Through depression we regain our spiritual bearings

[DreamBliss]

Thanks for putting that up. There are people in my life I greatly value who suffer from depression and I never know what to say to them about it. Understanding where they're at can help. I'm reluctant to recommend meditation, as I'm aware that "for a man with a hammer, everything looks like a nail". In other words, it may be completely wrong for them.

 

You have done rightly by them. Medication only addresses the symptom, seen by society as somehow bad, undesirable or wrong. It would not address the root cause and worse, medication only perpetuates depression. It just draws it out and makes it last longer. I could be wrong on this, but I don't think anyone has ever been healed from depression using medication.

 

What helped me were psilocybin mushrooms. It is the only "medication" I would ever "prescribe" to someone depressed. The best form is ground up in a gel cap pill and taken with a tall glass of orange juice. The person taking it should be in a  comfortable, familiar, safe environment, outside or with outside access if possible. It is probably better if someone takes the shrooms with them, someone they like to be around and trust.

 

The experience can turn ugly otherwise. But even if it does, the day after is what, to my mind, is important. Something will have changed inside them. Everything will be bright and colorful. They will find themselves truly happy and joyful, appreciative and thankful, just looking around. It will last for a few days, there is no sudden down, and as something changed inside, they will find that their depression just isn't as deep as it used to be.

 

After they have had the shrooms casually make available some transformative spiritual texts available to them, or take them to the library to look at the 133, 154 - 158 sections, among others. There will be some subject they probably weren't aware of that will fascinate them when they discover it, and reading it will begin their spiritual journey, taking them out of the depression they were in.

 

Some books you could try are Pam Grout's E-Squared, A Course In Miracles, Eckhart Tolle's, "Power of Now" or maybe one of the Abraham books. Don't force anything on them, they have to find what draws them, what interests them, what speaks to them. That would be my advice as to how to help these people you care about.

 

Most of all though work on how you perceive them. See them as happy, healthy and well - enjoying their life. Stop seeing them as the label depressed. See them as they really are inside, a unique manifestation of Source, the same energy that is in you. See the truth of them, not the mask the present or the role they are playing.

 

The root cause of depression is dissatisfaction with one's circumstances or situation. You find your life undesirable, you do not know how to make it desirable. You feel powerless to change your life. You may try but if you fail, you feel even worse.  It saps your energy and drains you of your reason to live.

 

But assuming Nikolai1 is correct, and right now, in this moment, I believe he is, there is a deeper level where depression really is looking for meaning in one's life, but not finding it in, to coin a phrase, the world of things.

 

So then depression seems more like it is the start of a spiritual waking up process. Not sure if I have said this quite right. It feels OK and accurate to when I was extremely angry and depressed.

Edited June 7, 2015 by DreamBliss

[DreamBliss]

When you're in a depression, all attempts to help can feel like intellectual bullshit...but still you find yourself on the receiving end of a gutful of it.  The truth is, your depression scares people...it's just so hard to accept.  You provoke everyone's deepest anxieties.   They think your're going to kill yourself.

 

This is at the heart of the problem. If someone is feeling depressed and we respond in fear, wanting them to behave differently so we feel better, that is conditional love. The true measure of unconditional love is if you are ready to help them kill themselves, if they ask for your help. Can you love and support them no matter what they do or are thinking of doing?

 

I don't think it is not common for anyone to say this. To fly in the face of everything, including the law, and love someone no matter what, to be there no matter what, that is a true friend. To offer to at least hold them during their final moments, if they choose to go through with terminating their life, that is true unconditional love.

 

If you can offer that, you may find out that the depressed person will change their mind. In fact, your ability to be there, no matter what, and furthermore, to see past the mask and role to who they really are, if you can do that, may just be that glimpse of light they need to emerge from this depression.

