Owledge Posted February 21, 2014 Some call it coincidence. That word is now expelled from my vocab It has coin in it though, so it's not completely void of value. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Rara Posted February 21, 2014 It has coin in it though, so it's not completely void of value. Yeah. What I mean is that people use the word as a sort-of throw away term. It lacks significance and understanding. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Brian Posted February 21, 2014 My take... (Take it for what it's worth, which is even less than the "coin" in "coincidence.") First, reality is highly probabilistic. This becomes especially clear as scale decreases (the subatomic being the textbook case) but is true in the macroscopic everyday world, too. We tend in daily life to overlook this as many occurrences asymptotically approach probabilities of either zero or one. For instance, the probability that I will learn to fly tomorrow by tripping and being so distracted that I miss the ground is approximately zero, and the likelihood that the sun will still be in the sky tomorrow is approximately 100%. But many things fall into the middle somewhere, like the odds of a flipped coin being heads or tails, or the odds of winning the lottery. There are also things for which data can be collected and statistics can be calculated but from which little can be said about future results. For instance, the historical average for a randomly person completing a randomly selected crossword puzzle can be calculated but that is of little value for predicting the outcome of the next case -- perhaps the puzzle will be in the wrong language or the person knows nothing of the works of Tennyson or simply can't remember at the particular moment a three-letter flightless bird. Additionally, we know experientially that we affect our environments, and it is a fundamental principle of physics that the observer influences the observation. So, now I'll just make up some numbers to illustrate a point -- feel free to shift the decimal point or otherwise season to taste... I believe that, let's say, 99.9something% of seeming coincidences are merely probabilistic fluctuations. I believe further that the remaining fraction of a percent is influenced by an individual and/or by <Tao/God/Light/ThatWhichIs/Whatever>. A step further, I believe that awareness and practice strengthen this so that the occurrences increase, perhaps to 99.something% for a dabbler/beginner and to 9something.something% for an adept. Universe is still highly probabilistic but orders of magnitude less so for some people than for others. Secondly, I believe that there are three varieties of these occurrences -- those which are just random probabilistic fluctuations, those which are the Light trying to get your attention (these are the ones which show up over and over) and those which are the Light opening a door. This last category is the one I am personally seeing more often recently -- opportunities for me to make a portentous choice, to choose a path made available to me. 3 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Rara Posted February 21, 2014 (edited) My take... (Take it for what it's worth, which is even less than the "coin" in "coincidence.") First, reality is highly probabilistic. This becomes especially clear as scale decreases (the subatomic being the textbook case) but is true in the macroscopic everyday world, too. We tend in daily life to overlook this as many occurrences asymptotically approach probabilities of either zero or one. For instance, the probability that I will learn to fly tomorrow by tripping and being so distracted that I miss the ground is approximately zero, and the likelihood that the sun will still be in the sky tomorrow is approximately 100%. But many things fall into the middle somewhere, like the odds of a flipped coin being heads or tails, or the odds of winning the lottery. There are also things for which data can be collected and statistics can be calculated but from which little can be said about future results. For instance, the historical average for a randomly person completing a randomly selected crossword puzzle can be calculated but that is of little value for predicting the outcome of the next case -- perhaps the puzzle will be in the wrong language or the person knows nothing of the works of Tennyson or simply can't remember at the particular moment a three-letter flightless bird. Additionally, we know experientially that we affect our environments, and it is a fundamental principle of physics that the observer influences the observation. So, now I'll just make up some numbers to illustrate a point -- feel free to shift the decimal point or otherwise season to taste... I believe that, let's say, 99.9something% of seeming coincidences are merely probabilistic fluctuations. I believe further that the remaining fraction of a percent is influenced by an individual and/or by <Tao/God/Light/ThatWhichIs/Whatever>. A step further, I believe that awareness and practice strengthen this so that the occurrences increase, perhaps to 99.something% for a dabbler/beginner and to 9something.something% for an adept. Universe is still highly probabilistic but orders of magnitude less so for some people than for others. Secondly, I believe that there are three varieties of these occurrences -- those which are just random probabilistic fluctuations, those which are the Light trying to get your attention (these are the ones which show up over and over) and