Icedude Posted March 21, 2014 How to become a taoist master: - Watch Karate Kid and The Empire Strikes Back. - Want to sound profound like Mr. Miyagi and Yoda, because you want to be respected for everything you say. If the Dalai Lama can just sit around and sound like Yoda, then that's the easiest job in the world. - Read a bit about taoism and Wu Wei. - Learn that everything you do is already part of the Tao, so that must mean that you're already spiritual. Anger, hate, discrimination, people crying when you beat them up, all part of the Tao, so you can't really be not part of the Tao. - Learn that as the Tao is unnamable and indescribable, nobody else can tell you what Tao is and isn't, because that puts them at fault. - Practice responding that everything people encounter is part of the Tao. That makes you sound really profound and wise. - Learn that everything has a buddha nature, so that must mean that you're a buddha. You just have to believe it. - Learn that zen teachers can beat students with enlightening sticks, and the student will just be grateful and enlightened for it. That must mean that you can go around and enlighten all your enemies with your enlightening stick, conveniently in the shape of a bat. It's a natural thing and part of your spiritual way. - Learn that Wu Wei is about everything working out automatically, without you really having to lift a finger for it. You just have to reach for that Cola without getting out of your chair, and sooner or later some friend-servant will get annoyed enough to hand it to you: You're a wu wei master! - Learn that if you call sitting for long periods of time "meditation", people will think you're awesome for doing nothing. (Of course I'm not serious! *whacks repeatedly with enlightenment stick like Yoda.*) 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
king Posted March 21, 2014 Dude seriously, don't post such things in the Taoist Discussion nor the General Discussion! It's not that comedy is not allowed here, but there is a place for such posts and it's called "Off Topic". You are only spamming that way. Unless you want to become more "popular" than MPG, then keep on doing what you're doing... 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Icedude Posted March 21, 2014 (edited) Dude seriously, don't post such things in the Taoist Discussion nor the General Discussion! It's not that comedy is not allowed here, but there is a place for such posts and it's called "Off Topic". You are only spamming that way. Unless you want to become more "popular" than MPG, then keep on doing what you're doing... Presenting taoism in a comedic and lighthearted way isn't allowed, because then it's no longer taoism? Mind blown. Edit: Also, let me add that I will never view this site as a popularity contest, so socially bullying me into compliance will not work. Don't even try. Edited March 21, 2014 by Icedude 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
king Posted March 21, 2014 Presenting taoism in a comedic and lighthearted way isn't allowed, because then it's no longer taoism? Mind blown. You can't just "act" enlightened and say this is Taoism, it's more complex than that. And you are not presenting Taoism in any way, you are just looking for laughs. Please, stop... Aah, I see! You really want to become more "popular". Ok then, I better let you do your work. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Icedude Posted March 21, 2014 (edited) You can't just "act" enlightened and say this is Taoism, it's more complex than that. And you are not presenting Taoism in any way, you are just looking for laughs. Please, stop... Aah, I see! You really want to become more "popular". Ok then, I better let you do your work. Taoism came from a librarian resigning from Confucius, because he didn't agree with him. Taoism then became a contrast to confucianism - a sort of spiritual and ethical anarchy that renounced virtues as being unnatural. This means that while taoism is complex and mysterious, and tao encompasses everything including Confucius, taoism means a deeper understanding than just not being philosophic and calling it spiritual. Am I "looking for laughs"? Yes, I am. I am often presenting what I say in a humorous way. Why does that bother you? Joy and laughter is meant to break down conceptions of virtues. It is a very healthy thing to be able to laugh at everything, including oneself. I am also apalled over you thinking that this is a popularity contest where people have to socially comply to be appreciated personally. I know that that's how many forums operate on the internet, but I simply don't care. I am here for the dharma. I'm not here to meet people, especially not at the *cost* of dharma. I agree that it's not funny when somebody seems to mock you personally, but I don't mean to be cruel with this topic. I felt a need to adress this stance to taoism, and there's really no super-kind way to do it in that everybody is okay with. I'm sorry, but you needed to know this. Edited March 21, 2014 by Icedude 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Marblehead Posted March 21, 2014 (edited) (Of course I'm not serious! *whacks repeatedly with enlightenment stick like Yoda.