 

It is best to think of it like the one you care about is in an egg. They are in that darkness, alone, and you can not reach them directly. If you try to break them out of the shell, they will emerge weak. This is probably what happens when a depressed person kills themselves. Well-meaning loved ones, who only loved conditionally, tried to "cure" the person of the depression (the undesirable state), instead of loving and accept them as they are, and so ultimately harmed them.

 

No, we have to leave them in the egg. They have to punch their own way out to emerge strong. All we can do is hold them lovingly, without conditions, as they go through this process. Oh and you could think of shrooms as something like the embryonic yolk that they can draw from to grow stronger. But be aware that some will not accept shrooms, and you have to be OK with that. They may not accept them especially if you offer it to them to "fix" them. Get rid of any idea of fixing anything before you go anywhere near a depressed person!

Edited June 7, 2015 by DreamBliss

[DreamBliss]

I think it was Gurdjeiff that talked a lot about wiseacring (making jokes) and what it has done to humanity, i.e., ".......that maleficent particularity of your psyche, called wiseacring". (source: http://books.google.com.au/books?id=2xwnInGze5sC&pg=PA30&lpg=PA30&dq=gurdjieff+wiseacring&source=bl&ots=eXnTWpNAFk&sig=dU9au7t2Fl_0A9G7xfeWQHhHuWc&hl=en&sa=X&ei=0BD1Urn_I4eulAWAw4CoDw&ved=0CDoQ6AEwAw#v=onepage&q=gurdjieff%20wiseacring&f=false)

 

I can't quite explain it though.......

 

Maybe it just stems from an insecurity (the ego makes an individual to want to gain acceptance by making people laugh all the the time).

 

 

 

 

Blessings of Sensibility.

:wub: :wub: :wub:

 

My guess is that the depressed people, not having learned to love unconditionally (and not knowing how because they have not been shown unconditional love) want to control the behavior of others, in order to make themselves feel happy, and making others laugh is one way to do so.

 

I know I did this a lot when I was depressed or sad. I wanted to feel happy, and it made me feel happy to have others around me laughing. I also wanted to hide how I really felt, so I did it behind a smile.

[DreamBliss]

When your in the death grip of REAL depression

"spirituality" is a bad , bad joke of the worst taste

and all this intellectual bullshit just aggravates an already wounded and tortured soul.

You cant even eat  never mind read or concentrate and the idea that things are going to get better

seems like a walt disney fairytale.

you are totally alone and ready to implode at any given minute ( or so you think )

and you are , make no mistake about it ,

in a real living hell which you cannot escape from and no one else can understand.

 

The only thing I have found personally to move this deathly heavy energy

is a powerful  physical and energetic shift ,

just enough to let a tiny bit of light in and even that needs the strongest of shifts ,

BUT...

That tiny little ray of sunshine breaking through the dense , dark clouds can be enough to save someones life when they are in the death grip.

 

This sounds like it is spoken in anger, which makes it seem likely that you are still depressed?

 

That is OK. I love and accept you as you are, depressed or not, and do not require you to behave in any particular manner.

 

If you are depressed, you may also feel powerless. You are not. You can choose how you respond to this time in your life. You can choose to dwell upon it or not. The choice is, and will always be, yours.

 

Believe it or not, you actually chose to be depressed! Nobody made you that way, even if you don't agree with me, when you are ready you will see the truth of what I am saying.

 

I have said before that if we are constantly looking back as we walk the path of our life we can't see where we are going and will fall flat on our faces. The same if we stare straight ahead. Better to deal with this moment, right now. What is happening in this moment, right now? Is there anything in this moment, right now, to be depressed about? To be angry about?

 

What are you feeling right now? Bring your awareness to it. Just gently be aware of whatever it is you are feeling, right now, in this moment, without criticism or judgment. Whenever your feelings begin to overwhelm you, just come back to this simple exercise. Bring awareness to what you are feeling. Maybe write down what you are feeling and anything else that comes to mind.

 

If you need someone to listen, I am here and you can PM me. You will get through this. If you have already gotten through this, awesome! There is still anger, maybe some bitterness about it, which is understandable. But there will come a time, when you are ready, when you will glance back and see the value in your experiences. But just a glance mind you.

