Gods created out of Fear

[Marblehead]

There is no 'time' unless you're looking at a watch.

Or unless you are alive and getting older.

[manitou]

No. Consider all the wars going on at this moment. Many more prior to electricity. Look at all the genocide going on in Africa and the Middle East. Watch a teenager kill a number of his/her fellow students with an assult rifle. I see more hatred and polarizing than I see peoples of the world coming together.

 

But what will be the outcome of all these wars? Hatred is just the other side of the coin. If we cast our eyes a little higher, we can see the goodness too. Unfortunately the goodness doesn't make the news. I think it's all reverting back to the One, when man can truly live in wholeness. The fellow who picks up the rifle and goes into the school is part of Us too. He's at a lower consciousness is all, but he is One with us. I feel nothing but compassion for people who resort to such things - hatred isn't a useful emotion.

[manitou]

Good response. (Good cop-out too. Hehehe.)

 

Not a cop-out, darling. It's just that there's book-learnin' knowledge, and then there's experiential knowledge, the inner Aha's that are part of the self realization process that can't be communicated to another (unless they've been there as well and understand). The odd thing is that so many of us experience the very same things, or so very similar - that alone is all the 'proof' I need - it's self corroborating.

[Marblehead]

Not a cop-out, darling. It's just that there's book-learnin' knowledge, and then there's experiential knowledge, the inner Aha's that are part of the self realization process that can't be communicated to another (unless they've been there as well and understand). The odd thing is that so many of us experience the very same things, or so very similar - that alone is all the 'proof' I need - it's self corroborating.

Okay. That was a much better response. To your last sentence: Yes, we can concentrate on that aspect of life and find it to be true. I really don't want to step on a positive attitude. Yes, we can find common interests and cooperation in many areas of life. But to ignore the other aspects of life is being delusional. To the negatives in life: if we don't acknowledge their existance we will never be able to do anything to make things better for all.

 

For all? Sure, that possibility exists. It would take a lot of work though. It would also require giving up some things. People don't like giving up things. What is mine is mine, you know.

[3bob]

I'd say at some point that the One will return to the Tao, just as at some point it was born of the Tao. (per the greatest cosmic cycles)

 

"Revert" has some connotations that could be more difficult to deal with than the term "return". (with return being used in the TTC.)

 

Also there is nothing that is not under the One except for the Tao, while the Tao is not limited to anywhere at anytime while standing still everywhere at once. (or un-manifest yet still there or connected -so to speak- in "One" to the "Ten Thousand")

 

If one accepts that then there are no real illusions, for illusions (as various forms of energy) can only be seen as such via limited or false perceptions.

 

The cycles turn whether we work with them or against them, thus the days of the Ten Thousand to the One are numbered, yet also re-cycle eternally. (Still there is the saying, "Fear not")

 

Om

Edited June 18, 2014 by 3bob

[manitou]

The people who are here now, are here now.

The people who have already lived and died are here now.

The people yet unborn are here now.

[3bob]

Does it not seem that everything is becoming One? That the internet is causing the world to be more One than it ever has? That language barriers are breaking down because we can communicate with the interpreter on our twitter-boxes and everyone can understand each other?

 

That the countries are becoming One, sooner or later, led by things by the IMF (regardless of how anyone feels about that organization!), and strange political alignments due to sectarian considerations.

 

That people like us, all over the world, are reaching up and trying to merge our consciousness with the One consciousness that we know is there, but can't see, describe, or touch?

 

I make my statements about time and space out of personal discovery - nothing scientific at all. Internal Aha's! - so of course I could be wrong. But the process of self-discovery, self-realization, does produce some answers. Only they're answers that can't be effectively communicated to another human being because the words just won't come together.

 

There is no 'time' unless you're looking at a watch.

 

An American Indian reflection related to same:

 

"Upon suffering beyond suffering: the Red Nation shall rise again and it shall be a blessing for a sick world. A world filled with broken promises, selfishness and separations. A world longing for light again. I see a time of Seven Generations when all the colors of mankind will gather under the Sacred Tree of Life and the whole Earth will become one circle again. In that day, there will be those among the Lakota who will carry knowledge and understanding of unity among all living things and the young white ones will come to those of my people and ask for this wisdom. I salute the light within your eyes where the whole Universe dwells. For when you are at that center within you and I am that place within me, we shall be one." - Crazy Horse, Oglala Sioux Chief

[silent thunder]

No. Consider all the wars going on at this moment. Many more prior to electricity. Look at all the genocide going on in Africa and the Middle East. Watch a teenager kill a number of his/her fellow students with an assult rifle. I see more hatred and polarizing than I see peoples of the world coming together.

I go back and forth on this. But I lean more toward the side that the amount of bullshit happening in the same, it's just that in our current state, we hear about it almost instantaneously and hear about much more of it when it does occur than in the past.

 

Used to be a city got sacked and some folks wouldn't hear about it until years later when the trade ships brought the news. These days it's all available in real time, so we're flooded with it.

 

That and folks are damn near obsessed/addicted to it and go lookin for it when it's no where near them.

[silent thunder]

An American Indian reflection related to same:

 

"Upon suffering beyond suffering: the Red Nation shall rise again and it shall be a blessing for a sick world. A world filled with broken promises, selfishness and separations. A world longing for light again. I see a time of Seven Generations when all the colors of mankind will gather under the Sacred Tree of Life and the whole Earth will become one circle again. In that day, there will be those among the Lakota who will carry knowledge and understanding of unity among all living things and the young white ones will come to those of my people and ask for this wisdom. I salute the light within your eyes where the whole Universe dwells. For when you are at that center within you and I am that place within me, we shall be one." - Crazy Horse, Oglala Sioux Chief

I just drove by the Crazy Horse monument on my drive home to Cali from Michigan.

That area resonates so powerfully.

[3bob]

Agreed Silent Thunder, that is a powerful area. The "Devils Tower" area is even more so, perhaps much more so!

I hope your drive home is going well.

[Marblehead]

I go back and forth on this. But I lean more toward the side that the amount of bullshit happening in the same, it's just that in our current state, we hear about it almost instantaneously and hear about much more of it when it does occur than in the past.

 

Used to be a city got sacked and some folks wouldn't hear about it until years later when the trade ships brought the news. These days it's all available in real time, so we're flooded with it.

 

That and folks are damn near obsessed/addicted to it and go lookin for it when it's no where near them.

I understand what you are saying and in the most part agree with you. I am just trying to hold to reality and point out that the rose garden isn't just about pretty flowers; there are thorns in there too.

[GrandmasterP]

I wonder if there is more or less violence nowadays than there was in the past.

For sure we get to see more of it via the rolling news channels but is there as much quantitively in proportion to the number of people alive in the world?

I suspect that, since around 1947; there is less general murder and mayhem about in today's world than there was in past times and intuit that we are living in relatively peaceable times compared to our none too distant ancestors.

Edited June 19, 2014 by GrandmasterP

[manitou]

I wonder if there is more or less violence nowadays than there was in the past.

For sure we get to see more of it via the rolling news channels but is there as much quantitively in proportion to the number of people alive in the world?

I suspect that, since around 1947; there is less general murder and mayhem about in today's world than there was in past times and intuit that we are living in relatively peaceable times compared to our none too distant ancestors.

 

I've wondered this too. We hear about it instantaneously. Surely there have been periods in the world's history that have been every bit as violent.

 

But the fact that we're hearing about it instantaneously is all part of the process, IMO. We are communicating across the world at the speed of light now, whereas years ago it took months to send a letter across the Atlantic. It seems to me that there are many conditions in the world that are now concurrently stretched to their limits and are about to snap.

 

I think this fits in with the reversion of the Dao, if you look at it with really long eyes.

Edited June 19, 2014 by manitou

[Marblehead]

I have nothing more to add at the moment. Y'all are looking at both sides of the coin and that is all I am asking for.

[silent thunder]

I agree whole-heartedly about the thorns in the garden. I guess another way to put it is:

 

I don't have a sense that human nature/experience has changed much in the last few thousand years good or bad.

[manitou]

I understand what you are saying and in the most part agree with you. I am just trying to hold to reality and point out that the rose garden isn't just about pretty flowers; there are thorns in there too.

 

 

 

LOL. I just know that you were boat ballast in a previous incarnation, Marbles.

[Spotless]

We live in a world with far less violence than in most of the past.

 

In fact most everything is getting better though we are beginning to feel the need to examine what we are wading about in up to our knees and here in the USA we have an alarming number of people who appear to have gone completely off the deep end.

 

People are Awakening at a fantastic rate all over the globe - check out www.batgap.com

Over 200 interviews with Awakened individuals with a focus on what that process was like just before and in the following weeks, months year. Start at the early interviews - recently the interviews are less centered on this aspect.

 

It also maps out where these people are and in every case how to contact them.

 

Accessibility is everywhere - only "ideals" get in the way of moving forward quickly once you set foot on the path.

Edited June 19, 2014 by Spotless

[silent thunder]

We live in a world with far less violence than in most of the past.

 

In fact most everything is getting better though we are beginning to feel the need to examine what we are wading about in up to our knees and here in the USA we have an alarming number of people who appear to have gone completely off the deep end.

 

People are Awakening at a fantastic rate all over the globe - check out www.batgap.com

Over 200 interviews with Awakened individuals with a focus on what that process was like just before and in the following weeks, months year. Start at the early interviews - recently the interviews are less centered on this aspect.

 

It also maps out where these people are and in every case how to contact them.

 

Accessibility is everywhere - only "ideals" get in the way of moving forward quickly once you set foot on the path.

thanks for this... it nudges me back the other direction and reminds me of an epiphany I had when sitting in my car after a near collision... it dawned on me, "man, for all the moments in life where something troubling or bad happens, there must me a million to one times that everything goes well, or 'normal'."

[manitou]

 

 

Accessibility is everywhere - only "ideals" get in the way of moving forward quickly once you set foot on the path.