*) Yeah, but it was still cute. And then I must add that King's points are valid. Edited March 21, 2014 by Marblehead Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Icedude Posted March 21, 2014 And then I must add that King's points are valid. If I get banned for being impopular, from this temple of immeasurable wisdom, then I will surely die, and my dharma with me. It would be like losing a part of my soul. I must strive to think and feel like the post count dictates, so that I can be one with the tao. ...or I can just hold up the cut off finger of a little boy apprentice. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Marblehead Posted March 21, 2014 Dear Icedude, Please don't bother yourself with such thoughts. Our moderation team is not that cold-hearted. The worst that could happen is that this thread would be moved to either "General" or "Off Topic" subforum. Your recommendations in your opening post are not much different from some other suggestions that have been made in earnest. That is why I thought it was cute. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Icedude Posted March 21, 2014 Dear Icedude, Please don't bother yourself with such thoughts. Our moderation team is not that cold-hearted. The worst that could happen is that this thread would be moved to either "General" or "Off Topic" subforum. Your recommendations in your opening post are not much different from some other suggestions that have been made in earnest. That is why I thought it was cute. While this topic mentions zen and buddhism, it focuses primarily on taoism, and describes follies - absolutely not recommendations - that people make while learning about taoism.Thus it belongs in the taoism subforum. People who learn buddhism typically learn it out of kindness, while people who mislearn taoism typically mislearn it out of laziness. They're out looking to make excuses for themselves, or build up a superficial spirituality. They're not out looking to understand something - only to justify themselves. It's only taoists that I wanted to adress. I don't know if the topic concerns any taoists in *this forum*, but it's worth pointing out. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Marblehead Posted March 21, 2014 I have no problem or disagreement with that response. There is truth in it. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Rara Posted March 21, 2014 While this topic mentions zen and buddhism, it focuses primarily on taoism, and describes follies - absolutely not recommendations - that people make while learning about taoism.Thus it belongs in the taoism subforum. People who learn buddhism typically learn it out of kindness, while people who mislearn taoism typically mislearn it out of laziness. They're out looking to make excuses for themselves, or build up a superficial spirituality. They're not out looking to understand something - only to justify themselves. It's only taoists that I wanted to adress. I don't know if the topic concerns any taoists in *this forum*, but it's worth pointing out. That is a fair point. I'm sure you can appreciate that the way you deliver stuff makes it sound like you are ignorant though. Just a heads up. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Icedude Posted March 21, 2014 That is a fair point. I'm sure you can appreciate that the way you deliver stuff makes it sound like you are ignorant though. Just a heads up. Everyone who delivers stuff is ignorant of something, else they wouldn't be delivering stuff. I am not hiding that I am a fool in this regard. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Rara Posted March 21, 2014 Everyone who delivers stuff is ignorant of something, else they wouldn't be delivering stuff. I am not hiding that I am a fool in this regard. Another fair point. Stubborn and sarcastic then, to be more precise. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ChiDragon Posted March 21, 2014 Let Nature take its course. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Marblehead Posted March 21, 2014 Let Nature take its course. I have to go pee. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
silent thunder Posted March 21, 2014 I have yet to discover anything which is not spiritual, nor any thing which is more or less spiritual than any other. In fact... spirituality is for me the most effortless of things... which is not in itself, innately a thing. 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Icedude Posted March 21, 2014 (edited) I have yet to discover anything which is not spiritual, nor any thing which is more or less spiritual than any other. In fact... spirituality is for me the most effortless of things... which is not in itself, innately a thing. Spirituality is for master Juni to quickly scale rock walls with hands and feet, wade barefeet through snow, and jump pools of boiling lava. You can learn much from master Juni. Edited March 21, 2014 by Icedude 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TheExaltedRonin Posted March 21, 2014 @icedude Man I'm really starting to like you. It appears so many peoples rectums are too tight here. I got a laugh out of it. Just ignore the people that are taking jabs at you. I guess they feel that they have to be white knights of taoism (which is cool I guess.) Anything to stir up the serious, scholar like know it all attitude that on this site I support. 