cultivation paranoia

[Thus-gone]

Hi everyone,

 

I am doing some very simple cultivation (just standing in wuji) and it is going really well.

 

But I have a little paranoia that always gets in the way of my motivation. It goes something like this: if I cultivate to the point where sensing and moving chi is pretty easy, wouldn't it be pretty easy to inadvertently hurt myself with it?

 

For example: do you ever feel the strange temptation when you're near a sharp knife to cut yourself or do something crazy with it? Not in a serious way, but just as a passing thought? Well, what if the same thing happened with your own chi - like thinking randomly, "what would happen if I shot all of this stuff directly into my brain?" And then inadvertently doing so just because you had the thought?

 

Or does it take an extended period of real intention to do damage to yourself, like doing a practice incorrectly over some period of time?

 

I hope this is clear; it's definitely bugging me!

 

Thank you all,

 

tg

[Aetherous]

You sense correctly...that when you have cultivated your qi, what your mind does moves the qi and this impacts your being. If you have a teacher, they will stress thinking about higher things and not being taken by stuff like hatred. Easier said than done. What you think and feel will have an effect on you and your life...more so after doing spiritual practices. Most people don't practice anything, and thus don't feel the effects of what they do and think.

Also, if you're worried about losing control of your actions, just slow down in your life. Don't rush through doing things. It's important to be able to control yourself.

[z00se]

I dunno, it sounds more like paranoia to me. Do you want to move the chi in a way that will hurt yourself? If so you will do it. If you want to feel good you will do it too. If you persist and keep doing something to make yourself feel like you don't want to feel it will do some bad. If you persist and drill yourself into the ground keep making yourself feel what you don't want to feel like, it will probably manifest as an illness on some physical level. You have the opportunity to make yourself feel good and there is some lee-way to make mistakes. Just be aware and watch yourself. It can be all pleasent.

 

Power of the mind, if you are unsure you are unsure for a reason. Be sure. That is quick to change

[liminal_luke]

Thus-Gone,

 

I think the kind of temptation you are talking about is very common. One of my best friends is afraid to walk across bridges because there's this part of him that fears he'd throw himself off and plummet to his death. The fact is, of course, that he'd do no such thing. It's just that so many of us have this pesky subpersonality (s) that would like to sabotage our conscious efforts.

 

My advice is not to let that part of yourself derail your practice. If you activate your chi strongly enough to hurt yourself then you've activated your chi strongly enough to heal yourself. You might work with that part of yourself, establish a dialogue. When it comes up say hi and be curious. Say something like "oh yeah, there you are again this part of me that wants to hurt myself...how ya doin? " That part exists whether or not you do your practice, might as well find out what it needs.

 

My two cents.

 

Liminal

Edited March 21, 2014 by liminal_luke

[SonOfTheGods]

For example: do you ever feel the strange temptation when you're near a sharp knife to cut yourself or do something crazy with it? Not in a serious way, but just as a passing thought?

You may have some underlying mental or personality issues.

 

Chi Gong is not recommended, as it can exacerbate it.

 

It seems your "inner voice" is already warning you of this.

 

Listen to it.

 

Even your name "Thus-Gone" seems like a subconscious heads up.

Edited March 21, 2014 by SonOfTheGods

[Thus-gone]

You may have some underlying mental or personality issues.

 

Chi Gong is not recommended, as it can exacerbate it.

 

It seems your "inner voice" is already warning you of this.

 

Listen to it.

 

Even your name "Thus-Gone" seems like a subconscious heads up.

 

No, I don't think chi kung will exacerbate minor neuroses - if it did, it would be useless.

 

"Thus-gone" is a translation of the word Tathagata, which I think is a very interesting word.

 

It seems you missed the point of my original post.

[SonOfTheGods]

do you ever feel the strange temptation when you're near a sharp knife to cut yourself or do something crazy with it?

Is that "minor"

minor neuroses

 

 

It seems you missed the point of my original post.

 

In your case, I'm glad I missed "your point"

 

Remember, you started the thread -asking us, basically if it is ok -for you to think that way.

Edited March 21, 2014 by SonOfTheGods

[Boy]

...

Edited April 6, 2014 by Boy

[SonOfTheGods]

No. You are thinking of hurting yourself. That is not good. Don't be a fucking idiot.

.

Edited March 21, 2014 by SonOfTheGods

[liminal_luke]

At the risk of outing myself as a suicidal madman, I think the impulse Thus-Gone refers to is exceedingly common. Many of us, myself included, house a self-destructive little imp beneath an otherwise placid psychic surface. And sometimes that little imp rises to the surface and asks us to do harmful things to ourselves or others.

