychology of this place, I find it interesting...

Ouh, the group mind in here is positive, in general. You just notice that there are people over here who cultivate. I really enjoy that, tbh, it's definitely not what I'm used to :)

 

But concerning this being selfish.. Well, whoever of you sincerely brought up that's right would receive a " and with this you are ... out!", if it was a dharma battle.

Of course being self-ish is stupid in it-self. How could it be clever to emphasize s.thing that basically doesn't even exist.

Edited by Yascra
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BaguaKicksAss   

BaguaKicksAss
Posted

I am more interesting in fighting to change the culture I see, than teaching anyone.

 

I *knew* it! Yes you should definitely take up martiall arts... :D.

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Yascra   

Yascra
Posted (edited)

I am more interesting in fighting to change the culture I see, than teaching anyone.

I for my part think that it is difficult to elevate culture by fights. How can lack of education, wisdom and knowledge produce high culture anyway? So first you have to get rid of the lack of those.

I fear that what you'll bring about with changing culture by fighting will be a culture of fight .. and after we had this in huge expanse in the past, how would we want to engage in building up s.thing like this, being aware of at least some of the consequences?

 

Without any doubt, there are situations in which you have to fight or even use violence. In many, many cases it will be possible to use softer methods anyway.

It may not be impossible to cultivate in hell or as a hungry ghost .. but without a question it's difficult. Being aware of this, one should at least try to handle people, things and situations with wisdom. More work in the beginning .. but less to clear up lateron.

As I mentioned, I don't say that you'll always be able to avoid fights, sometimes they are necessary. But fights always consume a lot of ressources that could in most cases be used for better purposes.

In the end people will prefer a king who loves them.

 

Best regards

Edited by Yascra

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Thunder_Gooch   

Thunder_Gooch
Posted (edited)

I'd like to see a community of serious, logical, rational, devoted, and focused seekers who want something real.

 

What I see (elsewhere on the internet) is just a bunch a grown men who are role playing, playing make believe and living in a fantasy world. No serious individuals. No one who cares about something real and meaningful.

 

The situation is such I am mortified to even label myself "spiritual" because of the connotations of newage (insert expletive here).

That is worth fighting to change in my opinion.

 

 


I for my part think that it is difficult to elevate culture by fights. How can lack of education, wisdom and knowledge produce high culture anyway? So first you have to get rid of the lack of those.
I fear that what you'll bring about with changing culture by fighting will be a culture of fight .. and after we had this in huge expanse in the past, how would we want to engage in building up s.thing like this, being aware of at least some of the consequences?

Without any doubt, there are situations in which you have to fight or even use violence. In many, many cases it will be possible to use softer methods anyway.
It may not be impossible to cultivate in hell or as a hungry ghost .. but without a question it's difficult. Being aware of this, one should at least try to handle people, things and situations with wisdom. More work in the beginning .. but less to clear up lateron.
As I mentioned, I don't say that you'll always be able to avoid fights, sometimes they are necessary. But fights always consume a lot of ressources that could in most cases be used for better purposes.
In the end people will prefer a king who loves them.

Best regards

Edited by Thunder_Gooch

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