 

 

Do you say this in context of the Ideals being of a religious nature, to be transcended?

 

Or do you say it because our ego propels us upward toward attainment, and the ego is something to be tamed?

[manitou]

thanks for this... it nudges me back the other direction and reminds me of an epiphany I had when sitting in my car after a near collision... it dawned on me, "man, for all the moments in life where something troubling or bad happens, there must me a million to one times that everything goes well, or 'normal'."

 

 

I've thought similar thoughts. Mine tend to realizing that if I weren't detained by this particular red light, or construction traffic----that I may well have been in an accident. LOL, at least that's an easy way to get over being impatient about it.

[Spotless]

 

 

Do you say this in context of the Ideals being of a religious nature, to be transcended?

 

Or do you say it because our ego propels us upward toward attainment, and the ego is something to be tamed?

We tend to think in extreme pictures - our judgements are harsh.

We are afraid to take a step for fear of appearing like a sucker but we will rain down hell on someone who ventures out in a mismatched pair of socks.

We live in the future so as not to make a mistake.

We compete for everything but don't want it if it's not selling well.

If we pick up a good scent we want to hump it to death.

Edited June 20, 2014 by Spotless

[silent thunder]

We tend to think in extreme pictures - our judgements are harsh.

We are afraid to take a step for fear of appearing like a sucker but we will rain down hell on someone who ventures out in a mismatched pair of socks.

We live in the future so as not to make a mistake.

We compete for everything but don't want it if it's not selling well.

If we pick up a good scent we want to hump it to death.

truth.

[manitou]

We tend to think in extreme pictures - our judgements are harsh.

We are afraid to take a step for fear of appearing like a sucker but we will rain down hell on someone who ventures out in a mismatched pair of socks.

We live in the future so as not to make a mistake.

We compete for everything but don't want it if it's not selling well.

If we pick up a good scent we want to hump it to death.

 

 

Yes, we tend to imagine the worst case scenario and assume that's going to happen. Maybe we should reset to imagining the best case scenario instead.

[Marblehead]

Although at times I may sound a bit negative, I rarely place any expectations on my efforts. How I did won't show itself until after I have finished the job. Those times when I don't like the results I just take a break from it and then, when inspired, do it over but in a different way. (In fact, I have one of those going on at the present time.)

[dawg]

Dawg,

 

Have you found someone who has the same type of enlightenment moment and outcome as you(from book or real life etc)?

 

Allinone

 

Allinone,

 

The moment of awakening is basically the same for everybody, but varies in the details…

 

The moment of awakening always comes after you have exerted a lot of effort to reach it, but not when you are thinking about it or expecting it… it happens when you are temporarily mindlessly preoccupied with something else and you least expect it… also it never happens when it would put you in danger (like if you were driving a car, or engaged in some hazardous activity)…

 

I know of one monk who was mindlessly watching a farmer plant rice when he had his moment of awakening… another monk had walked a long distance, and when he stopped to rest for a few minutes and sat down, he had his moment of awakening… another monk was mindlessly taking a piss when he had his moment of awakening… when it happened to me, it was late afternoon and I was sitting mindlessly listening to the wind rustling the leaves on the trees, and to a solitary bird that was singing its heart out, when it hit me like a ton of bricks… totally without warning… that was my moment of awakening…

 

As soon as it hit me, I could hear loud very deep rumbling sounds like an earthquake was ripping mountains apart, and hear very high pitched zinging sounds… and see blinding flashes of light, like the flash on a camera going off in my face… (this is basically the same for most people at their moment of awakening… but after this it can vary a lot, depending on the person )…

 

I had just spent more than six weeks in solitary meditation, trying to force my way into my subconscious mind, in an attempt to reprogram it… because of this, after the loud rumbling earthquake sounds, zinging sounds, and flashing lights were finished… I found myself inside my subconscious mind in a huge space looking at what looked like Hoover Dam (which represented my delusion) towering in front of me… then big cracks started appearing in the dam, getting bigger and spreading, and pieces of the dam were breaking off and falling away, fizzing away as they got smaller and smaller until they evaporated… then the whole dam gave away and collapsed… and the entire contents of my subconscious mind, like a giant wave swept out and over me… at this point my moment of awakening was over, and I was awakened… the “hypnotic trance of delusion” had been destroyed…

 

Everyone thinks that they are not deluded (which is delusion), until they awaken… then they feel as if their whole life up to this point was just a long hypnotic dream, and that they have just awakened in the “real world”… everyone experiences this, which is why it is called “awakening”…

 

After awakening, my subconscious mind had become as conscious as my conscious mind… so I then spent the next seven days inside my subconscious mind exploring it, and experiencing it, seeing what it was capable of… gaining firsthand knowledge of it… I had no sense of time passing, except that the sun kept coming up and going down, it was always “NOW”… and I was pure awareness, simply aware that I was aware… my subconscious mind was no longer deluded, so it was now completely reliable… and my conscious mind was serenely "empty” and peaceful…

Dawg

Edited June 21, 2014 by dawg