those which are the Light opening a door. This last category is the one I am personally seeing more often recently -- opportunities for me to make a portentous choice, to choose a path made available to me. Interesting take. But it seems like too many variables to me...and you seem fond of the term "random" You mention the god-like intervention being a small percentage but I would say no. In this case, surely everything is happening as part of a mathematical formula. So the term "coincidence" being another word for random, freakish event where something has come up in short succession of a previous event of a similar nature. TM's example counters this. Nothing here seemed random at all...just everything working like clockwork. Some may call it a coincidence and then some synics can criticise this by finding numerous non-coincidental things in life. For me, those stuck in the coincidence vs non coincidence debate are both of the same coin in itself! But those understanding, or beginning to understand synchronicity or ganying would feel that everything is, not so much happening for a reason, but happening due to patterns. What do you reckon? Edited February 21, 2014 by Rara 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ChiForce Posted February 21, 2014 One problem I have with the way we have been describing synchronicity is the "meaning" part. It seems that to categorize the events or sequent of events as synchronicity, we have to prescribe conscious meaning to them. This can be anything from some crazy Christians claiming God is everywhere, to some self serving meaning for a particular individual. What makes these sequence of events accusal? Our lack of models to explain them because they are normally not so apparent. Another example I have is the ticking sound I often hear during meditation. It is a well known reported meditation phenomena. Why? It happens 90% of the time but I have yet read anything to explain it. I read about some reference to having your heart chakra opened. Synchronicity is still events based on a different model of causality chain which we aren't aware of. It gets complicated when synchronicity is taking place within our society. As we all know, social norms and habits and customs are more or less not natural. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Brian Posted February 21, 2014 (edited) I may well be wrong, Rara, but I don't buy the "everything happens for a reason" viewpoint because this requires every event for every particle in the universe for the entire (and possibly infinite) history of the universe to have been carefully orchestrated such that the next future event for every particle in the universe is entirely predetermined, and I think this flies in the face of reason and scientific understanding. Instead, I think there are threads of influence which weave through that which is, ephemeral chords which resonate at particular frequencies, and specific patterns which briefly manifest and then dissipate. Edited February 21, 2014 by Brian 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Captain Mar-Vell Posted February 21, 2014 (edited) ... People have the false idea of a single causal event being solely responsible for a single effect. For many events, clearly a combination of causes is necessary: a variety of necessary causes, sufficient causes, contributory causes, whatever the case is. So it is more complicated. There is no chain. But there is a multidimensional web/lattice of probabilitistic nature. All is fractal self reflection in infinite variety. The correspondences are there for those with the eyes to see. But the subjective aspect cannot be removed. The consciousness of the subject, when following a certain stream, will encounter events that are very strongly laden with symbolic meaning. Recall that the world itself is a vast array of living symbols which reflects your own conscious state. I'm struggling to find words here, sorry. ... Edited February 21, 2014 by Captain Mar-Vell 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Rara Posted February 21, 2014 (edited) @Brian Yes, in fact, I tried to put over that there was no reason. Just patterns. It happens because it does...no one orchestrates it. I find it hard to put into words...but the best way I can think of is this. "I Have to exist right now. Me typing this HAS to happen" Can you imagine a world with me not existing/typing that? Yes, but it is only imagination. The fact still remains that I DO exist and DID just type that. Where did that option go to make a decision? I'm not saying that fate made me do it...but at the same time I'm on the Tao Bums writing stuff. I wouldn't say I'm here for a reason. But I would say I am here...because I slot in here right now. Just a jigsaw. I hope I'm making sense with my "supposed words"! Edited February 21, 2014 by Rara 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Rara Posted February 21, 2014 I'm struggling to find words here, sorry. ... Haha, I'm with you on that! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Brian Posted February 21, 2014 My contribution to this thread years ago would have been a probabilistic dissertation, starting with the quote Feynman used to start his chapter on the topic: “The true logic of this world is in the calculus of probabilities.” —James Clerk Maxwell A chapter well worth reading, BTW (http://www.feynmanlectures.info/docroot/I_06.html) Over time, that knowledge has been deburred (perhaps debrided?) by experience and, more recently, by exposure to the Light. I now recognize chance, free-will and influence as each shaping the cosmic theater -- part improv, part existential dark comedy, part passion play... 