Why should I have a teacher? Or follow anyone's advice here at all?

[GrandmasterP]

Oh man I remember sunlover.

Now he was bat shit crazy.

And I say that with the greatest of respect for bat shit crazy.

Edited May 10, 2014 by GrandmasterP

[doc benway]

Oh man I remember sunlover.

Now he was bat shit crazy.

And I say that with the greatest of respect for bat shit crazy.

You know, you're right.

I just stumbled on another of Ryan94's posts and it's not that crazy…

[PLB]

You should have a teacher if you can find one. Look for one but don't wait to start until that works out. Life is short. Maybe it won't be just one teacher.

 

There is nothing about being "here" that is grounds for acceptance or denial. It is an internet forum, not a school. There are sharp differences of what "we" practice here. I don't share a lot of the points of view I read here. But I am really glad there is a place to listen to them.

 

It is odd that you would combine the two questions you ask. One is completely about yourself and the other about people you have never met and most likely never will.

 

If what you want is to find a completely authentic vessel of a centuries old process of practice and analysis then i get that; I want that too.

[deci belle]

The ways of nature are your own eyballs. Nature isn't out there somewhere separate.

 

It's not a matter of petting flea-infested vermin.

 

Saints who don't frighten animals or even ride them are just going through a phase— or not.

 

How many eyeballs to snakes and fishes have? The point is that reality is a pattern that is evidence of the nameless.

 

As such, one would do well to wake up and smell the flowers and learn from everything and nothing without discriminating between self and other in the process.

 

As for the OP, I wouldn't even bother asking. I would ask the original poster to drop the dependence on authority to resist.

 

That's a dead-end.

[Ryan94]

As such, one would do well to wake up and smell the flowers and learn from everything and nothing without discriminating between self and other in the process.

 

So, how am I meant to learn everything, and nothing? Or am I not meant to notice that the emperor's not wearing any clothes?

 

And if I don't discriminate, how will I judge whether it's bullshit or not? I can't test out every taoist theory, as life is short, and the bullshit in modern Taoism is plentiful.

Edited May 11, 2014 by Ryan94

[deci belle]

Hi Ryan,

 

Where does the idea of oneself being "meant" come from?

 

You don't have to be meant in any way, shape or form. You already are.

 

Right now, it's you, through and through.

 

It's just right now. This meant business is another dead-end. You will get along fine without it.

[BaguaKicksAss]

sunlover, sounds like I missed a good one! Must have been before my time .

[Ryan94]

Hi Ryan,

 

Where does the idea of oneself being "meant" come from?

 

You don't have to be meant in any way, shape or form. You already are.

 

Right now, it's you, through and through.

 

It's just right now. This meant business is another dead-end. You will get along fine without it.

Totally irrelevant. I was aware of this teaching, and its significance, but I don't like how you tried to dodge my original question.

 

How can I learn both everything, and nothing? Explain, please. I expect you will have an answer, as Taoists seem to always want both ways, to always have their cake, and eat it,

Edited May 11, 2014 by Ryan94

[deci belle]

hahahhahahhahhahahhahahhahahhahhahahhahahhahahhahha!! I guess yer screwed kid.

[Ryan94]

 

hahahhahahhahhahahhahahhahahhahhahahhahahhahahhahha!! I guess yer screwed kid.

Yeah, i thought you didn't know. Taoists say all sorts of shit to sound wise, but no-one has the balls to call them out on it.

Edited May 11, 2014 by Ryan94

[Harmonious Emptiness]

"When you see a worthy person emulate them.

When you see an unworthy person examine yourself closely."

 

If you can't do this, you won't learn anything from anyone anyways.

 

Why do I try to help people that don't even want to be helped though...?

[soaring crane]

 

"When you see a worthy person emulate them.

When you see an unworthy person examine yourself closely."

There's a very broad range of possibilities in identifying "worthy" people. Copy-cat killers come to mind as an extreme example

[Chang]

"When you see a worthy person emulate them.
When you see an unworthy person examine yourself closely."

 

There's a very broad range of possibilities in identifying "worthy" people. Copy-cat killers come to mind as an extreme example

 

Yes you are quite right and it brings us to the difficult question of deciding what is good. To a serial killer the the opportunity to kill more victims would be good. The quote still holds true though even though a person may wish to use it for less than welcome motives.

[CloudHands]

You question is legitimate, this is no place to learn and find the dao, but affirmations on what you see when you look at the TTB are relevant too.

When you ask something you belittle yourself that's something you are maybe not ready for, but ask yourself why you care posting that ?

You are not fucked up... if you ask yourself questions you are not dead meat and in your time you'll have your own experiences, may them lead you to better trust and smiling more.

 

 

Just lookout overall the thread you find what you asked, isn't it ?

Edited May 11, 2014 by CloudHands

[idiot_stimpy]

Totally irrelevant. I was aware of this teaching, and its significance, but I don't like how you tried to dodge my original question.

 

How can I learn both everything, and nothing? Explain, please. I expect you will have an answer, as Taoists seem to always want both ways, to always have their cake, and eat it,

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c6vCVdXBoN8&list=PL5EF9213C6626267F&feature=share&index=7

[GrandmasterP]

 

So, how am I meant to learn everything, and nothing? Or am I not meant to notice that the emperor's not wearing any clothes?

