Informative Practice Log

[rex]

This practice log outlines practices and perspectives covering many areas of related interest to this forum:

 

http://salomesrevenge.freeforums.org/michael-t123.html

 

 

[RiverSnake]

Had another person recommend this journal to read. Yet to read it, but it looks interesting.

 

My 2 cents, Peace

[Captain Mar-Vell]

...
I skimmed it.

 

Yes, interesting fer sure.

 

Last entry was August last year.

I wonder how he is getting on.

...

[rex]

Well I hope he's doing fine and dandy.

 

Another journal to check out is The Seal of the Secrets of the World. Review here:

 

http://nick-farrell.blogspot.com/2013/08/the-limits-of-silence.html

 

 

edit: duff link

Edited February 15, 2014 by rex

[Nungali]

That was interesting reading. I have a shelf of old diaries that I haven't got around to burning yet. - no probs. But one of them, which I thought I had burnt recently resurfaced.

 

Its full of coloured diagrams and little paintings of equipment and tools for a Goetic working, all the notes on making them , the consecration ceremonies, the development of the main ritual; its text, notes on the workings, logistics [ which is where perhaps the value lies ? - there is 2 entries in particular; one where it is so hot - even at night- the candles flopped down 180 degrees, hanging in a down position (I remedied this by, the next time, keeping them in the fridge previously), and a wind arising and blowing veils into candles ....it is a BIG help to do run-throughs , anything can arise and if unforeseen or one is not ready for it , it can lead to hassles or worse ] drawings of spirits, etc and a series of photographs.

 

I go through cycles of thinking to chuck it or do something else with it ... I cant really see its benefit .... maybe beause the outcome (at the time and for some time after) seemed inconclusive.

[BaguaKicksAss]

I sometimes wish you lived locally Nungali .

[Nungali]

I do

 

.... go west cross that little island of yours ... keep going over the water heading south west, go past the two islands with the long white cloud over them, over the water again a bit to the north, its just where the mountains are close to the sea and on that line where the big slab pushed the other big slab up into the air .... you cant miss it. There is a big mountain there with a Nungali head on it ....

 

A bit like this .... but more Nungali like ;

 

 

 

PS. ... mountain was there before me ... I got the name from the mountain .. THE original Nungali is a man who was a man and a nungungali and is in the mountain with just his head sticking out .... watching the valley.

[BaguaKicksAss]

I'll work on my teleportation, then head right on over .

[rex]

 

That was interesting reading. I have a shelf of old diaries that I haven't got around to burning yet. - no probs. But one of them, which I thought I had burnt recently resurfaced.

 

Its full of coloured diagrams and little paintings of equipment and tools for a Goetic working, all the notes on making them , the consecration ceremonies, the development of the main ritual; its text, notes on the workings, logistics [ which is where perhaps the value lies ? - there is 2 entries in particular; one where it is so hot - even at night- the candles flopped down 180 degrees, hanging in a down position (I remedied this by, the next time, keeping them in the fridge previously), and a wind arising and blowing veils into candles ....it is a BIG help to do run-throughs , anything can arise and if unforeseen or one is not ready for it , it can lead to hassles or worse ] drawings of spirits, etc and a series of photographs.

 

I go through cycles of thinking to chuck it or do something else with it ... I cant really see its benefit .... maybe beause the outcome (at the time and for some time after) seemed inconclusive.

 

I'd say the value lies in all of it. Coloured diagrams and little paintings? They sound like real labours of love and cornucopias worthy of addition to special archives at places like the British Library, the Warburg and Courtauld institutes and Pitt Rivers Museum.

[Nungali]

thanks for supplying my morning chuckle .... I said they were coloured diagrams and little paintings ... I didnt say they were GOOD ones .... also my writing is atrocious (its all long hand). The painting of the 'spirit' is pretty funny, but , hey, that's what I 'saw'. *

 

The main value I see is that I worked through a lot of dead ends and that might help others (like if your cubes are based on your measurement from floor to navel, and you want a double cube altar with a set up like Liber Yod, and so your circle has to be this big, you do realise it wont fit in the temple ... that also makes your 'throne' ridiculously high so you have to crouch on it as the ceiling isnt high enough for your head and it might look regal to you up there but you have to climb up on to its so high and when you do you expose your arse and the ceremony is just ridiculous as we have to stop and watch you tring to get up and down off your tower ... "But its sacred geometry !" < closes eyes and slaps his own forehead > - I could go on and on but its all supposed to be confidential ... but anyway , nowadays; what others ?