3 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Rara Posted March 22, 2014 (edited) @icedude Man I'm really starting to like you. It appears so many peoples rectums are too tight here. I got a laugh out of it. Just ignore the people that are taking jabs at you. I guess they feel that they have to be white knights of taoism (which is cool I guess.) Anything to stir up the serious, scholar like know it all attitude that on this site I support. I get it, but is it really necessary to open a thread like this in Taoist discussion? Talk about taking jabs. I see where he's coming from and I have no problem with mockery but this particular thread is unprovoked. You too have opened some interesting and challenging threads but at least you have been respectful in asking genuine questions rather than just coming through and throwing your opinions around at the first instance. Edited March 22, 2014 by Rara 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Icedude Posted March 22, 2014 I get it, but is it really necessary to open a thread like this in Taoist discussion? Talk about taking jabs. I see where he's coming from and I have no problem with mockery but this particular thread is unprovoked. You too have opened some interesting and challenging threads but at least you have been respectful in asking genuine questions rather than just coming through and throwing your opinions around at the first instance. Is it really necessary? Yes. Either I'm doing silly shadow boxing for your amusement, or I'm striking nerves that should be struck for the sake of self-improvement. I very much count myself as a taoist. I've also seen how gravely taoists in general can fail to understand the very obvious core of taoism. You can try to convey positive messages to them, and they'll look at them and think that they're just alternative busy-work. If you instead give them a friendly jab in the stomach, they'll take more note of it. I am not looking to beat up taoists for my amusement, but I've seen the alternative up close. It took years for my friend the wu wei master to stop reaching for his cola with his "mind powers". "Beating them up" a bit is preferable to them for example gaining health problems due to obesity. ...but at this point, why do you even care? The thread is over and done with, isn't it? It was pretty much a "one post joke". Is it an eyesore to you? Does one topic of critique soil the serenity of the entire sub-forum? You've tried to claim that it "doesn't belong", that it makes me "unpopular", and that it's "taking jabs". These are dishonest tactics, Rara. These are tactics trying to exploit the forum environment we're in: Attempts at tricking mods, attempts as bullying me, and an appeal to tranquility. How on earth can you have become so upset with this topic? If this topic disturbed you, then consider this a wake-up call instead. Re-read the Tao Te Ching and understand what it is really trying to convey. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Rara Posted March 22, 2014 (edited) Is it really necessary? Yes. Either I'm doing silly shadow boxing for your amusement, or I'm striking nerves that should be struck for the sake of self-improvement. I very much count myself as a taoist. I've also seen how gravely taoists in general can fail to understand the very obvious core of taoism. You can try to convey positive messages to them, and they'll look at them and think that they're just alternative busy-work. If you instead give them a friendly jab in the stomach, they'll take more note of it. I am not looking to beat up taoists for my amusement, but I've seen the alternative up close. It took years for my friend the wu wei master to stop reaching for his cola with his "mind powers". "Beating them up" a bit is preferable to them for example gaining health problems due to obesity. ...but at this point, why do you even care? The thread is over and done with, isn't it? It was pretty much a "one post joke". Is it an eyesore to you? Does one topic of critique soil the serenity of the entire sub-forum? You've tried to claim that it "doesn't belong", that it makes me "unpopular", and that it's "taking jabs". These are dishonest tactics, Rara. These are tactics trying to exploit the forum environment we're in: Attempts at tricking mods, attempts as bullying me, and an appeal to tranquility. How on earth can you have become so upset with this topic? If this topic disturbed you, then consider this a wake-up call instead. Re-read the Tao Te Ching and understand what it is really trying to convey. To paragraph 1, fine, yes. Of course. You still haven't addressed the fact that I was saying you have come in and laid down insults as opposed to being polite about such an entrance. I don't disagree with what you say neccessarily. What if I walked into a Christian church one day and yelled out in the middle of the ceremony "you're doing it all wrong!" and decided to roll on with a lecture. How well would that go down. To paragraph 2.The thread is over and done with? Ok, I apologise for logging in too late. I didn't realise that it was over and done with and that was your call. I have stuff to do with my life, so I can't be on this website ALL the time. To paragraph 3. First of all, I didn't "try to claim"...I "did claim". Second, what tactics? What on earth are you