Does Anyone Have Power?

[Thunder_Gooch]

Just watching a few videos sound a bit simplistic, for me anyway. I am not going to try anything based on watching some video

Then best of luck to you on your path.

[Yascra]

I do not believe anything I could record even if my abilities exceeded JC's would convince you of anything, nor anyone else here.

Excuse me, but why shouldn't it?

That's not to say I'd agree that you should first demonstrate anything before making claims on effectiveness. It's up to everybody themselves whether they want to show anything - the only situation in which demonstration of one's powers and attainments should take place, in my opinion, is when you want to teach someone, who otherwise wouldn't have good reason to invest time, maybe money and effort into this system. Personally I don't think you're accumulating students here, so requesting you to demonstrate is inappropriate, at least that's how I see that.

 

But .. Non-believing by every possible reader/watcher is really a bad excuse in this place here, if you would honestly take a look on the whole instead of focussing on some people you might consider opponents.

If you don't want to demonstrate publicly that might be your decision, or maybe part of you personal ethics - but take the responsibility yourself and don't blame your imagined "99% of the board" for it. It's up to you, not more, not less. Point.

And to be honest, I doubt that C T is requesting you to instruct him, so in your place I'd prefer to not go into that over here.

 

All the best

Edited February 16, 2014 by Yascra

[Thunder_Gooch]

 

Lol. Are you implying that I ever said Reiki was a valid system?

We have different definitions of "valid system".

 

 

 

 

 

you think the only requirements for a system to be valid should be your own.

Results. Either you get them, or you don't. Real simple.

 

 

 

 

 

Any system which actually delivers what it promises is valid

 

I promise my system will cost you $250.00 if you decide to pay me, therefor it's a valid system.

Edited February 16, 2014 by Thunder_Gooch

[Yascra]

For example, in the Kalu Rinpoche video i posted in the Buddhist forum, he said it took him several years to finally come to acknowledge and trust his root guru.

Lol, for good reason, if you ask me.

But that's off topic here.

[adept]

I don't know enough about Reiki to properly judge it one way or the other, although I get the impression that it's probably nonsense.

 

Well Reiki worked for me. In fact I was very impressed with my experience of it.

Edited February 16, 2014 by adept

[C T]

Lol, for good reason, if you ask me. But that's off topic here.

Its not really off-topic.

 

To get somewhere, a student needs guidance. I am saying to be very discerning where and whom to rely on for this guidance to bear fruit. There is always the excitement and emotional factors involved when we think we have found a master in whom we can believe, and then we dive in with gusto, only to realize there is so much at stake, and as a result niggling doubts arise. This stems from a shaky personal attitude, a weak foundation too. So, the work can begin with the self first, with the support of a genuine guide. The criteria for a genuine guide needs to be clearly established first.

[Thunder_Gooch]

why shouldn't it?

Yascra,

 

Let's not play coy. If a biophysicist, a medical doctor, and the head of the mind science foundation stripping a guy to a shirt, checking him for metal and watching him power an LED with chi isn't enough to convince you, then nothing short of the academic, scientific, and medical communities changing their opinion on the matter would.

 

you should first demonstrate anything before making claims on effectiveness.

It's already been done, I don't need to factor myself into the equation here.

 

 

when you want to teach someone

I'm not here to teach anyone anything. I just want to find serious individuals who want something real, they can teach themselves.

 

 

 

take the responsibility yourself and don't blame your imagined "99% of the board" for it.

lolwhut?

Edited February 16, 2014 by Thunder_Gooch

[Aeran]

We have different definitions of "valid system".

 

The problem isn't that we have different definitions of validity, it's that you think the only requirements for a system to be valid should be your own. Any system which actually delivers what it promises is valid, after that it just comes down to what someone wants out of practice. If they want superpowers and spiritual immortality, then Mo Pai is probably a good bet. If they want something else (or just don't want to give up sex and multiple hours of every day), it isn't going to be much use for them.

 

Not everyone wants the same things you do. I'm not speaking for myself here, since we actually have pretty similar goals, but there are plenty of people who just want something to make them healthier or enhance their martial arts practice, and there's nothing wrong with that.

[BaguaKicksAss]

Sure glad no one is suggesting I do vid demos of what little I can do of *my* grandteacher's stuff!!!!

 

Aside from not wanting to make him look bad, there just is no comparison.

 

Now on the magical side of things, all the "wierd shit" as I call it happens at random.

[Yascra]

Ok, C T, if you think the topic fits here - okay.

So in how many cultures do you think some Tibetan "Rinpoche" is asked to search for his root guru?

Actually Tibetan buddhism might not be the system that suits him best, did you ever think about that?