 

And if I don't discriminate, how will I judge whether it's bullshit or not? I can't test out every taoist theory, as life is short, and the bullshit in modern Taoism is plentiful.

Fundamentalism might be more up your street Ryan.

Those guys deal in certainties.

You'd possibly find that more conducive than Taoism.

Taoists tend to have to think it through for themselves, at least eventually.

Fundie pastors, Imams and such can tell you what to do, what to think and what to believe.

Our guys tend towards sorting you out for trouble free cultivation methods and after that it's ...."YOYO".

( You're On Your Own).

That doesn't suit everyone, it can make some folks quite tetchy finding out that in life, sometimes; we have to work hard ourselves to attain the worthwhile.

Either way you win because there are plenty of folks out there who will play "Mommy for money" to you if that's what you're after.

Edited May 11, 2014 by GrandmasterP

[beyonder]

A student is only a student insofar he or she has the willingness to be taught. A teacher likewise, only is a teacher if he or she has the capacity to teach. If the student isn't willing, there will be no learning, and if the teacher isn't able, there is no progress. The concepts of "teacher" and "student" are nothing more than social conventions, though. There are no "teachers". There also are no "students". One could point the other in the right direction, but ultimately, everyone has to walk their own path.

[Brian]

Totally irrelevant. I was aware of this teaching, and its significance, but I don't like how you tried to dodge my original question.

 

<b>How can I learn both everything, and nothing?</b> Explain, please. I expect you will have an answer, as Taoists seem to always want both ways, to always have their cake, and eat it,

Everything and nothing slowly begin to dawn on you simultaneously, Ryan94, after you stop struggling.

 

Wang Juemin taught that three things are needed to continuing to expand into ever-higher levels of awareness -- remain calm, be a good & moral person, and practice your qigong consistently.

 

Are you?

Edited May 11, 2014 by Brian

[dawei]

Everything and nothing slowly begin to dawn on you simultaneously, Ryan94, after you stop struggling.

 

Or begin to dissolve into simultaneity...

 

When one struggles with the chains of duality, they make a lot of noise...

[CloudHands]

Or begin to dissolve into simultaneity...

 

When one struggles with the chains of duality, they make a lot of noise...

 

Or art... depends on the point of view.

 

I think that's a shame that nobody thanked Ryan, actually he's probably right ahah

[dogson]

Or maybe dude just needs to get laid

[GrandmasterP]

Like an egg?

[deci belle]

Realizing that oneself is dead meat is a fabulous place to be. No one owes you an answer.

 

When i say yer screwed, it's a compliment in the context of this thread. Its just at this time that one can see the truth. Now just jump into it completely. There's nothing to add. You don't need a teacher.

 

When yer screwed is the best time to be overwhelmed by reality. Just let it.

 

Make yer day, kid… and smile on the way down.❤

[Aaron]

The greatest teachers don't teach through their words, but through their actions. If you're looking for authentic, that has nothing to do with Chinese "superstitions" I'm afraid you're going to be disappointed, because both Lao Tzu and Chuang Tzu were well entrenched in these "superstitions". It's important to remember that Taoism didn't begin with either of these Masters, rather they elaborated on what was already occurring.

 

So perhaps what you meant to say was that you wanted to hear from people who are primarily following the path of these two teachers? Well you might first begin your lesson by remembering that the sage can move through life without anyone noticing him, yet everyone is helped by him.

 

Also keep in mind that a man who asks for help by calling others fakes, liars, and impostors has obviously missed the point of Taoism. You catch more flies with honey and all that.

 

Thirdly how can you learn everything and nothing? Well when you become enlightened (learn everything) you also learn that you know nothing.

 

Aaron

Edited May 20, 2014 by Aaron

[Friend]

The advices are not followed.

They are there to be considered

when you do a decision

and as well to make your aware that

there are people who think in that

way and act in that way.

 

You have to proof yourself it is useful

to you at the moment or any other moment.

The advices are there to reflect on them

and to see if there is relationship.

 

Actually it is unkind in the way you state your opinion

and as well less wise.

You might be learned but in this way not well brought.

 

It would have been enough to say that you are "only

interested in the philosphy aspect of the Taoism

and would like to discuss it without involve of the other aspects

like religion or inner alchemy."

 

Short, simple and neutral.

 

Calling people

"massive liars, idiots or deluded fools under placebos"

is making people question you if you acutually understand

Taoism and not just have reading it.

 

Taoism is expected to be executed in speech, manner and action

as it teaches a way to interact with the universe-

which means with your enviroment.

If Lao Tzu says everyone is your teacher. Then all has to be respected

to have something to reflect on to learn. The way the things teach

are by good example, by bad example, by confusion and by unclear situation.

But well people a different when it comes to make them feel respected.

One has to be flexible as water is.

 

As well people who are teachers here are not to teach taoist philosophie

but taoist tradition. Which involves Qigong, Neikung, Breathing, Wushu,

Kung Fu, Magic and Religion and Customs, Medicine, Nutrition and as well superstituion and very little philosphy

as well, those wrote the classics know better which we do have subforums to discuss here.

 

As well the comparism of different schools and teachings to see difference and similarities.