 

What separates (I hope) people like myself, and perhaps Thus-Gone, from the ranks of the truly deranged, is that we don't ultimately listen to that impish urge. The thought "why not cut myself with the knife," remains just that: a thought.

 

That's not to say that such an imp doesn't imply pathology of some sort. Certainly it's something worthy of our examination and curiosity. Perhaps a sign that all is not right under the hood. Fair enough. What it doesn't indicate, in and of itself, is a propensity to actual violence.

[SonOfTheGods]

At the risk of outing myself as a suicidal madman, I think the impulse Thus-Gone refers to is exceedingly common. Many of us, myself included, house a self-destructive little imp beneath an otherwise placid psychic surface. And sometimes that little imp rises to the surface and asks us to do harmful things to ourselves or others.

 

What separates (I hope) people like myself, and perhaps Thus-Gone, from the ranks of the truly deranged, is that we don't ultimately listen to that impish urge. The thought "why not cut myself with the knife," remains just that: a thought.

 

That's not to say that such an imp doesn't imply pathology of some sort. Certainly it's something worthy of our examination and curiosity. Perhaps a sign that all is not right under the hood. Fair enough. What it doesn't indicate, in and of itself, is a propensity to actual violence.

Fair enough.

 

I know qi psychosis is real- and read many disclaimers, warnings etc about people who might suffer from mental disorders to avoid such practices.

 

In good conscience, I won't tell the OP- "sure- go for it" if the OP's whole point of the thread is for others to give him permission to carry on.

 

I always warn others- you CAN NOT TURN OFF KUNDALINI --etc

Edited March 22, 2014 by SonOfTheGods

[Boy]

...

Edited April 6, 2014 by Boy

[NotVoid]

Thus-gone, I think I understand what you mean. No, when you are practicing you should not cause harm to yourself if you have a sudden odd thought of say "shooting your qi up to your brain'. If you are standing in the wuji stance, keep it as natural and relaxed as you can. Just like, say, as you would stand if you are relaxing and standing outside looking at the trees and birds and nature or whatever. When you are relaxed and natural your mind should start to become more relaxed and balanced and calm. However, all that aside, it is not that easy to develop qigong skill to a degree that you can so easily shoot a blast of qi to your brain just because such a thought happened to pass through your mind, and it really doesn't work that way anyway.

 

To really move qi in a significant way involves developing a special type of mind 'intention' which generally takes a long time to develop to a degree you are talking about, and just some passing random silly thought realistically is not going to cause any issues. The connection between mind intention and qi simply does not work the way you are thinking. Just practice relaxed and natural and you should be fine.

 

Where people put themselves at risk of causing them self some real issues with qigong, is where people are trying to intentionally control 'qi flow', and when people start doing very intentional or unnatural breathing methods and that sort of thing without really knowing what they are doing. It is always best to learn under the guidance of an experienced teacher if you can, even if it means just attending the occasional workshop with a teacher.

Edited March 22, 2014 by NotVoid

[liminal_luke]

@boy....

 

If by "take control" you are referring to gathering up the fragmented pieces of my being and integrating things so that everything works as a unified whole with my conscious self at the helm--if that's what you mean-- then I'm all for it. In fact, that's a pretty good summation of my motivation for my taobumming.

 

Of course, it's a process. No shame in not being there yet. In fact, I'm pretty darn proud to know where I'm going and have a good working plan for getting there.

 

Impish thoughts notwithstanding, I'm not a violent person. Not in any kind of sense that would interest the police or a triage nurse at the local psychiatric emergency ward. If you think otherwise, all I can say is that you're wrong.

 

Liminal

[thelerner]

I've felt the same way as ThusGone. Paranoia, its a danger when doing esoteric energy arts. The great teacher Glenn Morris made his students do the Secret Smile exercise before practicing. He always said energy runs best through a happy system. That was very important and potent part of his (and the KAP) system.

 

Modern life, especially modern news is devastating to the sensitive soul. Taking a news fast, no reading or listening to the news; often a potent concentration of all the worst going on in the world, can be a cleansing as a food fast. Some people are toxic too or just bad combinations.

 

In any case, if the thought of misusing chi bothers you, then change your practice. Nothing wrong with 'just' sitting or standing. Its been a main stay practice for 1,000's of years. Stay away from the manipulation stuff until you're totally at peace with it.

[Boy]

...

Edited April 6, 2014 by Boy

[HoldorFold]

OP, yes this can be an issue. For every bit of energy cultivation/work you do, you should probably sit in silence/emptiness for at least 3x the amount of time. That's what I would have told myself if I could go back in time.

Increasing the power of an uncontrolled mind can be asking for trouble. Imagine if your thoughts/energy started effecting people more powerfully and you were desperately not trying to "think of a pink elephant" all the time. Pure hell. Been there.

