How to cure Fallen Arches?

[4bsolute]

Fallen Arches I consider to be the bane of all MA practitioners. Because it totally messes with your balances. Basicly with your entire skeletal posture. You might never really notice this in normal life, but once you practice any MA, like me Qigong and Tai Chi, you instantly notice how screwed you are.

 

I position myself every day, in every stance I am, to lift the arches up and to re-align the rest of my posture. This takes quite some focus off of my practice, as you can imagine.

 

The improvements seem miniscule, but I keep going. I then realized how my entire right foot, through out any section, up to the hip, the back-muscles, the spine, the ribs/chest is misaligned. All from around 15years of not correcting it when it was first noticed, living unconsciously.

 

At some point it is really exciting what new muscles I rediscover or what tendons and muscles I "unlock". Like I have never felt them before. But there are also times where I see how much it affects, depression comes up a little. Especially when being in Embracing the Tree stance and I watch myself in the mirror and have to tuck my ex-duck-posture hip SO far in, that it looks perfect, but from the inside feels so so completely wrong. Same with my upper body, which is slouched back. Thanks to my yearlong hobby playing computer games. Thankfully this age is over and I dont even want to sit for more then 20minuntes during the day. Sitting on a normal chair gets uncomfortable. I see this as healthy improvement.

 

What information do you have, to cure fallen arches?

Edited July 19, 2014 by 4bsolute

[silent thunder]

I have naturally flat feet, always have...

 

We open the bubbling well by lightly gripping the earth with toes, while running qi gong forms.

 

I studied five animal kung fu for years and flat feet didn't impede my progress internally or externally.

Though because of the flat foot, I had a tendency to splay my feet outward duck style, this was corrected over time with attention and awareness. It's all but gone now as muscle memory has taken its place. Some minor corrections infrequently are needed.

 

Best of luck mate.

[soaring crane]

Barefoot running.

[Seeker of Wisdom]

The only thing I'm aware of that fixes the underlying structural issue with the tendons is insoles. Get ones specifically for flat feet from a shoe shop, or see a podiatrist.

 

I had flat feet when I was a kid, it took a few years for my flat feet to be set into proper arches. Might take longer for you, starting with adult feet. Insoles feel weird at first, then you forget they're there.

Edited July 19, 2014 by Seeker of Tao

[GrandmasterP]

Orthotics can help so a podiatrist might advise.

That said flat-footed is a good stance for standing cultivation.

We advise students not to grip the ground with their toes as it's thought that hinders 'sinking', but other schools have other ways.

Edited July 19, 2014 by GrandmasterP

[soaring crane]

I disagee when it comes to standing flatfooted. When standing, direct a little of your weight to the outside of your legs, stand a little bit bowlegged (o-beinig), like you're holding a balloon between the knees, and feel a little of your weight settle on the outer edges of the feet. Not so much that the big toes are elevated, not even so much that a casual observer would notice, but enough so that you feel it and can feel the effect on the arches/inside of the feet.

 

This not only strengthens and re-shapes the muscles/tendons of the foot; it also creates the best possible atmosphere for the Yongchuans to operate in. They'll feel more like suction cups on the floor/ground.

 

Orthotics won't do anything but weaken your arches further, and podiatrists aren't interest in or knowledgable about truly strong, natural healthy feet. They're initiated into an extremly conservative and pessimistic circle of snake-oil salesmen (in my opinion, of course. But I'm right haha).

 

The arch of the human foot is a functional, active element in the biomechanical equation. Healthy arches resonate throughout the entire organism.

 

And as I stated above, a little, intelligent, barefoot running is the quickest, safest and most natural way to bring them into form.

Edited July 20, 2014 by soaring crane

[BaguaKicksAss]

five finger vibram shoes, 24X7. They fix a LOT of foot problems. (just have to suffer the first 2 months of ouchyness, then all is good). They strengthen the feet, instead of weaken them like modern shoes do.

[GrandmasterP]

The MA lads are going gangbusters on those vibram shoes.

Everbody's already wearing or after a pair.