talking about? And tricking mods? Dude, you are paranoid or exaggerating. One of the two. I'm not upset...I have met people like you on forums before and it usually ends up in tears for other members, so I'm figuring out whether your posts are even serious or not. For someone who's supposedly enlightened, you don't seem very smart. Otherwise you would have got this diploma you speak of in your other thread without spending a dozen pages finding reasons NOT to take advice given to you. So that is my take. Perhaps if you want to talk more, we should carry on in DMs? That way, you can continue to talk to me like the teacher that you think that you are, and I will happily be open to whatever it is you want to say. And also, to your Tao Te Ching comment, I am glad you know so much about me to stick this little comment in. Bravo. Edited March 22, 2014 by Rara 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Rara Posted March 22, 2014 (edited) . Edited March 22, 2014 by Rara Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Icedude Posted March 22, 2014 To paragraph 1, fine, yes. Of course. You still haven't addressed the fact that I was saying you have come in and laid down insults as opposed to being polite about such an entrance. I don't disagree with what you say neccessarily. What if I walked into a Christian church one day and yelled out in the middle of the ceremony "you're doing it all wrong!" and decided to roll on with a lecture. How well would that go down. To paragraph 2.The thread is over and done with? Ok, I apologise for logging in too late. I didn't realise that it was over and done with and that was your call. I have stuff to do with my life, so I can't be on this website ALL the time. To paragraph 3. First of all, I didn't "try to claim"...I "did claim". Second, what tactics? What on earth are you talking about? And tricking mods? Dude, you are paranoid or exaggerating. One of the two. I'm not upset...I have met people like you on forums before and it usually ends up in tears for other members, so I'm figuring out whether your posts are even serious or not. For someone who's supposedly enlightened, you don't seem very smart. Otherwise you would have got this diploma you speak of in your other thread without spending a dozen pages finding reasons NOT to take advice given to you. So that is my take. Perhaps if you want to talk more, we should carry on in DMs? That way, you can continue to talk to me like the teacher that you think that you are, and I will happily be open to whatever it is you want to say. And also, to your Tao Te Ching comment, I am glad you know so much about me to stick this little comment in. Bravo. Ah, the tyranny of eloquence... At this point I am convinced that you are a woman pretending to be a man, because this is not how a man behaves. A man does not focus on "suitable" things, nor does he focus on being "popular", and he certainly isn't preaching politeness at your extreme level. This is why I come across as impolite to you: I was born this way. I was born to handle critique, I've been called all kinds of shit that a woman has the priviliege to stay clear of, and I've learned to "man up". I can't rise/lower myself to your impractical expectations, especially when you are inventing your expectations because you're simply butthurt and don't want to admit it. I can play your game too: "Why are you accusing me of being insensitive and stupid? You are such a meanie, and I'm going to go somewhere to cry now." Just go away. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Rara Posted March 22, 2014 Ah, the tyranny of eloquence... At this point I am convin ced that you are a woman pretending to be a man, because this is not how a man behaves. A man does not focus on "suitable" things, nor does he focus on being "popular", and he certainly isn't preaching politeness at your extreme level. This is why I come across as impolite to you: I was born this way. I was born to handle critique, I've been called all kinds of shit that a woman has the priviliege to stay clear of, and I've learned to "man up". I can't rise/lower myself to your impractical expectations, especially when you are inventing your expectations because you're simply butthurt and don't want to admit it. I can play your game too: "Why are you accusing me of being insensitive and stupid? You are such a meanie, and I'm going to go somewhere to cry now." Just go away. Ladies and gentlemen, our psychic here predicts I am a woman. I had better stop bullying you, just in case it makes me cry again. Lord, seriously, you make no sense. Sure, don't lower yourself, it might wind you up. Oh wait... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Icedude Posted March 22, 2014 Ladies and gentlemen, our psychic here predicts I am a woman. I had better stop bullying you, just in case it makes me cry again. Lord, seriously, you make no sense. Sure, don't lower yourself, it might wind you up. Oh wait... Look, there's a way to deal with faults, and lashing out at other people and searching for faults in them, isn't it. That's just distracting yourself in order to ignore them. I am not looking for any kind of student, so I'm not going to take you on. You can most likely fix these things on your own. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites