What do you think the forum can do to attract some quality teachers?

[Yascra]

As regards Admin. Well if the board needs oversight and some levels of technical permissions for certain things fine. But I mean ... imagine sitting in a cafeteria enjoying a skinny latté when the manager bursts in with a big stick and throws a few people out. Hardly conducive to free and frank debate is it?

 

lol

But that's more like a worst-case-scenario you're putting up, isn't it? You know, when I'm sitting in a cafeteria and talking friendly with someone, and suddenly have someone walking in who's shouting around how sh*tty this place here is, and that we are all stupid etc. .. then I really like someone who has this option to not discuss too long about whether we would appreciate this person as a member, but just have them kicked out, and who draws the consequences to really put this person out of that space where I'm trying to talk.

So I think in regard to the topic we're discussing right NOW .. when we've already stated that insults etc. might not be the environment teachers would feel comfortable in .. sorry, but it's not very the way to improve things.

 

I for my part don't discuss personal stuff that's relevant to me in an environment in which certain kinds of behaviour are tolerated with nobody caring about it.

 

But, to be very honest, though I feel that it's actually this topic that upsets you a little at the moment .. sharpened mod or admin action is not the topic of this thread we're writing in now

Edited April 11, 2014 by Yascra

[zerostao]

thank you also trunk for enduring and responding mindfully. i think we all are considering each other's viewpoints about these ideas and excellent choice of song to play. i appreciate that.

@brian, thank you for your detailed and thoughtful reply, we are all voicing our thoughts here with the same goal--to have ttb a great enjoyable place.

"So, finally, the TTB revenue stream." this is none of my concern really, this is soley sean's bizness.

 

"Not sure about Sean's marketing approach " me either, and again this is sean's concern or not, as he decides to choose.

 

"I don't know about you but when I am doing web research on a topic and I find a potential source of content which requires registration, I almost invariably look elsewhere. "

yes i agree, good point and i didnt mean to come off like i have no regard for our visitors but i do spend much more of my own energy and time with the tao bums members, and it is true that for every signed in member there are ten guests watching, if any of those are members that just havnt signed on becoz they dont intend to post at the time idk. but certainly we do have a large number of visitors comparatively to our membership.

Edited April 11, 2014 by zerostao

[zerostao]

@yamu, thank you for your response and it does make sense the way you expressed it.

also thank you for enduring the many things you have endured here.

it is good to have you on board this forum. and you do share the posting tendencies of hundreds of members here.

there is also well over a hundred non-sleeping, active member ppf's in that section

and these are members who share all kinds of things, including their practices and experiences with those. and care enuff to keep a journal, so to speak, of it.

like brian said, going around to all these different sites and registering etc many tend not to do that sort of thing. but here on ttb those that are already here, this is one convenient location to catch up with many things very quickly.

i do appreciate the efforts that you give here. i understand that the serious teacher does need to earn a living like anyone else and to be a qigong instructor in america can be a challenging endeavor. i am not second guessing your approach and again thank you for your reply.

[NotVoid]

Edited April 11, 2014 by NotVoid

[Captain Mar-Vell]

...

I will also repeat the sentiment that even High Masters need to relax.

 

I like to chat in the taobums chat room about cartoons.

 

If anyone wants to pop by.

 

I get lonely sometimes.

...

[thelerner]

I thought this was a good idea when it was contemplated to create "an optional "inner" forum where, in order to gain access, members have to use and validate their real full name by sending a pic of a valid photo id along with a self pic while holding up a sign saying "the tao bums".

 

Then people could actually be on a level playing field and get to know one another. Just like meeting in person.

Not a bad idea, but it flies in the face of the anti-elitism ideal of the sites founder. Having Inner 'high ups' and lower 'Regulars' is probably going to cause friction. I think Baguakickass's idea of teachers taking advantage of PPD makes the most sense. Especially since it gives teachers full editing control of everything posted there.

[SonOfTheGods]

I thought this was a good idea when it was contemplated to create "an optional "inner" forum where, in order to gain access, members have to use and validate their real full name by sending a pic of a valid photo id along with a self pic while holding up a sign saying "the tao bums".

 

Then people could actually be on a level playing field and get to know one another. Just like meeting in person.

 

yeah right - then you send over the Ninja hit squad

 

no way

 

------------

 

Maybe accessible to members who have over 2000 posts

 

less likely to troll

Edited April 11, 2014 by SonOfTheGods

[Ya Mu]

"I thought this was a good idea when it was contemplated to create "an optional "inner" forum where, in order to gain access, members have to use and validate their real full name by sending a pic of a valid photo id along with a self pic while holding up a sign saying "the tao bums".