Edited July 20, 2014 by GrandmasterP

[GrandmasterP]

I disagee when it comes to standing flatfooted. When standing, direct a little of your weight to the outside of your legs, stand a little bit bowlegged (o-beinig), like you're holding a balloon between the knees, and feel a little of your weight settle on the outer edges of the feet. Not so much that the big toes are elevated, not even so much that a casual observer would notice, but enough so that you feel it and can feel the effect on the arches/inside of the feet.

 

This not only strengthens and re-shapes the muscles/tendons of the foot; it also creates the best possible atmosphere for the Yongchuans to operate in. They'll feel more like suction cups on the floor/ground.

 

Orthotics won't do anything but weaken your arches further, and podiatrists aren't interest in or knowledgable about truly strong, natural healthy feet. They're initiated into an extremly conservative and pessimistic circle of snake-oil salesmen (in my opinion, of course. But I'm right haha).

 

The arch of the human foot is a functional, active element in the biomechanical equation. Healthy arches resonate throughout the entire organism.

 

And as I stated above, a little, intelligent, barefoot running is the quickest, safest and most natural way to bring them into form.

 

Yep I've seen that taught and it's good for sure.

We teach standing 'in' as opposed to 'on' the ground though.

The idea is to sink 'in and through' as if 'rooted like a tree'.

No biggie, every school does different and the end result's the same if it works.

[soaring crane]

well, I do certainly of agree on the VFF's for daily life and physical activities that aren't running. (Athough, being a bit of a zealot, I think it's best to go barefoot whenever possiple and view shoes as a regretable necessity for certain situations).

 

For running, it's much safer to chuck the footwear altogether, or just stick to your cushioned orthopedic boots aka 'running shoes'. The reasoning behind my opinion is that the thin bit of material under the feet of truly minimalist shoes masks just enough of the sensory feedback to allow you to overdo the activity, resulting in all kinds of damage to the foot. Bare skin on the road acts like a natural brake, forcing you to slow down to a pace appropriate to the condition of your feet, or to stop running and walk home.

 

I write from experience (and from the collective experiences of the BF Running community at large) haha.

[soaring crane]

Yep I've seen that taught and it's good for sure. We teach standing 'in' as opposed to 'on' the ground though. The idea is to sink 'in and through' as if 'rooted like a tree'. No biggie, every school does different and the end result's the same if it works.

 

but it's perfectly feasible to be well-rooted while keeping the arches from collapsing at the same time. It's one of the few areas of the arts that I'm kind of adam-ant about.

 

Besides, that small correction I described has to do with more than just the feet. It activates the outer/yang half of the legs while relaxing the inner/yin side likewise gently opening the kua area. At risk of sounding argumentive, I have to add that I don't view it as a option.

[silent thunder]

I disagee when it comes to standing flatfooted. When standing, direct a little of your weight to the outside of your legs, stand a little bit bowlegged (o-beinig), like you're holding a balloon between the knees, and feel a little of your weight settle on the outer edges of the feet. Not so much that the big toes are elevated, not even so much that a casual observer would notice, but enough so that you feel it and can feel the effect on the arches/inside of the feet.

 

This not only strengthens and re-shapes the muscles/tendons of the foot; it also creates the best possible atmosphere for the Yongchuans to operate in. They'll feel more like suction cups on the floor/ground.

 

Orthotics won't do anything but weaken your arches further, and podiatrists aren't interest in or knowledgable about truly strong, natural healthy feet. They're initiated into an extremly conservative and pessimistic circle of snake-oil salesmen (in my opinion, of course. But I'm right haha).

 

The arch of the human foot is a functional, active element in the biomechanical equation. Healthy arches resonate throughout the entire organism.

 

And as I stated above, a little, intelligent, barefoot running is the quickest, safest and most natural way to bring them into form.

This is a very good description of how we place the feet and emphasize leg position in our first form.

I found working in sand to be helpful when adjusting to this at first.

 

It's been three years now since I've been practicing daily and about a year or so ago, I noticed my feet had become larger. I went up to an 11 from a 10 in shoes and they're wider.

 

Since it's summer, I spend most of my time barefoot. Part of my practice is a daily barefoot walk in the park and around the neighborhood. Walking barefoot has always been like a form of prayer of thanks to me. My feet are always thirsty to massage the earth.