 

Its a bit like the articles I wrote about gardening here ( I went back geologically in my studies to the forming of the regolith, the major faulting patterns , the formation of soils, volcanic events, erosion, soil profiles, the history of agriculture (only since the late 1800s here) and all the mistakes and occasional 'not too bad;'things farmers and hippies did to the place , cross-referenced to scientific soil tests and agricultural advice from various government departments. I do not know of a single person that has read it or follows any of the advice ... gardening and farming continues as it did , soil and land degradation continues as it did (its 2 points off aluminium toxicity ) .... and hippies who yelled about good farming practice and permaculture 15 years ago now run monoculture for the new cash crop - garlic (as one said to me ... "But you can make good money out of it." errrmmm - thats what is usually behind most problems !

 

The same with occult or spiritual science .... I dont know how many times in the past, seemingly intelligent people did absolute crazy shit ... the amount of outside ceremonies I went to where the candles blew out ... one 'High Priestess" even stationed a person at each quarter with a lighter to constantly re-light the candles ... every few seconds . Once a new woman turned up and put a similar event on ... she opened a bag and pulled out coloured glass chimneys, the other (previously in charge woman) asked what they were for and she goes 'To stop the candles blowing out' ... I could resist, I had to go over and give her a hug (I explained later to her and she .... )

 

Where all living in a fuckin 'B Ark' and there isnt much we can do about it. If any of my work ends up in a museum then it will be labeled as 'from the guy that thought he could make a difference'.

 

 

 

* Then again:

 

[Captain Mar-Vell]

...

Nice tits.

 

Damn! Too much testosterone!

...

Edited February 17, 2014 by Captain Mar-Vell

[rex]

Avoiding practical pitfalls in gathering together required paraphernalia is one value of the diaries.

 

The other intrinsic value would be in the accounts of what actually transpired; the effects on the operator and physical environment during the working and any after effects. Were there any unintended consquences, like burst water pipes/blown fuses or householders not involved in the opeartion being affected?

 

Did the nature and character of the spirits encountered accord with what was written about them? Did they relate material that could be passed on without breaking any confidentiality (perhaps this is why diaries are burnt instead of published). What happened when things went wrong or events made unexpected turns? Was this down to flaws in the physical preparation or the state of the operator(s). Could the wrong turn of events have been amusing or deadly? When things did go wrong what did it take to return to an even keel?

 

Having a contacted a spirit was a short or long term relationship established? What was the basis of each relationship and in the case of long term relationships how were they maintained?

 

What about any philosphical/religious implications? Is there any sense that the intelligences contacted were universal and wore different masks for different traditions or were they very specific to a particular tradition/world view? Assuming the platonic grand chain of being exists what is the nature of the relationship between the operator, the intelligences and Source? etc etc.

 

Given the diversity of motivations and oulook out there diaries would make instructive if contradictory reading.

[Nungali]

Great post ! From my perspective (and very briefly) I will tell you how my experience related to it;

 

 

 

Avoiding practical pitfalls in gathering together required paraphernalia is one value of the diaries.

 

Yes, I think that has a value , as many mistakes have been uncovered when working with written material ... often mistakes are perpetuated and passed on as people just copy and work , or postulate from the armchair. Eg. the Kamea of Venus in G.D. Book 7 , Talsmans and Sigils is wrong. I have seen it put up in a temple a few times in that wrong form ... people dont realise as they just 'put it up' without working with it ... if one works with it one will realise it is wrong - it has a misprint.

 

Actually working with things reveals thgeir workings (or not)

 

The other intrinsic value would be in the accounts of what actually transpired; the effects on the operator and physical environment during the working and any after effects. Were there any unintended consquences, like burst water pipes/blown fuses or householders not involved in the opeartion being affected?

 

Not actually unintended ... more like unexpected ... (or not thought out) Eg. I know from experience about the mosquitoes in the temple before this working ... part of the 'banishing' prep involved citronella coils burning .. A wind can arise and blow draps and curtains into candles (so I had previously weighted them . Although one can never be prepared for everything (one time at a day ritual in the temple we left the roof open to the sky (I designed and built it so I could do that) and on a Sunday ( WTF!) on the 3rd day of the reception of the Book of the Law ( Ra Hoor Khuit) ... a fuckin police drug squad helicopter turns up and hovers over the temple for a look !

 

Did the nature and character of the spirits encountered accord with what was written about them?

 

Not really. I remember thinking 'you are not supposed to appear in that form " but by then I was not so bound by the original form as I only used it as a skeleton and had made adaptations ( from a more GD perspective to a Thelemic one.)