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Captain Mar-Vell Posted February 21, 2014 ... Jigsaw pieces is a great analogy. A puzzle. Is the following relevant, I almost put it in that thread on luck; http://halcyonhierophant.blogspot.co.uk/2012/12/29-nine-lives.html ... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Captain Mar-Vell Posted February 21, 2014 ... Over time, that knowledge has been deburred (perhaps debrided?) by experience and, more recently, by exposure to the Light. I now recognize chance, free-will and influence as each shaping the cosmic theater -- part improv, part existential dark comedy, part passion play... Great. That really made me smile. Actually some syncs are beyond cosmic lattice correspondence type meaning. They really appear orchestrated by a "higher intelligence." It's a grand tale, my friends. Full of sound and fury, maybe, but signifying everything. Maybe I should go meditate on this. Or I could give an account of some of my own most mysterious synchs... ... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Rara Posted February 21, 2014 ... Jigsaw pieces is a great analogy. A puzzle. Is the following relevant, I almost put it in that thread on luck; http://halcyonhierophant.blogspot.co.uk/2012/12/29-nine-lives.html ... Did a Yorkshire man write that?? I would say everything is relevant at this point. We've now got to the stage of The Phenomenon of Stuff Happening, Generally! But luck...some people get lucky a lot. Others not at all. The latter takes me back to my first post in this thread: Those that are simply switched off to it all. Aka, those who are not moving with the flow of their own natute. Aka the Tao. Ok I must get off the forum for a bit. That's my brain juice gone for the day! 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Captain Mar-Vell Posted February 22, 2014 (edited) ... Nice story, rainbowvein! Rara, I hail from the north west rather than the north east. The real reason for the structure of line 9 is to make it scan with eight beats (sounding out "the" would add two extra beats). Or maybe I was just channelling Heathcliff. Before I forget, just one coinkydink from the countless catalogue that I am bedeviled with. On 17/02/14 I posted this; http://thetaobums.com/topic/931-what-are-you-listening-to/page-201#entry524827 Time to Crank Up the Wish Bone Ash. The following day, I receive in the post, a flyer from the Fairfield Halls in Croydon advertising a Wishbone Ash gig. Never before had I received a gig flyer in the post from anywhere. I was astonished to find out that Wishbone Ash were still touring. Coincidentally, The Fairfield Halls is where I swear to God I received some sort of spiritual transmission from Jon Anderson when he and Rick Wakeman played the Living Tree tour there. Anyone want to go see Wishbone Ash in Croydon? ... Edited April 29, 2014 by Captain Mar-Vell 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Owledge Posted February 22, 2014 (edited) BTW Taomeow, funny that you mentioned a Vietnam-related story one day before the TV show I'm watching deals with a Vietnam theme. I only realized that now. ... It's even touching the whole interrelated-events thing. Edited February 22, 2014 by Owledge Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Taomeow Posted February 22, 2014 BTW Taomeow, funny that you mentioned a Vietnam-related story one day before the TV show I'm watching deals with a Vietnam theme. I only realized that now. ... It's even touching the whole interrelated-events thing. Not uncommon. Ganying never happens once -- just like a musical chord (which on a certain level it is) has the "call and "response" in a musical piece, and the response is usually followed by a related call, and this one, by a related response, and so on, till the piece is done. That's what's behind the phenomenon the attuned describe so often -- to wit, if you start noticing it, "it starts happening more" -- well not really, it's always happening as much as it's always happening (always and nonstop), it's just that you start noticing more of it happening. It's like discerning a melody in the background of white noise, and then being able to hear the continuation, just because you've noticed -- resonated -- with this particular harmony. You have a chance to hear the rest once you've heard anything. Most of the time, however, people don't unplug their mind's ear long enough to keep following the melody. The whole world appears noisy rather than put together of related calls and responses only because so many pieces of music of so many different styles go on simultaneously. (some of them very tricky, very hard to harmonize.) Ganying is much easier to notice when you live in nature. Seemingly unrelated things that are really connected spell themselves out to you enough times for even the unobservant to start making connections. Birds flying low mean a high probability of rain, a hazy ring around the moon means a high probability of windy, crisply cold weather, more boys than girls being born to the villagers mean a war is coming, not next Tuesday perhaps but most definitely sometime in the next twenty years... and so on. We are too busy and chronically distracted to notice the whole sequences. But there's something about noticing even parts of them... some, as Brian put it, tingle all over the body. Ganying is perceived on many levels, some of them physical, and occasionally intense. Like the faint call of the flute responded to by the great drum, ganying can suddenly grow rather than fade out. That's what's behind the "butterfly effect..." 