Maybe his ideal teacher might be some orthodox Russian - well, do those guys really explore those religions and get the possibility to learn something that DOESN'T fit expectations of anyone from his own culture?

 

Let's be honest about it - this boy lacks power, AND he is not realizing his own nature. He is serving as a political person due to politic reasons, and he has simply arranged himself with this kind of cage, finally.

He doesn't teach out of compassion or the intense need to improve other's practice .. But because it is his JOB.

I'm happy to see that he has become less destroyed and troubled, finally. But honestly .. Lacking faith into a religion of which your first impression was that it's monks sexually abused you as a youngster is not a sign of lack of "true faith", but a sign for common sense. A common sense most people tend to give up when blindly entering a religion they don't know as well as the one they've grown up with.

 

And actually large parts of guru-yoga as it's practiced nowadays IS in fact highly problematic.

 

A good FRIEND might help you to develop your own power. Someone who regards himself as you boss/master and wants to keep that role never will. And this again.. For good reason.

Edited February 16, 2014 by Yascra

[BaguaKicksAss]

I would like to see some talks by some who do exhibit some obvious power then.

 

I say this because most of the ones I have watched on youtube don't feel that strong to me (but this could be path bias or energy bias as well on my part).

[Yascra]

Yascra,Let's not play coy. If a biophysicist, a medical doctor, and the head of the mind science foundation stripping a guy to a shirt, checking him for metal and watching him power an LED with chi isn't enough to convince you, then nothing short of the academic, scientific, and medical communities changing their opinion on the matter would.

well, but it is not about the system, right? As you say.

A request towards you, personally, to demonstrate to proove your qualification and power of your practice, is about YOU.

 

lolwhut?

if you don't wanna do it, be honest enough to say so, and don't accuse others due to maybe unfriendly reactions you assume to happen, without even having tested that. Edited February 16, 2014 by Yascra

[Thunder_Gooch]

A request towards you, personally, to demonstrate to proove your qualification and power of your practice, is about YOU.

It isn't about me, it's about the system itself. What evidence exists already is as good as it's going to get.

 

I am not interested in trying to sell myself as a teacher, I am a student.

 

I am only looking for others that want something real, it's not my job to teach them anything. They can do the teaching part themselves.

 

don't accuse others due to maybe unfriendly reactions you assume to happen, without even having tested that.

what? Edited February 16, 2014 by Thunder_Gooch

[Jetsun]

People involved in the official school and lineage of Mo Pai have shown power, whereas those who are trying to do it without the lineage on their own from books and second hand information have demonstrated no power except the ability to balance books on their head.

[Torus]

A varied and sundry list of powers. You say you want to heal others 'especially', though, yeah?

 

I would recommend studying with Michael Lomax for that. Some of his students have been able to perform qi healing after one weekend (three days) of training.

 

He has a seminar coming up in March.

Well, that's in Missouri in I wouldn't be able to travel there, but I'll make sure to research him, thanks.

 

Another option that requires no practice, no money, minimal outlay, little change in lifestyle and practically no effort.

 

 

"Very truly I tell you, whoever believes in me will do the works I have been doing, and they will do even greater things than these" John 14:12

 

 

Just requires a firm belief !

 

 

Blessings of Belief

:wub: :wub:

The thing with this is that although I'm about to go church this morning, I'm not religious. I love the values of Christianity, but I don't consider myself one anymore... I don't know what I believe about religion.

 

No ... I dont see that as the moral of the story ... plenty of people help people but they don't have powers ... look deeper.

Lol, I guess I interpreted that very wrong.

 

Something about trying to gain powers so you can help more people better, instead of just selfishly wanting them seems to make the powers come about more easily or something....

 

Catch is you have to actually mean it.

I see where you're going with this...

 

What you are calling "power" isn't power.

 

What you are calling "meditation" isn't meditation.

 

Don't throw out mo pai because you can't have anything more than the first few levels, already that is more than most westerners can hope to accomplish in their lifetime.

 

If you want something real, that's where it is at. Virtually everything else is just make believe.

 

Exaggeration? See for yourself (inside spoiler)

 

You are just spinning your wheels with practices that no one has ever gotten results with, and no one ever will get results with. Just more make believe nonsense. You either want something real or you don't.

Well what is real "meditation"? I'm not actually throwing it out, that is why I continue to do horse stance when I have time along with daily meditation. I believe that this is a valid, legitimate system. Also, I wouldn't say that its the only thing that's real, I heard that there were other masters in hiding that also had similar powers as John but didn't want to reveal it. These people probably teach different systems or perhaps they don't teach at all. I believe that all systems have some grain of truth to them, like religion. I know mo pai is real because it has documented success, however, in my opinion it is not worth fully pursuing because it only explains the first 3 levels.

[Thunder_Gooch]

People involved in the official school and lineage of Mo Pai have shown power, whereas those who are trying to do it without the lineage on their own from books and second hand information have demonstrated no power except the ability to balance books on their head.

Which is still more than can be said of any student of Gurdjieff's teachings.

 

The group you are referring to has invented it's own system, which they claim isn't mo pai but is just as good as mo pai, even though they run a forum titled mo pai.

[C T]

People involved in the official school and lineage of Mo Pai have shown power.

Power to do what, exactly?

 

If you get a chance, go for an eye-opening trip to places like Thailand, Malaysia, and Indonesia. You will see all kinds of weird and wonderful claims by professing shamans and so on. Some of their work will make you want to believe beyond any reasonable doubt.

 

One very open demo is when devotees of a certain religion pierce themselves with all kinds of stakes, spears etc and have hundreds of hooks embedded in their bodies, with chains attached, pulling chariots for miles to get from one place to another. Apparently anyone can do it, if they wish. Is this power? Of course, there are various other examples, like working with charms, black magic, exorcisms, and all that jazz. It can be very interesting to see all these things live.

 

By visiting these places, it will give you more scope to understand what demonstrations of power really mean. How the minds of people become drawn to such things, like a sort of mass hypnotic trance thing. If a large group of people can be swayed easily, imagine how little it takes to sway individuals.

[Thunder_Gooch]

I believe that all systems have some grain of truth to them, like religion.

You can believe in rain gods and do rain dances and sacrifice goats to appease them that doesn't mean it's true even if you have a PhD. in rain god theology.

 

You can spend your entire life with random teachings and that doesn't mean you'll go anywhere or accomplish anything.

 

in my opinion it is not worth fully pursuing because it only explains the first 3 levels.

That is still more than you can realistically hope to master in your lifetime if you live a normal western lifestyle.

 

Virtually everything else is just make believe.

Edited February 16, 2014 by Thunder_Gooch

[Aeran]

 

Virtually everything else is just make believe.

 

I'm still waiting for you to back that statement up with an account of your extensive experience with the various metaphysical and bioenergetic systems around the world

[Torus]

You can believe in rain gods and do rain dances and sacrifice goats to appease them that doesn't mean it's true even if you have a PhD. in rain god theology.

 

You can spend your entire life with random teachings and that doesn't mean you'll go anywhere or accomplish anything.

 

 

That is still more than you can realistically hope to master in your lifetime if you live a normal western lifestyle.

 

Virtually everything else is just make believe.

Perhaps I should rephrase that, I believe that SOME systems have a grain of truth to them. Also, you never know what someone is capable of until they actually try. Maybe what I'm searching for is unrealistic, but I'm still not going to waste time with something that won't fully explain it's system.

[Thunder_Gooch]

 

I'm still waiting for you to back that statement

All you need is a functioning pair of eyeballs.

Edited February 16, 2014 by Thunder_Gooch

[C T]

Perhaps I should rephrase that, I believe that SOME systems have a grain of truth to them. Also, you never know what someone is capable of until they actually try. Maybe what I'm searching for is unrealistic, but I'm still not going to waste time with something that won't fully explain it's system.

that is wise.

[Thunder_Gooch]

waste time with something that won't fully explain it's system.

When you find something better let me know.

[Jetsun]

Power to do what, exactly?

 

If you get a chance, go for an eye-opening trip to places like Thailand, Malaysia, and Indonesia. You will see all kinds of weird and wonderful claims by professing shamans and so on. Some of their work will make you want to believe beyond any reasonable doubt.

 

One very open demo is when devotees of a certain religion pierce themselves with all kinds of stakes, spears etc and have hundreds of hooks embedded in their bodies, with chains attached, pulling chariots for miles to get from one place to another. Apparently anyone can do it, if they wish. Is this power? Of course, there are various other examples, like working with charms, black magic, exorcisms, and all that jazz. It can be very interesting to see all these things live.

 

By visiting these places, it will give you more scope to understand what demonstrations of power really mean. How the minds of people become drawn to such things, like a sort of mass hypnotic trance thing. If a large group of people can be swayed easily, imagine how little it takes to sway individuals.

 

John Chang seems to show some sort of electrical power which can be used for acupuncture type healing, whether that power of healing is much better than an electro acupuncture machine I don't know, but it is kinda interesting. Fakir type powers are interesting too. But none of which I think compares to the power of people like Amma and the Dalai Lama, but their sort of power even though it is obvious for everyone to see can't be measured properly so people don't think it exists because it can't be examined in a lab and quantified into a neat box.

[Thunder_Gooch]

 

John Chang seems to show some sort of electrical power

you forgot about..

 

 

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Efu4uctpgCM