 

Did they relate material that could be passed on without breaking any confidentiality (perhaps this is why diaries are burnt instead of published). What happened when things went wrong or events made unexpected turns?

 

Most of that got ironed out in practice. The main thing is , iI one has decided NOT to leave the circle inappropriately ... then you are stuck there until you exit approriatly (or not! - to put out a flaming curtain or veil for example).

 

Classic example; Lom Milo DuQuette - ' My Life With Spirits' .... :so I just decided to dump the vial of Oil of Abremalin on my head ... " (or words to that effect) as soon as I read that I was OMG! YOU IDIOT ! Of course a few moments later he is faced with the decsion to break the cicrcle immediatly and flush his eyes at the tap ... or possibly go blind. If any one had eer made that oil themselves (instead of buying some from the 'magic shop' ) one would realise the volatility of the ingredients.

 

Burn upon their foreheads O wondrous serpent

 

Was this down to flaws in the physical preparation or the state of the operator(s). Could the wrong turn of events have been amusing or deadly? When things did go wrong what did it take to return to an even keel?

 

Both . More amusing than deadly. Insight and quick thinking innovation (eg, my variant use of the Ring of Solomon )

 

 

Having a contacted a spirit was a short or long term relationship established?

 

It seemed short term and of no consequence ... but over time .... the results of the operation seem to have manifested but not by the direct route I intended. I am of the opinion now that it is always long term.

 

What was the basis of each relationship and in the case of long term relationships how were they maintained?

 

In the 'unconscious' (to be brief) .

 

What about any philosphical/religious implications? Is there any sense that the intelligences contacted were universal and wore different masks for different traditions or were they very specific to a particular tradition/world view?

 

In this case ... of evocation, I consider them a subjective projection into an objective realm . But my beliefs are not restricted to that ... I have since adopted a 'Daemonic Reality * view ... as it seems the closest to a 'unified field theory' in this area.

 

Assuming the platonic grand chain of being exists what is the nature of the relationship between the operator, the intelligences and Source? etc etc.

 

Given the diversity of motivations and oulook out there diaries would make instructive if contradictory reading.

 

 

It would have to be read in context with some of my other stuff (like 'Magical Madness - A Study on Angelic and Demonic Possession.' ( restricted release ) . It references the work of Swedenborg , Dr. Wilson VanDusen and other individuals, groups and documents .

 

Here is a start : http://e-swedenborg.com/tp/books/w.vandusen/presence_spirits.htm

 

I realise you questions were probably rhetorical ... but I had fun answering them briefly.

 

It was a great list ... perhaps it should be made into a format questionnaire so people can paste into their diaries at the end of each working.

 

 

* http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Patrick_Harpur

Edited February 21, 2014 by Nungali

[Captain Mar-Vell]

...

Nice.

 

The higher order hallucinations are quite a bit rarer, do not oppose the patient's will, but rather are helpful guides, and are far more abstract, symbolic and creative than lower order hallucinations. In Swedenborg's terms the higher order would be angels who come to assist the person. As Swedenborg describes it, they reside in the interior mind which does not think in words but in universals which comprise many particulars (AC 5614). The higher order in one patient visually showed him hundreds of universal symbols in the space of one hour. Though he found them entertaining he couldn't understand their meaning. Many of the higher order are purely visual and use no words at all, while the lower order talk endlessly. One patient described a higher order spirit who appeared all in white, radiant, very powerful in his presence and communicated directly with the spirit of the patient to guide him out of his hell. Swedenborg describes how the influx of angels gently leads to good and leaves the person freedom (AC 6205). I've described the incident where the patient recognized good forces first as a sun which withdrew from him when he was frightened whereas all his experiences of the lower order had been attacking. It was this simple respect for his freedom that led the patient to believe this was another order.

Swedenborg indicates that good spirits have some degree of control over the evil ones (AC 5992, 6308; SD 3525). Higher order hallucinations have made the same comment-that they can control lower order ones, but it is seldom to the degree the patient would desire. In some respects they overcome the evil insofar as the patient identifies with them. In one case I encouraged the patient to become acquainted with these helpful forces that tended to frighten him. When he did so their values merged into him and the evil plotters, who had been saying for months they would kill him, disappeared. I seem to see some kind of control of the higher order over the lower, though the nature and conditions of this control are not yet clear. Again, precisely in agreement with Swedenborg, I found evil spirits cannot see the good, but the good can the evil (HH 583). The lower order may know of the presence of the higher order but they cannot see them.