 

Then people could actually be on a level playing field and get to know one another. Just like meeting in person."

Not a bad idea, but it flies in the face of the anti-elitism ideal of the sites founder. Having Inner 'high ups' and lower 'Regulars' is probably going to cause friction. I think Baguakickass's idea of teachers taking advantage of PPD makes the most sense. Especially since it gives teachers full editing control of everything posted there.

OOPS! Sorry. When I see it quoted here I see my fast typing didn't get the source listed. And in such, I do believe you are incorrect, in terms of the owner of the site, as these are his exact words. I really don't think Sean and Trunk have the same vision in this.

 

So my revised post should read "I thought this was a good idea when it was contemplated by the site owner Sean "...to create "an optional "inner" forum where, in order to gain access, members have to use and validate their real full name by sending a pic of a valid photo id along with a self pic while holding up a sign saying "the tao bums".""

 

I was just agreeing with him in that, TOTALLY different than ppfs, it would be a place where everyone was on a true instead of pseudo level playing field.

 

Which of course is one reason your OP is addressed by the above idea of the site owner as it would help to eliminate the many reasons as to why the board doesn't attract a lot of teachers as well as the reason several of the advanced practitioners who are already members don't contribute as much as some of us would like to see.

 

And, I would suggest that your OP is a very viable one. Personally, I think the more advanced practitioners contribute to the better quality of conversation. And beginners who have valid questions are not told some type of complete misinformation bullshit that has potential to ruin their lives - as has happened many times, not only in this forum, but in the complete field of Taoist studies. Advanced practitioners can help insure that doesn't happen and I personally wish more of the advanced practitioners who are members would speak up when they see this sort of thing - I do realize that many in the past haven't because they knew they would be shouted down by the very few continuously rude people who know nothing of the practices - all to the detriment of the board as well as the people asking the questions.

 

And the above idea would help eliminate that sort of thing as well as encourage brotherhood - really getting to know the person posting versus an anonymous person who could be anyone or no one.

There would still be the anon forum, I assume, in his vision, so that opportunity would not change.

[Ya Mu]

yeah right - then you send over the Ninja hit squad

 

no way

 

------------

 

Maybe accessible to members who have over 2000 posts

 

less likely to troll

As you see in the above explanation, this was the site owners contemplation, not mine. I don't see anywhere in that contemplation that suggests any type of post requirements and certainly no ninja hit squads are mentioned. It would be a totally optional thing, as I understand what he is saying.

[Green Tiger]

Wait . . . there's a ninja hit squad and I'm not on it?

 

Feeling a little under appreciated right now.

[Aetherous]

The first rule of the ninja hit squad is: you do not talk about the ninja hit squad.

 

Edited April 11, 2014 by Aetherous

[GrandmasterP]

"There aint no such thing as the Ninjas.

What is that anyway?"

 

( Fat Tony ... paraphrased).

 

 

:-)

Edited April 11, 2014 by GrandmasterP

[Brian]

Wait . . . there's a ninja hit squad and I'm not on it?

 

Feeling a little under appreciated right now.

Maybe you are on it and don't know it.

 

Ninja are that stealthy, you know.

[SonOfTheGods]

Wait . . . there's a ninja hit squad and I'm not on it?

 

Feeling a little under appreciated right now.

 

There's an old TaoBums saying

 

"if you are not on the ninja hit squad, then you are on the ninja hit squad, list"

[Marblehead]

Wait . . . there's a ninja hit squad and I'm not on it?

 

Feeling a little under appreciated right now.

Did you consider that you might be one of the targets and that is why you are not in on it?

[Spotless]

Ask a good question

 

Create an Ignore list

 

Stay on topic

 

Do not indulge

 

Don't use quotes much if at all - speak from experience and inexperience, not from your library.

 

Speak in plain English - don't assume everyone knows all of the short forms such as LDT or lofty floating vague language.

Edited April 12, 2014 by Spotless

[ThisLife]

Although this seems to me an exceptionally interesting topic and relevant to most people who use this forum, up till now. I've refrained from contributing anything to the topic because it seemed to be a debate that should be resolved by moderators and whoever is paying for this forum,... with input and suggestions from those people who have regularly contributed the most. Unfortunately, I don't fall into any of those categories.

