Wells Posted February 16, 2014 (edited) ... Edited February 17, 2014 by Dorian Black Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
idiot_stimpy Posted February 16, 2014 Just when I thought the ultimate peak level of absurd world-views and mental confusion is already reached on ttb, I read several posts in this thread! Different paths, different people. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ChiDragon Posted February 17, 2014 (edited) I know meditation is extremely helpful and I do it everyday, but I'm not really seeing any progress with meditation. Yea I'm able to calm my mind, slow my breath almost to a stop, and remember some dreams, but that's it. I sometimes do horse stance and then my body automatically starts reverse breathing and my legs shake, but I'm still not noticing any differences. I'm curious to see what actually works for people. Please don't say mo pai because I researched this and can't find any reliable information past a certain level. Also the book(The Magus of Java) although a good read, seems exaggerated. Thanks for reading this post and if you have any advice/criticism, please input your thoughts. "Slow breath almost to a stop" is not the proper way to practice meditation. The proper way is to breathe slow and deep to the lower dan tian but you should never stop breathing. Thus you will see some physical changes in your body in few months. However, please don't expect to have some special power to heal someone yet. Edited February 17, 2014 by ChiDragon Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
silent thunder Posted February 17, 2014 I disagree. I've spent a fair amount of time sublimating breath and residing in the body without breath in a state of deep relaxation. Indeed, in this process, I can go many more heartbeats with lungs 90% empty as opposed to lungs full of breath and it's bliss. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
chegg Posted February 17, 2014 (edited) . Edited June 2, 2017 by chegg 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Captain Mar-Vell Posted February 17, 2014 (edited) ... Amen, brother Chegg. These people just don't know. As to meditation, there is no proper way. I second Silent Thunder. You don't need to breathe really. Ha ha ha! ... Edited February 17, 2014 by Captain Mar-Vell 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ChiDragon Posted February 17, 2014 (edited) I disagree. I've spent a fair amount of time sublimating breath and residing in the body without breath in a state of deep relaxation. Indeed, in this process, I can go many more heartbeats with lungs 90% empty as opposed to lungs full of breath and it's bliss. That is exactly what is happening but that is exactly what you don't want your heart to have more beats than it should. You want your heart to beat slower and stronger to circulate the oxygenated blood. So, your heart won't be overworked from beating faster. The ideal way for the heart to beat slower is by having more oxygen in the blood. So, the heart knows not to speed up to provide more oxygen to the body cells. The only way to provide more oxygen in the blood is by breathing more air into the lungs. Is that what you want to have many more heartbeats to overwork the heart....??? Edited February 17, 2014 by ChiDragon 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Captain Mar-Vell Posted February 17, 2014 (edited) ... True yogis know what they are doing.* Especially when they don't. I think, ChiDragon, the processes can be a little more complicated than you suggest. Obviously in these activities, where the breath slows and begins to still itself, the heart rate is much reduced. note to self: must overcome aversion to being offered (medical) advice. * I hope to God that doesn't fall into the category of "famous last words." ... Edited February 17, 2014 by Captain Mar-Vell Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Torus Posted February 17, 2014 (edited) It's very simple but there is a lot more to it than that. Then you look for a better system at that point, and continue meditation. At this point there is no better option I am aware of. Okay, thanks for your advice and criticism. I understand what you're saying but I'm still going to find something else. From what I've been reading, I need to be able to go into deep meditation states and must get better at that first, so before I even start practicing mo pai I have a long way to go. Probably a few years before I actually start attempting this training, so in the mean time I've found something pretty interesting to occupy my time. Anyways thanks for the insight, but I'm not ready for mo pai yet. Interesting things WILL happen! But the most interesting and stable thing isn't a particular ostentatious breakthrough. It's looking back and realising that you're sailing with a smile through things that used to make you hulk out. It's being able to remember, understand and do things that most people can't, faster than the few who can, because your mindfulness is such that you just get on with it. It's discovering that people respect you, ask your opinions, ask how you are so happy all the time... and still being humble. Aside from in the wake of occasional 'WOW' moments - which will happen, and blow your mind - you will only notice your progress by looking back. We always consider how we are now to be normal, but how we are may be truly incredible compared to the way we were. Haha thanks for the encouragement. People actually started asking why I'm so happy which I'm assuming is due to my recent meditation , I never noticed until this post. Power is locked behind a door that a search for power does not have the key to. The search for power can provide a lock pick, you can open the door but