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Rara Posted February 22, 2014 On the subject of luck, don't forget the "farmer's son" story. Highlighting that luck is situational. http://www.rainbowbody.com/newarticles/farmerson.htm Memories! I first heard this 3 or 4 years ago. Do you happen to know its origins? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Rara Posted February 22, 2014 ... Nice story, rainbowvein! Rara, I hail from the north west (Ellesmere Port) rather than the north east. The real reason for the structure of line 9 is to make it scan with eight beats (sounding out "the" would add two extra beats). Or maybe I was just channelling Heathcliff. Before I forget, just one coinkydink from the countless catalogue that I am bedeviled with. On 17/02/14 I posted this; http://thetaobums.com/topic/931-what-are-you-listening-to/page-201#entry524827 Time to Crank Up the Wish Bone Ash. The following day, I receive in the post, a flyer from the Fairfield Halls in Croydon advertising a Wishbone Ash gig. Never before had I received a gig flyer in the post from anywhere. I was astonished to find out that Wishbone Ash were still touring. Coincidentally, The Fairfield Halls is where I swear to God I received some sort of spiritual transmission from Jon Anderson when he and Rick Wakeman played the Living Tree tour there. Anyone want to go see Wishbone Ash in Croydon? ... More memories! I grew up in Bromley, so went to Croydon a lot! I don't know the musician you mentioned though! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Captain Mar-Vell Posted February 22, 2014 (edited) ... Taomeow, you adept fer sure. You da best. By the way, I often get the impression I have a strange effect on the world around me. My synchs may not be spoken of, They are not spoken of enough. In truth, I speak of nothing else. Their sound be that of ringing bells. So, what the hell exactly is going on, taomeow? might edit soonish ... Edited February 22, 2014 by Captain Mar-Vell 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Captain Mar-Vell Posted February 22, 2014 (edited) ... More memories! I grew up in Bromley, so went to Croydon a lot! I don't know the musician you mentioned though! Well fancy that. I like you Rara! I hope you are listening to Argus, it's a great album. Jon Anderson, though, he some sort of saint of prog rock. As a matter of fact, I might never forgive Squire. I'm talking about Yes, possibly the greatest band in history. But Jon and Rick did this amazing album together too, and toured it right into Croydon. The Living Tree. Yggdrasil. Staff of Life. Wake Man and a Sun. ... Edited February 22, 2014 by Captain Mar-Vell 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Nungali Posted February 22, 2014 What ? Whishbone Ash ? I had their albums in my early 20's and they are STILL be listened too .... I saw them in Sydney in 1975 !!! . Ohhh, I see: " WISHBONE ASH. Celebrating 40 years of continuous road performances and recording, " Now thats impressive ! 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Taomeow Posted February 23, 2014 ... Taomeow, you adept fer sure. You da best. By the way, I often get the impression I have a strange effect on the world around me. My synchs may not be spoken of, They are not spoken of enough. In truth, I speak of nothing else. Their sound be that of ringing bells. So, what the hell exactly is going on, taomeow? might edit soonish ... Thank you for your kind words. What exactly is going on? Tao gives birth to one, one gives birth to two, two give birth to three, three give birth to ten thousand things. Ten thousand things, all having common parentage. Each of them will resonate with every "relative" it meets down the road. Like this: 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Rara Posted February 23, 2014 I like you Rara! I hope you are listening to Argus, it's a great album. ... Yup. Got it! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
HoldorFold Posted February 24, 2014 (edited) From some guy's mushroom trip: "I had an exceedingly clear awareness. I am seeing this all Happen before my eyes. The most unquestionable convincing presentation, it was all one SYNCHORNICITY. Every object, every action, every thought, every living being anywhere, now, throughout all of history, every weather pattern, rock falling from a cliff, a random guy in New York asking for a bratwurst, comment from a cashier. Every occurrence is accounted for. It is all SYNCHRONICITY." Source: https://www.erowid.org/experiences/exp.php?ID=52679 Edited February 24, 2014 by HoldorFold 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Brian Posted February 24, 2014 From some guy's mushroom trip: "I had an exceedingly clear awareness. I am seeing this all Happen before my eyes. The most unquestionable convincing presentation, it was all one SYNCHORNICITY. Every object, every action, every thought, every living being anywhere, now, throughout all of history, every weather pattern, rock falling from a cliff, a random guy in New York asking for a bratwurst, comment from a cashier. Every occurrence is accounted for. It is all SYNCHRONICITY." Source: https://www.erowid.org/experiences/exp.php?ID=52679 That wasn't me... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