 

I'm curious to see if my arches have improved in all this. Though I was never hindered on any of our long camping/hiking trips, putting 20 plus miles a day on my flat feet, it just never caused any problems... always wondered why the army wouldn't take flat footers because of this.

[GrandmasterP]

 

but it's perfectly feasible to be well-rooted while keeping the arches from collapsing at the same time. It's one of the few areas of the arts that I'm kind of adam-ant about.

 

Besides, that small correction I described has to do with more than just the feet. It activates the outer/yang half of the legs while relaxing the inner/yin side likewise gently opening the kua area. At risk of sounding argumentive, I have to add that I don't view it as a option.

I do see what you are saying and I'm genuinely not disagreeing nor claiming 'ours' is somehow right or better. It's just what we do and it seems to work but so do other cultivation methods as well.

"Let a thousand flowers bloom."

We teach and I cultivate a standing form only.

The feet stay put, always.

Odd times I go to the local TaiChi class the nice teacher there says what you say.

That's how it's done for sure.

Just not in Chen Xi Yi standing form ( Baduanjin-like externally but not exactly internally) QiGong.

There's an old poem attributed to the lad himself....

Be still like a mountain

Rooted like a tree

Then move like water

Soft and supple

Gathering Qi

As your movements flow

Search for the meaning of the Tao

and follow its natural way.

 

Edited July 20, 2014 by GrandmasterP

[Bearded Dragon]

Bruce Frantzis has mentioned something about a 5 Rings practice. I know nothing about it but perhaps talk to one of his senior instructors. People have been cured of this.

Edited July 20, 2014 by Bearded Dragon

[Sloppy Zhang]

Bruce Frantzis has mentioned something about a 5 Rings practice. I know nothing about it but perhaps talk to one of his senior instructors. People have been cured of this.

 

I second this. I've only heard a description of the "Five Rings," but never actually seen any visuals.

 

I think it's a subset of the "Opening the Energy Gates of Your Body" practice (I don't think it's covered in the book).

 

I think any senior instructor with advanced Energy Gates certification might know it.

[Green Tiger]

I agree with the barefoot running. You also might want to try rolling a golf ball or a lacrosse ball around under your foot, putting as much weight into it as is comfortable. You might find you have some plantar fasciitis going on. Rolling a solid ball can help break up some of the adhesion.

 

Also, be careful where you choose to barefoot run. Barefoot running, for me, became an unintentional mindfulness meditation . . . stick . . . stick . . . rock . . . dog poop . . . nettles!

 

The safest place I've found is on the soccer pitch. It's well maintained and pretty flat. Also, it's fun to kick the ball around a little while you're running.

[soaring crane]

Also, be careful where you choose to barefoot run. Barefoot running, for me, became an unintentional mindfulness meditation . . . stick . . . stick . . . rock . . . dog poop . . . nettles!

 

This is so absolutely true! When you're barefoot, you really have to remain aware of your surroundings. I assume barefooters tend to use mp3 players less often than "shoddies", too.

 

Contrary to most people's gut feeling, though, for the initial foray into barefoot running, the consensus in the community (and I'm with it 100%) is that a hard surface is best, with the most desireable being smooth blacktop/pavement. Running on a softer surface acts like a kind of ersatz-shoe, allowing you to continue making the same mistakes in running form e.g. heel striking and overstriding. The harder the surface, the less likely you are to land on your heels (OUCH!) and the natural springing action of the foot comes into play. This is where the arches start to become important, along with the Achilles tendons.

 

But this is just for the beginning. Once things get settled, then it's a lot more fun to get off the roads and onto the meadows and trails

 

hmmmm ... split to a thread about barefoot running?

[Green Tiger]

This is so absolutely true! When you're barefoot, you really have to remain aware of your surroundings. I assume barefooters tend to use mp3 players less often than "shoddies", too.

 

Contrary to most people's gut feeling, though, for the initial foray into barefoot running, the consensus in the community (and I'm with it 100%) is that a hard surface is best, with the most desireable being smooth blacktop/pavement. Running on a softer surface acts like a kind of ersatz-shoe, allowing you to continue making the same mistakes in running form e.g. heel striking and overstriding. The harder the surface, the less likely you are to land on your heels (OUCH!) and the natural springing action of the foot comes into play. This is where the arches start to become important, along with the Achilles tendons.