you can never be the master of this door, you can't open or close it at will if all you have is a lock pick. You can open it but then you're at the mercy of all the powers behind, some of which will be infinitely greater than you've bargained for and infinitely less obedient to your will than you hoped for. (I mean a generic you, not you personally.) The key to power was shown to me by the Mother of the Universe. The inscription on the key reads, "Do Not Abuse Power." Whoever has this key has unlimited power. If you haven't found it, you can't get power from a legitimate source, only from a breaking-and-entering, with the law (the law of the universe) on your ass. Not recommended. Look for the key. If you grasp that key, the door will open and close as you wish, power is your oyster. This is power the hard way, but power any other way is bogus and transient and never really yours. Alright thanks for your wise insight and great analogy. Worry not, I won't abuse any power I may attain. Hopefully I will find this key through meditation and self-mastery. If not, I'll simply destroy this door... just kidding Honestly, if you want power.....asking about it on TTB will do you no good. Most people here either tell you something like "You want power(s)?!? NO NO NO! You should cultivate compassion, kindness,love and a good heart!! All that other stuff is soooo not spiritual!"... I started meditation when I was in juvenile hall at 15 years old...I didn't gain any real abilities trying out MANY Qi Gong systems and Yoga meditations until I started investigating things on my own,piecing together whatever knowledge I could get from many ancient systems and practices...and finally, learning from a YOUNG shaman(shaman is not the correct term but it's what most westerners call them other than witch doctors) with great CONTROL over his abilities. So what does this have to do with your question? Well, to actually gain any abilities you must first gain awareness of your own energy and how it moves and functions inside of you. To do that, it requires getting into a deep meditation which means NO breath regulation or visualization (these things keep your brainwaves close to the alpha and beta ranges which obviously is not going to allow you to go deeper). Once in a trance/trance-like state (hypnagogic might be the proper term), the mind is quiet,with absolutely NO thoughts and you'll have enough clarity to really feel your energy working..you'll feel strong vibrations or what may be considered "strong" at this point at least. Another marker for being in this state is the ability to "see" through your eyelids! This is extremely common for those who actually make it to this state... But anyways, in that state is when all the training truly begins. Get to that state first THEN put your awareness on your LDT or Astral projection...etc.. This meditation is in SFQ btw, Chunyi Lin calls it "going into the Emptiness" I believe. It's also in Longmen Pai but called Yin Xian Fa. It is obviously called different names in different systems but that meditation is where it all truly begins! I've gotten to probably a lower version of that state only once when there were absolutely no thoughts, but only once (It's hard to reliably get into that state). Thanks for advice "Slow breath almost to a stop" is not the proper way to practice meditation. The proper way is to breathe slow and deep to the lower dan tian but you should never stop breathing. Thus you will see some physical changes in your body in few months. However, please don't expect to have some special power to heal someone yet. Haha okay, I know that stuff will take a long time, maybe not even in a few years. However, regarding meditation, I just don't focus on breathing at all, sometimes I'll notice it but other times, I forget I'm even breathing and just notice it slow down considerably. But I'm not gonna focus on the lower dan tian, at least not until I make some progress with other things Maybe a relevant quote....... Archimandrite Father Dionysios: "Repentance. Recognizing our mistakes and our sins, this is the highest thing that we can do. And not to recognize our sins in order to succeed at something else, but just to see the truth about ourselves. Saint Isaac, the great mystic of the Church, says that one who accepts, who understands, who recognizes his sin in front of the Lord, in reality, he is the highest. He is greater than one who has gained all the world, who feeds all the people, who makes miracles, who resurrects the dead. This man, the first one, is bigger because he can never fall down. He has a stability, a level, a place where he can talk to the Lord. He has a place where he can invite the Lord with his tears, with his repentance, with the understanding that he has done wrong. And straightaway he becomes clear. The light comes from him. He becomes a spiritual doctor, a teacher or father, because he’s not afraid to recognize sins. It is not a problem for him to say, “Excuse me, it was my fault.” This is the key to escape from all the drops of the devil." (source http://www.enlightennext.org/magazine/j34/dionysios.asp?page=2 ) Blessings of becoming greater ! :wub: :wub: :wub: :wub: Thanks for the quote, very inspiring. I'm actually focusing very heavily on realizing my mistakes, flaws, bad qualities, and transmuting them into something better. I respect most religions like Christianity, but that's still not my thing. Sorry I disagree. I've spent a fair amount of time sublimating breath and residing in the body without breath in a state of deep relaxation. Indeed, in this process, I can go many more heartbeats with lungs 90% empty as opposed to lungs full of breath and it's bliss. Woah, I don't even notice my heartbeat in meditation Edited