It remained a considerable puzzle to me for over a year why the higher order hallucinations were rarer since they were far more interesting to the patient and myself and potentially more therapeutic. Again, Swedenborg has an explanation that fits beautifully with my findings. I have noticed the higher order tends to be nonverbal and highly symbolic. He indicates angels possess the very interior of man. Their influx is tacit. It does not stir up material ideas or memories but is directed to man's ends or inner motives (AC 5854, 6193, 6209). It is for this reason not so apparent and hence rarer in the patients' reports.

 

I read Swedenborg thirty years ago.

 

I very much liked Swedenborg.

 

He had real insight which I recognised immediately.

 

He was an influence on Blake.

...

Edited February 21, 2014 by Captain Mar-Vell

[Nungali]

and he was fluent in 9 languages, wrote 150 works in 17 sciences, expert in 7 crafts, a musician, a Member of Parliament and a mining engineer. He came up with the first theory of nebular hypothesis, wrote extensive works on metallurgy, algebra and calculus, mapped several areas of the brain and ductless glands, suggested the particle structure of magnets, designed a glider and a submarine and engineered the world’s largest dry-dock. He then took on psychology and religion with extensive exploration into the ‘hypnogogic’ state. He led a successful and productive life and claimed daily intercourse with spirits. He appeared to have psychic powers, wrote 12 volumes on the psychological meanings hidden in Genesis and Exodus and (of course) was tried as a heretic and had his books banned in his native country - Sweden.

[Captain Mar-Vell]

...

Hypnagogic.

 

Yeah.

...

[Nungali]

...

Hypnagogic.

 

Yeah.

...

 

 

Edited February 21, 2014 by Nungali

[rex]

Great post too! Thanks for your reply; the questions were rhetorical but your respnses were appreciated nonetheless. Swedenborg was a polymath and I can think of no greater recommendation for his work than the reactions from the authorities whose feathers were ruffled, I'll have to check him out.

 

Haven't read Patrick Harpur's material so that will also be on the 'to read' list. An interesting work is Michael Psellus' book on the Operaton of Daemons which is said to be a bridge between the classical Greek and medieval understandings of daemons. An old translation is available here:

 

http://www.esotericarchives.com/psellos/daemonibus.pdf

 

For a more (pricey) modern translation: http://www.amazon.com/Michael-Psellus-Operation-Daemons-Collisson/dp/0955738725/

 

I can also see a value in diaries/journals in that long term patterns may be discerned. Now what was that phrase I read somewhere - 'The Method of Science, the Aim of Religion' ?

 

Great post ! From my perspective (and very briefly) I will tell you how my experience related to it;

....

 

[Nungali]

Great post too! Thanks for your reply; the questions were rhetorical but your respnses were appreciated nonetheless. Swedenborg was a polymath and I can think of no greater recommendation for his work than the reactions from the authorities whose feathers were ruffled, I'll have to check him out.

Check out the work of Wilson VanDusen too - very interesting.

Haven't read Patrick Harpur's material so that will also be on the 'to read' list.

Yes, I am quiet taken by him ... not just me, he gets great reviews from critics. ' Mercurius - The Marriage of Heaven and Hell' just arrived in the mailbox ... page 1 totally got me hooked ( due to certain synchronicities with my own life ) :

 

" ... it is probably the most explicit account of the alchemical art ever published ... " - The Literary Review

An interesting work is Michael Psellus' book on the Operaton of Daemons which is said to be a bridge between the classical Greek and medieval understandings of daemons. An old translation is available here:

 

http://www.esotericarchives.com/psellos/daemonibus.pdf

 

For a more (pricey) modern translation: http://www.amazon.com/Michael-Psellus-Operation-Daemons-Collisson/dp/0955738725/

Thank you ! (Snaffle - score ) ... " SYDNEY:

PUBLISHED BY JAMES TEGG, BOOKSELLER AND STATIONER,

AND

PRINTED BY D. L. WELCH,

AT THE ATLAS-OFFICE, OPPOSITE THE POST-OFFICE,

Of whom the work may be had. "

 

In Sydney ! - In 1843 ... someone was offering classes in Goetia ? ? ? Next to the GPO in George Street - I'm stunned ! .. maybe he meant classes in classics ?

 

I gotta track this guy down ... cant find much from a quick search so far.

 

 

" The Translator is willing to devote a few hours daily to

private tuition.—His course of instruction would include,

besides the Classics, a general English Education. "

 

 

 

I can also see a value in diaries/journals in that long term patterns may be discerned. Now what was that phrase I read somewhere - 'The Method of Science, the Aim of Religion' ?

'Scientific Illuminism'

Edited February 24, 2014 by Nungali