 

But this is just for the beginning. Once things get settled, then it's a lot more fun to get off the roads and onto the meadows and trails

 

hmmmm ... split to a thread about barefoot running?

 

I think a split may be in order, but I also think some discussion of barefoot lifestyle is necessary in a conversation about loss of arch.

 

If we are talking about someone with foot pain, I really don't think running on a hard surface initially is a good idea. Walking barefoot on a hard surface or in the grass should probably be your first step.

 

I personally found that walking and running barefoot on a hard surface was more painful, but it could be that it's also more therapeutic. I'm not one to spout a lot of "no pain no gain" talk, but in some cases a little muscle-fatigue-type pain can be an indication that you're working muscles that need to be worked.

 

Stop if you feel sharp pains in the joint, for sure.

[4bsolute]

Inlays do not correct the foot. It just gives comfort. You do not strenghten the foot musculature further.

 

Here is a good video about techniques. Its in an austrian (german) accent, but it has great techniques.

 

 

And yes, I do agree that with full awareness of how you actually move, this is no problem at all. We only see it as a problem or obstacle in the beginning, because we really never paid attention (and so the misalignment could develop). Over weeks now I have found many spots on my feet that I never used to actually touch the ground, while standing or walking.

 

The fun part is to get an even balance. To get 50:50 gravity on both feet while standing. This truly trains both brain hemispheres even further.

 

Thank you for your feedback!

 

PS: You better walk barefoot for a while before running. It's quite torturing running barefoot at the beginning, with no thicker skin. My personal experience.

Edited July 21, 2014 by 4bsolute

[GreytoWhite]

I have had flat feet all my life and it's only since I started practicing neigong that I've noticed a small arch beginning to form. Honestly, the biggest gain was getting some wide toe Merrell skate shoes and these acupressure insoles.

 

http://www.massager-machines-and-more.com/acupressure-insoles.htm

[Spotless]

Yep I've seen that taught and it's good for sure.

We teach standing 'in' as opposed to 'on' the ground though.

The idea is to sink 'in and through' as if 'rooted like a tree'.

No biggie, every school does different and the end result's the same if it works.

When you do actually experience the sinking rooting feeling it is extraordinary and something you will never forget.

 

I have a question that may be germane to this topic:

If I do not massage my feet prior to Qi Gong practice my left foot and sometimes my right foot will become very painful for at least the first 1/2 hour. Raising to my toes or stretching the foot pad helps but it is distracting.

I have normal arches but I have been feeling both arches when in practice.

Edited July 22, 2014 by Spotless

[soaring crane]

If I do not message my feet prior to Qi Gong practice my left foot and sometimes my right foot will become very painful for at least the first 1/2 hour. Raising to my toes or stretching the food pad helps but it is distracting. I have normal arches but I have been feeling both arches when in practice.

 

haha I assume that was a typo, but a lovely one, and perhaps a subliminal message for you? Talk to your feet :-)

 

Sore feet can come from anywhere in your posture.

 

Some random thoughts in question form: Are you stiff in the hips by any chance? Lower back? Do you feel numbness (old fashioned nerve numbness, not happy qi tingling) anywhere at all in your body? What kind of surface do you generally stand on? What do you wear on your feet?

 

Read through my post above regarding stance.

 

Do you know the classic 'ankle circling' warm-up exercise? Do you do any warm-up, loosening exercises beforehand? Are your legs relaxed when you stand? Knees unlocked? Pelvis opened? Sacrum lowered like the keystone in a stone bridge?

 

What's your foot massage routine?

[z00se]

Many difference answers fancy and what not.

 

One easy solution... Clench your feet like a fist as hard as you can trying to bring your toes to your heel and hold it. It's strengthening up the muscle.

 

Do 10 - 20 reps twice every day. Hold it in tight, strain those muscles. Build up to more, it's like any exercise, the more you do the more it will increase. Stretch it too.

 

Do while sitting at a desk at work, while watching tv at night, while typing on taobums, anywhere, just do it.

 

2-3 weeks, and they'll be done like a doggys dinner.