Edited March 22, 2014 by HoldorFold

[RiverSnake]

One of the great things I have found in working in the western tradition with Pathworking.....is that they take the time to address the personality and imbalances early on rather than just throwing chi at it and letting it dissolve with long term cultivation.

 

Also a big bump to Aetherous's post. Controlling your thoughts and emotions is very important especially as you grow in personal power. Developing a strong and unshakeable sense of equanimity/rooted-ness no matter what life throws at you is key.

 

My 2 cents, Peace

Edited March 22, 2014 by OldChi

[Mike]

Thus-gone, I know exactly what you mean! I have sometimes felt this way.

 

It sometimes happens to me when I am standing near a ledge on a high place, I think to myself, what if I jumped? And I see myself doing it and then back off.

 

Or I'm ironing my shirt and think:" what if I just put my hands on the iron and burned myself?".

 

Or I have a warm cup of beverage in my hand and think "what if I just threw this into my boss' face?"

 

Ofcourse these are just thoughts and I wouldn't seriously do such things.

 

I'm no expert, and I have personally wondered about this same question before you've just asked.

 

But the thoughts with the chi you mentioned does sound like paranoia. When you feel like you can't control yourself, its best not to resist, you will just make it harder for yourself. Instead feel as if your chi is the river, let the river flow and it will go where it should. But concentrate what you are feeling as well, because it sounds like you are feeling fear. It is this that you must fight.

 

In the end even if you mistakenly caused your chi to behave in a menacing way this is because your mind is interfering with the flow. Once you just let go and forget about it, the chi would probably go back to behaving the way its should be (like the river) flowing in a manner that is most beneficial for you.

 

Also, its good to make a habit and finish your practices by storing the chi in the sea of chi (navel area).

Edited March 22, 2014 by Mike

[Spotless]

To the original poster (OP):

 

Do more than just standing - do a series of postures.

This paranoia is not something to entertain - it is not you - it is part of incorrect thinking - just as hate is - just as judgment is.

 

In a daily practice of Qi Gong or Yoga or many ancient forms, you will move energy into areas you have isolated yourself from and you will connect anew those areas you hide in to the great flows of earth and cosmic energies. You will not do this consciously and do not try - these pages are filled with willful stories of premature strain and effort.

 

TheLearner was giving excellent advice - take a break from the news feeds of misery in everyday headlines - this is food - incorrect food.

 

The paranoia is the voice of some small closeted mechanism - bring it to light and it evaporates. No effort is required.

It is a requirement to have no effort.

 

In all of this diet is a simple but key balancer - diet is not just food and drink, but the media you eat, the air you breath, the vibrations you subject yourself to. As your energy increases (often exponentially) notice where you vent it - paranoia is a vent to the future (it is not of the now) it is dysfunctional thinking.

 

Functional thinking is more along the lines of: My body is speaking to me and telling me some of the energy work I am doing is way over my head - my body is not comfortable with the person in the drivers seat - perhaps I should listen to my intuition and pace myself along with my body and grow this voice of intuition instead of overriding it like the whole world teaches us to do in order to arrive nowhere as soon as possible.

 

Bring energy to all parts of your body being and your light will shine through this doubt.

Edited March 22, 2014 by Spotless

[Thus-gone]

Thanks everyone! This is all very helpful.

[thelerner]

If you grew up with a TV you watched countless acts of extreme violence and its only gotten worse and more graphic these days. I've read there's a part of the subconscious that takes everything literally. So beware of what you watch and what you focus on.

 

We may all be more Pavlovian then we think. Cleansing rituals are good to have. Whether formal or mindfully drinking tea from a nice cup. I like to do Rawn Clarks Archaeous exercises which contain a bit where you drain off negative emotions. I haven't done it lately and there is probably an accumulation of negativity that happens unless you clear yourself every now and then.

[joeblast]

Issue of verbiage, Qigong is quite a vast category.

 

This is why the fundamentals of stillness and movement, of focused awareness, of mindful breath, action, and non furtherance of arising thought are very important.

 

Work with these before doing more advanced energy practices, and you've already "upgraded the wiring" to be able to handle it. Does your have have old 1940s wiring that has two wires encased in paper, with rotting plastic around it? Or is the wiring some good romex that has the 3rd grounding wire and can handle it if you fire 20 amps across the medium?

[JohnC]

To chime in,

 

Don't sweat it, you'll be fine. Standing practice can only help.

 

If you were develop to that point, you'd have developed to the degree that you would also understand your energy so you would know what not to do. Aka with power comes understanding as you practice.

 

Your going to spend a time shedding and releasing sick chi.

 

So enjoy, and relax.

 

John