Nevertheless, this topic seems to have energy and longevity. Reading through the high quality of many of the replies, I let myself be tempted into throwing my own two bits worth into the ring.

When this thread first appeared my immediate thought was that the question seemed very similar in nature to that old chestnut,...."Why don't pigs fly ? Answer : Because they don't have wings." My reasoning here is that, in my opinion, NO ONE would even consider going to an open internet forum in search of serious teaching. Neither the teacher nor the pupil get to see or experience the reality of the other person,(which I feel is absolutely a necessity for any genuine connection).

Of course this is also true of the spiritual books that have inspired most of us at different times in our lives. But here again, on the internet everything is unverifiable, hidden, open to deception -- unlike books which have had to go through a huge number of 'check-able steps' before publication. Forums like this, to me, seem suitable only for exactly what is happening here : An informal social chat room for people who share an interest in spiritual questions. It can never be a serious teaching venue, because the doors always stand wide open to frauds and nut cases.

This leads me to my second thought -- this time from the side of the serious teacher who feels a genuine responsibility for those who try to follow his or her prescribed actions and practices. Again, I feel that an internet forum like this would never even be considered as a teaching venue. Just scroll through the topics listed. Even many of the titles illustrate all that needs to be seen if one wants to know what kind of place this is. For instance, today there's one 'Golden Advertisement for Credibility' titled "Poo". Or that equal gem of intelligent thought, "Don't Do It if Your Penis Says Yes"

I mean, really, whatever suggestions might come forward from a thread like this,....one glance at brain dead topics like that would immediately scupper any genuine teacher's desire to spend his time sharing his experience here. Internet forums are wide open to any Charlie who blows in off the street. We can all feel safe here knowing knowing that we're hidden and protected by complete anonymity. But, our 'invisibility'. doesn't always lead to our best side, our clearest thinking, coming out.

Of course, this is precisely what makes the place interesting as a chat room. Like the bar at the end of the universe in the film 'Star Wars', one just never knows who or what is going to walk through the door next. Fascinating and entertaining stuff. But I can't imagine anyone coming here on any serious, life-changing spiritual quest. To me it would be like hoping to gain a PhD in English through studying the collected film-works of Walt Disney.

Why not just be happy with this place exactly as it is,... doing the job it does so admirably well day-after-day. An open bar-room door with no bouncer, no dress code, open to anyone who feels the need to belly-up to the bar, jump up on the spacious counter and have a bit of a rant on any topic under the sun, while protected by a bullet-proof screen of anonymity.

I think this is a great hang-out for all those like us who are lacking a more healthily balanced social life, and who also have the combination of genuine spiritual interests joined with too much free time on our hands to know quite what to do with.

Anyway, that's my two bits worth. I doubt it will meet with any offers of a free drink from any of the regulars,... so maybe I'd better just take a quick duck behind this wonderful screen of anonymity and go quietly to the nearest corner to nurse my beer in solitary silence.l

*

Edited April 16, 2014 by ThisLife

[Spotless]

A good teacher is in search of good questions and it does not matter from what package.

[Brian]

I'll buy you a beer, ThisLife -- and sit at the bar to drink one with you.

Edited April 12, 2014 by Brian

[ThisLife]

I'll buy you a beer, ThisLife -- and sit at the bar to drink one with you.

Thanks for the kind offer, Brian. Even though our connection only exists here in the land of 'Virtual Reality', I would most certainly take you up on your offer if this was 'Actual Reality' we were standing in. I've always found your posts to be honest and thought-provoking. (The best of all possible qualities in this curious method of inter-human communicating, IMHO)

 

*

[Trunk]

Couple of things re: interviews:

 

As I've previously mentioned, Interviews *can* be done under our current structure, as evidenced by the fact that 3 of them *were* done, going back as far back as 2010. To do that all you had to be was a member and apply initiative and creative energy.

 

Additionally,

"The Interview idea" *is* a good enough idea that it deserves more structural support. Since day before yesterday, prompted by this discussion, I've been making notes on how to implement by creating a section for it (already half way there). I didn't say so in my previous post because as admin I don't have the luxury to just casually say publicly, "interview section! we've thought of that before but never got around to implementing, good idea to return to!" ... without being willing to commit, because then there'd be backlash. I'm saying it now. Expect an interview section shortly. (Pinning is not enough.)