February 17, 2014 by Torus Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Torus Posted February 17, 2014 Thanks everyone. I know not to be greedy, not to abuse anything, enjoy moments of life, not to crave power, etc; all fantastic advice from multiple sources. I have found an answer so thank you all 3 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Thunder_Gooch Posted February 17, 2014 (edited) That is exactly what is happening but that is exactly what you don't want your heart to have more beats than it should. You want your heart to beat slower and stronger to circulate the oxygenated blood. So, your heart won't be overworked from beating faster. The ideal way for the heart to beat slower is by having more oxygen in the blood. So, the heart knows not to speed up to provide more oxygen to the body cells. The only way to provide more oxygen in the blood is by breathing more air into the lungs. Is that what you want to have many more heartbeats to overwork the heart....??? I agree with Chidragon here. Heart rate will slow down to the point you would be declared dead by an EMT. You don't stop breathing or hold your breath at any point, it just slows down, way way way down. Edited February 17, 2014 by Thunder_Gooch 3 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Thunder_Gooch Posted February 17, 2014 (edited) I understand what you're saying but I'm still going to find something else. Best of luck, there is nothing else except lots of newage bs made up by silly hippies who live in their moms basement. but I'm not ready for mo pai yet. You can't not be ready for level one, it's as simple and as basic a meditation as you will ever find. Edited February 17, 2014 by Thunder_Gooch Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Green Tiger Posted February 17, 2014 Well, that's in Missouri in I wouldn't be able to travel there, but I'll make sure to research him, thanks. Believe it or not, they are actually flying commercial airplanes into and out of Springfield, Missouri. Granted, they don't always make it there on time. And if a storm happens to be rolling through, you might end up stuck in Chicago or Kansas City and then you'll have to drive a rental car the rest of the way. Still, people have done that and felt it was totally worth it for a weekend of high-level energetics. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Aeran Posted February 17, 2014 (edited) Best of luck, there is nothing else except lots of newage bs made up by silly hippies who live in their moms basement. Wait, are they hippies or nerds? You're mixing your stereotypes. Edited February 17, 2014 by Aeran Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Thunder_Gooch Posted February 17, 2014 Wait, are they hippies or nerds? You're mixing your stereotypes. Most of the occult/newage authors have never accomplished anything, still work a min wage job and have never amounted to anything other than writing books. At best it could serve as toilet paper or as kindling. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Thunder_Gooch Posted February 17, 2014 totally worth it for a weekend of high-level energetics. We have grossly different opinions of what makes something "high-level". Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Aeran Posted February 17, 2014 Most of the occult/newage authors have never accomplished anything, still work a min wage job and have never amounted to anything other than writing books. At best it could serve as toilet paper or as kindling. So while you were travelling the world investigating every single bioenergetic system out there, you also took the time to personally meet up with every occult/new age author as well? Damn dude, that's pretty impressive. 3 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Green Tiger Posted February 17, 2014 (edited) We have grossly different opinions of what makes something "high-level". Shouldn't you be meditating? Edited February 17, 2014 by Green Tiger 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Thunder_Gooch Posted February 17, 2014 So while you were travelling the world investigating every single bioenergetic system out there, you also took the time to personally meet up with every occult/new age author as well? Damn dude, that's pretty impressive. All of it is garbage that leads nowhere. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Thunder_Gooch Posted February 17, 2014 Did I ask you? Shouldn't you be meditating? I won't be meditating till May, as until then I have 60+ hour weeks lined up. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Green Tiger Posted February 17, 2014 I won't be meditating till May, as until then I have 60+ hour weeks lined up. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jetsun Posted February 17, 2014 All of it is garbage that leads nowhere. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Aeran Posted February 17, 2014 (edited) All of it is garbage that leads nowhere. Are you sure? These guys look pretty legit: http://www.thelivinglightfoundation.com John Chang might have been able to do some pretty cool stuff, but he couldn't perform crystal vortex activation or dragon magick! Edited February 17, 2014 by Aeran Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Thunder_Gooch Posted February 17, 2014 Are you sure? These guys look pretty legit: http://www.thelivinglightfoundation.com John Chang might have been able to do some pretty cool stuff, but he couldn't perform crystal vortex activation or dragon magick! Yes Aeran, I am more than sure. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Thunder_Gooch Posted February 17, 2014 You care enough to post animated gifs, about how much you don't care. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