 

I look back at when I was depressed, and I have a lot of regrets. I wish I had done more, experienced more. I seem to have arrived ta this time in my life without accomplishing anything of any real meaning or value. I still struggle with figuring out my dream. Only recently found a purpose for myself. Thoughts of its too late, I waited too long or I missed out keep wanting to play over and over in my mind. I contemplate ending my life, although not recently.

 

But if I had not gotten depressed and began to doubt my Christian faith I would still be trapped in it. My former faith was making me depressed. It must have been my dissatisfaction with it and the way my parents chose to live that brought my depression on. It is what caused me to glance at that shelf at the library and try that first book on a subject I knew nothing about at the time, Lucid Dreaming. It is what allowed me to say, "To hell with it!" and try shrooms. Everything that happened to me brought me to this point in my life, was necessary for me to arrive here.

 

So I have no anger or bitterness about my time of depression. I have forgiven my former religion and my parents, who converted me to it and did things that hurt me without being aware of the damage they caused. I have come to see that they did not know any better. They still don't. I can't change them, and shouldn't try. I need to love them unconditionally, that is the practice, this is how I am to be with others, To love and accept them as they are. No conditions.

 

You will find your way, if you haven't already. Even if you don't, that is perfectly OK. There is no right or wrong choice. There are only actions and consequences, the choices we make and what happens as a result. You will receive no criticism or judgment from me. But I did notice your anger and so pointed it out.

 

You will get awareness and noticing out of me...

Edited June 7, 2015 by DreamBliss

[Jetsun]

 

I think it was Gurdjeiff that talked a lot about wiseacring (making jokes) and what it has done to humanity, i.e., ".......that maleficent particularity of your psyche, called wiseacring". (source: http://books.google.com.au/books?id=2xwnInGze5sC&pg=PA30&lpg=PA30&dq=gurdjieff+wiseacring&source=bl&ots=eXnTWpNAFk&sig=dU9au7t2Fl_0A9G7xfeWQHhHuWc&hl=en&sa=X&ei=0BD1Urn_I4eulAWAw4CoDw&ved=0CDoQ6AEwAw#v=onepage&q=gurdjieff wiseacring&f=false)

 

I can't quite explain it though.......

 

Maybe it just stems from an insecurity (the ego makes an individual to want to gain acceptance by making people laugh all the the time).

 

 

 

 

Blessings of Sensibility.

:wub: :wub: :wub:

 

Wisacring doesn't mean making jokes, it is a word he created to describe the way humans expand upon things and talk about things they don't really know anything about.

[Kubba]

I would say that there is trust, distrust, and different degrees of trust in between of total trust and total distrust.

One, in some phases of waking up, after spending hours or days just doing things, just walking around just forgeting about everything, will notice that all this happened without one's will to do anything or participate in anything.

Will appears more as a kind of contraction within the phosiology of body-mind complex.

Different contractions with different power, different impact on particular regions of body functioning, and different durration of fading away.

 

Depression can often be missinterpretation. After some insights beggins just a naturall process of throwing "old" patterns out of the system. It might looks as if depression and one, withouth right understanding can believe that sth is going wrong, cause of accumulated pain, slowly (or quickly) coming out and impossible to avoid anymore.

 

But offcourse it might be a simple depression just overestimated as awakening .

 

Some processes start with depression or emotional imbalance.

One day you are a perfect example of psychological health, another day you appear as if a total crazy person, suffering of anything that someone say to you.

Also bodily temporary disfunctions or symtoms of ilnesses shoe but then you visit a doctor and he says that he can't see anything.

 

Then after time, you can't say there was sth like a will. It was just misunderstanding of a process that looks more like seeds planting, growing and dying. Then impacting the body-mind with adequate contractions and oppenings.

Then you might laught

Edited June 8, 2015 by Kubba