 

As I've said previously, the interview idea (whether in it's own section or at large) is different from a "teacher's section/s" (in which teachers would get section/s in which they'd get preferential treatment by staff in on-going dialog). The teacher's section idea is not workable at TTBs for a number of reasons that'd contradict TTBs fundamental managerial premises (conflicts that the Interview idea neatly avoids) ... which I've mentioned before but I'll repeat two of here:

1. In a teacher's section/s, staff would have to choose which people are "worthy teachers". Contrasted with Interviews: who gets chosen to interview is entirely member-driven. If you've got the energy to interview someone and to come up with the ?s, have at it. No need for staff to choose.

 

2. There's no on-going dialog, so staff doesn't have to be biased in moderating for one member over another.

 

I've got some base-line parameters in mind that I'll finish up before making an Interviews section available...

 

- Trunk

[Captain Mar-Vell]

...

I only serve.

 

Cha Cha Cha.

 

Chat chat chatter.

 

Chat chat chatters.

 

...

[Apech]

Couple of things re: interviews:

 

As I've previously mentioned, Interviews *can* be done under our current structure, as evidenced by the fact that 3 of them *were* done, going back as far back as 2010. To do that all you had to be was a member and apply initiative and creative energy.

 

Additionally,

"The Interview idea" *is* a good enough idea that it deserves more structural support. Since day before yesterday, prompted by this discussion, I've been making notes on how to implement by creating a section for it (already half way there). I didn't say so in my previous post because as admin I don't have the luxury to just casually say publicly, "interview section! we've thought of that before but never got around to implementing, good idea to return to!" ... without being willing to commit, because then there'd be backlash. I'm saying it now. Expect an interview section shortly. (Pinning is not enough.)

 

As I've said previously, the interview idea (whether in it's own section or at large) is different from a "teacher's section/s" (in which teachers would get section/s in which they'd get preferential treatment by staff in on-going dialog). The teacher's section idea is not workable at TTBs for a number of reasons that'd contradict TTBs fundamental managerial premises (conflicts that the Interview idea neatly avoids) ... which I've mentioned before but I'll repeat two of here:

1. In a teacher's section/s, staff would have to choose which people are "worthy teachers". Contrasted with Interviews: who gets chosen to interview is entirely member-driven. If you've got the energy to interview someone and to come up with the ?s, have at it. No need for staff to choose.

 

2. There's no on-going dialog, so staff doesn't have to be biased in moderating for one member over another.

 

I've got some base-line parameters in mind that I'll finish up before making an Interviews section available...

 

- Trunk

 

 

Thank you Trunk for accepting this idea and agreeing to implement it.

 

I think it is a good step for the TBs to have the interviews incorporated into its structure.

 

I hope that since you now have overall control of this site that you will come to accept also that staying the same is both non-Taoist and actually a kind of death knell, as things that rigidly stay the same eventually break and die. I hope you will take on board that you have development responsibilities that go with your admin role and will be open to fresh ideas about how we can attract quality content on to here.

[Trunk]

I hope that since you now have overall control of this site that you will come to accept also that staying the same is both non-Taoist and actually a kind of death knell, as things that rigidly stay the same eventually break and die. I hope you will take on board that you have development responsibilities that go with your admin role and will be open to fresh ideas about how we can attract quality content on to here.

Some bedrock principles, structure, won't change (otherwise it suddenly becomes a completely different site). I know we've struggled over that before. Initially those premises were assumed, not written, and I think that that's part of what led to conflict. Those bedrock principles are non-negotiable, but there are skillful ways to creatively work within them (interviews being an excellent example) and there are infinite possibilities outside of TTBs (and ways to link those outside venues to TTBs, the simplest being signature links). My view is that, on that basis, there is room for more creativity both inside and outside of TTBs... and that there should be further exploration so that those options are navigated more often and more fluently (not waiting until a frustration leads to breakdown leads to explosion).

 

Interviews section, I agree, is a good idea that is late to full implementation - thanks for your patience and mentioning that you'd said it previously in-thread: I reviewed and got up-to-speed on thread specifics.

 

There is a "Tao In-Person" idea in-the-works. The premise is to facilitate in-person training partners, training parties, get-togethers on a peer-to-peer basis. There are some parameters that I need to finish writing (having to do with safety). TTBs won't facilitate all of it, but will encourage external links to meetup.com (as they have all the angles worked out). There was a member-map idea (and we'd found a way to only give general locations, not specific), but apparently the technology shifted on that and it's no longer viable. We're on the look-out and, map or no map, it's a good idea.

[SonOfTheGods]

I'm working it in my PPF

 

seems to be coming along rather nicely